Open forum, April 8-14



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The US gov't has the two party system firmly entrenched in order to maintain the status quo. Even principled people who get through the cracks (Bernie Sanders, Ron Paul) end up having to play ball. Local politics is the only avenue for undermining that system.

roger — April 8, 2013 at 6:38 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Do ya all remember a TV program that featured a young man who got elected to congress? I believed it lasted about six episodes. He was against the 'I'll scratch your back, you scratch mine' ideology. I wonder if some politicians and lawyers had it shut down. It was a good show.

If you look back on the officials we have elected it seems that they all get seduced in some way to the dark side. Some lose their moral compass. Some just don't care. Some plain lied to get there, and some tried to do good but in the long run they all find out it is a dirty business. If you don't have the stomach for it don't go there.

It happens on both sides of the aisle. It doesn't matter that you go in with a high standard it will get you. It will chew you up and spit you out if you don't wish to compromise.

Just look at the pork added to all the bills that are presented on the floors. They don't believe in just one item on the bill, they believe if they don't add their pork their constituents will not get any money. THAT is what it is all about. The almighty BUCK.

JohnCasey — April 8, 2013 at 6:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal

*"Our kids expect us to do a better job, because so far, we have failed miserably and let these current thieves in to steal us blind and enslave us forever in debt!"*

holycrapola — April 8, 2013 at 6:02 a.m.

Our kids expect us to do a better job??? How would they know what to expect of us? If they think we're not doing a better job than we are currently, then why aren't they going out and proving it to us, holyc? It' isn't often that you even see a younger adult making a difference and when you's big news.

Also...some parents such as myself, discuss political matters regularly with my adult children and yes, our opinions are different on many occasions. I urge their public involvement and sometimes, they amaze me with what they come up with. Guess what, holyc...once in awhile, some of the comments I make on here reflect the view of my kids as I see them as a better thought to share than what was originally intended by myself. Speaking of younger folks getting involved and getting the word younger person who used to post here often has found this forum filled with comments so vile and ignorant and the people are so stuck in their opinions, that it wasn't worth the time or effort to continue sharing their political views. Condescending attitudes and juvenile behavior by people who consider themselves adults have pushed away the younger set whose opinions should be heard. Only a few were recognized as well thought and well presented. It's a sad world we live in and as long as the cycle isn't broken...we'll continue to see the same error in ways for many generations to come.

goldenoldie — April 8, 2013 at 7:22 a.m. ( | suggest removal

JohnCasey — April 8, 2013 at 6:58 a.m.

Ever see the movie "Distinguished Gentleman" starring Eddie Murphy???

goldenoldie — April 8, 2013 at 7:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Local politics, Roger? The Federal government increasing became, note past tense, a National government, where today, not much can happen without Washington D.C.

Sanders was elected by his state, Paul by his district, so I get guess you could say that's local, but they're on opposite ends. So if you end up with a Congress full of Sanders and Pauls: it's the same thing. Like I said yesterday, when a country is divided, on the purpose of gov., then the Congress will divided.

kn_dalai — April 8, 2013 at 7:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal

*So, hell yeah. Sequestration is only starting to do its damage.*

manthou — April 7, 2013 at 9:44 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal | Ignore User )

manthou- A couple of articles relating. America can do better than this.

**'Missing In Action': Congress Ignores America's Poverty Crisis**

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 7:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

*Even principled people who get through the cracks (Bernie Sanders, **Ron Paul**) end up having to play ball. Local politics is the only avenue for undermining that system.*

roger — April 8, 2013 at 6:38 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal | Ignore User )

roger- Your comment called for a reprint. Please tell me why you would think Ron Paul, of all people, would fall into your category of "principled people".

If anything, Paul represents all that has gone wrong with our system.

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 7:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Luvithere, Soo Holy C, what are YOU personally doing about it?

Hear me out, and hold me accountable to it. Nor a Republican or a Democrat will get my vote from now on in any election what so ever, no matter if it is life or death!

holycrapola — April 7, 2013 at 1:07 p.m.

Answer: Just like you, giving opinions and raising awareness. *What is next?*


Then vote again, and the election after that vote. We can bitch to high hell, but if you're not taking part than......words fall empty Holy.

We found out in 2010 what buying into this ridiculous apathy speak will do.

If not for any other reason, be pro-active and support what you do believe in and get legit! :)

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 7:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Nails you are so right about voteing.I don't care if you are right,left or somewhere in the middle.Your vote counts,if nothing else it should count for you.And you are right in saying if you don't vote than you have no bitch about what they do.All my kids vote and now my grandchildern vote.At least they listened to me on that one.

timerick — April 8, 2013 at 8:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal

(since we started w/pols again, gonna repost my last post from sunday)

***KN_DALAI : I think most of you are looking for something that isn’t there.***

I'm afraid you may be right.

I'm looking for a politician who runs because he wants to serve his country. Who feels an obligation to help her, protect her and keep her free.

Someone who wants to make the people around him (the voters, not the machine pol's) better off. Who wants to give all the children, not just his, a better future.

And after he's done as much as he can, who wants to go back to his real life. His PRIVATE life.

I'm also looking for a journalist who actually remembers they're the guardians of our freedom. Who remember that Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein brought down a President. And who realizes that Nixon's crime, wiretapping an opponent's offices, wouldn't even be considered newsworthy today. And that makes him as sick and disgusted as it does me.

Yeah, I know; i'm a hopelessly out of date, old 60s genner who'll die soon so who really cares anyway.

DeeLittle — April 8, 2013 at 12:34 a.m

DeeLittle — April 8, 2013 at 9:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal

DeeLittle — April 8, 2013 at 9:20 a.m

I agree with you 100% and no you are never too old to care, not out of date.

I'm afraid the politicians we have today are nothing compared to those in the past. One's of today only care about what can be done or given to them. Not what they can do for the people and country! It's all about the money in their bank account.

Journalist of today are a joke, they are only looking at rubbing elbows of the rich and connected, making a name for themselves and of course money. They could careless about reporting truth without bias, staying objective and only report what is needed. Instead they add what they want, tell lies and when caught, some like Dan Rather slide off into the sunset with an apology, others refuses to omit their wrong and keep on reporting and showing doctored videos, like many have.

I've all but stopped watching the news, anymore it's a game of what can we say today to keep the masses minds off of what's really is going on.

ELISI — April 8, 2013 at 9:49 a.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai - Unfortunately, you're mostly correct with your observation that the feds have it set up so that not much happens without them. But it can be done - Maricopa County in AZ keeps reelecting Joey Arpaio and he keeps thumbing his nose at the AG, for example. As for the polar extremes, what we're seeing today is a perfect example of the downside of the two party system. In Europe, with the several parties in most governments, they HAVE to compromise.

Nails - Yes, I do include Ron Paul. He is pretty much the godfather of the Tea Party movement which - whether we agree or not - has yanked the Repub party away from the WFB Jr. thinking they'd been stuck in. I'd be a whole lot happier if Bernie and his message of taking control of the gov't back from corporate America would succeed, but....

roger — April 8, 2013 at 10:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Political pundits like Bill O, and Piers M and the like have all but made a mockery of our journalistic views. Back a long time ago these guys would be on the covers of the checkout stand covers of the trash mags.

Now, somehow, they have evolved into what we have today. Unless it's a straight news article you will get all kinds of commentary. Spin it right or spin it left, it doesn't matter. They will skewer it to fit their agenda and the devil take the hindmost. Yelling at your guests just doesn't cut it. When you are rude and interrupting it will fall on deaf ears. Let your guests finish their thought and them maybe I'll watch it more, but as it stands right now if you keep interviewing your guest's in this manner the only viewers you will have are ones who really don't give a damn about civil discourse.

Just look at one national news feed. They feel or think? that by running a vast amount of time for the Jodi Arias trial they are ahead of the rest. Why do they do it? In my opinion they don't have anything else of value to bring to the table. A side note. Get rid of that Nancy Grace. She is a shrew all for the ratings.

To me, that's not good TV journalism. Another station says they are fair and balanced. My ass. Even their own news is cluttered with opinion.

One more thing then I'll be done bitchin'. Piers Morgan comes from an entertainment venue, and has a well known reputation in England as a journalist. He shoulda stayed there. He's really not up to understanding our beliefs here in America. Some of his guests have been treated pretty shabby. If you don't like their views do a little research and find those who do agree. Same goes for Bill O.

Just trying to watch those kind of pundits gives me a headache and I reach for the changer.

JohnCasey — April 8, 2013 at 10:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

HC, to add insult to injury, the corn syrup and sugar, likely came from GMO seeds, if you care about that kind of thing. Then there's the question about artificial growth hormones in milk cows.

Milk from cows is produced for their young. Not for humans. Why in the world does anyone want to drink cow's milk anyway?

kn_dalai — April 8, 2013 at 12:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Not sure if I've been lurking long enough to contribute to the meatier discussions. You all seem to know each other well enough to reference prior opinions or developing views, and so have a better sense of community, but here goes...

I intend to always vote. For as long as I can, and at every opportunity. No lousy politician will take that from me if I can help it. The huge historical exception of a voting populace that America began is reason enough, maybe... honor, privilage, etc. But, even more reason is the representation. We use that word over and over until, like so many other words, they loose their meaning, and become sanitized through intentional or unintentional misuse, so words evolve. However, there will be a Representative for as long as America is a Democratic Republic, but will that Representative represent me? It is certain they will not if I do not vote. They will only represent others. Madore, who just dosen't get it, represents only those who voted for him, not representating the whole community and their wellbeing, even though compromise is part of being a politial reprentative, and necessary for just that reason. But he is not the only one who has taken on this New way of subversive representation, hence voter disillusionment, who by their very act of not voting endorse 'loyalty' politicians.

I'm too pragmatic to want to erase the whole structure, and start over...especially with nothing better in mind than what is here now but not working, or or barely working, or not right.

Thanks to whoever mentioned Confrontational Activism. The reading has been eye-opening.

jacjak — April 8, 2013 at 12:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal

JohnCasey — April 8, 2013 at 10:52 a.m.

Couldn't have said it better.

I miss the days of Cronkite, Huntley & Brinkley. We need another "trusted voice" in America.

And why is it that "the powers that be" think is their mouthpiece has a British or Aussie accent, it makes them "sound" smarter? It just pisses me off and I turn the channel.

My one more thing; last night I heard this quote and it seemed about right- The Democratic party were the ones that had their war on poverty, the Republican party now has their war on the poor. just a thought.

hawkeye — April 8, 2013 at 1:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

And once again. There are very different ways of thinking about the role and efficacy of government. When someone says that so-and-so “doesn’t represent me”, then no doubt ,if, they got their candidate elected who did “represent” their ideas, then the other side would then say that so-and-so “doesn’t represent me.” Not hard to understand folks. Corruption aside, you seem to think that some pol is supposed to make everything right. Huh? You can’t agree amonst yourselves about these things, but then some elected pol is supposed to have a magic bullet?

And Hawkeye, Johnson’s war on poverty was nothing but a larger welfare state. Just what’s been accomplished. It’s at the heart of political differences. Where are the cities of alabaster? As Ross Perot once aksed.

kn_dalai — April 8, 2013 at 2:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*Not sure if I've been lurking long enough to contribute to the meatier discussions.*

jacjak — April 8, 2013 at 12:59 p.m.

You should be sure now!

As to your patriotic well articulated screed...BRAVO!

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 2:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HC, Wow. So just to take one of your suggestions. Just how is an elected candidate supposed to implement their big idea, considering everything must pass through the executive and legislative branches of government?

kn_dalai — April 8, 2013 at 2:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Did someone mention Ross Perot? :))

I've always said this Teaparty movement is nothing but Ross Perot in a skirt...I suppose this is somewhat of a forum validation! :)


HolyC- (just wanted to say) I dig you contributing again and putting some fire in conversations.

*Who am I politically? I identify myself more with the libertarian kind but with some exceptions: They are that I believe in sustainability, protecting the environment and leave no one behind.*

holycrapola — April 8, 2013 at 8:48 a.m.

I think most of us embrace the romanticism of supposed Libertarian .. philosophy.

And many of us go through a bit of the Ayn Rand baseline thought then move on to a better understanding concerning role of government and it's applicability in 20th & now in 21st century America.

Neither party matches up with everything we want. Never will. But understanding these are the cards America dealt itself-the finest cards in the world that I know of-we need to play them. We've got the winning hand. Once in awhile somebody draws to an inside straight, gets lucky, bluffs, gets lucky..but they never walk away from the table ahead.

I'm hoping someday for a couple more viable party selections. I do believe we are currently witnessing the dissolution of the Republican Party. In ten years or so I believe there will be a viable 3rd "conservative" party, with Republicanism as we know it gone. How the splinters will align is anyones guess. But all the signs are pointing to it.

Our system isn't perfect, but it's one to die for. If I ever feel lazy about casting my vote, I just need to think a little about the red ink so many have left on the battlefield, just so I have the freedom to color in the circles.

Not to wax all hoorah!, but we have to work within. If we give up.....

Look at what's happening in these Red controlled states.

Republicans are putting the exclamation point in why we need federal government! Outlawing abortion, contraception, bills calling for state religion...etc. etc.

Many laws without Fed conformity become the absurd and unjust. Laws that deal with privacy, freedom, equal rights etc. we all deserve. What state you live in shouldn't dictate the legal terms of who you sleep with, a paycheck depending on what gender you are, or one's ethnic background dictating what restroom you use. Hell, Ron Paul wouldn't have voted for the Civil Rights Act. If one of his followers understands differently lease speak up.

This is the country. America.

Our process is far from perfect and surely needs improvement.

That's when we come in.

(if Joe's not around)

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 3:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Make sure you live in a state that allows condoms!


nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 3:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Ron Paul crapping rainbows..

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 3:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

My,, my, my...

It seems to me that the folks who planned the Columbia River Crossing have yet even more "issues" to explain when it comes to the cost of the actual bridge component, their ballooned cost request for light rail, the costs involved in investment in LR cars...especially since it is an assumption that the cost for an expansion will be $40 million more for 19 vehicles in 2019 than it would expand at a cost of $8.10 million for 20 rail cars last year or the Milwaukie/Portland line...AND...that in 2002, expansion at Ruby Junction for the Yellow Line for a cost of $9.15 million. The two prior expenses were allotted for the upgrades at the Ruby Junction Maintenance Center in Gresham. If I didn't know any better, I'd say they're scalping the taxpayers. Naw...they couldn't do that. They wouldn't do that! Would they???

Don't know why the Escalated Cost per CRC's Published Map and Public Statements don't match the Escalated Cost per the CRC's written budget with a $55 million dollar discrepancy on their hands. They're doing this to improve the *e**CON**omy*, huh!

A few questions for those of you who support the crossing project WITH lightrail:

Can you guess just what the current dollar amounts have been spent on the crossing project???

Do you know *WHEN* the light rail will be ready to take passengers into Portland???

Do you have any idea what *"Improvements"* will be done on Phase I of the Columbia River Crossing Project???


goldenoldie — April 8, 2013 at 4:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal

A clarification... "...the costs involved in investment at Ruby Junction Maintenance Facility for LR cars...." instead of "costs involved in investment in LR cars." My apology.

goldenoldie — April 8, 2013 at 4:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HolyC-LOL! Watch out for Mono! :)

I don't know if you clicked this link last week, but Maher gets it right. Pretty clean material. It's got the male P word (warning to conservatives) one time, but I'm not sure if it's a "cuss" word. I thought it was just my P.E. teachers last name until I got older. :) Just dotting my I's and crossing .... my P's.

Libertarianism has morphed into something else. I get the freedom thing, it's just that today's Libertarianism no longer represents it.

That and it's getting peeled back politically front and center.

Devil's in the details.

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 4:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Beggin’ your pardon there HC, but I think you’re the one that has hi-jacked the term Libertarian. A pure Libertarian believes that no one has the right to another’s life, which includes no right for the state to takes own’s property, as in money, for another’s use. I’m sure there all all manner of gradations, but I’m not aware of anyone who doesn’t think that government can’t raise public money for public infrastructure like roads.

That is not what you are describing.

Interestingly, Ayn Rand could not stand Libertarians, as she thought they stole her ideas and twisted them around. I believe it had to do with morals. Ayn Rand beleived that there had to be the highest standard of ethics in Capitalism while Libertarians are amoral on various subjects. At least that's what I understand her complaint to be. I’ve posted on this twice before and linked to the Ayn Rand Institute. Easy enough to find with a Google search.

BTW HC, as I was going to post, I saw your post and link a 4:53 p.m. If you’re referring to the thing they say on that web page about “Caring for People” you may want to take another look at that and understand what that means. It has nothing to do with government welfare programs, Just the opposite.

kn_dalai — April 8, 2013 at 5:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 8, 2013 at 4:32 p.m., 4:53 p.m.

Well said. I think if business is to partnership with public ed it needs to be limited and designed to accommodate societies disenfranchised which you spoke of. Trouble is profit. When monetary profit is introduced .. not that it isn't now to some degree .. but to escalate such..(maybe langenthal, manthou, someone with much knowledge in professional edu will chime in) could make a witches brew.

Germany has a great trades/higher ED program from what I have seen & heard. I disagree with (kind of) as kids are determined by test scores (@ 15,16 maybe luvit can help) and then education is decidedly geared blue collar or white collar for that individual.

We are going more and more European as time moves on. They've had a lot longer to figure things out. So far America's not to good at the trial & error thing. Think Iraq, and current fiscal austerity alone. Investment is needed and $$$ is cheap right now.

On a different note but within scale, government wasn't designed too make a profit, nor should it be. As you mentioned some need to be provided for and given a leg up to be a part of us. This sequestration is already hurting the services poor folk depend on so much.

Many start life in the basement digging holes anyway, to heap this type/kind of undue financial burden on them is unconscionable.

HolyC It's good to hear others speak up for basic values. People who care about the future of our society long after we're gone. There's a lot of backward thinking in this area. I look at facebook and WOW!

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 5:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Man: What's the difference between "libertarian" and "anarchist," exactly?

Chomsky: There's no difference, really. I think they're the same thing. But you see, "libertarian" has a special meaning in the United States. The United States is off the spectrum of the main tradition in this respect: what's called "libertarianism" here is unbridled capitalism. Now, that's always been opposed in the European libertarian tradition, where every anarchist has been a socialist—because the point is, if you have unbridled capitalism, you have all kinds of authority: you have extreme authority.

If capital is privately controlled, then people are going to have to rent themselves in order to survive. Now, you can say, "they rent themselves freely, it's a free contract"—but that's a joke. If your choice is, "do what I tell you or starve," that's not a choice—it's in fact what was commonly referred to as wage slavery in more civilized times, like the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, for example.

The American version of "libertarianism" is an aberration, though—nobody really takes it seriously. I mean, everybody knows that a society that worked by American libertarian principles would self-destruct in three seconds. The only reason people pretend to take it seriously is because you can use it as a weapon. Like, when somebody comes out in favor of a tax, you can say: "No, I'm a libertarian, I'm against that tax"—but of course, I'm still in favor of the government building roads, and having schools, and killing Libyans, and all that sort of stuff.

roger — April 8, 2013 at 5:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 8, 2013 at 4:32 p.m.

No, they didn't "hijack" the term Libertarian, your big intrusive government view is the opposite of Libertarian. Please read at least one of the many resources available defining the philosophy.

frobert — April 8, 2013 at 5:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

David Boaz and compatriots at the Cato Institute define the modern US brand of Libertarianism.

roger — April 8, 2013 at 5:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

From Gar Alperovitz, a professor of political economy at the University of Maryland, and author of “America Beyond Capitalism: Reclaiming Our Wealth, Our Liberty, and Our Democracy.”

One of the most important Chicago School leaders, Henry C. Simons, judged in 1934 that “the corporation is simply running away with our economic (and political) system.” Simons (a hero of the libertarian idol Milton Friedman) was skeptical of enormity. “Few of our gigantic corporations,” he wrote, “can be defended on the ground that their present size is necessary to reasonably full exploitation of production economies.”

The central problem, then as now, was that very large corporations could easily undermine regulatory and antitrust strategies. The Nobel laureate George J. Stigler demonstrated how regulation was commonly “designed and operated primarily for” the benefit of the industries involved.

Of course, it would probably take another financial meltdown to make banking nationalization politically tenable. But given how the sector has behaved since the last crisis, a repetition seems inevitable, and sooner rather than later. When it comes, we would do well to keep the work of Henry C. Simons and his acolytes in mind when we contemplate how to rebuild a more equitable economy.


roger — April 8, 2013 at 5:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

From holyC's article:

The protesters were said to be members of the Ukrainian feminist group Femen, which is known for its topless activism.

Afterward, Putin cheekily quipped that the event's organizers should "say thank you to Ukrainian girls for helping you promote the trade fair."

Looks like old Vlad isn't the sourpuss our press likes to portray him as being.

roger — April 8, 2013 at 6:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HolyC, MANY THANKS for referring to the dog shelter in Washougal fiasco. I actually came on here to comment on the story. We got our dog from there and so we are heavy supporters of them. They are a no-kill shelter; thanks to them and their rescue, our doggie survived the Humane Society where he was already slated for the big sleep. Then he spent four months in Washougal until yours truly took the boy, and here he stays as long as he lives.

These people operate on a shoe string budget as the city cut them back (from already low levels) to nearly zero. They also provide all services to the city such as animal control. They live off volunteers and donations. They deserve a big thank you; they do not deserve this jerk of a neighbor. Videotaping and harassing; and read the guy's comments? What an arrogant (insert choice word here). If anybody has any ideas how to aid the shelter, let me know. I will definitely write this dude a note.

Nails: education in Germany. I actually had occasion to meet with a bunch of Germans from the system there a couple months ago. The graduation rate from college is like 25% higher than over here. That was a stunner to me. And no tuition! A few fees! Germany still believes education benefits the society - that's what we used to do here, while it has now evolved into 'education benefits only the individual, so let him pay.' State support for higher ed is roughly 30-35%, while it used to be 75%. Ergo the tuition hikes. For-profit colleges are a rip-off, period.

Couple that with the apprenticeships right out of K12 and you see where Germany differs from USA. My three brothers all apprenticed at the age of 15 (obviously none was interested in college, while I slogged through the higher system of high school before I did college. None of my brothers ever experienced a day without work.

luvithere — April 8, 2013 at 6:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

The base of society and country is a family and a job. You lose any of those elements, you lose everything!

holycrapola — April 8, 2013 at 5:43 p.m.


luvithere — April 8, 2013 at 6:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Luvithere - How has the German system held up? When I left there in 2001 it was getting strained, due to the influx of East Germans, Russians, and various other Eastern Europeans and the Kurds and Turks. There was a whole lot of rumbling about needing to close the borders.

roger — April 8, 2013 at 6:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger, they rumble and grumble, absolutely. Amazing how many easterners discovered a German ancestor five hundred years ago that now entitles them to citizenship. Due to geography of the country, many come and stay. It is a strain. West Germans still pay a (temporary) extra tax for re-unification; many now wish the wall still exists. Infrastructure is getting done in Eastern part and the western part is still getting neglected. And how long ago was that reunification?
And just as Elisi noticed the makeup of hospital staff here, I saw the same over there. Eastern Europe in that case.

However, we still seem to be doing alright if you look at the rest of the EU. And higher ed is still very valued: they tried to impose another fee a year or two ago. Went down in flames really fast.

Not to say that Germany is not suffering the same stuff we do over here. We got the same industrialists that screw us over, the banks too big to prosecute etc. As the saying goes: the crooks in industry learned well from the Amerikanern.

I am also not a fan of Angela over there, let that be known. :)

luvithere — April 8, 2013 at 6:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere: Your doggie rescue story brought me back for a quick comment:

Glad to know he has a good home and that this Washougal no kill shelter protected him until he found you! We got our pooch from a shelter: she was found abandoned and very full of puppies, so tired and sick and hungry. She had all 8 a day later and was fostered for awhile until she was healthy and ready for adoption. Her foster mom picked us over all the other applicants and it was a good match for sure. She is like my fourth child, I swear. :)

I am so supportive of these shelters and so upset with folks who demonize them (what a fool this guy is: kinda like attacking Mother Theresa) or withhold contract funds like a certain commissioner-who-shall-not-be-named.

manthou — April 8, 2013 at 7:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 8, 2013 at 4:32 p.m.-- We need equal opportunity to access quality education at a very affordable cost if necessary but also a true partnership between business and schooling. There is a vested interest in order to have a capable workforce. Businesses have not assumed that responsibility and have decided to import human capital devastating our own financially.

I agree that few doors open without education, and today's costs are a complete outrage, but isn't business, with their associated skills, only part of the culture of higher education? What about Fine or Proforming Arts degrees, or Philosophy, History, or Humanities? Fantastic knowledge but limited earning potential, most likely acknowledged even before applying. What does one do with an archaeology or oceanography degree except love the science? Or a Creating Writing degree without some sort of attachment for literary tradition?

Then again, humans are so optimistic and weird about things. Aiming high has always been one of our collective charms, and dreaming big is certainly no exception. Maybe we each go into it thinking we'll be the next Carl Sagan, Jane Austin, or Luciano Pavarotti.

And, there are the on-going changes of any job discription, education notwithstanding. E.g, for almost 20 years I worked in the electronics industry, but the evolving science made most human job discriptions extinct. There are now circuits the size of a only a couple hundred atoms, and most the size of a fingernail and contain billions of transistors. Totally science fiction fantastic, but ceased to pay the bills.

jacjak — April 8, 2013 at 7:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Citizen Forum starting now. Stephanie Rice just tweeted this so maybe it's going to be interesting;

Stephanie Rice ‏@col_cityhall 22m

Before #vanwa council mtg, CM Eric Holmes gave out copies of all city resolutions, letters and plans in support of CRC. Not sure why.

Stephanie Rice ‏@col_cityhall 14m

Here is the intro of the memo from Ransom to Holmes.
View photo

langenthal — April 8, 2013 at 7:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I am actually of the strong opinion that we still need those liberal arts. A university is not yet a vocational school. What people need to understand is that such liberal arts majors actually work in a variety of fields. English majors do not work in a field called English. So I am in full agreement with you. Sadly, many do not understand this and think liberal arts degrees are a waste of time and money. Not so.

In addition, where would be be as a society without artists, thinkers, creative people? Without those who work in the social services fields? There's room for the STEM people and the business people and the scientists, but there is also room for the liberal arts people. Nothing wrong with an education that teaches you to be a well-rounded person. That was the original intent anyway of higher education if you go back to charters.

luvithere — April 8, 2013 at 7:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Back in the day, around the late 70's and early 80's, when long discussions about the spectre of globalization was the hotly debated dinner topic with friends, the words 'Libertarian' and 'Libertarianism' came up really often, along with John Birch Society, deregulation, productivity, and environmental pollution. Libertarian was not a recognized party back then, or it was very fledgling and so not recognized as a party, but may have forgotten. The definition of Libertarian, along with my understanding, still seem to be in flux, and for me it's hard to hitch my vote to a star that is still defining/changing/re-making who they are or intend to be.

jacjak — April 8, 2013 at 7:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Anyone who thinks there isn't a difference between the two parties...

From today's HuffPo:

**Mike Reynolds, Oklahoma Rep: 'It's Not Our Job To See That Anyone Gets An Education'**

Oklahoma state Rep. Mike Reynolds (R-Oklahoma City) told fellow lawmakers last week that they have no responsibility to ensure students have access to a college education.

The state's legislature has been debating a bill that would expand Oklahoma's Promise, a program that provides post-secondary education scholarships to qualified low-income students. State Rep. James Lockhart (D-Heavener) emailed colleagues to highlight a student named Austin, who, Lockhart was told, earned a 4.39 GPA and a 32 on the ACT, but doesn't qualify for Pell grants and has only received a few scholarships, which won't cover his tuition bill.

In an email exchange posted on the state Democratic Party's website, Lockhart wrote:

*How do we guarantee that students like Austin, who is clearly very much a top student, get an education? These are the ones that will cure cancer, create the next big invention or possibly become a great leader. How do we help these students?*

*It's OUR JOB to see this kid get an education. We want our best and brightest to receive an education that lets them reach their full potential. We are failing him.*

Reynolds responded:

*It is not our job to see that anyone gets an education. It is not the responsibility of me, you, or any constituent in my district to pay for his or any other persons [sic] education. Their GPA, ACT, AS[V]AB, determination have nothing to do with who is responsible. Their potential to benefit society is irrelevant.*

Read more @

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 7:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Yes, Nail, exactly what I said. There it is. Sob.

luvithere — April 8, 2013 at 8:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 7:47 p.m.

First of all unless things have changed drastically over the years, a perfect GPA is a 4.0, a 4.39 is seriously fudged figures.

Secondly, government funding of higher education has done little more than diminish the value of the education and assure that the prices are unreasonable to anyone not receiving aid. When I went to school, I worked and paid out of pocket and finished without debt, that is impossible today.

frobert — April 8, 2013 at 8:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Frobert, a GPA higher than 4.0 is NOT fudged. it is weighted to account for certain AP courses. Yeesh.

And no, it is not government and their funding aid. It really is the cutback in STATE funding to the public colleges.
This I actually do know. Job and all.

luvithere — April 8, 2013 at 8:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvit is correctomundo. My oldest finished with a 4.40 something. A lot of high schools offer AP/Honors classes that will kick your number up, and deservingly so.

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 8:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — April 8, 2013 at 8:44 p.m.

If one school uses a weighted average, but most do not, then, yes it is fudged figures.

frobert — April 8, 2013 at 8:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 8:51 p.m.

Where did your oldest go to school? Under Washington State law, no class can have a value higher than 4.0.

frobert — April 8, 2013 at 9:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

frobert- Maybe you're misunderstanding what "fudged figures" implies by definition.

A fudge figure? Maybe?


Not that it's your business where my daughter went to school, (how's Gen? Man it feels like old home week:) But her high school years were spent in DoDEA-DoDDS.

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 9:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*Could this be a good start? Sounds like it. I'll believe it when I see it.*

**Wall Street Lobbyists Cry Foul**

WASHINGTON -- Momentum to break up the nation's largest banks is building quickly on Capitol Hill, just weeks after a unanimous, symbolic vote in the Senate to end taxpayer subsidies to Wall Street. The latest sign of this swift and unexpected shift in the political wind came Monday when Rob Nichols, a lobbyist with the Financial Services Forum, attacked new capital standards proposed by Sens. Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio) and David Vitter (R-La.) as "comically high."

The Brown-Vitter bill is, in fact, designed to put banks in a difficult position. As Brown told HuffPost in February, he hopes to move legislation this year to break up big banks; Vitter echoed Brown's comments on the Senate floor. By crafting a bill that requires banks with more than $400 billion in assets to hold at least 15 percent of those assets in hard capital, the senators hope to encourage the handful of multitrillion-dollar behemoths to split up into smaller firms.

Brown has been pursuing this line of attack for years, pushing a 'break up the banks' bill during the 2010 debate over the Dodd-Frank financial reform bill. Wall Street endured the heat, however, and emerged from the fracas without having to downsize.

Read more @

nailingit — April 8, 2013 at 10:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 8, 2013 at 5:21 p.m.

No beating a dead horse till it's dead, holyc.

The project has no approved permits. The USCG has not rendered a decision. Quotes given to the Feds in order to obtain federal funding for LRT were inaccurate. Local towns in the surrounding area which will see a direct impact to their traffic mobility are putting their two-cents' worth in saying they will not support the project unless the price is lowered. There is a growing opposition by elected officials on both sides of the river. Ms. Tiffany Couch in her official capacity as a proven expert, continues to point out discrepancies of the CRC which continue to build. The list goes on, holyc.

I find it a bit revealing that you had no response to my comment about the man in NYC who opposed my original thoughts about LRT and you continue to claim the CRC project opposition is kicking a dead horse. I also noticed you couldn't answer even one of the questions I'd posted at 4:12 pm yesterday but instead...chose to claim we're fighting a losing battle. Sounds a lot like the way a certain elected Democratic Official in the 49th Legislative District talks down to this constituents, you know.


goldenoldie — April 9, 2013 at 6:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal


holyc, you also stated they've spent $150 mil. thus far. Guess again, my friend. Also you said "Where do we go from here? To a cheaper place to live if we can't afford it anymore. That is how it works."

Well, no...that isn't how it works. The roll of the voter is to remove those from office who spend tax dollars like there's no tomorrow with no result other than a higher cost of living and nothing to show for it...much like the current crossing project. The uncontrolled spending is out of control and the entire project must be halted till the price is brought down. It could be done easily just by removing the entire bottom deck and install a centralized walkway like I-205. The promises made in the beginning are promises that cannot be held. We call those lies and deception.

To find a cheaper place to live...always has it's hidden expenses. There is no "cheaper" place to live unless you want to lower your quality of instead, you work together as a community and bank on improvements which do work. The current crossing project is a failure even before the first piling is driven into the ground. I certainly hope the voters take note of the folks they've elected multiple times and refrain from repeating that mistake for a fourth time in some cases.

Empty dreams do not make a city flourish. Hillsboro did not become what it is today because of light rail. Light rail has only made it a more expensive place to put up shop and to live. Traffic is still a nightmare on the west side if you haven't noticed. I don't want to see the same mistake for a city with so much hidden potential. Quantity does not make a city better. It devastates a county.

goldenoldie — April 9, 2013 at 6:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm continuing my rant on TV news commentators and TV in general. It seems to me that our country is swayed pretty easily by the idiots on the boob toob.

When our younger generation counts on the likes of Stephen Colbert or Jon Stuart for their 'news' what does that say about how we raised them.

Our society has become a nation of quips and quotes. Instant this and instant that is all that matters to a lot of the younger generation. If you can get it in less than a minute the better. We have dumbed then down so much that they don't have the wherewith-all to pay attention more than a minute. Unless it's a 'reality' show or video game, they could care less. They only work because they want a lot in a short amount of time.

I know not all of them are dumb. But the scales are tipping and we better stand up and show those that are getting dumber that if they don't wake up and smell whatever, then when it's all done and said they will wonder what the hell happened.

TBC later

JohnCasey — April 9, 2013 at 7:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

When our younger generation counts on the likes of Stephen Colbert or Jon Stuart for their 'news' what does that say about how we raised them.

JohnCasey — April 9, 2013 at 7:21 a.m

Maybe, just maybe, that makes them much smarter than we are. "We" no longer have ANYBODY that tells us the truth in the news, the best you can hope for is the lesser lie.

As for reality shows, no! They are ALL dumb, and the ones that aren't are scripted, like American Pickers.

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 9:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Goldie - Hillsboro and area is having their own moment of enlightenment. Ten years ago they could have built that route southward and over to the I5. They chose not to, and are now paying with long waits in traffic - and my own experience is that OR26 is a lot worse than I5.

roger — April 9, 2013 at 9:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

***refer to my 'journalism' post***

the fbi & US atty's office have just been called in to investigate alleged wiretapping of mitch mc cconnell's Senate Minority office.

this happened around the time ashley judd was considering running.

so. anybody gonna care? nbc? cbs? msnbc...??? ANYbody?

DeeLittle — April 9, 2013 at 10:08 a.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 9, 2013 at 10:25 a.m.

holycrapola — April 9, 2013 at 10:41 a.m.

You're still on

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 11:48 a.m. ( | suggest removal

***Anybody see this?***

CYPRESS, TX (RNN) – Multiple people have been injured after stabbings on the campus of Lone Star College Cy-Fair, according to local media outlets.

Details are still emerging, but reports of those stabbed are as many as 14 people.

The Harris County Sheriff's Department confirmed that there were stabbings on the campus and said several people have been transported to area hospitals.

Four victims were taken from the campus LifeFlight and have serious injuries according to a Robert Rasa, the Cy-Fair Volunteer Fire Department spokesman. Others are being treated at local hospitals and two victims refused treatment.

Their conditions are unknown at this time.

One witness told KHOU about what she saw after the incident.

"Just a lot of blood scattered on the floor and a girl bleeding in the stairwell," Jackie Cristobal said.

Early reports said there were possibly two suspects, but police have said the one male suspect they have detained is believed to be the only one involved in the incident. The suspect moved from building-to-building, which may have lead to the early reports of multiple attackers.

According to Harris County Sheriff's Office spokesperson Thomas Gilliland the suspect was wrestled to the ground by a student and was held there until police arrived on scene.

"As of right now we have one suspect who has been detained. The school is currently on lockdown and as the investigation continues we will be able to give you more information," he said. "We can't confirm the weapon or motive at this time, but it appears the attack was at random."

Traffic flow is moving out of the campus parking lots, but is being managed by campus police and Harris County Sheriff's Office. The Lone Star College Cy-Fair will be closed for the remainder of Tuesday.

This is the second major incident at the college system this year. In January, three people were injured in the college's North Harris County campus.

Lone Star College System is the largest institution of higher education in the Houston area, according to its web site.

***One guy with a gun could have stopped this. Irony***

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 11:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Yeah, but they probably would have sent the guy with the gun to prison, and send the guy with a knife to a mental hospital.

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 12:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Now I remember. One of your other avatars was columbiancensures or something like that, HC.

You’re still using the wrong word. Censure means to reprimand. Censor means to prohibit, like banning books.

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 12:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkeye you mean to say American Pickers is not real?Next you be saying lite beer is not lite and Diet Pepsi is not diet.What has this world come to?

timerick — April 9, 2013 at 1:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

now that there has been an attack with a knife, wounding 14-16. *2 of which are in critical condition* students at a texas campus will there be a call to ban knives?

will we see the hypocrites of hollyweird, micheal mooore, piers morgan, jim carrey, the nanny of all ninny's bloomburg and a slew of others take up "ban the knife campaign? can't wait to see what else that comes up to scream ban ban ban.

jasonb — April 9, 2013 at 4:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

goldie and roger: According to Andrea Damewood of WW, Ray LaHood is coming to Olympia tomorrow to lobby for CRC funds.

manthou — April 9, 2013 at 4:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Here's another big news item from our new AG, Bob Ferguson. He is filing a discrimination and consumer protection lawsuit against a florist who refused to provide services to an engaged gay couple for their wedding.

This is gutsy and will be a real test case, probably going all the way to the WA Supreme Court:

[link text][1]


manthou — April 9, 2013 at 4:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — April 9, 2013 at 4:59 p.m.

Pretty gutsy move, McKenna would never do that.

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 6:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — April 9, 2013 at 1:37 p.m.

I'm sure it's "real" to a point. A lot of it is staged and heavily edited.

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 6:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Gutsy on who’s part, Manthou?

You may recall a similar issue a couple of months ago about a bakery in Gresham. [][1] David and Goliath if you ask me.

This is just another example of a coercive government, depriving individuals of their own freedom to enter into voluntary associations. If the bakery or the floral shop want to turn away business, it should be their business. Funny how some talk diversity, so long as it fits into their own idea of diversity, but then use government to force others into homogeneity, because they don’t like someone else’s values. People vote with their dollars, and will naturally decide the issue. In the meantime, there are plenty of other bakeries and floral shops.


There’s a story in the news today, about the National Spelling Bee making some changes. Have you ever noticed, I’m sure you all have, how disproportionately, young people of asian ancestry, are so well represented in the spelling bee. Also the National Geography Bee. Ever watch the Jeopary Teen Tournament? Seems to me, that the same holds true in every walk of life. Just why is that? Do these high acheivers all go to expensive private schools, or is there some other reason why they are succesful beyond their numbers.


kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 6:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Interesting - Andrea's article says LaHood is meeting with Gov Inslee at 10:15, and then will have press time afterward. Meanwhile, both the House and the Senate caucus from 10:00 to 1:00. They also canceled their Transportation Committee meetings today, and I'm not seeing them rescheduled. I'm trying to muddle my way through the current Senate version of the Transportation bill - Sure as hell wished they used normal English to write these things.

roger — April 9, 2013 at 6:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 6:36 p.m.

I have been a steadfast and outspoken advocate of marriage equality, but when the government dictates who does business with whom, they have gone too far. If someone chooses to make a possibly detrimental business decision, that is their right. We should worry about paying for our schools before we try to enforce state sanctioned thought on businesses.

frobert — April 9, 2013 at 6:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 6:36 p.m.

frobert — April 9, 2013 at 6:57 p.m.

So what I'm reading Fro and kn_d is that if YOU walked into a store and tried to buy a widget and they refused to sell it to you because they didn't like the way you looked, you'd be OK with that? Well good for you but not everybody feels the same way and that's what laws are for. We are, after all, supposed to be "equal", are we not?

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 7:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — April 9, 2013 at 9:21 a.m.

That's exactly what I'm speaking of, roger. Just today, I was out and about in Beaverton, Tigard and Sherwood (didn't quite make it to Hillsboro)...and all the evidence of *Progress* flourished with new high density housing, roadways to the yin yang, light rail and WES train tracks...shops and stores and minit marts (many standing empty). Roads pitted with chuckholes that would break the axle on any smaller hybrid!!! Thank goodness we were in an SUV with good shocks. Where PGE once stood as a district office, it has since moved out and is now a library with video stores and whatnots surrounding it. Hardly recognizable. And downtown Beaverton??? What a headache!!! Talk about a driving nightmare!!! It gives a distinct clue as to what downtown Vancouver would be like with MAX. Talk about ***YUCK!!!***

Progress at some point costs a lot more than just the construction...a cost that nobody sees coming till after it's done and that's the traffic headaches, increased pollution, more crime that typically follows the higher density living...yeah, progress. Uncontrolled progress. Beaverton is a great example that Vancouver could certainly learn a lesson or two from when it comes to poor planning and lack of funding to maintain their roads and construction needs.

The problem with progress is the fact that planners don't stick to one plan. They keep changing the rules...keep changing the ideas and zoning laws midstream and the end result doesn't nearly match what the original intentions were.

I did see one neighborhood which I was quite impressed with, though. It was a definite cluster development a bit farther away from the clusterf... city center of Beaverton...complete with high-density housing, parks, walkways, schools, fire department...even a nice lake for trout fishermen...everything. And the stores and entertainment concept...they too were grouped together. Not exactly my type of living, but it suited the needs of the community and was quite organized. You didn't see a bunch of mini malls standing half empty. All spaces were full...and there were no real estate signs, either. And guess what??? There wasn't a single rail track around. No light rail whatsoever!!! They did have roundabouts nearby, too. We were driving through there about 4:00 this afternoon and traffic was light. If you've ever been to the Big Al's near the New Season's in Washington County, you might know the neighborhood I speak of. When we entered downtown Beaverton...fughettabout it!!!

goldenoldie — April 9, 2013 at 7:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou and roger...thanks for the info on Ray Lahood as well as the Transportation Committee. Hopefully, the facts will speak for themselves and the right decisions will be made.

goldenoldie — April 9, 2013 at 8:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — April 9, 2013 at 4:59 p.m

Seriously? Flowers are a form of personal expression, and that's why the florist denied flowers to a wedding?

Silly me, I thought flower were sold to make money. I thought flowers were overpriced window dressing for overpriced gala productions of pomp and self-indulgence, and for pleasing inlaws. And I thought, as with most living things, flowers were about attraction... sex... pollination, and procreation, even when flowers are asexual.

Then again, flowers are in my backyard. I do nurture them. So, maybe they are a form of personal expression...if I am talking about beauty, or soil, or digging in the dirt.

Perhaps the shop owner should have stuck to only her religions reasons for denying commerce with gay weddings, and not put the product itself, which she most likely sells to other weddings, right in the middle of her lawyer's letter to the State.

jacjak — April 9, 2013 at 8:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 7:57 p.m.

Businesses have the right to refuse service to anyone. All it takes is one comment from either side (one showing obvious prejudice or the other assuming someone is showing prejudice) and it can be blown out of proportion and people are quick to throw out the discrimination card. Too bad for those who were refused service. It's too bad that something like this still happens nowadays...but in doing so, it'll probably drum up a lot of business for the company by those who stand in agreement with the person who refused service....kind of a backfire.

goldenoldie — April 9, 2013 at 8:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal everybody will know where I was getting my stats from in my post on the 8th @4:12 pm., thanks to the article entitled "Report challenges CRC bridge cost statements," although I have Mister Lew Waters and Ms. Tiffany Couch to thank for bringing to the attention of the people prior to the C's report. Nice one again, Tiffany!!!

The truth always prevails!!!

goldenoldie — April 9, 2013 at 8:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 7:57 p.m.

I am denied commerce at many businesses in Vancouver if I exercise my right to bear arms, and that is a Constitutional right. If I dress like a tweaker and try to rent a nice hotel room, I will be turned away.
I support marriage equality completely, unlike liberals who support marriage equality for a select few. The Government however has no right interfering with whom I choose to do business with.

frobert — April 9, 2013 at 8:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

frobert — April 9, 2013 at 6:57 p.m.

I’ve always understood, and agreed with you on that Frobert, and most everything else. With some exceptions. I’m sure you recall the comments on the same sex marriage debate from months ago.

Here’s the funny thing about all of that; plural marriage. And Incestual marriage as far as that goes. It all comes down to just what right others have to use government to enforce their will against others' personal liberty, ostensibly for the greater good.

50 years ago, the idea of same sex marriage was incomprehensible, laughable, to the hoi polloi. That was then. Now the idea of multiple partner marriage is incomprehensible, disgusting, even while the idea of two men being married to one another is passe.

I recall some time ago, that when this issue was raised on FB to J. Moeller, he fluffed it off and said something about his fight was about same sex marriage. Understandable, as the issue of other types of marriage opens up a whole new can of worms and Moeller, and others, wouldn't want to muck up the works with an even broader issue of government butting out.

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 8:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 7:57 p.m

Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying.

Just what do you think would happen to a business that acquired a reputation of turning away ugly customers?

Exceptional circumstances, such as Jim Crow laws, may require exceptional intervention, but this isn't one of them.

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 9:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Kn_dalai: My wife and I have been together for 13 years.We do not have a licence to be married.We were married in a church with all kids with us.I do not feel that the government has any right to tell me I need a licence to be with the one I love.I guess what I am saying is people can do what they deem as right in their minds to do what ever makes them happy.Life is short do what you need to do to make it the best for you.

timerick — April 9, 2013 at 9:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Libertarians gone wild! Gawd help us! :)))

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 9:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

My God Nail first Hawkeye tells me that American Pickers are not real and now this from you.I think I m starting to turn in to a progressive.What are you guys doing to me.My brother may start talking to me once again.

timerick — April 9, 2013 at 9:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

The Libertarian movement, (assuming there is one) seems to have a heavy hitter vying for leadership. He must have run the numbers for this niche market and is giving it a go.

My guess is he'll do quite well. I can see his *repeal civil rights* coffee mugs now!

*If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull.*

~W. C. Fields~

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 9:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*I m starting to turn in to a progressive.What are you guys doing to me.My brother may start talking to me once again.*

timerick — April 9, 2013 at 9:39 p.m.

Improving family relationships can only be good! The water is refreshing and the grass is meaner on the other side. Come on over!

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 9:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

what I find odd is that not one you have mentioned the events of today in texas.
oh but if it would have been a crazy with a gun this forum would be lit up more than a christmas tree in a town square crying for gun control! hollyweird would be in a frenzy pumping out info- commercials about how bad guns are. elected would be faking sadness with a squeezed tear seeking a microphone and anyone that will listen, crying "gun control is what we need"!

true if it had been a gun, it could have been a lot worse. today's event just proves it's not the instrument it's the crazy whom holds it that kills.

jasonb — April 9, 2013 at 9:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Holycrap! What's up with the censure tests HC? Did you have something removed?

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 10:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal


It seems to me that you have totally misunderstood my comments.

It is not the government’s business who you are with. It is certainly none of my business. It is your own life and liberty which includes your own freedom of association.

By like token, it is not the government’s business to dictate who a business must associate with. Even if others find this reprehensible. Consumers can take their business elsewhere. This is what a free society is about.

Please reread my previous comments.

Progressive? Just what do you think that means in a political sense? Finally, once again, I’d like someone to explain what the difference is between Progressive and Socialist. I can’t see a dimes worth of difference. And just who are the ones who want to funnel everything through government? I've always preferred the word Collectivist as more all inclusive.

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 10:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 9:07 p.m.

frobert — April 9, 2013 at 8:16 p.m

kn_d, I understand your problem, but I can't help it if you are (to be delicate) not a handsome person. Unfortunately, it isn't against the law to discriminate against ugly.

And you, Fro, you have the right to carry anywhere you want unless a person who owns a private business or home doesn't want you to. But that doesn't mean you can't leave your gun at home and go there. The Constitution says you have the right to keep and bear arms but you don't have the right to take them anywhere you want, like a courthouse. But we are talking apples and oranges here. Discrimination is against the law and telling someone they can't buy from you because you are Gay is discrimination and is specifically against the law.

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 10:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jasonb — April 9, 2013 at 9:59 p.m.

Can I please direct your attention to my post of:

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 11:52 a.m.

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 10:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*Please reread my previous comments.*

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 10:08 p.m.

kn_d- Perhaps you're taking our free society for granted.

Had you made your previous suggestion in the U.K., Scotland Yard would be at your door.

You'd be in flagrant violation of the U.K. Human Rights Act of 1998

**Article 3:** Inhuman treatment

No one shall be subjected to torture or to inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 10:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 10:35 p.m.

Funny. But a little backwards 'cause even though I have been said to look like a pomegranate with warts, if I followed your thinking, then I'd be using government to pass laws against discriminating against people who look like - pomegranate's with warts. Which I don't do. I just take my business elsewhere without interfering in someone else's own rights.

Hmmm. Somewhere in there, I think there's a message.

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 10:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Who leads the Libertarian movement (if one exists) today?

Consider Sarah, still going strong in Wasilla. She could easily grab the republican reins as the leading voice for libertarian thought/philosophy.

Here's a write from 08' making the libertarian case for the Republican Vice Presidential candidate in 2008, Sarah Palin.

**The Libertarian Case for Palin**

The potential political consequences of Sarah Palin have been chewed over from every imaginable angle.

Though there is plenty to ponder, one thing is certain: libertarian-inclined voters should be encouraged. No, I'm not suggesting that your little Molly will be bringing home "The Road to Serfdom" from her (distinctly non-public) elementary school. *But in contrast to any national candidate in recent memory, Palin is the one that exudes the economic and cultural sensibilities of a geniune Western-style libertarian.*

Read more @

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 11:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I just take my business elsewhere without interfering in someone else's own rights.

kn_dalai — April 9, 2013 at 10:57 p.m.

And that's your right!

But riddle me this, if you went to a store that had the best bagels you had ever tasted and you bought a bag every week, and then one day you came out of the closet and they found out and REFUSED to sell to you, wouldn't you be pissed? I know I would especially knowing what they are doing is illegal. It's just wrong. Might just as well put up a sign that says No Gays, no Blacks, no Asians, No foreigners, Whites ONLY.

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 11:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 11:21 p.m.


Who is going to explain to her what a Libertarian is?

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 11:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

All this stuff happened centuries ago, right? I mean I don't blame Sarah. It's not like it happened yesterday.

Just like I can't wholly blame libertarians/conservatives for not wrapping their heads around the 21st century and the reasonable application of government thing. It's too hard. Read a newspaper? Naw..papers, news, (except for Fox) all crooked. Can't trust a one of em'.

Some even believe rape can't cause pregnancy! What's a person to do? Get educated? That's not government's job!

Sarah in 2016! The Libertarian's Choice!

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 11:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*Who is going to explain to her what a Libertarian is?*

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 11:27 p.m.

If she'd cough up some of that SarahPac money and spring for a weekend's entertainment, I'll chat with her.

She reminds me a bit of our night service maid we had at the Hawaiian resort a couple years back. Did you ever leave a tip?

Anywho, God knows she could use some new consultants, and I work pretty cheap.

nailingit — April 9, 2013 at 11:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

hawkeye — April 9, 2013 at 11:24 p.m.

Yeah, I wouldn’t like it. So what. Then I go home and make my own bagels, or go down the street and buy from the guy who prospers from all of those who no longer want to take their business to the other guy up the street. That’s real democracy, where you vote with your wallet.

Just how many businesses would be around next year if they had signs that said no gays, no asians…. This is not like the Jim Crow South of yesteryears, in which it was ingrained in the culture and local gov to deny citizens their constitutionally guaranteed rights, and there was no alternative. The Federal government stepped, as they should have.

Now things have gone the other way, where some pass laws denying others of their own freedoms of association. That’s a problem as far as I’m concerned.

Respect other’s rights to their own sensibilties and move on. Shouldn’t be a big deal. You don’t like it, go someplace else.

In the end, the truth is the truth, and this situation doesn’t require the heavy hand of gov.

kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 12:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Did not one you see where Annette has passed away? Oh god, she was my first true TV crush. Thank you Disney!! I grew up watching the club.

And those movies. OMG They don't make them like that anymore. What a great actress. They haven't made a good movie in Hollywood since 'Beach Blanket Bingo', have they?

I know she couldn't act her way out of a paper bag but she was my eye candy anyway. And you just know that them there peeverts were well aware of it at corporate.

JohnCasey — April 10, 2013 at 4:07 a.m. ( | suggest removal

She was one in a million, JohnCasey. She will be missed by many, although she will live on in her movies and her public role in battling neurological disorders.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 5:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 12:37 a.m. (and all others you've posted on the subject):

Said very well and you hit the bullseye, my friend. some people just don't grasp the concept very well that reverse discrimination comes in many forms...including the right to religious freedom when running your company. As I'd said before...some are quick to pull the discrimination card out...just to make a name for themselves.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 6:02 a.m. ( | suggest removal


That fuzzy math means a lot to the commuters who will be shouldering the brunt of the tolling. And take a look at the project maps - it looks like a lot of the roadwork on the Oregon side is to give truckers an easier route to Jubitz, an upgrade to the Hayden Meadows area, and a few other fixes in the Delta Park area that were stuck in there to keep the Pier 99 crowd quiet. Oregon has no idea where their cost share will be paid from after they exhaust the excess federal funds they say will cover the first 2-3 years.

Both gov'ts - WA and OR - are blowing smoke at us. Neither can afford this project in the near to mid term future. WSDOT, through Jim Moeller and friends in the House, is trying to fund it with gas taxes. OR Metro is much more open - they will continue to push for tolling the I205. As far as they're concerned, personally owned cars are a thing of the past that need to go away. And there's more than a little being said that indicates WA will follow that lead, especially if enough people divert from the I5 to avoid the tolls.

I commute - so I have a personal stake. And the more I see, the more I'd like this whole project to fail. Others cry about light rail; my main concern with that has to do with it's pretty much useless to anyone who doesn't plan on going to the downtown Portland area, Clackamas Mall, downtown Gresham, or one of the other locations on the lines. TriMet's bus routes are the most screwed up I've ever seen anywhere - they don't provide the adequate support an LRT system needs to be successful. Which is why so few in the Portland area currently use it (in comparison to total working day traffic), and why their ridership numbers are steadily dropping on every line except the Blue.

My bigger concern is that OR is having us pay for their refusal to fix their streets themselves - their transportation dollars have been used to support their LRT system, and street maintenance has been ignored. Mayor Hales is refocusing back to streets, but they need a lot more cash than is available. And we are their golden goose.

roger — April 10, 2013 at 6:48 a.m. ( | suggest removal

holyc...(*Yeah*, you knew it was coming, lol.)

We know numbers are juggled BEFORE a contract is finalized. From the beginning, the CRC has misled the people, even manipulated the "public" meetings till the last moment to keep opposition away early on in the game. Their carefully-selected advisory committees were an early indication of issues. Voters were robbed of honesty and integrity by elected officials who had vested interests in the project not revealed till after they were in office. Once it went to the Feds, that was written in stone...but not according to them. Dean & Associates had $50 mil. to do their part in this project. They've gone over $80 mil. above and the final design isn't approved. In the current proposal, special interest projects such as restoration of the Hood River Channel, +80 miles away...the Lewis River restoration...+20 miles north of the exorbitant cost request for the Ruby Junction Maintenance Facility which surpasses last year's costs and a prior year's costs combined by over $40 million (obviously ballooned out of proportion for something they're refusing to reveal) to the Steel Bridge (not in the project construction zone)...a museum...

Thanks to the work of Ms. Couch and a legally-binding contract with Madore who was once a private citizen and now a county commissioner by an overwhelming majority vote (someone you clearly show your distrust), she currently works pro bono on this information she releases according to sources; has opened the eyes to many who hadn't a clue...the corruption and misleading documentation...and it has solidified the stance of opposition to the project to the point that the elected officials cannot ignore, even though three who represent Clark County and others at the city level who are trying their hardest and making themselves look ever more like the fool. Remember when the CRC people said it would be around $3.2 billion? or when we have been saying the project cost could easily surpass $10 billion???

Tell me this, holyc...which dollar amount is more tangible here, considering the FACTS presented by Ms. Couch???

We're not talking of a small-jobs contract...we're talking billions of dollars which the taxpayers will have to repay for well over 70+ years...and no evidence to support such a ridiculous cost since expansion of the light rail segment of the project will never happen and traffic will still be a nightmare through the Rose Quarter region.

You should be glad to see people are standing up and fighting for the rights of the citizens...and more are joining in the fight on our side. It's our civic duty to fight unfair taxation without representation. The decision is not final. The project is still hanging in the rafters, holyc. It's far from beating a dead horse as you call it.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 6:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal

**Jon Stewart Hammers Red State Laws With 'Sodomy! Zygotes! Welfare!**' **(VIDEO)**

Jon schools us about the role of government. Did anyone else know Virginia has been trying to outlaw oral sex (as well as anal) between two consenting adults?

Part of what makes the Libertarian club laughable, is they stay silent on these types of constitutional abuses, but will spout pro personal choice/freedom positions. (accept on abortion of course) Down with Jim Crow but up with no BJ's?

Our country has remained a two party system, much due to the Libertarian group. The libertarian's have highlighted how absurd some can be when left to their own devices, and makes voting Dem or Pub the only viable option.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 7:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

**GOP’s backward sexual politics**

*The party’s “war on women” continues, but now it’s being fought with antiquated weapons*

Long before Gov. Eliot Spitzer and Sen. David Vitter, Abraham Lincoln paid prostitutes. And he contracted syphilis. Long before — and here you can supply whichever name comes to mind first — James A. Garfield was a great womanizer, who told his wife (repeatedly) that it would never happen again. The two presidents did not have to face the press and answer questions about their private conduct –- and it’s not because they were assassinated first. Nineteenth-century voters did not know national politicians in the intimate way we’re getting to know the private predilections of ours.

So while it’s true that the media of that time didn’t stalk candidates in the ravenous manner it’s done today, in most other respects, the moral definitions of the 19th century are still very much with us, and we seem oblivious. It’s not just the 1950s the Republicans wish to return to — they’re actually stuck in the 19th century.


There is no more instructive example than the much heralded reemergence of former South Carolina Gov. Mark Sanford. Some have praised his honesty in admitting a mistake, never minding the fact that, freshly smitten with his Argentine soul mate, he lied and lied (and misappropriated taxpayer money) until he was finally caught.


What the Sanford affair really tells us is how the Republicans’ adherence to moribund standards of masculine performance won’t go away. Because they don’t believe in gender equality – which, as you’ll soon see, relates directly to their anxiety over gay marriage.


The Republicans who would forgive and forget Sanford’s South American romp are the same ones who have steadfastly rejected gay marriage. They claim that if society endorses gay marriage, we’ll all be headed down that slippery slope from polygamy to bestiality. As laughable as the argument sounds, it has a historical foundation among mid-19th-century evangelicals and their opposition to divorce. They described marital dissolution as the gateway to hell, leading to “free love” and polygamy.

Before the ideology underlying companionate marriage became common in modern times, “free love” was the idea that people could select their partner when they first fell in love, and when love faded should be free to follow their heart and find a new, more suitable spouse. Old-time evangelicals preached against free love and Mormon polygamy in the same breath. The evangelicals who couldn’t see their way to voting for the Mormon Mitt Romney were replicating what they never really left behind –- the 19th-century anti-Mormon rhetoric and the confiscation of polygamists’ property that sent Romney’s people to Mexico.’s_backward_sexual_politics/

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 8:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 7:52 a.m.

I’ve been through this twice before, in recent memory.

The political spectrum can be viewed as two extremes with libertarian on one end and totalitarian on the other. Most everyone is a mixture of the two with those on the Right being more libertarian on economics and totalitarian on social issues and those on the Left being more totalitarian on the economic issues and more libertarian on the social issues.


The situation you describe in your post, has nothing to do with Libertarian.

And once again, nobody cares what a woman does with her own body. The problem is what a woman does with someone else’s body. Many believe that abortion is nothing less than murder. Personally, I believe that Roe v. Wade was the best decision that could be made on this most difficult issue, but respect others right to object and even to try and overturn it. What I don’t respect is referring to abortion as women’s health care, reproductive rights and other euphemisms. The issue will only eventually be resolved by some new technology, whatever that will be, which will make the subject moot. IMHO.


kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 8:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Really? A wiki link? (yawn) Although symbolic of your movement.

*What I don’t respect is referring to abortion as women’s health care, reproductive rights and other euphemisms.*

And spoken from a senior white male's viewpoint, right?

*The issue will only eventually be resolved by some new technology,*

As to your assertion, outside of replacing us with droids, what part of free choice are you not understanding?

Why aren't you and your ilk denouncing proposed sex laws in Virginia and other red controlled states?

What happened to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of happiness? The principles of The Declaration of Independence are being trashed daily in Red states and your group stays silent.


nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 9:08 a.m. ( | suggest removal

One could say Virginia Republicans are making getting ahead that much harder.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 9:16 a.m. ( | suggest removal


This stuff just shouldn't be that hard to understand.

Just to pick one of your items, unless the proposed laws that you are describing are being passed unanimously, then those with libertarian ideas on these matters, are denouncing them.

kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 9:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

:)) The silent minority, objection by deduction! :))

Maybe frobert can pipe in with something more reasonable.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 10:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal

...or objection by assumption? :)) Your reasoning is only understandable by those with a pie in the sky philosophy, such as was front and center with..

*The issue will only eventually be resolved by some new technology, whatever that will be*

Again, what part of personal freedom are you not getting?

People are risking their lives daily defending what you so easily put on the chopping block. Women's rights aren't any different. Freedom isn't free, and to marginalize such a large part of our population well..... reminds one of the 2012 elections.

Keep it up! (you might have to if you live in Virginia) Your republican party will continue to lose elections.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 10:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal


You've got it all backwards. The people who need to move to Portland are the ones who are complaining we need the new bridge with light rail. They're the ones inconvenienced by rush hour traffic, bridge lifts, and really really looking forward to being able to ride the MAX downtown so they can socialize with the diverse culture in that area. I don't have a problem with the rush hour traffic - I've seen lots worse in other places. To me, it's an acceptable tradeoff for being able to live in the suburban community of Vantucky.

roger — April 10, 2013 at 11:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal

With some republicans, politics have been reduced to a free lunch at a costume party.

It's not a club or a sorority guys, it's a democracy . It's the only one we have so please quit trying to screw it up with repressive lawmaking birthed from religious ideology. You are shaming our country and mocking our very foundation.

I posted a lengthier more detailed CPAC vid a few weeks ago, but this sums current GOP intellect/philosophy up rather well. You don't have to cherry pick, the fruits already off their tree.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 11:25 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Maybe you should actually try to understand what I have written, nail.

Better yet, maybe you should stop your daily fanatical channel surfing and web surfing of Leftist sites, and spend some time on understanding political ideas at a more fundamental level.

Understanding the basis of things, might actually help you to make more sense out of your Leftist, pop culture inspired outlook on everything.

I really should have known better than to try to engage, one such as yourself.

kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 11:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 11:36 a.m.

*Maybe you should actually try to understand what I have written, nail.*

Seems as though you spend considerable forum time telling folks they're not understanding what you're saying. Perhaps it's not the message, but rather the messenger. Regardless..

You do understand you answered no inquiry, but deflected all personal opinion, then channeled some weird tutorial on "leftism" while chastising what you believe to be a personal shortcoming in literary preference on my part. (God forbid you should read about current affairs:).

How can you possibly understand liberalism/progressivism/fill-in-the-blank philosophy if you can't or won't understand your own beliefs, let alone defend them.

It helps me understand why most republicans refuse to hold their elected politician's feet to the fire.

Either they don't care or it's for lack of understanding.


To repeat:

*As to your assertion, outside of replacing us with droids, what part of free choice are you not understanding?*

*Why aren't you and your ilk denouncing proposed sex laws in Virginia and other red controlled states?*

*What happened to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of happiness? The principles of The Declaration of Independence are being trashed daily in Red states and your group stays silent.*


nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 9:08 a.m.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 12:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola, you have made an accusation that Tiffany Couch is Madore's hired hand. Care to prove that? She has said from the beginning that she was entered into a contract by Madore to conduct an independent analysis. Is it because she was chosen by Madore rather than someone else? Is that your reasoning? If it is, then it's a laaaaaaaame-O excuse by you if you cannot come up with evidence to back your statement.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 1:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

This could very well have been Vantucky. Has Frick n' Frack honored the many Muslims in our community? How about a little Russian Orthodoxy? Let's get some Jews and Jehova's witnesses on this. How about Mormons praying for the dead? Where's the Angel Macaroni when you need him/her? Listen closely, was that Frack prayin' to lord Reagan?

Wake up people!

**Michele Presnell, North Carolina Lawmaker, Links Islamic Prayer To Terrorism: Report**

North Carolina state Rep. Michele Presnell (R-Burnsville) linked Islamic prayer to terrorism in an email sent to a constituent, the News & Observer reported Tuesday.

In an email exchange obtained by the Raleigh newspaper, **Presnell was asked by a constituent if she would support an Islamic prayer being said before a state legislative meeting.**

**"No, I do not condone terrorism," Presnell responded, according to the report. "We just need to start taking a stand on our religious freedom or it will be whisked away from us."**

The email exchange between Presnell and the constituent, Britt Kaufmann, began over Presnell's support for House Resolution 494, a bill that would allow North Carolina to declare an official state religion. Presnell was a co-sponsor of the bill, which was killed by the legislature's Republican speaker last week. Kaufmann wrote to Presnell to express opposition to the proposal.

The Huffington Post's John Celock reported on the North Carolina bill last week:
The bill, which was drafted by state Reps. Carl Ford (R-China Grove) and Harry Warren (R-Salisbury), was intended to address an issue in Rowan County, **where the ACLU has filed a lawsuit against the county commission in an attempt to block commissioners from having a Christian prayer at the beginning of meetings.**

The North Carolina measure responds to the ACLU suit by declaring that each state is "sovereign" and **no federal court can prevent a state from "from making laws respecting an establishment of religion."** Though **Warren, one of the bill's authors, told HuffPost Live that the measure was not seeking to create a state religion, the drafted legislation would clearly allow for such an action.**

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 1:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Get ready to be sick and destitute???? A rather bold statement I'd say. Our health care will be provided by Obama's Health Care Plan, remember??? Destitute? If you think seniors aren't starving and poor now, holyc...then you need to pull your head out of the ground and take a good look around you.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 1:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Someone on here reminds me of Peanuts cartoon I saw recently with Lucy and Schroeder..

Lucy: Repubs are racist, sexist, homophobic, gun-toting religious fanatics

Schroeder: But you support the Muslims who are racist,sexist, homophobic, gun-toting religious fanatics


Lucy: That's their culture. You have no right to judge them.

ELISI — April 10, 2013 at 1:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

goldie: I do think that Tiffany Couch's politics are getting in the way of her ability to be an objective evaluator as far as the CRC goes.

Her entire business is wrapped around this fair and objective promise. It is her integrity that is on the line. She probably can be objective with most contracts, but this CRC thing has become an unhealthy obsession with her. She sends out all these press releases, which is her right, I guess. After awhile, no one reads them. Or at least traditional publishers in the business of news don't.

I know some prosecutors who do the same thing. Eventually, they hang themselves with their zealous overreach.

She may lose some local business over her politics, but she probably has so much it won't matter.

Just my thoughts on it. I don't want to start a big ol' fight over it.

manthou — April 10, 2013 at 2:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

-yawn- Seems like this more of a panic forum this week than a discussion. Ad nauseum pls

andrecht — April 10, 2013 at 2:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Holyc I don't know if Madore has any thing to gain from the CRC.But will tell you to look at all the good old boys with all the old Vancouver money that are supporting this.Why do you think that a new apartment building is being built at the old Burgerville site.Why was such a sweetheart deal made to This developer.Look also at who owns Grammer development.Look at the sweetheart deal that was made to Arch Miller for the old Fort Vancouver buildings.Why was the Hilton put where it is.Look at the Angelo condos across from Esther Short Park.You think that these and numerous other projects were put there because the land was available.No. All these were done because they knew that light rail was going to be forced on us.Kind of makes one wonder how they knew about this so many years ago.You don't think insider information had any thing to do with it do you.Not to stick up for Madore,I think he can do that on his own,but the fact is he has not been in this community long enough to belong to that group.And I don't think they would wellcome him with open arms.And I forgot one that has the power to convince people and that would be Scott Campbell.

timerick — April 10, 2013 at 3:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick: All our shared anxieties about downtown development reminds me of the issues that the hippie dippie artsy fartsy Fremont dwellers in Seattle decried when landowner/developer Suzie Burke got to working her magic there a few years ago.

Now Fremont is hot, hot, hot. Some say it's lost its charm, but I do not agree. I think it is hella expensive, but maybe that was the goal.

Point is: our Suzie Burkes are Kassab, Angelo, Oliva, Hidden: the masters of the Couviverse who also happen to give back to this community, too, at the end of the day. I celebrate their success.

I do think that rents are going to skyrocket for those downtown and Uptown who do not own their buildings. I think we should lobby the city to do something to help those long-time businesses like yours stay put. They gave Al Angelo a tax break on Heritage Condos. They gave Kassab one on Prestige Plaza (the one at Burgerville). Maybe something to support rent control or ???.

That is a question to pose to the Mayoral candidates.

manthou — April 10, 2013 at 3:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm not going to argue that a new bridge is needed.It is the design of this one that needs to change.And I agree that moving people across the bridge is needed.It has been proven time and again that express bus's can move as many or more people with less cost and it also gets people closer to where they work.Putting light rail to Clark College does not solve that problem,if fact it creates more problem as we have a parking problem at Clark now.If they could run the rail across a redesigned rail crossing and run the rail to the existing park and rides in Hazel Dell and Salmon Creek than it may get people behind the project.But we have been told that that is not possible.But I have not heard a good explaination as to why not.I would not be aganst independent auditors.But who would hire them?I do not trust the CRC board to do that and there are others like you that don't trust Couch.And I am not sure I would trust the State or the Feds to do that either.

timerick — April 10, 2013 at 4:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 10, 2013 at 2:15 p.m.

You said it yourself earlier that you believe there should be a whole team running the audit. You've also said in the past under your other avatar that you never have to worry about retirement...lounging around in your sailboat on any given day just because you can and haven't a care about using I-5 into one state or the other.

Would you be willing to pay for a Certified Public Accountant who is also Certified in Financial Forensics and a Certified Fraud Examiner??? David Madore was willing and how 'bout it, holyc??? Care to take the plunge???

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 4:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — April 10, 2013 at 2:22 p.m.

Never be hesitant to share your thoughts and opinions, manthou. That's what a forum is for...and no big ol' fight is in the works....just an exchange of well-thought points of view. In fact, you bring up a valid point.

In response to your comment...Tiffany runs an established company here in Vancouver...another one yet to face the wrath of increased sales taxes, fees, tolls, etc. If you look at her work, she is quite meticulous in her findings and mentions the suggestion of further investigation but at no time says anything in her reports to suggest she has an ulterior motive. Compare her findings to the findings of other auditors and their way of verbalizing the reports and you'll find they're almost identical. The facts speak for themselves. She was contracted to run an audit and she did what she is highly qualified to do.

I do have a few questions for you to think about...

She is a resident of Vancouver, Washington. She pays taxes...could pay tolls and fees in the not too distant future in order to support the crossing project. As a resident of Vancouver, doesn't she have the right to voice her opinion on the subject???

Doesn't she have a right to fight for what she believes in?

Because she knows what she found in an official capacity, shows all the earmarks of corruption and finagling (boy, that's an old word) and is public record...and as a citizen as well as business owner here in our fine city of Vancouver, why shouldn't she use the found information to support her opinion? She definitely has the facts to back up her statements.

In the case of Representative Moeller, in his capacity as State Rep, he has been quite vocal regarding his support of the crossing WITH light rail. He's on the House Transportation Committee in Olympia, struggling to gain support for a hefty sum of money for the crossing project which taxpayers will have to pay shouldn't Tiffany have as much right to voice her concerns as he does his opinion on the matter?

And manthou...please understand that when we discuss issues such as this, there's nothing personal in our discussion. I'm interested in your rebuttal and hope we can continue on this discussion in a positive way. I truly enjoy when we share in our comments...even when we disagree with each other.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 4:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 10, 2013 at 4:32 p.m.

Yes, I wanted you to prove your assumption regarding Madore and Couch. You've made the accusation, now prove your claim.

Regarding paying towards an audit...I was proving a point, holyc. Not everybody has the funding to pay for such an audit and the cost is something most cannot afford. Because Madore took the plunge after finding out about the crossing project and was disgusted with what he found, all of a sudden he's a bad guy in your eyes because he had the dinero to do so???

Holyc, I still remember that first conversation. I even suggested to him that he should run for office and he wasn't interested. Neither of us knew each other's political affiliation. There was no politics in the discussion back then. He thanked me several times for "enlightening" the people on the subject...and it was genuine. If you remember years back, I also made the big push for high capacity transit instead of light rail. That too came up in discussion between us and sparked his interest. Was he disingenuous??? Not at all. When he was at the BRT open house that I attended, he was trying to find out all he could about it. He had major concerns and shared them with the folks who ran the open house as we all did. It wasn't the "David Madore Show." In fact, he remained silent, taking notes all the I did and so did others who included business owners, commuters, families...the community.

The difference between C-Tran and the CRC...from the beginning of the bus rapid transit idea, C-tran had made it well known about the open houses and meetings and involved all the people. CRC had a limited group from the beginning with very little public notice. You've gotta ask yourself why it is that the CRC was so quiet in their first few years, holyc. If you don't know the answer...

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 5 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"Somehow, all the good stuff is happening in Portland. Vancouver can't even catch up!" -- holycrapola — April 10, 2013 at 12:10 p.m.

Sorry - You spoke too soon. Integra announced they're bailing on Portland for the old HP/SEH site over past Fishers Landing. Portland's downtown has been losing major businesses for years; this loss is large enough that there's some hand-wringing going on down there.

roger — April 10, 2013 at 5:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HolyC - How can you be raising hell about the gov't wanting to pick our pockets by cutting back on Social Security (and even Pres Obama is playing the game of calling it a benefit rather than something we've paid for), yet you've got no problem with them bending us commuters over to get the money to build a bridge with LRT? Both moves involve taking from one hand to put into another.

roger — April 10, 2013 at 5:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*because just becoming dust and the trip is over seems to make no least to me...*

holycrapola — April 10, 2013 at 4:01 p.m.

I hear you holy. There's more to the sum of our existence than this. This life but a fraction...

Great vids. I was listening to Floyd Ummagumma so inserted it as background tunes. Great mix with some green.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 5:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — April 10, 2013 at 5:15 p.m.

Looks like Holyc's "silicon valley" ideas are already beginning to happen here...and they're moving into a complex as far away from light rail as they possibly can, too! Smart move!!!

Your 5:21 p.m. comment to Holyc...excellent point! I guess if it doesn't fit their ideals, it's ripping the people off. It would be interesting to see the numbers comparison with cutbacks to SSI and medicare/CRC.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 5:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal

goldie: Oh, yes. I certainly support Tiffany Couch's right to express herself politically. No problem there. That is not the issue. She can do that any way she pleases, but that does not mean that she will convince me because she is too committed to a certain outcome: the downfall of the CRC. That makes her a biased evaluator. Just as biased, I would say, as having the CRC do a self-evaluation.

She is expressing her free speech through a process, forensic accounting, that is supposed to be objective.

That is kinda like a surgeon operating on their own child.

Too close. Too emotional to allow the professional objectivity needed to do the best job possible.

Her politics ruin her credibility.

Anyone else can help me explain this conflict-of-interest better?

She can analyze the CRC 6 ways to Sunday and, if I were ever cross-examining her in court on this, say, I would be able to impeach the hell out of her testimony by pointing out her biased politics.

She also received money for the project, initially at least, from someone who wants the CRC to fail, too. When you get money, your final product just might be skewed in the direction of the guy who paid for it.

There are all sorts of studies to support this phenomenon: confirmatory bias.

manthou — April 10, 2013 at 5:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 10, 2013 at 5:43 p.m.

Naive??? Maybe, but at least I'm accepting of information provided which is based on hard evidence and fact and am willing to accept another perspective when I consider it as credible.

Because Madore hired someone locally, someone from Vancouver with over 14 years experience with certification as a licensed "CPA, CFF and CFE," you think it's cracked. Because Madore hired someone without your approval...he's corrupt? Because Madore financed himself for the election, that's corrupt? Have you seen how much other political hopefuls have paid into an election...any election???

The fact here is...Madore was elected by a landslide BECAUSE of the fact that his opponent was a staunch supporter of the current crossing project and Madore was willing to step up to the plate and work FOR the people. The fact is, he has no history in politics. He is a citizen who could afford to take the take action on his own dime...knowing and seeing what it was going to do to his community and the folks who live in it (including those who work for him) and he was going to fight this corruption to the very end. The fact is Madore was elected because of his stance against the current crossing project. The fact is the majority votes in Clark County chose not to pay for maintenance and operations for light rail. The fact is Moeller has done everything in his power to prevent another vote deciding the fate of the crossing. The fact is the people are standing up and fighting back against elected officials such as Moeller and Inslee and Kitzhaber and we're fighting back against poor Washington State and DC spending practices and we're fighting against corruption and deception and we're fighting against TriMet's MAX system.

Someone who is naive, would let it slide, believing the hype that the current project is exactly what we need...especially when 27% of the county's children are starving or malnourished due to poor dietary needs...thanks in part to the extensive unemployment rate we've experienced for the past several years, holyc.

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 6:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Back at you, HolyC (and Nails too)!!!

roger — April 10, 2013 at 6:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — April 10, 2013 at 5:56 p.m.

I understand your point of view...I just happen to disagree. She did her audit, compiled the reports and was done with it. Now, she's a citizen of the community expressing her concerns. Manthou, you would have to prove in court that when Madore chose her company to run the audit, it was because of her political beliefs at the time of contractual obligation. You would have to prove her bias at the time of her audit report. It's just not there in the report. Because she found discrepancies and made suggestions for further review, that doesn't make her biased.

So from another perspective, are you saying the same for Jim Moeller? Seems to me he wreaks of special interest on this he no longer credible? He's supposed to be listening to the people and making a conscientious decision regarding funding the crossing but instead, he's been quoted as saying he was bored with the public hearing in Oly a few days back and has heard it all but won't respond to questions people in opposition have. He only listens to what he wants to listen to and throws out the political bias card. Seems to me, he's lost his credibility as State Rep. (to think I've voted for him in the past. Just what was I thinking back then...sheesh!!!)

goldenoldie — April 10, 2013 at 6:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Pretty amazing stuff. The partnership of business and government can be profitable in more ways than one.


**Stanford's Transparent Brain: Local Scientists Reach Amazing Breakthrough**

Stanford researchers have turned a dreary gray brain into an object as transparent as apricot Jell-O -- an approach that will reveal new secrets into the most mysterious of organs.

The process, called CLARITY, transforms the brain's tissue -- replacing opaque fat with a clear gel -- and creates a limpid organ with all of its essential circuitry intact and in place.
"Brain tissue is very dense," said researcher Kwanghun Chung. "We have developed a technique that makes tissue we can visualize the architecture, necessary to understand the function of the complex organ."

The technique ushers in a new era of whole-organ imaging, offering hope for improving the study of such devastating neurological disorders such as autism, schizophrenia, Alzheimer's disease and Parkinson's disease.

Read more @

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 7:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Yay CREDC! In spite of David Madore's cutting you off at the knees, you managed to help bring Integra from Portland to Vancouver (HP campus).

Half of its employees are already living here and no longer have to worry about the bridge.

This is something to celebrate!


Does anyone else own a MAC with a tracpad that seems to have a mind of its own? Mine is possessed, I swear. It types things I don't type and erases large amounts of text and then jumps the cursor up and away: Errrgh

manthou — April 10, 2013 at 8:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

to answer your question manthou I have a pc laptop that has a trackpad and it does pretty much those same exact things. I've noticed if I so much as brush the pad while typing that it will jump the cursor and mess everything I've done up. maybe try to disable the pad and use a separate mouse? thats what I do when I can and it works much better.

jasonb — April 10, 2013 at 8:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jasonb: I have heard that these new trackpads have "smart" technology. You can adjust the sensitivity, but Mac, as much as I love it, is too sensitive.

Thanks for the suggestion about the mouse. You are the second one, so this may be the strategy. :)

manthou — April 10, 2013 at 9:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

looks like the navy will not be sending ships to the annual portland rose festival fleet week this year. big loss to portland businesses and the rose festival.

jasonb — April 10, 2013 at 9:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

haha my laptop has some sort of tech where it's supposed to prevent un intended imput but it never works when needed! only when I actually need to use the pad haha. I don't know about mac's though.

jasonb — April 10, 2013 at 9:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — April 10, 2013 at 4:20 p.m.

That's exactly what I've been saying for over a year now. You think anybody listens to little ol me? NAAAAAAAAAAAA!

hawkeye — April 10, 2013 at 10:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Why is the Rose Festival Navy fleet not coming this year? Sequestration cut backs? Do they need the ships elsewhere?

manthou — April 11, 2013 at 6:17 a.m. ( | suggest removal

All the services are cutting back on the public outreach projects. The Blue Angels and the Golden Knights parachute team have also canceled engagements. Not sure about the NASCAR sponsorship; that argument is going on now. We're also looking at one day a week civilian employee furloughs as another cost cutting measure. Retirees who don't live in the immediate vicinity of a military medical facility are being kicked out of the TRICARE Prime network. Numerous other cost cutting things are also planned. And I suspect the list will grow; the logical response to our friend in North Korea is to send a carrier fleet to that general neighborhood - a very expensive proposition.

roger — April 11, 2013 at 6:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou - How do we know CREDC got Integra to move here? Weren't they recently attempting to sell Nike on moving to that same property? I don't recall seeing anyone get the credit for bringing this move to become reality. But yes- This is great news. (And as I noted on the other side, LRT wasn't even a factor after all!)

roger — April 11, 2013 at 6:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Anyone else think it's kind of ridiculous sequestration cuts are happening while Wall Street is profiting tremendously? Slashing bennies for societies weakest and cutting jobs from the middle class while the 1% lifts their collective glasses for a refill?

We can do better than this. At least that's what I've heard...

**Dow ends at another record close as cyclicals rally**

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 7:22 a.m. ( | suggest removal

**One of these is not like the other:**

When 502 passed I was happy, but with a sense of trepidation. I had read the initiative several times, and other than that 5ng/ml per se dui thing, I was confident 502 would not impact 69.51a (medicinal cannabis).

And that niggling in the back of my head has come full forward.

Senator Rivers' efforts are misplaced. She is creating an issue where there isn't one. Her arguments are of the strawman, red herring variety. She tells us of her concern about a disparity in cannabis pricing between the medicinal and recreational markets.

It appears the Senator isn't aware the only (soon to be) legal cannabis market is the recreational. Regardless of what they do up in King County the medicinal dispensing of cannabis is not legal in this state. So, the Senator would tax a black market?

She opines individuals would "fake" a medicinal recommendation in order to gain availability to lower cost medicinal pot. I've got news for her, junk recommendations are currently out there. Not to gain access to medicine, but pot in general.

C'mon, do you really believe your everyday law abiding citizen will screw around with that hassle (and cost) so they can buy a pack of joints for a few dollars less?

And though the dispensaries are illegal (see the former gov. vetoes of 36 sections of E2SSB 5073), know the majority of the folks who purchase from them are on tight budgets. Many are disabled - living on the dole.

So, her bright idea, in order to ensure sales of recreational pot, is to jack-up the price sick people pay for their medicine.

Where the heck do these people come from?


Drift — April 11, 2013 at 8:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal

yes manthou, it is do to sequestration cut backs.

nail, I also think ridiculous cuts are happening while the wh keeps having concerts, dinner parties, sending their children to the bahamas one week and to skiing in sun valley the next.

jasonb — April 11, 2013 at 8:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal

**Iranian scientist claims to have invented 'time machine'**

An Iranian businessman claims to have mastered time with a machine that allows users to fast forward up to eight years into the future.

"My invention easily fits into the size of a personal computer case and can predict details of the next 5-8 years of the life of its users. It will not take you into the future, it will bring the future to you."

jasonb — April 11, 2013 at 8:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

jasonb — April 11, 2013 at 8:42 a.m.

Yes. The Obama family is killing our economy. Obama doesn't understand they should behave unlike President's families in the past. Completely unforgivable and we should consider impeachment. Such behavior! So......uppity.

They just don't understand they should be held to a *different* standard than past presidents and their families.

Right jason? And those two spoiled kids....shameful!

And personally I thought this was the straw that broke the camels back (or cow as it were),
was this outrageous trip!! (no pun intended)

I'm so thankful to God for Michele Bachman breaking this story of Obama corruption!

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 9:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Wasn't it Dubya who spent **4 months a year** on vacation?

This new guy, there's something about him that's....

Anyway, God bless Dubya! Oh how we miss this hard working two term Republican president.

If only Obama would learn...but you know how they are.

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 9:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Fisher Communications (KOMO in Seattle; KATU in PDX) has been purchased by Sinclair Communications, a mega company that just got more mega.

Sinclair was involved with some controversial decisions: publishing those Swift Boat Ads against Kerry and refusing to air a Nighline segment that disclosed the names of US soldiers killed in Iraq.

Just what we need: More media monopolies and more slanted media.

Just to be clear: I detest slanted media from any side.

[link text][1]


manthou — April 11, 2013 at 10:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Clarification: Sinclair Broadcasting made all their stations run a Swift Boat DOCUMENTARY against Kerry.

My bad.

[link text][1]


manthou — April 11, 2013 at 10:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

It doesn't sound good manthou. One more reason the Fairness doctrine should at least be a part of the broader conversation.

An excerpt from your 2nd link...although the entire piece is eye opening.

**[**The company's best known for a program called "The Point," extreme right-wing commentary produced at its corporate headquarters in Maryland that its affiliates must air as part of their local evening news. It's delivered by Sinclair vice president of corporate relations Mark Hyman, who has claimed, among other things, that Sen. Kerry supported Communists, falsified military records and dodged the Army draft by enlisting in the Navy. Hyman routinely denounces leftist agendas and calls animal rights advocates "whackos."

Worse, viewers are tricked into thinking that Hyman's commentary is part of local news coverage, when in fact like much of the local coverage on Sinclair affiliates, it's produced at the corporate headquarters.

"Sinclair has turned localism on its head," Mark Cooper, research director of the Consumer Federation of America, told the Chicago Tribune. "Instead of using its right to pre-empt national programming to preserve a local voice, it wants to impose its political will on 62 local stations."

"Their whole business model is about cutting operating costs," Andrew Jay Schwartzman, president of the Media Access Project, said in the same article. "They fake the localism by presenting the hometown station feel but without any of the presence and journalism that local communities deserve."**]**

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 10:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 9:29 a.m

now where did I say anything to the likes of your rant?
you are way off the mark dude.
putting words in others mouths that was never said or even thought. typical of your ilk!

if you'd have really took the time to read what I said your brain cells would see that while the country's people and businesses count their pennys to see if they can pay all their bills, military cutting more and more by the week, one would think at least the leader of said country would be doing some cutting in his house too! extravagant parties, trips, come on man. he keeps telling the people times are hard, that we all will have to dig deep to help. isn't he and his part of "we"?

jasonb — April 11, 2013 at 11:13 a.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 11, 2013 at 11:21 a.m

right on man, right on!!

jasonb — April 11, 2013 at 11:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal

*The very fact that a pimpled NK wacko is making threats and not being put in his place, to me is a sign of weakness and the world is in awe of how America lets him get away with it.*

If the conditions are right, let's make 2014 and 2016 the year of a third party for America. Democrats and Republicans ought to be fired for being incompetent fools that get nothing done and when they do, we are at a loss.

holycrapola — April 11, 2013 at 11:21 a.m.

Fair enough holy. So tell me, another war, or just keep starving a higher % of his people. Nuke em'? It's one thing to state a problem, it's another to offer a reasonable fix.

*and the world is in awe of how America lets him get away with it.*

Really? Fortunately the rest of the world's attention span isn't as short as ours.

What are your international sources? Should we go to war with Iran also?

Seriously holy, your concept of libertarianism seems to be a new one. There's an idea! Create that third party we're talking about.


(Kid Rock your *idol*? :) To each their own I suppose.

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 11:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Holy- I'll take the Dixie Chicks! .....

*I do not believe that artists or actors and people should be out there like voicing their full-blown opinions on politics because, let's face it, at the end of the day, I'm not that smart of a guy. I play Rock 'n' Roll, that's what I do. Who would you trust to make your decisions, Donald Rumsfeld or the Dixie Chicks?*

~Kid Rock~ 

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 12:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*If it takes a WWIII, so be it.*

How does your thought relate to Libertarian thinking? You sound neo-conservative when it comes to war.

You sound like Rumsfeld or Cheaney. Or Netenyahoo

Or a *we don't know if we did it or not* Obama drone approach.

What would you attach to this drone? What capabilities would you target? Would you gain support through Congress and the American people first or just do it?

Is it the young leaders blather you would act on, or would it be hard intel?

You sound rather Imperialistic. Assassinate a world leader for insult and provocation?

War is serious business holy, we need to keep our noses out of the @#$% unless we have to.

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 12:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holy- I play myself. I've got one of my babies, a Taylor 454ce 12 string (to include ovangkol back & sides) I'm selling if you're interested. As far as getting charged from playing I agree. (and no clean up or pillow talk required:)))

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 12:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal

They maybe more articulate for public speaking and trying to sell their mouse trap, but smarter....hahahahahah Mielke...hahahahah Stuart....hahahaha Madore...hahahahaha

Couldn't agree more! Sometimes we forget the idiot we had just a few years ago, for e-i-g-h-t y-e-a-r-s. Interesting conversation with the first vid. A serious talk with two Republicans and a Dem concerning Dubya's intellect.

Is George Bush really as intellectually challenged as he sounds? Or is his mind incapable of articulating sound thought. These are the questions! LOL!

The other vid places Dubya in his natural setting. Doing stand up.

Republicans would like to bury recent history. It's important we keep it alive, if not for anything else, as a learning tool.

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 12:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Sorry HC but the only one mishandling the term Libertarian around here is you. Libertarianism is about respecting everybody's liberties not just your own. When you want to protect the liberties of those who run loud exhaust, but condemn the liberties of those who use fireworks, you are not Libertarian, you are just a liberal. When you support the liberties of select groups such as gay marriage, but then condemn the liberties of a similar group like polygamy, you are a liberal not a libertarian.

frobert — April 11, 2013 at 12:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

....a liberaltarian? That's it!!

Liberaltarianism! The perfect marriage! As long as it's not plural and involves fireworks.

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 1:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Taylors are great! More than great, excellent! I've got a 314ce they'll have to pry from my cold dead hands.

I'm considering ebay. More folks with $$$.

I'm all for a viable multi-party system, and I believe conservatives will part ways first. Obama with his chained CPI push and low investment will help nurture 3rd party ideas to progressives.

Trouble is neither party are more than reluctant to do it, splinter off that is.

It would ensure the other guys victory for at least one election cycle, most likely several more.

As you know it's all about money n power. But you gotta have the numbers. Neither side willing to give.

But these emotional hot button issues such as immigration reform, gay marriage, chained CPI, changes to Medicare and differing war ideologies could bring it on.

It's happening on the right as we speak. I hope they break up sooner rather than later so liberals/progressives can reap the spoils! ;)

What is currently happening in Red states will turn the majority off forever. They know this and don't care. Cool. Let em' implode and make way for new and progressive ideas.

The Republican party as we know it is done. It's a matter of time, attrition and compromised senior health care. :))

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 1:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal

The total ignorance displayed here by some, about what should be pretty basic understandings, is just appalling.

And some of you people go around blaming everyone else in politics, who have to deal with people like you, for all of the ills.

kn_dalai — April 11, 2013 at 3:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Well now HC, I’ll answer those questions, but first of all, I’m wondering why you’re sure that I’ve directed my brief statement of 3:35 p.m. towards you. You are hardly the only one to post comments, many or few. I would think that my statement could be applied to many. Did it hit a nerve? Did you recognize something about my comment in yourself?

kn_dalai — April 11, 2013 at 4:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

From Andrea Damewood's article in the Willamette Week. Seems Jim Moeller is facing up to something unexpected - that even with the major power blocs in town and elsewhere, and the major newspapers, backing the CRC, there's a damn good chance the will of the majority here in Clark County will prevail.

"But Moeller is also reading the tea leaves: this $3.4 billion megaproject is probably going to die in the next few weeks. It's the first sign that proponents are acknowledging that the political wrangling to push this project through may fail.

"I don’t mean to be a downer, but I’m also a realist that this may not happen," he tells WW.

roger — April 11, 2013 at 6:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HolyC and Nails - GW Bush is inarticulate, and B Obama is highly articulate. Both suck at being President.

roger — April 11, 2013 at 6:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I have hardly made an attack. You may wish look at the way someone else here constantly belittles others, HC.

One will note that you have not actually addressed my question of 4:23 pm. OK, I’ll move on.

The biggest thing here is how one can define things as they please. There is a reason for commonly defining things for the common understanding.

Your idea of Libertarian is really Socialist in all sorts of things. And therefore authoritarian. Not Libertarian.

Specifically, how about the floral shop owner? I say that government has no business of deciding who is with whom, as in marriage, which is a contract. And by like token, if someone else wants nothing to do with same sex couples, the government has no business in forcing unwanted associations.

kn_dalai — April 11, 2013 at 6:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HC, Social Security is a government social insurance policy. Not the same as government social welfare.

There is nothing at all which prevents you from being your brother’s keeper. What does this have to do with government?

The others may well display bigotry and be despicable in your mind, but freedom of association is the thing. It works both ways.

And FWIW, I think there should be a government social safety net, as Reagan called it, for those who have no where else to turn. Hardly Libertarian on my part. Problem is matters of degree, mission creep and the efficacies involved, like government beaurocracy. Look up the word efficacy. And get out in the world to understand beaurocracy.

kn_dalai — April 11, 2013 at 7:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*Hardly Libertarian on my part*

I don't think folk think of you as such. Though not evangelical, religious conservative would be much closer. frobert seems to be the only one who posts as a libertarian.

*Look up the word efficacy. And get out in the world to understand beaurocracy.*

People are smarter than you give them credit for k_nd. Are you still criticizing spelling? Just cutting through some BS...


Conservatives...always so angry.


holycrapola — April 11, 2013 at 12:49 p.m.

Sounds good Holy. Politics get so entangled we lose common sense/values.


Here's a couple links to party platforms for anyone who cares.


*Evangelicals and there are many in the County, vote "by order", same as mormons and the like, it is an unwritten rule but usually obeyed as a church thing due to their brainwashing. We are the devil so they are against the rest and they mix their religion with politics. They do not understand separation of church and state.*

*Name me one evangelical elected leader in the City, County or State that is a Democrat or Independent or Libertarian. Name it.

holycrapola — April 11, 2013 at 1:53 p.m.*

Careful holyC, a forum few will charge you with a hate crime and attack you opaquely forever! :) Will, not really. They'll just throw crap at the fan to see if anything sticks.

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 9:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal

We could use a little harmony in here..

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 9:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Crap like-

*The total ignorance displayed here by some, about what should be pretty basic understandings, is just appalling.*

*I would think that my statement could be applied to many. Did it hit a nerve? Did you recognize something about my comment in yourself?*

Perhaps we should define belittling. k_nd.

What do you think drives your desire to .. scold us? Why be a/so .. pompass.

Which reminds me k_nd, you never provided any substance with just a few basic questions. (after all you're always insisting your questions be answered) You just hid under a party line blanket. (kinda like what you accuse others of doing;)


Just to pick one of your items, unless the proposed laws that you are describing are being passed unanimously, *then those with libertarian ideas on these matters, are denouncing them.*

(care to add reality to your assertion? Who are *"those"* and how did *they* vote on the issues mentioned?)

kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 9:36 a.m.


To repeat:

*some new technology, whatever that will be,* PIE IN THE SKY

As to your assertion, outside of replacing us with droids, what part of free choice are you not understanding?

Why aren't you and your ilk denouncing proposed sex laws in Virginia and other red controlled states?

What happened to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of happiness? The principles of The Declaration of Independence are being trashed daily in Red states and your group stays silent.


nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 9:08 a.m.

nailingit — April 10, 2013 at 12:03 p.m.

BTW, your criticizing of others spelling or word usage needs no ..*"explaination". Nor your other misspellings or errors. Everyone, regardless of writing ability, should feel comfortable posting here, and not be trolled by an over zealous finger pointer.

*(kn_dalai — April 1, 2013 at 5:15 p.m;).

I'm trying to be careful and not project *a belittling*. Everyone has their own comfort zone and I certainly don't mean for you to be embroiled in any type of personal .. kerfuffle. Negative displays of emotion are one thing dude, but this is a forum. Maybe you see yourself as a victim in this world, but you're certainly not in here. Your trashing and constant whining about others behavior has no value and is just one more Red Herring you folks who lack substance many times lean on.

It's ego run amok. I printed a Carlos Santana interview awhile back that dealt with the type of destruction an over inflated ego can cause. I'll find it. You're never to old to learn......or are you?

Read a bit of taoism and absorb some positive stuff. Lay yourself aside a bit. Treat others as you would have them treat you.

*The total ignorance displayed here by some, about what should be pretty basic understandings, is just appalling.*

I agree. But it has nothing to do with politics.

Some food for thought.


nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 10:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 11, 2013 at 11:34 a.m.

Alright. I'll walk back my Kid Rock critique. I watched the vid and am down with it. But his music is much different than I remember. Sometime in the early nineties I dug a song I heard him do. Got the album and it was all this like, glam-rap stuff. Then I saw him on some show wearing sparkly leotards or something and haven't given him a look since.

This stuff has a good-earthy vibe and feel.

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 11:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal

This guy could have been 2nd in line to the Presidency. This is what he's about. This is what Conservatism is about.

**Paul Ryan On Abortion: 'We Want A Country Where It Isn't Even Considered'**

WASHINGTON -- Rep. Paul Ryan, the Republican vice presidential nominee in 2012 and an abortion opponent, said Thursday that anti-abortion activists should try to build a broad coalition and find common ground with supporters of abortion rights as a way to advance their agenda.

Ryan, R-Wis., said in a speech to the Susan B. Anthony List that those who oppose abortion "need to work with people who consider themselves pro-choice – because **our task isn't to purge our ranks. It's to grow them."**

**"We don't want a country where abortion is simply outlawed. We want a country where it isn't even considered," he said.**

Read more @

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 11:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

They have learned nothing. Just the basics of fairness escape today's republican politician, let alone not learning a political lesson from getting thumped in 2008 & 2012. Women vote!

And their conservative constituency stays silent. Are they even paying attention?

**Paycheck Fairness Act Vote Blocked By House GOP**

Recent Census Bureau data shows that full-time working women make 77 cents for every dollar men make per year. The Paycheck Fairness Act, which DeLauro has introduced in eight consecutive Congresses, would expand the Equal Pay Act to close certain loopholes and allow employees to share salary information with their coworkers. It would also require employers to show that pay disparities between their male and female employees are related to job performance, not gender.

Most Republicans oppose the bill, and Rep. Virginia Foxx (R-N.C.) said on the House Floor Thursday afternoon that the bill is a "liberal plot" to perpetuate the narrative that Republicans are anti-woman. DeLauro countered that she has yet to hear a reasonable excuse for Republicans to oppose the bill.

"I think we're looking at a group of people who either don't believe there is a pay gap or who just want to be contrary," DeLauro told HuffPost in a phone interview. "This bill isn't a liberal plot. We have enough statistical information to demonstrate that no matter what the job is, whether you're a waitress or bus driver or civil engineer, women are paid less money."

nailingit — April 11, 2013 at 11:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

If you drink to the point you end up blowin' a .22 on the drunk-o-meter scale why can't you just own up to it?? You kill two people and put two more in the intensive care unit and you STILL claim you're innocent??

You are an idiot. You proved that by racking up five PREVIOUS DUI's. I hope they find this idiot guilty and throw away the key. He is taking up valuable court time and it's pretty much a done deal. Unless there is plea bargaining involved, in which case it's the lawyer who thinks this idiot has money.

JohnCasey — April 12, 2013 at 6:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Some of the greatest are/were gay - Elton John, KD Lang, Rob Halford, Michael Stipe (REM), Melissa Etheridge - to mention a few.

And if Axl Rose can deal with it, well....

roger — April 12, 2013 at 6:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

> I really should have known better than to try to engage, one such as yourself.

kn_dalai — April 10, 2013 at 11:36 a.m.

kn_dalai — April 12, 2013 at 8:07 a.m. ( | suggest removal

You would think.

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 8:11 a.m. ( | suggest removal


My favorite "give em' the finger" openly gay do something about band was Mott The Hoople. They not only flaunted their lifestyle, they celebrated it. Long live the Mott!

Raunch & Roll baby...incredible jam!

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 8:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

JohnCasey — April 12, 2013 at 6:36 a.m.

Sorry, but I'm not ready to throw out our entire Constitution and justice system because the police say someone is guilty.

frobert — April 12, 2013 at 8:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Another reason we need gay equality. God bless our gay community. This should not be an issue.

**Gay Man Arrested At Missouri Hospital For Refusing To Leave Sick Partner, Not Recognized As Family (UPDATE)**

A gay man was arrested this week at a Missouri hospital after refusing to the leave bedside of his sick partner.

Roger Gorley went to Research Medical Center in Kansas City, Mo., on Tuesday to visit Allen, his partner of five years. But when he got there, a member of Allen's family asked him to leave, according to Kansas City Fox station WDAF. When Gorley refused, hospital security allegedly handcuffed him and forcefully removed him from the premises. Now he cannot visit Allen at all because of a restraining order filed against him.

Read more @

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 8:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Nail I don't like Paul Ryan any better than you.But I came away with this thought after hearing what he said about abortion.He may have meant that it would be great if we had a society that didn't need abortion.I don't like abortion either,I look at as more of a nessesary evil.

timerick — April 12, 2013 at 8:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 8:47 a.m.

The same thing happens to unmarried straight couples, it is not a gay issue at all. Gay and straight couples should prepare for these situations, a simple power of attorney would have kept this situation from happening.

frobert — April 12, 2013 at 9:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — April 12, 2013 at 8:57 a.m.

I don't think anyone likes abortion and agree with your assessment.

My problem with Ryan is the policy this guy not only endorses, but sponsors. He's a personhood guy who believes rape & incest should not be a factor when outlawing what is already a lawful act.

He's a conservative social activist extremist who has no place in government in my opinion. An ideologue, who not only would give a zygote equal rights, he'd starve the same with a destroyed safety net.

He'd repeal Roe v Wade in a heartbeat and puts the need for Fed law front & center.

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 9:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal

*Marriage may be a great thing but oh boy you have to put up with a lot of crap all your life and many times of you choose to marry several times sequentially that is...LOL On the other hand, gay people are "very fuzzy", they live their own hell and as a result of discrimination...*

holycrapola — April 12, 2013 at 9 a.m.

holyC- I've always said misery love company when it comes to gay/straight marriage. :) One suffer, all suffer. :))

[DISCLAIMER] I will say I hit the jackpot with my wife of..21 years..I think? Uh oh! It's been too damn long! She's the sweetest person in the world. (and she puts up with my @#$%!)

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 9:43 a.m. ( | suggest removal

frobert — April 12, 2013 at 9:01 a.m.

Agreed. Maybe incidents like this will shine more light on the issue.

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 9:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Fobert you are right on the power of attorney.The lady I am with is not my "legal" wife.We chose to not get a license for income reasons.She would have lost her deceased husbands social security.After the first couple of years when we knew we were going to move in with each other we went to a attorney and did our wills,power of attorney and our end of life directory.We wanted to make sure we had all bases covered.We have everthing in each others name.We know several couples in our age bracket that have done the same thing.It is one of those things that if you are legal the government takes income from you that is rightfully yours.

timerick — April 12, 2013 at 10:14 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick: speaking of the government taking money from us that is not theirs: My spouse and I received this form letter, saying that our very substantial refund is being held until they can get a chance to review our tax return (done by a competent accountant). Then we got another saying: you should go ahead and pay your first quarter business taxes, even though you were counting on part of the refund to be credited to the first quarter.

Never had letters like that ever. So they have our refund, which is our money, and won't credit the first quarter taxes with part of it, as was our request, until they take another gander at the return, just in case there were any math errors or such.

I think, cynic that I am, they have sent out a bunch of these letters and are using them to dole out the refunds piecemeal because the sequester has them in a bind.

In the meantime, we had to dip deeper into our savings to make that quarter tax payment when it was going to be done through an overpayment credit.

This is the last time I overpay my federal taxes again. Much better to underpay and have them asking for more?

manthou — April 12, 2013 at 10:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: The Seattle Times' Emily Heffter has a great piece today on Sinclair Broadcasting and what the Pacific NW can expect now that it has entered our market.

Really, I do not like any slanted stuff that is disguised as news.

[link text][1]


manthou — April 12, 2013 at 10:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Then you'll likely be hit with a penalty fee and interest, manthou.

kn_dalai — April 12, 2013 at 11:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal


I never heard that anyone in Mott was gay - not Ian Hunter, Mick Ronson or Mick Ralphs anyhow. Ronson especially had to look a certain image because he also played for Bowie. I'm thinking it was more the glam image of the time - had to do something to get the attention of the fans. New York Dolls dressed like transvestites, which I know was just an act with Johnny Thunders.

roger — April 12, 2013 at 11:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I see the folks who promote the CRC are hard at work in attempts to capture the minds of folks at the downtown library, today. Nothing on their little signboards promoting light rail, though. Hopefully, these are folks who are promoting a new design. I wish I had time to talk to them but had an appointment I couldn't miss.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 12:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I believe Governor Jay Inslee made a HUGE mistake ousting Brian Baird from his position as Chairman of the Washington Student Achievement Council...but I guess that's normal for people who make nearsighted judgments without considering the consequences of his errors. Seems to be how things are done nowadays, huh.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 12:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

goldie: A lot of Democrats were very angry at Baird for his stance on the Iraq war and for "overstating" the threat to his person via a "brown shirts" comment. They were angry at him for a variety of reasons. I had a personal email exchange with Dwight Pelz over Baird once: Pelz was hopping mad at him. Pelz and Inslee are close.

While I do admire someone who bucks the party line every so often to follow their conscience, he was supposed to represent the people who voted for him.

Jim Moeller's answer to the above argument: You also voted me in office to LEAD.

I wonder if there is not a bit of payback to Baird.

manthou — April 12, 2013 at 12:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 12:11 p.m.

Goldie, I had some of the same thoughts. I never voted for him myself, but always respected him for his thoughtfulness, being straight forward, and never thought him to be corrupt. He really angered a lot of his base after he came back from his trip to Iraq, and changed his position to that of favoring the “surge”.

As I noted previously, he was featured on a Sixty Minutes segment, where he was very critical of those in Congress who benefited in the stock market from insider information.

Seems sort of strange that Inslee would sack the guy just like that.

kn_dalai — April 12, 2013 at 1 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — April 12, 2013 at 10:31 a.m.

One of the downsides of capitalism. Money can buy a soapbox to spread propaganda.

(speaking of, soapbox4u are you still around?)

Until we hold our parties accountable from the electorate view, denouncing our own party from within when needed, then the market will ensure success. Fox News gets great ratings yet...

I hate the idea of resorting to a fairness doctrine, but it might help many come out from their bubble. To include lawmakers.

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 1:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — April 12, 2013 at 11:59 a.m.

If it walks like a duck...more times than not it quacks?

If they're not gay they did a fabulous job of behaving gay. I dug the screw everybody mentality they brought to music. On a personal level, it matters not if someone smokes pickles or munches melons. Just be safe and responsible.

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 1:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal

> While I do admire someone who bucks the party line every so often to follow their conscience, he was supposed to represent the people who voted for him. -- manthou — April 12, 2013 at 12:53 p.m.

Of course, the standard reply to this is that a representative is supposed to represent everyone. While the sentiment that your comment addresses is understandable, it is also the reason that someone on the other side may also say that so-and-so “doesn’t represent me”. It’s a quagmire that sticks the pols in the middle, where no matter what they do, they will always be wrong. That was my point of April 8, 2:09 pm statement.

kn_dalai — April 12, 2013 at 1:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 12, 2013 at 12:26 p.m.

HC, I can't find anything to support your contention that Baird was pro outsourcing. Just what do you mean by that?

kn_dalai — April 12, 2013 at 2:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HC, Beacock Music opened in 1976. They used to be off of Mill Plain. I remember that store as I bought a guitar there myself. Never did learn how to play the thing though. But I’m not disputing your account. I’m guessing they had some event when they moved to the new location. But I am surprised by the account you gave about Baird.

kn_dalai — April 12, 2013 at 5:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Washington State Senate Leaders says NO to funding for crossing project AND have requested a FORMAL independent investigation after Tiffany Couch's independent audit that revealed many discrepancies and was vetted by another forensic accountant, Linda Saunders, of Jefferson County also scrutinized the data.

The Truth SHALL Prevail!!!

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 5:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nothing surprises me when it comes to the actions of our current governor. Bet ya Inslee will deny the request by the Washington State Senate leaders regarding the crossing project investigation which my opinion...something that should have been done a long, long time ago!!!

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 5:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

what do you mean nothing surprises you about the new gov? Because he is a Dem?

Don't get me wrong. I am in full support of an investigation into CRC, not just about cost overruns but the whole thing. Something just does not add up here; the whole undertaking to me smells of bought off people and corruption. From day 1. I never did get the reason for new bridge. Quakes? Ok, I buy that. Traffic congestion? Right, not with a new bridge that is no better than the old one. Light rail? is that it????

And if it is: what does a little bit of light rail extension do to such a major, important, much touted interstate highway that connects from Canada to Mexico? It does nothing. Ergo light rail is and should not be a reason for this. Take it out. Fix the design, get on with a new bridge.

I am against a gas tax to pay for this, and the terrible tolls proposed. Local yokels responsible for paying for this? Nah, don't think so.

luvithere — April 12, 2013 at 5:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"Quakes? Ok, I buy that. Traffic congestion? Right, not with a new bridge that is no better than the old one. Light rail? is that it????

And if it is: what does a little bit of light rail extension do to such a major, important, much touted interstate highway that connects from Canada to Mexico? It does nothing. Ergo light rail is and should not be a reason for this. Take it out. Fix the design, get on with a new bridge."

Most concise critique I've heard. But do remember, some schmuck in Nowhere, Arkansas is going to help finance this joke, and he doesn't even know it. Does that make it right? Nope. But, life goes on for politicians, so whatever....
Remember to vote-yea vote-that'll fix stuff....yea right...

mrd — April 12, 2013 at 6:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — April 12, 2013 at 5:43 p.m.

It has nothing to do with his political affiliation, Luvit. I vote both sides of the ticket...and sometimes others. It has everything to do with the fact he's not listening to the people.

That little bit of light rail...costs well over $850 million with no improvement foreseen on the crossing other than a little over a minute's time saved for commuters. That little bit of light rail will provide a larger taxing region for TriMet so that they could acquire more federal funding to save their backsides from total embarrassment and complete failure. That little bit of light rail would end at Ft. Vancouver Way with absolutely no future plans of expansion in the works for another 30 years+. That little bit of light rail is the only funding the feds are hold over the heads of drooling CRC fanatics. That little bit of light rail could potentially increase sales tax here in Clark County. That little bit of light rail funding could easily replace an entire without lifts and without light rail. And it's that little light rail funding...instead of the bridge funding...which could easily cost taxpayers yet another 10-cents a gallon on gas PLUS $2,000 per year from the mouths of babes.

That little bit of light a big fat failure to the community. It is NOT a vision of the future. It's a drag backwards to the people and we deserve a lot better than they're trying to slip us.

And please don't mind my attitude. It's nothing personal. I've devoted a lot of my personal time and my family's time over the past 7 years, fighting for what I believe is right and when I see such corruption and deception as I have with this crossing project and the way they've manipulated the people, including those involved who were against the selected LPA...I will continue my fight till the day they say..."Let's put it back on the drawing board." The current project design was "dead in the water" long before the Washington State Senate made their statements, today. It's the profiteers who have bilked the funding and bled it for all they could, some even going way over budget...who have some 'splainin' to do.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 6:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal

The scoop about the earthquakes and the bridges...


There's a reason why the State of Oregon pulled the information which stated the bridges had at least 60 more years of quality use before replacement should be considered.

There's a reason why the State of Oregon had a report in 2009 which clearly showed the Cascadia Subduction Zone and any earthquake activity associated with that would have very little impact on the two bridges, given the type of earthquakes typical of this region.


Bogus claim by the CRC.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 6:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Gold, no attitude toward me detected. :) I do agree with you on light rail. I was just curious about your opinion of our gov. Thanks for clarifying.
Yea, that little bit of light rail..Sure is supposed to do a lot.


luvithere — April 12, 2013 at 6:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal

You just call me stupid, HC, or what?? Now we are unAmerican? (well in my case, that's true anyway.MENSCH, HC, aber bitte!!!! Etwas mehr denken und weniger ueber uns schimpfen wenn wir anderer Meinung sind. Sowas.)

I think we are all for progress etc etc etc down here but I'll be damned if I pay so much toll and tax so some scheisters get richer with their corruption.
Do this thing right and I am all behind it. But do it like they do it now, and I will NOT support. Heck with that.

And don't tell me I got to take light rail. I take light rail when I want to.

luvithere — April 12, 2013 at 6:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

And HC, what's with this "American can do pride" that you say is missing? Allow me to counter with this: how about the "American can do RIGHT" mentality? where's that in this mess?

luvithere — April 12, 2013 at 6:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I was just getting ready to post this video of Ray LaHood meeting with the State Senate - Then I read your comments and sidetracked to the two articles. Wow!!! I'm hoping Ann Rivers can ensure a good investigation - Tiffany Couch has been making some good points for at least a year, and has been routinely dismissed with a smug "you don't understand contracting" response. The documents she's posted show numerous cases of contractors going over budget without being challenged, and a fair amount of money completely unaccounted for.

Anyhow, here's the video. Ray LaHood is clueless. He's presented with about 20 minutes of solid reasons why various Senators don't like this project - his response is the same old one of so many people spending so much time and money getting where we are now.

roger — April 12, 2013 at 6:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola, you'd better believe we're singing and a dancing. We are witnessing government at work. Something which is rare in this neck of the woods. The battle of the crossing isn't over till it's dead in the water and that would be a shame. The

If the current LPA design is incorporated into the project, it will NOT relieve traffic. In fact, the improvement of commuting times is a whole gosh-darned minute! Now doesn't that just knock your socks off that our states should fund $850 million plus, just to save a whole minute on commute times??? Of course, the sweat equity of cyclers and pedestrians on the current LPA should be enough to pay for the bridge they'd be using, right??? And the poor transit riders...they're paying their fair share with the fares. Doesn't that beat all!!!


Do you not even see how rahdiculus (yes, misspelled) your post sounds by calling a failing transit system's choo choo as a long-term transportation solution??? The best way to eliminate the "long-term transportation problem is to secure good paying jobs here in Clark County in order to keep Warshingtonians IN Warshington!!!

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 6:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Luvithere @6:51 pm...

I have to laugh. I had to use a translator to read your comment...and was glad I did. Nice message.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 7 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Go - a clean message also. In case the translator messed up which they often do. Not one cussy word there.

luvithere — April 12, 2013 at 7:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*"No problem there but it surprise me the lack of vision some of you have and here is why."*

One man's vision is another man's nightmare. You said it yourself many a time that you have no need to travel over the bridge. Well sir, then in this really bungled up your stance on light rail and "progress." Progress does not include forcing the people to do something they don't want. Progress is improving on the economic future of a community which benefits all, my friend.

*"You people are still thinking on driving your cars to PDX, aren't you?"*

Yes, of course.

*"Enough already. You are thinking with the mentality of anything else but Americans."*

Actually, we're thinking with the mentality of Americans who are fighting corruption, no matter how matter how big. It's our civic duty to stand up for what we believe in. You honestly think this is all we have on our minds??? Maybe you haven't noticed that everything has to be decided before September 31st of this year, according to the feds. So it comes a little sooner than we though!!!

*"You did not complain then nor when they looted your 401ks and wanted bail outs, did you?"*

Where were you when all this happened, holyc??? Seems to me many of us wrote letters, contacted our politicians...fought for what we were experiencing...but the force behind the banks and investment companies stomped on the little people.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 7:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I think he means (back of the ) Biker world.

frobert — April 12, 2013 at 7:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 7:15 p.m.

well put

luvithere — April 12, 2013 at 7:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal


It's pretty obvious you haven't been paying attention, or just don't care. The FACT is that light rail will do very little to remove traffic from the roads during rush hour. The MAX does not go to where most of the commuters work. TriMet has crappy bus service; timeliness is atrocious on many routes, and a very high percentage of the people would then have to walk as much as a mile to get to their jobs. This is all OK when you're not in a time crunch, but it doesn't work with going to work. By TriMet's own performance figures, all rail lines except for the Blue are steadily losing riders - even Portlanders are dropping out of the grand plan!

We who commute during rush hours will be paying high tolls - by the CRC's own tolling estimates, $4.32 each way during rush hour under their variable tolling estimates. These tolls will pay for everything above however much New Starts funding is granted and how much the states can raise of their shares from other sources. The Washington House is pushing for that source to be a ten cents per gallon gas increase, and annual vehicle registrations that will run a couple of hundred dollars or more. We are the ones who will pay for most of this project - estimates are in the $2000 per year range.

Who benefits? Primarily the Ports of Portland and Seattle, per the vaguely worded Economic Benefits Analysis. Maybe Gramor Development and their investors in the Waterfront project. And let's not forget all the people who want to spend a Saturday walking around McCall Waterfront Park munching on Voodoo doughnuts and enjoying all of Portland's diversity. As has been clearly stated by Jim Moeller and that Parker lady - they WON'T have the privilege of paying any sort of toll - They've already paid. (Bull - Our federal tax dollars are paying their share.)

So, your vision of light rail removing so many people from the road that the 3 lanes wide (2 in some locations) through Portland is once again adequate is a pipe dream - the same one Portland Metro has been selling for years. And as for the cost of the upgrades, you might want to go back and look at the plan that Sam Adams resurrected before leaving office - moving the I5 across to the west side of the Willamette in the vicinity of the Rose Garden, and having it go underground with a cap over it (like in Paris, as near as I can tell). That project will be very expensive and take out properties too, so....

roger — April 12, 2013 at 7:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 12, 2013 at 7:04 p.m.

Cost overruns like...say...requesting funding for a river 60+ miles east of the project??? Or how 'bout paying for a museum??? Or how 'bout going $85 million over budget by one particular engineering firm...just to mention a few???

To compare us to the East Coast yet another bogus attempt to find a parallel. Hey, you aren't part of the folks at the CRC or that New Yorker who used to try to convince me that light rail was the only way to go...are you???

holycrapola — April 12, 2013 at 7:06 p.m.

Glad we agreed on something.

holycrapola — April 12, 2013 at 7:12 p.m.

That dumb estimate isn't something I made up. It's documented information.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 7:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 12, 2013 at 7:23 p.m

I'm the one who didn't show?

A simple look at the posts from that day will show who was out on their bike and who was home at their computer.

frobert — April 12, 2013 at 7:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I've worked with enough government contracts (and helped investigate a few) to be pretty confident this one stinks. Tiffany Couch has been posting documents and questioning the unchallenged overruns and unaccounted for dollars for at least a year. Sometimes she gets anally obsessive over (relatively) small numbers, but she's put enough info out there to show a clear pattern of poor supervision by WSDOT over Evans & Associates and their spending of taxpayer dollars.

roger — April 12, 2013 at 7:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holyc...only with martial law can they force us to ride light rail. Humans can have their behavior changed in a positive manner when applying some monetary pain. Have you seen the stories of survival during the past several years? Many are getting by with absolutely nothing. How do they do it? Barter and trade. Learning to stretch meals with a lot less than ever before. No longer poisoning themselves and their children with MacDaddy fries and hamburglers, cardboard pizzas and macaroni with chemically-developed cheese substitutes.

Holyc, what you have failed to see is the new transformation brought on by the greed of those in DC, the banks, insurance and everywhere else. People are turning their backs on what was once the normal way of living. Greed is a powerful vice...but honesty and humility are a powerful reality. Truth always prevails.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 7:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — April 12, 2013 at 7:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

So just how many vehicles will be taken off the road with LRT ?

Someone on FB, maybe a week or two ago, brought up this issue, looked at the capacity of the parking garages, and used that to estimate the reduction in vehicular traffic. The reduction was very little. Like a percent or two? But then there’s the issue of how many are already using the bus anyway and would just switch to LRT.

I've probably missed it before, but does anyone have any other estimates on this? There's really something suspect about what has gone on over this entire project from it's inception.

kn_dalai — April 12, 2013 at 8:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Geez, I hate it when the internet crashes over and over and over!!! Hmm...I wonder if an M-class solar flare has anything to do with it.

Hey Roger, I just watched the video. Mr. LaHood sounded like a broken record if you compare his speech to the public to the one shared behind closed doors. Hasn't this been the modus operandi from the get go with promoters of the crossing with LRT?

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 8:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Kn_dalai...the estimates by the folks with the CRC have only that...estimates. They assume a traffic reduction will happen but in all actuality, the majority of the riders will be those who already take mass transit through Delta Park and further into Portland and even with that, they're seeing a ridership reduction. According to the first document in the link below, they estimate 6 million boardings a year into Vancouver and back into Portland via the Yellow Line. Kn_, that's over 16,438 people a day. I don't see that happening and frankly, I believe they don't either. I think this is yet another fine example of manipulating the public. All you have to do is check the annual numbers on the Yellow Line. Currently, the numbers are at about 14,900 round trip (January numbers. February and March aren't not out yet)...and these are down 1500 (750 one way) from the previous year. January 2012, the numbers stood at 16,400 for the Yellow line (second link). They also stated the Express Bus would still go downtown. Sometimes you've got to ask yourself "Why, if light rail is so great...why keep the express bus???" Of course, the answer is simple. When light rail shuts down (as it has many, many times, sending people into a tizzy because they're 1 maybe 2 hours late getting to their destinations), they'll need the backup buses to bail 'em out.

I hope this info has helped.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 8:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"Evangelical Christians want to hit Republicans right where it hurts: in the wallet. Tony Perkins, president of Christian advocacy group The Family Research Council, recently emailed supporters to say they shouldn't "send them a dime of your hard-earned money" until Republicans "grow a backbone." The backbone comment was referring to the ongoing debate about gay marriage. Perkins ain't kidding around on this; last month, he said born-again activists would "move to create a third party" if the Republican leadership caved on gay marriage"

"born again"?? wtf? Can a rational person explain to me how I can be borne more than once? My mom made it sound as once was enough.

More GOP self destruction. When all else fails, and it has, these a$$clowns are clueless. When all else fails, and apparently it has, go with the typical 3G's, god, gays and guns.

As if to demonstrate their callousness, these idiots in Wa state are gonna auction an AK-whatever, the exalted symbol of gun ownership, the kind that killed all those kids at Sandy Hook. If you're a Democrat, things are looking good. The R's are less than clueless, and pandering to a diminishing crowd.

mrd — April 12, 2013 at 8:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

**Do you want to be the next one? Do you think that your stinking $5 toll or your letter to so and so will do a thing? They will close a deal behind close doors and in the middle of the night and you will be left as a fool like you started as in their eyes...****

holycrapola — April 12, 2013 at 7:04 p.m

mr H.C.....are you feeling well? i have followed your posts each day, especially those regarding CRC and LR. while mr pridemore's mantra "it's a done deal" your posts were (mostly) reasoned and helpful to the subject.

but here we are today, where wa's funding is no longer 'done', and your posts resembles the ranting, scatalogical thinking processes of the rabid LR group.

i hope you're not coming down with something.

DeeLittle — April 12, 2013 at 9:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal

the kind that killed all those kids at Sandy Hook. mrd — April 12, 2013 at 8:57 p.m

excuse me but the last I read, they found a bushmaster AR-15 INSIDE the car and a long rifle IN the trunk. they found 4 hand guns IN the school with lanza.
all rounds found inside the school, spent and unspent did not fit a AR-15.

Visit for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy

jasonb — April 12, 2013 at 9:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

try this again.

jasonb — April 12, 2013 at 9:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

There's a word for this...

**New Hampshire Stand Your Ground Law Opponents Threatened With Arrest, Removal From Office**

Tea party Republicans in New Hampshire want to press criminal charges against state legislators who voted to repeal the state's Stand Your Ground law and kick them out of office.

Two Republican members of the state House of Representatives and a former state GOP chairman have filed a petition to remove 189 members of the state House and file criminal charges against them for their March 27 vote to repeal the controversial gun law. The group claims that the vote violates the lawmakers' oath of office, unconstitutionally challenges the Second Amendment and fails to adhere to state constitutional protections on life.

nailingit — April 12, 2013 at 9:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

mrd — April 12, 2013 at 8:57 p.m.
I have to point out that the democrats have always been more homophobic, DADT was pushed onto the military by democrats Sam Nunn and Barney Frank, over the objections of republicans like Goldwater and Bill Cohen. Additionally the "Log Cabin Club" was officially recognized by the republicans 15 years before the democrats acknowledged their gay membership. Currently the most vocal anti gay activist is lifelong democrat and former Gore supporter Fred Phelps, and his Westboro Baptist Church. Before democrats start making false claims about bigotry you really should check out your own back yard.

frobert — April 12, 2013 at 10:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Holycrapola, your plan is flawed. First of all my friend, $20 tolls is an outrageous cost that nobody charges anywhere in the USA without a thorough investigation which would prove whether or not the costs exceed the need. Secondly, TriMet could offer to pay the commuters and they'll still turn it down. They couldn't afford it anyhow, given they're in the RED!!! Thirdly, I guess you haven't heard of longer shifts, shorter work weeks and carpooling incentives for those who cannot telecommute. Guess you haven't seen the number of people who carpool in the HOV lane on I-5 since you have no need to drive that stretch. The only difference should tolls be implemented... add a couple carpoolers to the crowd if needed. Everyone pays their share and bada bing!!! High cost solved. Heck, that works with $2 tolls and $5 tolls, too!

Number four...bring jobs to the as competitive as the ones the people are forced to drive into Portland. No more bridge crossing on a daily basis. Again, problem solved! You see holyc, the reason why they want this bridge so badly is to generate revenue from the commuters who also happen to be tax payers, drivers and those who would pay the tolls as well as riders. Even if they took light rail OR a bus, they'd be paying into the tolls with fares which would definitely go up to pay their fair share. You don't believe me??? Well holyc, check out your little city's price hikes then come back and reply:

My favorite quote: *"MTA chief Joe Lhota said the increases are unavoidable. “Costs that the MTA does not exercise control over, namely those for debt service, pensions, energy, paratransit, and employee and retiree health care, continue to increase beyond the rate of inflation.”* Now isn't that great..."unavoidable increases." Gee, haven't we heard that one before??? Sounds like TriMet.

Did you know you could use your Hawg in the carpool lane during peak hours???

Did you also know that in some states, motorcycles are exempt from paying tolls??? If bicyclists are exempt on I-5 tolling, then motorcyclists should be exempt as well. That's my opinion, though. Yet another fix to your "tolling" idea.

And your Saturday morning dropping??? Just a little bunny nugget.

goldenoldie — April 13, 2013 at 7:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

According to the letter submitted to Governor Inslee, the Washington State Senate Leaders requesting a formal investigation into the Columbia River Crossing have requested a reply by the governor no later than April 17th. Stay tuned, folks!!!

goldenoldie — April 13, 2013 at 7:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal

**U.S. ranks near bottom of UNICEF report on child well-being**

The United States ranked 26 out of 29 countries, just ahead of Lithuania, Latvia and Romania

The United States ranked in the bottom four of a United Nations report on child well-being. Among 29 countries, America landed second from the bottom in child poverty and held a similarly dismal position when it came to “child life satisfaction.”

Keeping the U.S. company at the bottom of the report, which gauged material well-being, overall health, access to housing and education, were Lithuania, Latvia and Romania, three of the poorest countries in the survey.

UNICEF said in a statement on the survey that child poverty in countries like the U.S. “is not inevitable but is policy-susceptible” and that there isn’t necessarily a strong relationship between per capita GDP and overall child well-being, explaining: “The Czech Republic is ranked higher than Austria, Slovenia higher than Canada, and Portugal higher than the United States.”

The Netherlands ranked number one on the list, with Norway, Iceland, Finland and Sweden filling out the top five.

**Awash In Record Profits, Corporations Shift Even More To Offshore Tax Havens**

Even as American corporations are raking in record profits, the largest among them are shifting larger amounts of money away from the United States and into offshore tax havens that allow them to pad their bottom lines even more, according to multiple analyses of legal filings made since the beginning of 2013.
The Wall Street Journal found that the 60 largest companies moved $166 billion offshore in 2012, shielding 40 percent of their earnings from American taxes and costing the U.S. billions in lost revenue:

The amount of money at stake is significant, particularly when the U.S. budget deficit is high on the political agenda. Just 19 of the 60 companies in the Journal’s survey disclose the tax hit they could face if they brought the money back to their U.S. parent. Those companies say they might have to pay $98 billion in additional tax—more than the $85 billion in automatic-spending cuts triggered this month after the White House and Congress couldn’t agree on an alternative.

A similar analysis from Bloomberg found that 83 of the largest American companies moved $183 billion overseas in 2012, bringing the total offshore to $1.46 trillion for those 83 companies alone.

nailingit — April 13, 2013 at 9:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 13, 2013 at 8:42 a.m.

lol...That I can definitely agree with!!! Thanks for the smiles, holyc.

goldenoldie — April 13, 2013 at 9:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Thanks for the links @8:39 pm, Goldie . I’s hard to see how they’re projecting over 9000 people daily using LRT when the parking garages are for 2900, which the FB commenter referred to. Even taking into account buses feeding into LRT. Dummied up projections, if you ask me. The decline in ridership on trimet, generally, has been brought up before. Nothing about any of this project makes sense.

And HC @ 6:20 am:

> You can't condition human behavior? is an idea...

Two words: social engineering. But then again, I guess that’s what you said. Sometimes hard to know if you’re really serious, or just throwin’ stuff out there to shake things up. I’m afraid it’s the former.

kn_dalai — April 13, 2013 at 11:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai and Goldie,

As I keep harping on, you HAVE to look at the Waterfront and other downtown Vancouver revitalization projects when trying to account for Vancouver City Council and the 49th District state legislators being so insistent on light rail being part of this project. Those 20,000 riders (which kn_dalai correctly identifies as 10,000 people due to most will ride twice) are going to mostly be people living in those 3300 high rise apartment dwellings they want to build in their nice little upscale community of young professionals. People who live in their little isolated community south of the BNSF tracks, and who will spend the majority of their time and money working and playing in Portland. If the planners were truly concerned about the 60,000 daily commuters from this County, they would have run the tracks up I5 to at least the vicinity of the Salmon Creek Park and Ride. In reality, this project is just one more example of how they'll gladly spend every penny they can lay their hands on in their misguided attempt to somehow resurrect Old Vancouver and ignore that the city has long since moved eastward.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 11:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Frankly, here's a project that makes a lot more sense for Oregon to invest their $450 million cost share in. A fair amount of that cost will be tied to projects like bicycle bridges - not really necessary but it is their dime - but the main effort will be to fix the congestion where the I84 runs head on into the I5 below the Rose Quarter. Fix this and a lot of the daily commuting congestion will be reduced - something the CRC project will not accomplish.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 11:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

HolyC - You confuse the hell out of me. One minute you're all fired up supporting a bridge project that is all about the liberal vision of pushing the proletariat out of their private cars and onto public transportation, and the next moment you're giving us tunes from someone who's been been opposed to our "nanny state" federal gov't far longer than that johnny come lately Ted Nugent.

Anyhow - Back out you with one of my favorites by him.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 12:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal

No idea why, but this has been running through my brain for a couple of days - So I'm going to share it. The guy was actually pretty entertaining, looking back.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 12:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Yes Roger, you have harped on the waterfront project. You always made sense about that. Looking at the project’s website, it’s not hard to see how light rail could be made to order for that project.


I don’t know, but it seems a foregone conclusion that ctran will be running shuttle buses in there to get the yuppies, as we used to call them, to the LRT platform and then into their Portland jobs on light rail at a minimal cost to themselves, while vehicle commuters are paying for the works with high tolls.


kn_dalai — April 13, 2013 at 1:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — April 12, 2013 at 7:37 p.m

Ha! That's funny. I had that record.

hawkeye — April 13, 2013 at 2:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I see the folks who promote the CRC are hard at work in attempts to capture the minds of folks at the downtown library, today. Nothing on their little signboards promoting light rail, though. Hopefully, these are folks who are promoting a new design. I wish I had time to talk to them but had an appointment I couldn't miss.

goldenoldie — April 12, 2013 at 12:06 p.m

I stopped & asked. It took about 60 seconds. They have a contract to do a traffic study. They ask if you have been across the bridge in the last 90 days. If yes, there were four laptop computers so you could participate. They are not employees of CRC and they aren't promoting anything. Nothing to fear. No CRC bogeyman.

langenthal — April 13, 2013 at 2:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

No idea why, but this has been running through my brain for a couple of days


You have a fever when your temperature rises above its normal range. What's normal for you may be a little higher or lower than the average normal temperature of 98.6 F (37 C).
Depending on what's causing your fever, additional fever signs and symptoms may include:



Muscle aches

Loss of appetite


General weakness

High fevers between 103 F (39.4 C) and 106 F (41.1 C) may cause:






**When to see a doctor**

Fevers by themselves may not be a cause for alarm — or a reason to call a doctor. Yet there are some circumstances when you should seek medical advice for your baby, your child or yourself. If MC Hammer is running through your brain longer than 2 minutes deem yourself a survivor. After 2 minutes proceed with reparative therapy mixed with Stevie Ray Vaugn and Black Sabbath music.


roger- In case you are not feeling well, something to show I care.

God bless you bro.

nailingit — April 13, 2013 at 2:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"Currently the most vocal anti gay activist is lifelong democrat and former Gore supporter Fred Phelps, and his Westboro Baptist Church. Before democrats start making false claims about bigotry you really should check out your own back yard."

funny thing, a coupla days ago I made a comment about some Dem stating something about dumping any Dem that went along with some proposal in order to get a little bi-partisan action going. I got called out by Nail, claiming she was not an elected official, and certainly didn't speak for the Dem Party. I think Phelps would also fall into that category.

"excuse me but the last I read, they found a bushmaster AR-15 INSIDE the car and a long rifle IN the trunk. they found 4 hand guns IN the school with lanza. all rounds found inside the school, spent and unspent did not fit a AR-15."

My bad. I read the C's article and the headline stated that was the weapon used, but either way, auctioning off an assault rifle is something I find offensive, in light of recent happenings, and I'd bet a majority of parents that lost their kids in Newtown would agree. The Rep's are showing a complete lack of insensitivity in their promotion of a view that currently anyway, is inconsistent with polling #'s and good taste. Kinda like selling nooses after a black person is lynched or decorative pesticides containers after several Hispanic field workers die from insecticide poisoning. But what's really comical would be then try and convince these folks you'd like them to "help you grow the tent" as if they couldn't see thru that. Now THAT'S funny.

mrd — April 13, 2013 at 5:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal

OK, Nails - Thanks for getting me back to the good stuff. Here's one back from one of those guys that never got the acclaim deserved.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 6:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

This guy was my brother's next door neighbor in Austin years ago - another one of those bands that should have seen a wider popularity than just in Texas.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 6:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I first learned of this guy when he was playing in Mayall's Bluesbreakers. Too bad he has to go to Europe to get recognition.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 6:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

But I liked Hammer - too bad rap didn't follow his example of having a good time.

roger — April 13, 2013 at 6:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

langenthal — April 13, 2013 at 2:45 p.m.

Did you see the questions? According to some who posted on the FB side, the questions were misleading. There was nothing regarding whether you support or oppose the light rail. You see langenthal, the game with the folks at CRC has been to trap people into answering their well-thought questionnairs to suit some false sense of support for the crossing. People have caught onto the game they're playin'. Why else would you think so many have come up to the plate and made such a fuss??? Sometimes you have to ask why the voters' choice in 1995 was ignored. Sometimes you have to ask why the powers that be never allowed another vote by the people regarding the crossing. It has been said here a couple of times that the recent Sales Tax Increase request by C-Tran for maintenance and operations of light rail and funding for BRT failed...not because of opposition to light rail, but because of how poorly the request had been written. Folks such as myself say B>>>S>>>!!! It was the voters' last attempt at a vote in opposition of the expense of refusing funding for BRT plain and simple. It's just that the promoters are in denial.

goldenoldie — April 13, 2013 at 7:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Kn_dalai and Roger, I've noticed your discussion after my last comment this morning so I'll address the both of you in one comment. Kn_ I'm glad I was able to help. And yes, I was dead serious when it came to the crossing project...and still am. This impacts us in such a's unfathomable how they want to attack us from all sides with tolls, taxes, fees...AND we're already penalized by paying Oregon State Taxes which we cannot even vote on. Anybody in their right mind would refuse to move to Portland to avoid that. It's worse over there. I know. I have relatives and friends there...and I grew up there. They've got TriMet. We've got C-Tran. I'd take C-Tran any day!

Roger AND more comment to the both of you and it's regarding the Waterfront Project. When I sat down with Eric Holmes before he left the position, I was told by him that there were plans for a trolley system to go down the main route of the waterfront. Guess what that would've connected with??? You win the $20 question of the day if you guessed light rail. I asked him "What if light rail won't come to Vancouver?" And the look on his face...Talk about a blank stare!!! I had told him they should have an old-fashioned style of trolleys to reflect the historic aspect of the region. Instead, it would look like the trolleys in downtown Portland so you know who would've had that in their back pocket. Now...hopefully...the trolley idea is a no go! Also...who in their right minds would think it's trendy to live or work in a development parked directly under the flight path of PDX or stare at a shopping mall from their upper-story windows...or stare at grain towers or the BNSF train tracks??? Gramor has their work cut out for them to master a magical trick to bring people in...THAT'S for sure!

goldenoldie — April 13, 2013 at 8:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger- Hammer's like crack! Put down the pipe before it corrupts your soul!

I fasted for 20 minutes then prayed for you. A small still voice said unto me...


A night ending attempt to bring you back into the fold.

Sex, Guns, Magic, with a dose of Sinatra. (I was all out of eye of newt)

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 12:13 a.m. ( | suggest removal

mrd — April 13, 2013 at 5:48 p.m.

I did not claim that Phelps spoke for all democrats, that would have been a Straw man fallacy. My point is that republicans are no more bigoted than democrats. Republicans are the one major party that did not support bigotry, and hatred.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 7:02 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Aaron Corvin, good job on your article, "The Big Divide." Always a pleasure reading an impartial article written so well!!! You sir, are a gem in Columbian's ethics vault (you too, Paul).

Paul Suarez...your first video tells all and it's clear just who wants what for our county. In my case, I side with Commissioner Madore (no shock, huh) and I believe that we need to keep our county growth under close scrutiny so that we don't become the reflection of all that is wrong with Portland. Why would we want another Portland? Heck, it's just across the river. If people want to live in a city such as Portland, then why not move there and leave Clark County to grow its own wings without the influence of Orygunians telling us how it should be. And yes, I was born and raised in Portland but my roots began here in Vancouver long before. I've lived here most of my life and continue to live here till retirement and beyond. My heart is in our city and our county. We need to preserve it and maintain it and bring jobs to the industrial zones that already exist (like Integra moving into the old warehouse on the east side...a prime example). We need to improve the industrial zones and bring them up to standards...even beyond standards. We need to raise the standards of quality living which is reachable for everyone, not just the few that can afford it and we can't do that with uncontrolled planning for growth which takes away the very wonderment that our county has to offer.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 7:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal

*"As much as we want to give Obama the benefit of the doubt, I think that we fell for a con job."*

Ya think?????????????

It reminds me of the con job we've endured with the crossing project. Must be the *modus operandi* of much of today's leadership, that many across America have closed their minds as to what our leaders are doing, only so that they can survive through the insanity of it all. Other that or their bodies are so filled with the junk chemicals, antibiotics, hormones and toxins in processed foods that it has numbed their thought processes, lol.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 7:53 a.m. ( | suggest removal

oops...that should read "Either that or their bodies...."

sorry about that.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 7:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I have to react to the Columbian article, "C-Tran at a crossroads over light rail."

In the article, it states *"C-Tran Executive Director Jeff Hamm laid out a wide range of options Saturday, from pursuing another vote to simply withdrawing support for the CRC entirely, or ceding authority to another entity, such as the city of Vancouver.*

*Vancouver Mayor Tim Leavitt, who supports the CRC, made it clear he's not interested in that option. Doing so would only "shirk" the transit agency's responsibility, he said.*

*"C-Tran should be the one to take up that obligation, and nobody else," Leavitt said."*

My reaction??? Well, it goes directly to Mayor Tim Leavitt.

Sir, you just don't get it, do you??? You say C-Tran should be the one to take up the obligation and nobody else...but did you forget just who it is that is paying for C-Tran to even operate??? This is exactly the mentality of folks in leadership positions that gets them to lose their jobs at the next election.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 8:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Smart marketing on "The Great Divide" to have it available for purchase on Kindle!

roger, goldie and others who are interested in Keeping Vancover Normal:

What about the Slow Cities movement? Heard about it?

It started in Europe and there are only 3 US cities who have embraced its mission: Sebastopol, Sonoma, and Fairfax California.

Take a look at its US website and tell me if Vancouver USA should not join them and become the 4th. Slow does not mean no progress or business growth. It is simply an embrace of a way of life that research shows is healthier:

[link text][1]


manthou — April 14, 2013 at 8:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Ooops: Vancouver cannot be a slow city because our population exceeds 50,000.

Nice concepts, though. I think we have it, regardless of population!

manthou — April 14, 2013 at 9:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 8:29 a.m.

You remind me of someone by the name of Mike who loves to through insult into injury in their comments for nothing more than just to gain a reaction to suit some sick mind game. At least you explain yourself, though.

Regarding Madore...

Long before I even heard of his name, I held to the vision I had for our county and it hasn't changed. It just happens he came into the public picture and had a similar vision. Remember holyc, he used to live in California...ran an upstart business from scratch...chose to move to Vancouver for it's intrinsic value and quite successful and has taken his civic duties county commish. No light rail, no funkified Portland mantra which attracted him...Just Clark County...Vancouver for what it IS, not what someone wants it to be. I haven't seen anything in his portfolio that says he's not genuine but you seem to think he's a snake in the grass. Till I see evidential facts to that assumption, I will wholeheartedly disagree.

And just because I support certain political moves he makes which match my ideals and my vision, doesn't mean it's a political love affair. In fact, I find that quite offensive and I believe you should apologize. Just because I show support publicly for political moves by politicians, doesn't mean anything other than voicing my public support.

Falling for the demagoguery of Madore? Hardly. In fact, I totally disagree with a third bridge on the East side. It should be on the west side as an arterial for both ports.

Portland??? Yeah, it has its own intrinsic value....but it's not for everyone. There's a reason why us Clark County residents hold steadfast to living here and you live there. Remember this, too...Vancouver was the first and always be the first in bringing folks to the west side along the C-River and the first to bring commerce to the region. We have Fort Vancouver National Historic Park to remind us. Vancouver also had the first pilot land at Pearson...from the other side of the Pacific Ocean. Clark County has a grist mill which has been in place since 1876. Portland and Multnomah County do not. You have to go to Hood River County for that. Clark County has an outdoor amphitheater/event center worth attending events. We have arts theaters and dance theaters...and we have a wonderful school of the arts. Within the boundaries of Clark County, we have not only a community college, but a State University with a vast array of education potentials to suit any job anywhere in the world for those with wanderlust. There's the wine and jazz festival, celebrations at the fort, international festivals and festivals to celebrate the native culture. There's quite a list of celebs from Vancouver and Clark County as well as authors and philanthropists who have dedicated their time, their money and their efforts to preserve our community and our county. To say Vancouver has nothing...that's pure ignorance.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 9:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou, the concept was a good idea. I believe a community should be for the most part, self reliable...self sustaining, and it should meet or exceed the expectations of those who live there without stepping on the toes of the taxpayers, making it unaffordable to live. No community should ever have to rely on loans against taxes paid by the masses but in these economic times, that appears to be what is happening. I so hope we don't have that lead weight of MAX in our community. They have proven time and time again that they cannot maintain their existence without taxpayer-funded subsidies. I believe C-Tran is starting to feel the pinch, hence the reason why they're questioning going on with funding for the CRC. I just wish Mayor Leavitt would realize it's not the burden of C-Tran, but the burden of the taxpayers.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 9:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Why do you come to Portland? Because you are bored at Vancouver more likely... For the ones that live in Vancouver and work in Portland? What are you thinking? Are you out of your mind? LOL

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 8:31 a.m.

Quite an assumption by you, holyc. The only reason why I go to Portland isn't because of boredom here. There's plenty to do here in our county. Why do you go to Nick's in Amboy...are you bored of Portland? If you are indeed an Oregonian, then how many times have you used your Oregon ID to pay for products here in Clark County? You know you're cheating the taxpayers here, right???

Why do people work in Portland? Mainly because of the fact that families have to survive and that companies have left Clark County to international sites or other states and the jobs infrastructure here in Clark County is poor.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 9:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

We're so lucky to live in an area where we can enjoy the best that both states have to offer. Why change the intrinsic value of Clark County in order to fill the pockets of the few who want to ruin Clark County just to fulfill their own greedy interests?

I'm about to enjoy what Clark County has to offer the rest of this day, rain or shine!!! Have a great one!

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 9:24 a.m. ( | suggest removal

mrd — April 13, 2013 at 5:48 p.m.

The Bushmaster was indeed the weapon used, this site, the Connecticut State Police website is pretty much the most official one I could find.;=4226

Pertinent line: "The shooter used the Bushmaster .223 to murder 20 children and six adults inside the school; he used a handgun to take his own life inside the school. No other weapons were used in this crime. This case remains under investigation."

Anyone who is posting differently is either ignorant, in denial or a shill for the NRA.

dfsadfh — April 14, 2013 at 9:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal

A glimpse into the soon to be released "Looking To The Future" video produced by our own Vantucky Conservative Movement. (the Digital No-Ho's *lend me your hand and I'll give you a job*) crowd. A place where Waters is turned into Whine...

..a place where Dave elected himself Mayor.

I don't see any light rail..

[No park fee's needed]

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 9:43 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Frick n' Frack return from Washington with a very hopeful message for their base..

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 10:38 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I played the part of Evil-Eye Fleegle in my high school's rendition of Lil' Abner. It was a two night show.

They put green food coloring in my face makeup. It took two weeks to go completely away - no matter how hard I scrubbed.

What do you mean Vancouver doesn't have any writers, HC?;=UTF8&qid;=1365960751&sr;=1-1&keywords;=A+Little+Sex%2C+a+Lot+of+Dope+and+an+Aircraft+Carrier

Ouch, I see sales are slipping again. I'm gonna have to switch to the cheap beer. Again.

My second book *From the Attic of a Madamn?* went to the publisher a couple of days ago for review. Hopefully, editing will begin in the next couple of weeks.

And, of course, there's the ever popular blog:

You just never know who you're talking to, now do ya, HC ;^)

Hey, how 'bout you use a photo of your bike for an avatar the next couple of days? I'll admit to being curious.

C'mon, I've showed you *mine*.

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 10:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

"Madman," ...Attic of a Madman. Editing, indeed.

Though, "Madamn" does kind'a look cool. I can think of several definitions... Never mind.

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 10:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift- I gotta say that is one beautiful ride.

It's been some time since I've ridden. All my bikes burned rice except for a couple of schnitzel eaters.

My love for two wheels was always married to dirt & sand, but I did own a couple of street bikes in the past. Never a Harley but always longing for one.

My vision is much like your bike.

Well done!

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 11:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Thank you, Nail!

The first time I "built" it was back in '80, shortly after I departed the Navy. She's gone through several renovations since.

At the book signing you might have noticed the numbers tattooed on my right wrist. Those are the Panhead engine numbers.

My first bike was a Yamaha 125 MX. I was about 17 when I traded my quadrasonic home-eight-track player for it.

I rode a Yamaha when I road raced over at PIR, too. That one was a '89 FZR 400. And before you ask; second was my best finish and, yes, I did crash. More than once.

I'll give something up here: That HC cat is sort of irritating me with all of his whoola about "bikers." Bummer, HC, but, man, you spread it pretty thick.

I've been riding *something* even before I could reach the pedals. I've toured the West Coast aboard the machine pictured. Several times. There were times when the bike was the only wheels I had. A gallon of milk, diapers, smokes... that meant flipping out the kicker pedal and giving it a jump.

I was both a Board Member, and one year, voted in as the president of the racing club I was associated with.

I can take my machine apart (and put it back together) with not much more than a crescent wrench and a pair of pliers. On the side of the road. Headed up hill. Both ways in the snow.

I've never considered myself a "biker." A motorcycle entusiast? Sure, but not a biker. You see, the word has become so ubiquitous whatever it may have meant at one time has been left along some lonely road.

If I did, however... you know, HC, I think I would take exception with you trying to shove me into your little box.

Show us the bike *you've* built, HC.

Thanks again, Nail.

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 12:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift: In your avatar, I see another nice ride that you're leanin' up against. Is that yours as well???


holycrapola, I truly don't need to dignify an answer to your comment @10:06 am but I will just for the heckuvit. As I've said before, I vote both sides of the ticket. Telling me to stay away from neo cons (a liberal's favorite label) is like telling you to stay away from Vancouver. You still come this way now, don't ya??? Must you're really bored with Portland.

Seriously, if the person running for office has no history to prove that he or she is otherwise genuine in their stance and what they state in the campaign matches what I stand by, what I support...they're most likely going to get my vote. If campaign promises are broken or unfulfilled, I learn from my mistake and vote 'em out next time.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 1:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 1:19 p.m.

must be H A.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 1:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 10:06 a.m.

You asked why Madore left the Columbian. Seems to me he's been in the news quite often, doing a lot more FOR the people rather than some on here who would rather just sit back and complain about what the commissioner's not doing. Maybe you should ask him. My opinion...he's not on any more, probably because he's working diligently in his position as county commish, has been assigned to the following duties, courtesy of Clark County website:

2013 Board assignments

Council for the Homeless (CFTH) Board of Directors
Disability Board - Clark County
Southwest Washington Workforce Development Council
Southwest Washington Council of Governments on Aging and Disabilities
Southwest Washington Behavioral Health (RSN) Governing Board
Urban County Policy Board
Southwest Washington Convention and Visitors Bureau
Fort Vancouver Television
Regional Transportation Council (RTC) Board of Directors
Clark Transit Agency (C-Tran) Board of Directors
Board of Health (BOH)

AND he runs a business AND he's a family man along with other attributes I'm sure I've missed.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 1:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Goldie, the car is my boy's. The Oldsmo-pile resides at his place now.

In that photo the engine is missing. Yeah, I know, it's hard to tell. ;^) He's since had the machine work done and reassembled/installed it. He did the "hotrod" thing.

Right now he has his hands full with my grandson. After his boy gets along a ways mine will get back on his project.

I rode in it after he dropped the motor back in. Wowza!

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 1:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HA!!! You have given me a good the expense of purging coffee all over my monitor, tho. Your innuendos regarding Madore are really sick minded, but that's okay. I understand that "biker" mentality of yours more than you know. Yeah, I could tell ya a few stories but this isn't the place and I haven't the time. There's no "agenda" directly against me, holyc. I'm not paranoid like you. I will say there is an agenda directly against the people of Clark County, but it's by someone you've mentioned.

If you want to talk about who's lying to all of us, is using us and chewing us up and throwing us into the ditch, you need to take a closer look at Rep. Moeller, your idol. Now there's a person who is totally out of touch with the people of Clark County. Thank heavens he only represents the 49th Leg. District...and even that's bad enough. If he's so good, then why have so many businesses in his district closed up shop and left??? And his time on the C...shouldn't he be working in the Washington State House of Representatives??? They've only got a couple of weeks left in this session. I've been wondering why he's so vocal on...of all places...the Columbian!!! Then I realized it's because he's desperate to get his pet project passed in the Washington State Senate...which right now is a no go. You know...the pet project which will tax us from all ends and toll us into the dirt. Yeah, talk about an attack against the people!!! For what??? So you can ride your little choo choo into downtown instead of your Hawg? Why not take your sailboat and anchor it in the moorage on the southwest side where the jazz festivals play??

And wasn't it you that said you had no need to travel across the bridges into the other state? Contradicting yourself again, eh???

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 2:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Do you have photos on your computer HC?

'Click' on your blank avatar. It will take you to "your page." There, sort of follow the directions. When you 'click' the browse option you'll be able to choose any of your filed photos for the avatar thing.

And, HC, please remind me of the question I asked - I simply don't recall.

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 2:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift, just to clarify...that last comment wasn't directed at you. From the little, teeny, tiny picture, it looked pretty nice. They don't make 'em like they used to...for sure!

When I first read your comment about "Attic of a Madamn," I was beginning to wonder if you were taking a different route in your writing career. 8))

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 2:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 1:52 p.m.

In politics, they all have to start somewhere and he's a newbie at holding a position in the political world. To the folks of Clark County, $3.6 Billion is hardly chump change and is hardly something unnoticeable. That's okay, though. I know where you're coming from. You think we should have Dubai x2 here and erase the historic aspect of this diverse county. You think we should have the little choo choo into a dying downtown. You think the people should pay from 5 different directions in order for you to have your choo choo here. You think some million-dollar makers should move their businesses out of Clark County at some other waterfront, displacing thousands of families so you can have your little choo choo. You'd rather displace or destroy the remaining businesses in downtown Vancouver in the LRT/bridge construction zone just for your little choo choo.

Yeah...I know exactly where you're coming from with your bad boyz attitude, trying to belittle a woman who isn't afraid to tell it like it is and you resort to your disgusting innuendos...probably for personal gratification for what reason is unbeknownst to me and quite frankly I could care less. Of Mr. T. used to say - I pity da fool. You're more transparent than you think you are, HC. Oh yeah quite transparent.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 2:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 12:26 p.m.

Well stated.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 2:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Ready to take my ride on the road.

roger — April 14, 2013 at 3:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Let's pack a lunch and ride! Drift taking point while froyo rides downwind.


John Laird is the best!

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 3:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Just playin' fro...HEY! Watch where you're going!

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 3:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal

HolyC- We should expect nothing less from electing a narrow minded conservative.

We got what he paid for! ;)

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 3:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 4:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 4:03 p.m.

I always had my suspicions but who knows.


hawkeye — April 14, 2013 at 5:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

*I am no bigot and could care less about this guy's sexual inclination...does he sound gay to you? I mean no disrespect but his speech is kind of weird. Any opinions on this?*

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 4:03 p.m.

With all due respect, I suspect quite a few to have had similar thoughts HC.

As Jon points out, it's really hard not to go there sometimes.

Conservatives tend to be light in the humor department and take themselves quite seriously. Better wear a flak jacket from now on! :)

They believe God will send all gay people to an everlasting hell. Just to imply anyone having same sex, sex, is, well, ungodly!

Until one of em' gets caught acting out.

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 5:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Geez...freakish avatar on the forum today and it's not roger's. Roger, your that big wheel your ride? If so...I've seen some pretty wild riders spinnin' cookies with those...and they weren't children, lol.

Ever watch Nitro Circus?



Regarding low density planning...

Clark County is filled with empty warehouses, mall outlets, homes and condos. Before any new high density planning is approved, roads continually need improvement and the empty buildings must be upgraded and filled first...hopefully to meet or exceed LEED certification. There has to be a need...a market and right now, high density development would be yet another empty dream awash in foreclosures and bank sales as I'm afraid the waterfront project will face. What farmland is left in Clark County must be preserved if we want our region to remain self sustainable. Thanks but no thanks to a concrete sewer like downtown Portland. Iiilghh!!!

Talk about depressing!!! For travelers driving through downtown Portland, it's a nightmare...all those signs of "progress" (gag), including the ones with fecal matter and aftermath of cheap booze and no food on the stomach. Gotta do the Texas two step sometimes ya know. Yeah...progress, Portland style! (gross, I know...but it's true).

And Max...such a pleasant walking experience in downtown! Oh, should I mention the wonderful hotels like the Nines (one of my fav's) or Fifth Avenue Suites or better yet, the Governor!!! Wonnnnderful places to spend a night (yes, that part is true) and sleep in the next mornin'...unless the garbage trucks come down your street (and yes, this part is true as well)! Then there's spending time eating your lunch at Pioneer Courthouse Square on a warm spring afternoon...if the panhandlers don't try to rob you of your bus/MAX fare or your lunch.

Now the Pearl...that's a nice location, even if the roads around Andina's are screwed up with ruts and hard leans, but if you want to walk around...heading to the Chocolatier is definitely an interesting experience if you don't mind the confusion of the roads. You can't beat Powell's Books. Too bad the rest of Portland can't be like the area around Powell's. That is, if you can maneuver around the area without a hitch! Nevermind the construction and reconstruction forever tying up roads in downtown.'d think they'd fix the roads before anything else. And Chinatown??? Such a safe place for people to be at night, wouldn't you say??? Honestly, Portland could learn a few things from the city to the north.

Yeah...downtown Portland has so much to offer these days. High density planning at I think not. It tarnishes the good things like the Schnitz, the main library and the Art Museum.

And no, I'm not in a bad mood. It's actually a fantastic day...and has been a fantastic birthday week for me. Lot of wishes came true for me...and I'm a smilin' away!!! Sorry for you to think you've ruined it for me.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 5:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal

So holyc...where's that picture on your avatar??? Still waitin' to see your "ride."

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 5:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 5:44 p.m.

No can do, holyc. You haven't made it to my "trusted friends" list.

By the way, you do know that copyrighted photos cannot be used as an avatar, right??? Most likely your photo was either copyrighted, watermarked or resembles one that was copyrighted. Try a different one.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 5:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 5:21 p.m.

... and the dog ate his homework.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 5:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

frobert, your comment @5:55 pm...please remind me not to take a sip of my drink before reading the comments here on the forum. It makes such a mess on the computer screen when something hilarious is posted. Guess it's the shock factor, lol.

goldenoldie — April 14, 2013 at 6:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Is that your motorcycle, fro?

And for roger:

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 6:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Great avatar Nail. That's one of my favorite movies. Great acting, hilarious story, and the fiddling is out of this world.

Not posting, just reading. Too opinionated today from all sides.

luvithere — April 14, 2013 at 6:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 5:17 p.m.

I'm thinking this is Madore's roll model.

hawkeye — April 14, 2013 at 6:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 10:38 a.m.

@ 1:20-1:22...I've listened to this more times than President Palmer listened to the Cypress recording.

Is this tune marginalizing people who use recreation drugs and their procreation?

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 6:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

hawkeye — April 14, 2013 at 6:38 p.m.

He'd better watch his step! Like so many well known evangelicals, Ned had his foray into... fornication.

I can't recall which episode, but Ned wasn't on too good of okadokally terms with the Lord.

nailingit — April 14, 2013 at 7:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 6:23 p.m.

Yes 80 inch evo FXR, lowered with a dual disc wideglide front end, mild apes and an S&S; hot set up kit, not as cool as yours but should out run it.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 7:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

> Prosperity and job creation happens in high density areas more than not. More human capital at he disposal, more resources, more ideas, more diversity, more culture, more education, more banks, more lending, more hospitals, etc, etc, etc. -- holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 3:40 p.m.

Well here we go again. Prosperity? You mean like bankrupt and crime ridden New York City? I mean -- NYC is high density isn't it?

Centralized planning through government; to include population densification, is very much a Leftist hallmark. Nothing about it is Libertarian. Which in this case means non Rightest.

BTW HC, from one of your previous incarnations, I thought you were some sort of computer expert. You’re having trouble with putting an image on your avatar? You ARE just playing some games here right? OK. I can get that. Funny, especially when you can get someone to agree with you. OK. Ha. Ah hahaha.

kn_dalai — April 14, 2013 at 7:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

holycrapola — April 14, 2013 at 6:36 p.m.

"You were a no show the same as this loser frobert. I told him the place and the time, he was a no show."

You were here posting at the appointed time and only 3 people were at the appointed place, you aren't one of them.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 7:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — April 14, 2013 at 7:29 p.m.

He didn't seem to have any problems posting the pictures of the car in his neighborhood, remember the ones that got him kicked off last time.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 7:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Thanks, Drift. Both my kids coulda taken that crowd out when they were young. Then they got older and discovered skateboards. We spent more than a few hours in the emergency room getting them patched up.

roger — April 14, 2013 at 7:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Sorry, but I can't keep the avatar of my ride up, it is autism awareness month and in honor of my wonderful son, I am changing back to the autism awareness ribbon.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 7:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Yeah, you'd spank me hard, fro.
My ol' pan has a few tricks up her sleeve, but she's still just an old pan.

I got no front brake(s), man.
I clutch with my foot and shift with my hand.

There's the Andrews gearing in the tranny, the STD heads, the Spyke electronic ignition, S&S; this and Sifton that... but she's still just an old tractor. That's the truth of it.

She's one Hell of a bark, her bite though...

Hey, HC, if you log off and click on my avatar, you can send me a private message. It'll come through my email client. I don't know if you can include an attachment, but go ahead give it a try.

If that doesn't work I'll give you my home address and you can ride over. Do you pitch shoes?

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 7:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — April 14, 2013 at 7:50 p.m.

From my youngest, I don't know what was scarier, "watch this" or "look what I can do", either one usually resulted in an ER visit.

frobert — April 14, 2013 at 7:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Or perhaps???

roger — April 14, 2013 at 8:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Or even???

roger — April 14, 2013 at 8:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

No... This is more basement speed.

roger — April 14, 2013 at 8:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift — April 14, 2013 at 7:55 p.m.

I had a '49 that kicked me over the handlebars a few times. I guess I wasn't the only thing "retarded" that day.

hawkeye — April 14, 2013 at 10:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal

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