Open forum, Feb 18-24

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329 comments

Comments

Thoughts on Mayor Leavitt running for re-election?

Lou Brancaccio (Columbian Staff) — February 18, 2013 at 1:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


May the best man win.

---

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7NyO9...

I've always considered Floyd as belonging to the "no labels" genre of music.

Rock, space rock, jazz rock, prog rock, acid rock, London pop, blues, classical, heavy, etc....no label exists, anything but contemporary.

Not to mention Soul Music.

This tune still reduces me...

nailingit — February 18, 2013 at 1:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Thoughts on Mayor Leavitt running for re-election?*

Not getting my vote this time around.

ELISI — February 18, 2013 at 1:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Can't vote for anyone in Vancouver, but if I could it would be for anyone that isn't backed by Madore.

hawkeye — February 18, 2013 at 2:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


It depends on who is running against Tim Leavitt. :)

It may be a lesser-of-two-evils situation. Again.

manthou — February 18, 2013 at 3:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Mayor Leavitt - Even Royce Pollard called him a liar - just stated it a little less bluntly than some. "Mr. Leavitt was on the Council for seven years. He knew exactly what was going on. What the conditions were. And what had to be done. Has to live with that and figure out how to weasel his way out of it."

roger — February 18, 2013 at 3:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal


HC, just a thought here but maybe it's time that the Mayor's job becomes a full time job. When you are working part time it doesn't seem to get full effort. Cut back on the "manager" job and become a real Mayor.

hawkeye — February 18, 2013 at 3:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nails,

There's a German band called Amon Duul II that was big in Europe, but for whatever the reason didn't get much of a following here. A buddy of mine who was in the USAF and stationed in Europe in the early '70s was a big fan - turned me on to them. Similar to Floyd, and at times perhaps ahead of them. This is from '70.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xt3EoQ...

roger — February 18, 2013 at 3:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I think once the list of candidates is out and I have a chance to hear them speak and see what there plans are then I will try to get a clearer picture of who is deserving of my vote... I think having Mr. Leavitt run again is a good thing. When one runs for re election no mater how many times your personal record is always scrutinized... Your campain promises and what you did and didn't accomplish come to the fore front..

That is why Obama should never should have been re elected.. He was full of hope and change and broken Promises... Couldn't hang his hat on one thing he did during his first term except Divide our country several ways ....He was so articulate in doing this he painted everyone who was a R to actually be something they werenm't. He turned off more voters than any other presidential election in history...Nail I just had to throw that in for you....And why was Tiger playing golf with him anyway... Tiger had to move from CA or be hit with 66% taxing of his earnings...JMHO on that subject... I see several states are now going after CA busineses due to that fact of the new taxing on businesess and wealthier folks in CA... They seem to want to keep more of what they earn than the Pres and the State of california think.

As for a Madore backed candidate... This person could be a great choice, again will have to wait and see... Just remember....

'Great people talk about ideas.
Average people talk about things.
Small people talk about other people, and then, sadly, there are the people who love to talk about themselves.

Who do you want to be?

vanwadreamer — February 18, 2013 at 3:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — February 18, 2013 at 3:33 p.m.

Just an observation here but wasn't your WHOLE statement about other people?

hawkeye — February 18, 2013 at 4:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwa- *Couldn't hang his hat on one thing he did during his first term*

Incorrect. Like it or not ObamaCare is a huge deal. Historic. Many more but that's a start.

*He was so articulate in doing this he painted everyone who was a R to actually be something they werenm't.*

What is it about conservatives always playing the victim card and blaming others for their failures? You should give our electorate a little more credit than that. The people aren't stupid. Many have rebounded and pay attention since the Bush debacle, and many who were lazy at the polls in 2010 learned a lesson.

This Fox bubble many conservatives live in got popped in November.

Romney ran a terrible campaign, and more importantly lost in the arena of ideas. Until republicans wake up to this you've got a long road ahead and our country will be the worse for it.

*He turned off more voters than any other presidential election in history*

Just citing the last two elections before Obama, O received more votes both electorally and popular than Bush. Your assertion appears to have no merit.

*Nail I just had to throw that in for you....*

How about throwing in something of substance?

*And why was Tiger playing golf with him anyway...*

Rory Mcilroy was busy?

nailingit — February 18, 2013 at 4:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — February 18, 2013 at 3:32 p.m.

I'm not seeing anything close to Floyd but they sound pretty trippy.

nailingit — February 18, 2013 at 4:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Jim Moeller keeps carrying on about the CRC Economics Benefit Analysis and all the jobs - I finally went to the CRC website and downloaded it to read. http://www.columbiarivercrossing.org/FileLibrary/CRC%20economic%20benefit%20analysis_2012-10-31.pdf

Well, by 2030 it's supposed to create about 4200 jobs. About 1700 of these will result from the improved freight/commercial transportation access - these will mostly be in Portland (presumably the Port area). There'll be a few more real estate agents and insurance salesmen (go figure), but a large percentage will be in retail sales and "household services" (lawn crews, maids, fix-it men, etc). And there's no breakout for this remaining 2500 between Vancouver and Portland. The hell with it - let's take them all for Vancouver - We are going to pay a few billions for a bridge project to create 2500 mostly low paying or part time/intermittent work jobs? (Table 5-6)

The document up front indicates two key and interrelated problems. First off, they compare us to similar size cities on a river. We have 2 bridges. The next closest is Norfolk with 4. Cincy has 7, St Louis 8 and KC has 10. Pittsburgh has over 30! Except for Norfolk with 0, the others all have 2 or 3 railroad bridges to our 1. So for starters, the biggest hindrance to our area's economy is the number of bridges. Then why aren't we fixing this problem???? Because Portland says No? Then why are we building a bridge project that will benefit their economy (jobwise) more than ours?

The next problem is that due to the lack of railroad facilities, the Ports are heavily dependent on trucking. The report says Seattle and Portland are a joined regional zone; business suffers because traffic backups on the I5 results in over 3 hours travel times between the two cities. The solution is to get personal vehicles off the road and to build the interchanges that will make access to the Ports quicker for the truckers. Now, this may be stupid talking, but why aren't we fixing the rail problem? (Oh - We are here in Port of Vancouver!) And now it appears we Clark County commuters are helping Portland AND Seattle out. I'll bet all those Oregonians (to include in their city and state gov't) who think this bridge is just for the benefit of Vancouver are sure going to be surprised!

roger — February 18, 2013 at 4:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


(cont'd)

There's also a lot of silly BS when it comes to economic impact. One thing they measure is estimated savings to a person riding LRT during rush hour vs being caught in traffic. This will be anywhere from 3 to about 20 minutes, and they calculate using an hourly wage of about $23. Well, the answer is painfully obvious - tell all the $9 per hour workers to get the hell off the road and let the $50 per hour and up types through!!! (Yes Nails - That's sarcasm. My initial thoughts were interspersed with a whole lot of words that would have me booted from here.)

Table 5-1 also got my attention. It discusses dollar amounts for Annual Traveler Benefits (that little travel time analysis I mentioned will supposedly save $250 million in 2012 dollars). This says tolls will only take out $2 million - huh??? It's based on a $1.50 one way toll!!! Rush hour tolls are projected to be anywhere from $3.50 - $8.00 one way when the bridge opens in 2018 (or 19). That $1.50 figure is for someone crossing the bridge at midnight. What a bunch of bogus nonsense - which leads to wondering how much of the rest of this analysis is also crap. AND THEN, I look done and see trucks paying $0 - that's right, NOTHING, in tolls. What gives here? All the CRC tolling scenario info says they will be charged by axle or by wheel - either way, more than cars. Is this just an error in the EBA that casts further doubt on its validity, or are we being hoodwinked?

That's just an initial scan.

roger — February 18, 2013 at 4:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger- Don't get me wrong. I'll check them out a little further and appreciate the music turn on. I think you posted these guys once before on this topic.

It's hard to compare anyone to Pink Floyd. It's that no labels thing. That and talent way beyond ridiculous. It appears some of Amon's music is definitely Floyd inspired

The early 60's to early 70's Great Briton music scene was insane. Quite the musical gene pool. Just think of what musicians/groups came from England during this period.

A portal in time never to be rivaled or repeated.

nailingit — February 18, 2013 at 5:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**LR**

it's easy; either the people are sovereign or moneyed interests are. i wonder which will prevail.....

**LEAVITT**

see above. we re-elected obama so i gesss ther really *is* a chance in hell he may re-up.

DeeLittle — February 18, 2013 at 5:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — February 18, 2013 at 4:54 p.m.

Roger, coming back from Virginia in a big ol U-haul truck pulling a little trailer, I got halfway thru the toll gate and got stopped and charged more because they didn't see the trailer the first time. To travel 8 miles down their private freeway cost me $11 for 3 axles. Then at the next stop, another $11 just to bypass 40 miles of bad road. Oh well, at least I got here.

hawkeye — February 18, 2013 at 5:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal


At this point voicing a choice for mayor seems premature. Tim Levitt is mediocre at best, and visibly inconvenienced by the public process. However, anyone connected to the approval and financial support of Madore is hampered by Madore's possibility of using that history of financial support to influence city politics, and that's only if the candidate running against Levitt hasn't been specifically hand-selected by Madore in the first place.

jacjak — February 18, 2013 at 6:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*It's great to have a forward thinking president. I hope this gets funded.*

*If Romney would have won we'd be farming out Medicare, building electric fences and wondering what cuts to make in social services & health programs to fund a new tax break for Romney and buds.*

**Obama Seeking to Boost Study of Human Brain**

The Obama administration is planning a decade-long scientific effort to examine the workings of the human brain and build a comprehensive map of its activity, seeking to do for the brain what the Human Genome Project did for genetics.
Enlarge This Image

George M. Church, a molecular biologist at Harvard, said he was helping to plan the project, the Brain Activity Map.

The project, which the administration has been looking to unveil as early as March, will include federal agencies, private foundations and teams of neuroscientists and nanoscientists in a concerted effort to advance the knowledge of the brain’s billions of neurons and gain greater insights into perception, actions and, ultimately, consciousness.

Scientists with the highest hopes for the project also see it as a way to develop the technology essential to understanding diseases like Alzheimer’s and Parkinson’s, as well as to find new therapies for a variety of mental illnesses.

Moreover, the project holds the potential of paving the way for advances in artificial intelligence.

The project, which could ultimately cost billions of dollars, is expected to be part of the president’s budget proposal next month. And, four scientists and representatives of research institutions said they had participated in planning for what is being called the Brain Activity Map project.

The details are not final, and it is not clear how much federal money would be proposed or approved for the project in a time of fiscal constraint or how far the research would be able to get without significant federal financing.

In his State of the Union address, President Obama cited brain research as an example of how the government should “invest in the best ideas.”

“Every dollar we invested to map the human genome returned $140 to our economy — every dollar,” he said. “Today our scientists are mapping the human brain to unlock the answers to Alzheimer’s. They’re developing drugs to regenerate damaged organs, devising new materials to make batteries 10 times more powerful. Now is not the time to gut these job-creating investments in science and innovation.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/18/science/project-seeks-to-build-map-of-human-brain.html?_r=0

nailingit — February 18, 2013 at 6:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Do they even worry about political party with the city mayoral elections? Leavitt ran with Republican support (Dino Rossi backing), and got a lot of votes from those supporters. A few ideas:

Royce Pollard - Back from his 4 year hiatus and ready to rub Timmy's nose in the doo doo?

Jeannie Stewart - Probably too polarizing; the pro-CRC crowds hates her for that split the C-Tran vote business. Not sure if she could get the votes just within city limits.

Marc Boldt is currently unemployed - The majority of those against him are out of the city, I'm thinking. And if it was him vs. Leavitt, expect support from Madore's crowd. That is worth a lot of votes, no matter what the Madore haters want to think. I see him winning this match-up in a landslide.

roger — February 18, 2013 at 6:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger: I have to chuckle, because you chose the three top people that came to my mind immediately.

And, I have to say, I agree with your analysis of all three.

The only one Madore will support, though, is Jeanne Stewart. He is kind of the king and queen maker right now, isn't he? If Leavitt's challenger does not have the blessing of our newest Commish, there will be a third candidate, I can assure you.

manthou — February 18, 2013 at 8:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou,

This is all going to depend on what happens with the CRC in the next year. Jim Moeller says he can push it through our state, but he's going to have to come up with something big as a tradeoff to get the votes from the Senate. We have no idea whether New Starts will provide the entire $800 million for light rail. It's looking very much like we'll undergo the sequestration cuts - the military takes the biggest hit - this could have the Repubs in a surly mood and refusing to provide funding for anything like this. And while the bill hasn't passed yet, Oregon says they don't kick in their cost share without these two sources on board first. There's a lot that has to happen, and too many things that can still derail the project.

So, if we get to next fall without the CRC funding in place, Boldt could run on wanting a CRC district vote on light rail. I believe he made some noise along that lines back during the summer. This alone would get him elected. At that time, the State Court would have to rule on the applicability of RCW 81.104.030.

roger — February 18, 2013 at 8:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal






roger — February 18, 2013 at 9:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal


It doesn't seem fair complete idiots are allowed to affect policy. Both local and national.

**Mary Sue McClurkin, Alabama GOP Lawmaker, Claims A Baby Is The 'Largest Organ In A Body'**

Albama State Rep. Mary Sue McClurkin (R) believes that babies are organs in women's bodies.

Alabama state Rep. Mary Sue McClurkin (R) is pushing legislation that would impose restrictions on abortion clinics -- a move that she argues is necessary because the procedure is a major surgery that removes the largest "organ" in a woman's body.

“When a physician removes a child from a woman, that is the largest organ in a body,” McClurkin told the Montgomery Advertiser on Thursday. “That’s a big thing. That’s a big surgery. You don’t have any other organs in your body that are bigger than that.”

A "child" is not a bodily "organ." Indeed, children have organs of their own. The largest human organ is actually the skin. According to National Geographic, adults carry about eight pounds of skin, which is slightly above the average weight of a newborn baby.

McClurkin's argument actually undermines the "personhood" bills being pushed around the country by other like-minded Republican lawmakers. Those pieces of legislation argue that undeveloped zygotes are people too and should therefore be given full legal rights, thus making abortion -- and even certain forms of birth control -- illegal.

McClurkin's bill would impose stringent requirements on abortion clinics that could make it hard for them to keep their doors open. It would, according to the Montgomery Advertiser, "require physicians at abortion clinics to have admitting privileges at local hospitals; **require clinics to follow ambulatory clinic building codes and make it a felony -- punishable by up to 10 years in prison -- for a nurse, nurse practitioner or physician’s assistant to dispense abortion-inducing medications."**

*There are five remaining abortion clinics in the state of Alabama. McClurkin and her allies have argued that the bill is not meant to stop abortions, but rather to make sure that patients who do undergo the procedure are kept safe.*

*Opponents, however, note that studies have shown that abortion is already safe, and McClurkin's bill would likely shut down clinics.*

*"The real purpose of this bill is to make safe and legal abortion in Alabama unavailable under any circumstance," Nikema Williams, vice president of public policy for Planned Parenthood Southeast, told the Montgomery Advertiser.*

Hospitals, for example, aren't required to extend admitting privileges to doctors at abortion clinics, which would make it impossible for those doctors to comply with the bill's restrictions. According to Williams, Mississippi physicians were rejected at seven hospitals.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/18/mary-sue-mcclurkin-baby-largest-organ_n_2712812.html?utm_hp_ref=politics

nailingit — February 18, 2013 at 10:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — February 18, 2013 at 10:46 p.m

So would that make gallbladder and appendix surgeries illegal too?

hawkeye — February 18, 2013 at 11:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 18, 2013 at 9:06 a.m. (Open forum, Feb 11-17)

It isn't a matter if I am agreeing or disagreeing with the data, Basil. In fact, if the data was collected from a broader number...say, 800,000 citizens OR more, then I would consider the poll as accurate. Unfortunately through the entire piece, the 800 represented are supposed to be an accurate sampling of the majority opinion which is obviously not the case. The article is slanted, referring to 59% of Americans...NOT 59% of Americans surveyed. Again...I view this as a sell job by those promoting the intrusion of a failing transit service rather than accepting the word of the voters of not only Clark, but Multnomah County as well...a sell job based on highly limited and manipulated surveys to suit their needs.

Explain to me why it is the RTC, WSDOT, ODOT, State of Washington, State of Oregon, Federal Government, City of Vancouver, City of Portland and columbiarivercrossing. org don't want that vote by the people, Basil.

Explain to me why it is Clark County and Clackamas County are shouting out a resounding "NO" to light rail in their counties, Basil.

This project affects ALL county residents in both states yet those who are promoting such an eyesore as light rail have the upper hand and REFUSE such a vote. Explain to me why it is that members of our communities have had to take them to court in order to gain such a vote.

Before jumping to conclusions regarding BRT to all who promote light rail, they should check out these links:

http://reconnectingamerica.org/assets/Uploads/2008_brt_network_planning_study.pdf

http://www.worldwatch.org/node/4660
http://sf.streetsblog.org/2009/02/10/brt-comes-out-ahead-of-light-rail-again/

http://www.gao.gov/assets/600/592973.pdf

And Basil...as well as everyone else...

The crossing could still incorporate BRT rather than LRT. It's not too late! The cost to change the design to fit the needs of LRT as well as river commerce AND satisfy the needs of PDX in addition to the cost of constructing LRT are overwhelming, especially if the USCG says it must be 121', not 116'. The cost to change to the design to fit the needs of BRT as well as eliminating the need for rail and electricity which LRT would need would be significantly lower. PLUS, there wouldn't be an issue of height adjustments. It's a no brainer.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 6:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal


I should also add the list of Board of Directors of ICC to the list of supporters of light rail to Vancouver as well. Oh, if they'd only check out the REAL information on Bus Rapid Transit and the benefits to the local economy rather than the sell out they're receiving AND promoting with LRT.

It's no wonder companies are going elsewhere.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 7:03 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Regarding Lou's discussion on Leavitt running again for mayor...

History has repeated itself here for far too many times, much to the detriment of the local economy.

Need I say more?

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 7:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — February 18, 2013 at 11:30 p.m.

Great perspective! :)

I feel fortunate to live in a state lacking this degree of evangelical activism.

I wonder how many of these Alabamy politicians found footing as a County Commissioner...

And where are the voices who tout Ron Paul/Libertarian beliefs? Lawmakers using their position to subvert the will of the people and disallow a constitutional right...

...most likely sitting at home and forming collectivist conclusions about our downhill society while receiving Medicare and cashing SS checks.

nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 7:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger: This brinksmanship pattern is a bad habit with the US and I think sequestration, if it is allowed to happen, will impact what little trust is left between our country's citizens and their legislators.

I keep wondering what Craig Pridemore is going to do. He is a young man and I cannot believe that he is out of politics forever. He should find a way to head back to the legislature. It is so hard for anyone outside Olympia or King County to win a statewide election.

Didn't he serve on the Clark County Commission way back when? Vancouver City Council? I do not know much about his public service history.

manthou — February 19, 2013 at 7:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou- Ready the Twilight Zone music!

Obama is speaking about sequestration now on MSNBC.

nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 7:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


I think Bernie Sanders finally had a meet with our Prez! Obama speaking up for the middle class big time! This is who I voted for in 2008.

nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 8:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*More from Alabama. They're trying to turn our entire country into more of a good ol' boys network than it already is.*

*Why aren't Republicans speaking against this? Most agree on some degree of campaign finance reform......where are you?*

**Supreme Court To Hear Campaign Finance Donation Limit Challenge**

WASHINGTON -- The Supreme Court will hear a challenge to campaign finance laws limiting how much an individual can give to political campaigns.

The justices on Tuesday decided to hear an appeal from Shaun McCutcheon of Alabama and the Republican National Committee. They are arguing that it's unconstitutional to stop a donor from giving more than $46,200 to political candidates and $70,800 to political committees and PACs.

McCutcheon says he accepts that he can only give $2,500 to a single candidate but says he should be able to give that amount to as many GOP candidates as he wants.

The U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia upheld the limits, but the high court decided to review that decision.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/19/supreme-court-campaign-finance_n_2716762.html

nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 8:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Joe Scarborough: Fox News, Rush Limbaugh Have Not Been Good For GOP (VIDEO)**

Joe Scarborough lashed out at conservative "media culture" on Tuesday's "Morning Joe," telling viewers that Rush Limbaugh and Fox News have not been good for the Republican party.

Scarborough urged Republicans to look beyond those two outlets. "Just for conservatives that think they have to stay in their own little media world, since Rush Limbaugh went on the air and became a national figure, Republicans have lost five out of the last six presidential elections in the popular vote," he said. "Since Fox News went on the air in 1996, Republicans have lost four out of the five last —"

"Please keep doing what you're doing," co-host Mika Brzezinski joked.

"When Ronald Reagan and Richard Nixon had to go up against a media culture that absolutely hated them... and there were no conservative outlets, they won 49 states," Scarborough continued. He said that he turns to conservative outlets as well as mainstream media, but added, "for people who think they have to stay in the little box, I got bad news for you: it's not working."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/19/joe-scarborough-fox-news-limbaugh_n_2716783.html?utm_hp_ref=politics&ir;=Politics

nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 8:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit: I guess the President is feeling his oats because he does not have to worry about re-election. :) I hear that the sequester cuts do not happen all at once: they occur over time, so not everything is hammered at the same time. No small consolation, that.
____________________

David Madore's latest video: he wants to cut county staff at citizen advisory committee meetings. Shows me he does not fully understand their important role. We have a city liaison at every neighborhood meeting for a reason. They are "watchdogs" to make sure there is a government rep should something go haywire. Get a group of citizens together today and the chances are there would be a lot of unproductive crabbing going on.

County staff need to be at these meetings, David. They advise, they make sure policies and procedures are followed; they observe and report back to their bosses.

Good luck getting rid of them.

manthou — February 19, 2013 at 10:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*It isn't a matter if I am agreeing or disagreeing with the data, Basil. In fact, if the data was collected from a broader number...say, 800,000 citizens OR more, then I would consider the poll as accurate. Unfortunately through the entire piece, the 800 represented are supposed to be an accurate sampling of the majority opinion which is obviously not the case.*

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 6:55 a.m.

Seems you ARE rather "disagreeing with the data".

Again, IF you have a DATA source that shows a different outcome, bring it forward. Until then, harping on the sample size without being able to show specifically why - in your opinion - it is inaccurate is just a piece of evidence that you are starting from a opinion then working to find 'proof' that supports it.

Basically, we have a constituency that wants a meaningful change in the US transportation policy. One that supports mass transit.

Now, why? A growing understanding of the effects on the environment of our burning of fossil fuels; a growing understanding of the effects of land use based on assumptions that we 'need' McMansions sprawling out into the countryside; a growing understanding that building 2 ton cars with multi-hundred horsepower to move one person to work and back isn't a logical use of resources; etc, etc, ...

Note that this is a growing understanding; more people understand that now than 2 years ago, 5 years ago, 20 years ago. Just like how learning is bringing the science of climate change to increasingly larger public acceptance; that is showing the austerity policies to not work; the Republican economic policy is dropping in acceptance by economists; that civil rights includes gender and sexuality issues; etc, etc, ....

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 10:11 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Thoughts on Mayor Leavitt running for re-election?*

Lou Brancaccio

It seems odd that a local issue is the only question you brought forward to be discussed in a REGIONAL newspaper of record......

Why not ask (for example) about the stance of the county on growing medical marijuana?

Or ordinances about poultry or front yard food gardens inside city limits within the region?

Or maybe some investigative reporting on the per capita CO2 emissions of the region? Maybe by looking a specific effects of zoning, transportation policies,weatherization programs, in the region?

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 10:22 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Shows me he does not fully understand their important role.*
manthou — February 19, 2013 at 10:10 a.m.

Shows me that his thinking is quite similar to those benighted people that claim the gov't is wasting money by putting $$ into science research. Or extending unemployment insurance payments. Or hiring meat inspectors. Or funding schools. Or........

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 10:26 a.m. ( | suggest removal



goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 6:55 a.m.

Dig further: The discussion on the LTR/BTR study is narrow. And note that the authors make some assumptions that aren't really valid.

Start here:

http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/009395.html

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 10:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Nail-

That is what I thought you would say. Why is it that this is the Presidents signature and only piece of legislation he has passed and brought up yet it is one that is already costing the average tax payer hundreds of dollars a year. What about this program that is cost unsustainable and punitive that wets your little willy.... I guess you haven't seen your healthcare costs rise like everyone else... Or you don't have any or even better yet your on the Dole or Gov't program....

The eligibility reuirements by the time I wsih to retire will be so out of wack it will be rediculous.SS probably won't even be there as you know... what do we have like 15yrs left before its been exhausted of all its reserves.. Yes this was the hallmark of his first four years.. Were already two months into his next four years and he spent a cool several million jsut to play golf with Tiger.. Now thats what I call deficit reduction at it's best... That's just how the pres rolls.. Do as I say not as I do you Lemmings... Thats all the Dems are ... Lemmings...

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2013 at 10:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*costing the average tax payer hundreds of dollars a year*
vanwadreamer — February 19, 2013 at 10:36 a.m

Source?

*program that is cost unsustainable and punitive*

Source?

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 11:09 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Again, IF you have a DATA source that shows a different outcome, bring it forward.*

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 10:11 a.m.

Do you consider historic election results for our area...namely three which the Clark County Voters have rejected???

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 11:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal


"Seems you ARE rather "disagreeing with the data"."

Only when it is based on such a limited number of adults. 800 as opposed to 300 million+. Also Basil, the number one factor in construction/extension of any transit service is that there must be a financially-supportable need for a costly enhancement of the project by the people. TriMet has not proven it can support itself through taxpayers or riders and must rely on federal tax dollars to bail it out. The voters here in Clark County have made it clear that the sales tax proposal was not a supportable way to pay for maintenance and operations.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 11:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Basil, it is BRT not BTR. Secondly, how would increasing taxpayer dollars in order to maintain and operate a rigid rail system...riddled with financial/mechanical/safety issues...to a dead end, 1-1/2 miles north of the Columbia River be considered an improvement to our overall transit system here in Clark County? Would it serve the needs of enough of the Clark County citizens to be considered a money-worthy cause??? Just saying it's an improvement doesn't mean it is. I want to see data which supports that extension - LOCAL data which correlates the difference with regards to construction and maintenance, energy costs, energy efficiency, safety improvements and time saved with the extension of LRT to Clark College as opposed to bus rapid transit. Please explain how it's an improvement, given the questions I have presented.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 11:26 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Though much of the article is framed in the '12 presidential race, the following article covers many economic aspects - local with Madore claiming to bring jobs, regional, and national.

*Which Way Is The Road To Serfdom?*
By Levi Asher

"Barack Obama's economic program is more moderate and earthbound, and is also better for one gigantic reason: Obamacare. Health insurance reform is essential for transient, semi-employed citizens who lack a company benefits package to join. Mitt Romney's threat to repeal the health insurance reform features of the Affordable Care Act is terrifying to anybody who doesn't have an employment-based group insurance plan, because it sharpens the contrast between the jobbed and the jobless. Obamacare seems to present the most consequential difference between what Obama and Romney are offering, and the Democrats would do well to campaign extensively on this point from now until election day.

The Romney vision of a hyperactive job-obsessed economy without Obamacare is a vision of a world where your job -- not your country, but your job -- takes care of you. What is gained by trading in a nanny state economy for a nanny job economy? One could argue that private sector companies are better able to handle issues like health care than the federal government. But in fact there's little evidence for this, especially since we watched the private sector manage itself into financial disaster only four years ago. Most importantly, a nanny job economy where employment-based health insurance is the only affordable insurance available would be horrific for the tens of millions of Americans who cannot find access to employment-based health insurance."
http://www.litkicks.com/WhichWayIsTheRoadToSerfdom

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 11:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*I guess you haven't seen your healthcare costs rise like everyone else... Or you don't have any or even better yet your on the Dole or Gov't program....*

Not significantly. BTW (not to get personal but to address your rant) I'm not on any *Dole or Gov't program....*

*and he spent a cool several million jsut to play golf with Tiger..*

You'll make up anything to get across a non-existent point, no matter how ridiculous.

It's understandable you did not address your other errors/misstatements @ 3:33 yesterday.

What's not understandable is why you and your ilk continue to skew, misinform and propagate lies about this administration and it's policies, relying only on what you hear from like minded people such as yourself or right wing media.

Your party has lost it's way, in part because folks such as yourself support obstructionist politics based in fear and bigotry, only relying on informational sources such as Fox news, Limbaugh Beck and others.

Please read post @ 8:51.

It used to mean winning the Presidency gave power to shape policy and act on ideas, understanding to some extent Congress would comply, if not for any other reason out of respect for our political process.

Not it's bombard the masses with false or little info and watch em' respond.

We can't even get a more than qualified Republican enlisted war hero confirmed as Sec Def because of personal grievances from those in his own party. Beyond silly and unforgivable. You may thrive in this atmosphere vanwa, but many of us just want to give this President his due respect and allow good governance to proceed. Change things next election if you want, but respect the majority of people who elected this man.

Maybe your party should focus on who the next Romney, Palin or Bush your party will try and put in power next election.

At least that would be honest and productive.

*Thats all the Dems are ... Lemmings...*

Read your posts. You might want to give that thought a little more ... thought.


nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 11:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 11:10 a.m.

Not really. It is a multi-state, literally national issue. Also, the election results are old data.

So, IF you have something beyond the local politics and current....

You are basically trying to prove Climate Change isn't happening because a speaker at a local townhall said it isn't.

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 11:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 11:18 a.m

IF you can PROVE the sampling protocol had errors, that the poll was in some way administered in a faulty manner, THEN you'd have an argument.

At this point, all you are doing is taking your pre-formed opinion and CLAIMING the survey is invalid BECAUSE it doesn't fit that opinion.

So, what data can you bring? Old elections? The 'agreeers' at Madore's last effort? Lew's opinion?

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 11:44 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Ah yes, goldenoldie's true grit:

I see the resident weasel with the big brown nose is posting again. Before removing the gray bar feature, I came to the conclusion there would be nothing of substance with regards to any discussion brought forth by anybody on the forum by the little brown noser, licking away. Out of curiosity, I decided to temporarily remove that gray bar feature just to confirm my suspicions...

and I couldn't stop laughing.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 7:12 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal | Ignore User )

made in reference to a comment manthou in last week's forum.

soapbox4u — February 19, 2013 at 11:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Hmm...interesting information I just found. It's about Las Vegas, Nevada and their Transit System. Las Vegas, a bustling city with a population of 500,000...about 100,000 more than Clark County, WA...the number Moeller claims we'll grow within the next 25 years...runs well with Bus Rapid Transit, shows increased improvement in assets year after year, even with the increase in hybrid cars, less fuel tax to help offset costs with the transit system and figure in how they've managed to survive during bad economic times without a lot of opposition by the people. (courtesy financial report on following link):

http://www.rtcsnv.com

Quotes from the RTC website: *As the Las Vegas Valley’s population continues to increase daily, so too does traffic congestion and the RTC identifies transportation challenges and explores and implements both short and long-term resolutions while simultaneously promoting sustainability, air quality improvement, enhanced mobility and increased quality of life in the region.*

Another - *The RTC provides mass transit that connects throughout Southern Nevada and administers programs that encourage sustainability, such as Club Ride Commuter Services that promotes walking, biking, carpooling, vanpooling and taking transit to and from work.*

My question is...if Vegas can manage without light rail, why couldn't we???

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 11:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Nice try, soapie...but anybody can see that wasn't a comment directed at manthou. I've never gray barred manthou but I have you. How 'bout focusing on the issues discussed in the forum rather than your consistent little troll attacks? You're much better at sharing a point of view rather than this trashy, feeble attempt to start something that isn't there.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 11:36 a.m.

Now where do you come to the conclusion that I'm a denier in climate change??? You say "it is a multi-state, literally national issue." No, basil...it's global. Do you honestly believe a couple miles of light rail track will do anything to substantially improve our overall global climate???

I suggested one credible piece of evidence of opposition to light rail (last November's election in fact)...one of several through voter elections. I also suggest you review TriMet's history of financial issues...even current issues which may result in cutting back of yet more routes due to budget woes...and you consider them as old data??? Must be because they don't fit the criteria for you to form your own conclusion.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal


"At this point, all you are doing is taking your pre-formed opinion and CLAIMING the survey is invalid BECAUSE it doesn't fit that opinion."

If you go back and read what I said on February 17, 2013 at 1:33 p.m. Basil, I said *"In the method of presentation, this statement is quite misleading. What wasn't mentioned in your comment is that this was a nationwide poll of 800 people. With almost 314 million people in the USA, that's not an accurate statement, claiming 3 out of 4 Americans are frustrated with the lack of transportation options."* Because of the misleading presentation of the article when focusing on what 800 people had said as if they represented the entire population of the USA, I rendered it as moot with regards to their supporting argument on the point of view by the writer of the article.

Context, basil...Context.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:10 p.m.

How you came to that conclusion escapes me.

But then, so does comparing two places because they happen to have the same name ....

Or insisting that a poll is faulty without bringing any evidence....

By the way both Clark counties "can manage without "; but that is similar to the GOP idea of solutions to problems - just cuts, not progress.

The evidence that what we are facing in the near future is pretty overwhelming; that we need to be forward looking for mitigation and adapting to those economic, environmental, health issues is beyond the politics of a few noisy nay-sayers with no plan except 'no'. So, yes - a "couple miles of light rail track" are figuratively going to "substantially improve our overall global climate". And literally when multiplied by all the other efforts and projects.

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 12:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Context, basil...Context.*

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:27 p.m

The context doesn't change the argument; no proof that the poll is inaccurate; no proof that the findings were misconstrued; no evidence that counters the data.

All we have is your claims that you think (opinion) that that poll isn't accurate.

At this point, all you are doing is taking your pre-formed opinion and CLAIMING the survey is invalid BECAUSE it doesn't fit that opinion.

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 12:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**The New Know Nothing Party and the High Price of Willful Ignorance**
by John Atcheson

Ignorance: The condition of being uneducated, unaware, or uninformed.

Here in the 21st Century the Republicans have become the new Know Nothing Party. Just as the original Know Nothings employed fear, bigotry, ignorance and hate to motivate its base, so too does the Republican Party.

Look at the litany of the new Know Nothing’s commitment to willful ignorance.

For example, the idea that debt and deficits spell doom and austerity will grow the economy. This buffoonery can no longer be attributed to ignorance – history tells us it isn’t so, and the failed experiments in Europe confirm it. At this point, holding fast to this notion can only be explained in terms of willful ignorance – AKA bald-faced lies.

Or take the trickle down fantasy that has dominated their economic policy for 30 years. Nothing trickled down, but a great deal of our wealth has trickled up. Believing in trickle down can only be explained as a de facto act of economic aggression on the middle class and low-income earners.

We could go on and on here with the Republican’s commitment to lying. Government as inefficient. The private sector as the provider of all good things by pure serendipity. The Republican’s commitment to freedom and liberty –except when they want to shove an ultrasound device into your vagina, tell you who you may or may not marry, who can and cannot fight in wars … on and on it goes.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2013/02/19-0

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 12:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 12:28 p.m.

It appears you are like a puppy dog, going around and around in circles, chasing his tail just because it's there. You have not supported your argument regarding that small amount of rail to Clark College...just provided what you claim is evidence of what we're facing in the future and the consequences for the world if we don't lay that light rail track down. You say we need to be forward looking for mitigation and adapting to those economic, environmental, health issues...I agree but again, no data to support your opinion that the extension of light rail to Clark College is the only answer. Where are the numbers, Basil? Where's the data I requested which supports your argument?

Care to describe in detail how the metal tracks, the cables, the towers, the crossings, the cement, the sealants, the gravel needed for the tracks...are harvested and made from raw materials, the transport of supplies and equipment, the installation, the preservation (through painting, coatings, blasting, pressure washing, the sealing, the energy to produce enough get up and go for the trains to cross the river with the pending elevation change of the bridge, pending repairs and maintenance of such lines and the GHG emitted in the process and what effect that will have on our atmosphere, Basil???

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal


You can add the glass enclosures and sitting facilities, the planters, the additional lighting, additional parking structures and all supplies needed including additional mining for brick materials/grouts/sealants, laying of new power lines in order to facilitate energy to the structure to that list as well, basil.

When comparing the minimal distance extension and what GHG would be reduced as a result of minimal ridership and vehicular traffic change - if any...to what needs to be mined, developed, constructed, preserved and maintaqined and the GHG emitted in the process, the scales of balance do not weigh in support of the light rail extension to Clark College.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal


"just provided what you claim is evidence of what we're facing in the future and the consequences for the world if we don't lay that light rail track down"

If you are not cognizant of the issues:

Rising CO2

Rising sea levels

Rising global temps.

Record breaking run of those temps.

Ice cap melting

Glacier retreat

Shifting hardiness zones

Ocean acidification

Ocean temps rising

species extinction

Nearly 14,000 published papers showing a range of effects of our burning of fossil fuels

98% of scientists with expertise in climate science agreeing on the cause of climate change.

(I've likely missed a few)

| sarc on | No, we don't have any proof about what we need to be doing ...| sarc off |

However, I do remember when you tried arguing against the cause of Anthropogenic Climate Change, so there has been some progress. Now there's just that pesky attempt at ignoring that we've entered the Anthropocene.....

mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 1:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 1:08 p.m.

Argument by consensus or argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy.

98% of scientists at one time disagreed with Newton, Einstein and Tesla, does that invalidate their findings?

frobert — February 19, 2013 at 2:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Ignorance-

Obama promised that he would lower familys insurance premiums by an average of $2500 annually if Obamacare passed.. That didn't and won't happen the actual opposite is happening...

First Obamacare is charging Insures over 10B illion next year and up over 50% more through 2016. 100milion in the next 10 years... That’s not the only new fee that will hit health insurers under the law. Last month, the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) proposed charging health insurance companies a 3.5 percent “user fee” if they sell plans through federally run health exchanges....

the 2013 Preemptive raise in the Obama tax increases on insurance companies are being passed on this years to you and I.... But that hasn't stopped insurance companies from charging higher premiums this year to cover the hike, as well as the cost of ObamaCare benefits such as free birth control and preventive care. The fact of the matter is there are four plans coming out Bronze, silver, gold and Platinum... I wonder what most people will choos.. Just think of a percentage that you currently spend of the gross income on your Annual Premium... Go to the internet and you can find a mulitude of information on how much these plans will cost and the differences in co pays and penalty's "TAXES" because the IRS will collect at the end of the year wether you had a plan for one month or eleven months. It's based on your gross annual income...

Some say Ignorance is bliss, there probably more like an Ostrich in my opinion... If you didn't have an increase this year on your health insurance premium then you don't have Health Insurance.. Good luck Basil...Sounds like you and a few others here are in for a rude awakening....

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2013 at 3:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal


***See, right here, this is what's wrong with America!! Right HERE, these greedy POS Bosses!***

Reuters) - Bank of America Corp (BAC) Chief Executive Brian Moynihan's pay increased 73 percent in 2012 from the previous year to $12.1 million, as the bank gave him a bigger package of stock awards.

The second-largest U.S. bank gave Moynihan a raise when other CEOs on Wall Street received a pay cut, after Bank of America's stock soared in 2012 and it made progress in resolving lawsuits from the financial crisis.

Moynihan received 926,238 shares of stock in three types of grants, including restricted shares and performance-based shares, according to a regulatory filing on Tuesday.

Moynihan earned a $950,000 salary in 2012, but received no cash bonus, similar to 2011, a person familiar with the situation said. The CEO's 2013 salary will increase to $1.5 million, the person said.

The stock grants for 2012 were worth $11.1 million at the closing price of $12.03 on Friday, the date they were awarded. Moynihan received grants worth about $6.1 million for 2011.

Bank of America's shares rose 109 percent in 2012, the best performance among stocks in the Dow Jones Industrial Average, as investors grew confident it had the capital it needed to meet new international guidelines.

Moynihan, however, is still wrestling with losses from the bank's 2008 Countrywide Financial acquisition and is under pressure to show the bank can increase earnings at a time of low interest rates and tighter regulations.

hawkeye — February 19, 2013 at 3:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


part 2

MORE THAN DIMON

His pay rose in a year in which other bank executives were not so fortunate. Morgan Stanley (MS.N) CEO James Gorman's total pay for 2012 fell 7 percent to $9.75 million, while JPMorgan Chase & Co (JPM.N) awarded CEO Jamie Dimon $11.5 million after slashing his bonus in half after the bank lost billions on disastrous trades by its Chief Investment Office.

Moynihan made more than Dimon, even though his bank posted net income of $4.2 billion in 2012, compared to $21.3 billion for JPMorgan.

Bank of America's filings disclose only the stock portion of pay for Moynihan and other top executives in 2012. More details will be provided in the annual proxy filing this spring.

Moynihan's grants included 277,871 shares that will be paid out on a monthly basis in cash over the next year and 463,119 restricted shares that vest over three years. The remaining 185,248 performance-based shares will vest if the company meets return on asset goals for half the shares and growth in adjusted tangible book value goals for the other half over a three-year period.

The 2012 performance-based shares differ from previous grants, potentially giving executives another chance to make them pay off.

In 2011, the bank granted performance-based shares tied only to return on assets, a measure of profits compared to total assets. The bank needed to reach a minimum return on assets of 0.5 percent over a four-quarter period by the end of 2015 to pay out at least partially. The bank's return on assets in 2012 was 0.19 percent, up from 0.06 percent in 2011.

The bank's tangible book value per share of common stock grew to $13.36 in the fourth quarter of 2012 from $12.95 a year earlier as the bank built capital. Tuesday's filings did not disclose the performance-based goals for the shares.

hawkeye — February 19, 2013 at 3:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 19, 2013 at 1:08 p.m.

Are you serious??? Your list you shared...you truly believe every single one on the list is directly caused by not extending the light rail 1-1/2 miles north of the Columbia River??? Well that's what you're trying to make it sound as if this would be the result.

Basil, Basil, Basil (shaking my head in disbelief), you are aware that anthropogenic causes of climate change are not something that happened overnight, aren't you???

As I'd asked before, show me the data which shows light rail from the very beginning of the process to remove natural resources needed to construct and run the light rail system in order to prove that light rail (in the overall picture) is better for our environment. Did I fail to mention the types of mining operations utilized in order to remove the necessary minerals and stone for production of equipment/structural end products??? Shall we go into that as well, basil???

Your memory is lacking, basil. I was never against anthropogenic climate change. I was against the statement which claimed climate change was caused only by humans.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 4:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Forgot to say that Light Rail was a big plus in that decision, duh! Brains live in Beaverton, they take the max to the tech centers, it is all there. No brainer.*

holycrapola — February 19, 2013 at 2:19 p.m.

MAX doesn't end at NIKE and it doesn't end at other places like Intel or Epson. It parallels Sunset Hwy. (Hwy. 26) to Hillsboro on the North side of Sunset Hwy. and also has a connection at Hwy 217 with WES...a commuter rail. Folks still need to connect with a bus or company shuttle.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 4:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal


holycrapola — February 19, 2013 at 2:19 p.m.

You also forgot the time and money spent promoting the Hilton and a dead-end light rail project which will serve no purpose other than to add parking garages, congestion and traffic nightmares to downtown and the area immediately surrounding Clark College.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 4:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


As I'd mentioned in my comment regarding Lou's question about Mayor Leavitt...

History has repeated itself here for far too many times, much to the detriment of the local economy.

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 4:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal


More people hating on people making money money..If people focused more on what they can do to earn a living the "Middle Class' would be stronger than ever..Do I wish I had Tigers money, sure if I had his Golfing talent so you know what I can't make his money that way but the good ol USA has options for people that want to make it, go out and earn it... JMO as I started my own business right here in the Couv, quit rolling over the bridge into PEE TOWN.. Drive a couple miles to work and back, Work about 65 hrs a week give or take 5...Me I just hate on those who want to take what I have earned.. Ask the folks in cali, we will start seeing a pretty good migration up here in the coming years....Less government equals happier people...More money for the peiople..

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2013 at 5:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**Karl Rove Nazi Image Featured In Tea Party Patriots Email (UPDATE)**

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/19/karl-rove-nazi-image-_n_2718349.html

nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 5:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwahwah-

I can't understand you and/or folks that subscribe to your take. I too, am self-employed, and started my business in 2006. Guess what? The economy tanked. Sound familiar? Deal with it. Mine tanked, too, but I'm surviving. The rates are lower, but I'm still able to turn away work-too busy.

I work 6 to 7 days per week-from home-so a 65 hr week is the norm-no biggee.

Do I pay taxes? Of course. Do I like all the benefits of those taxes paid? Of course. From excellent airports in Alaska-my favorite hotspot, yuk, yuk, to Glacier National Park-another spot-things are good. If you actually added up all the tax paid for stuff you use, you might be surprised.

And if you think, even for a moment, that most-or even many Americans-are going to give up those government provided services, roads, treatment plants, navigable rivers, cheap hydro-power, and on and on, without a helluva fight, I think you're sadly mistaken.

As easy as it is to "rail against the machine", popular support isn't there. When the baggers return their SS checks to the government, don't use Medicaire, interstate highways, etc., your positions may require a second looksy. But it won't be anytime soon. So rail away, ZZzzzzz.....

mrd — February 19, 2013 at 6 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mrd — February 19, 2013 at 6 p.m.

Your insistence on using derogatory terms to describe political groups you disagree with, really sums up liberal bigotry and intolerance quite well.

frobert — February 19, 2013 at 7:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal



frobert — February 19, 2013 at 7:07 p.m

Clean your glasses, son. He didn't use one!

hawkeye — February 19, 2013 at 8:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


fro-

you have a problem with the term "baggers"? I can find plenty of instances where the "baggers" refer to themselves as "baggers". Maybe if I referred to the "baggers" as the "T baggers" you'd take less offense? How's your buddy Ron Paul doing? Is he still around?

mrd — February 19, 2013 at 8:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXSco6...

It's a matter of perspective. It's very short sighted to think baggers find "bagger" offensive.

Here's a proud Teabagger!

nailingit — February 19, 2013 at 9:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mrd — February 19, 2013 at 8:59 p.m.

I have seen plenty of bigots use the same argument to justify their use of derogatory terms toward at women and minorities. Sad that those claiming to be "enlightened" are so often the most narrow minded.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 12:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Illinois introduces a bill that attempts to regulate anonymous online comments.

Hmmmm. Where do these legislators get these ideas? How much research do they do before they waste time and money on bills that are DOA?

[link text][1]

[1]: http://www.citmedialaw.org/blog/2013/illinois-clumsily-enters-nymwars?utm_source=feedburner&utm;_medium=feed&utm;_campaign=Feed%3A+CitizenMediaLawProject+%28Citizen+Media+Law+Project%29

manthou — February 20, 2013 at 5:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 12:10 a.m.

Yo frobot, you mean women and minorities don't like being called "baggers"? I don't understand why. Can you give me some examples or maybe a reference or two?

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 7:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — February 19, 2013 at 10:36 a.m
&
*the 2013 Preemptive raise in the Obama tax increases on insurance companies
....
If you didn't have an increase this year on your health insurance premium then you don't have Health Insurance.. Good luck Basil...Sounds like you and a few others here are in for a rude awakening....*

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2013 at 3:55 p.m.

**Premium Changes Over Time**

The average annual single premium ($5,615) in 2012 is 3% higher than the average annual single premium in 2011 ($5,429), and the average annual family premium ($15,745) is 4% higher than the average annual family premium last year ($15,073) (Exhibit 1.11).

The $15,745 average annual family premium in 2012 is 30% higher than the average family premium in 2007 and 97% higher than the average family premium in 2002 (Exhibit 1.11).

For large firms (200 or more workers), the average family premium for covered workers in firms that are fully insured has grown at a similar rate to premiums for workers in fully or partially self-funded firms from 2007 to 2012 (36% in fully insured firms vs. 29% in self-funded firms) and from 2002 to 2012 (105% in fully insured firms vs. 94% in self-funded firms)

http://ehbs.kff.org/?page=charts&id;=1&sn;=6&p;=2

So, "Preemptive" started in 2002?

You were asked for data yesterday to support your claims. You made a conscious choice not to.

Gee, wonder why......

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 7:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 4:05 p.m.

Since '91 there have been something on the order of 14,000 published, peer reviewed papers showing causes and effects of Anthropogenic Climate Change. Something like 25 claim or attempt to prove what is happening is due to some other cause. Even the trope of 'in the 70's we were worried about an ice age' doesn't hold up to any kind of scrutiny of the literature.

And there is a long history of scientists and activism pointing pointing this out and promoting action to mitigate ACC.

So your little sarcastic "you truly believe every single one on the list is directly caused by not extending the light rail 1-1/2 miles north of the Columbia River??? Well that's what you're trying to make it sound as if this would be the result." doesn't hold up.

And you know that.

However, those 'couple of miles' is just one part of hundreds of projects. Just as are incentives to business to move to producing renewable energy develop more efficient machinery, further research into better production and techniques; laws to increase mileage and reduce emissions; and making the general public more aware of the current and upcoming issues.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 8:09 a.m. ( | suggest removal


$10,000 to include a secret decoder ring and a 'Don't Tread On Me' flag signed by Ted Nugent.

**Conservative offers $10K for plan to overtake GOP establishment**

“The Liberty Prize" would be awarded to anyone who helps conservatives "take over the Republican Party"

Have a grand scheme to help conservatives oust establishment Republicans, take over the party, and win the White House in 2016? Well, you could just win $10,000 for your trouble.

Richard Viguerie, the Conservative fund-raiser and chairman of Conservative HQ, announced “The Liberty Prize,” a contest that will award a “$10,000 prize, plus fame, appreciation and the opportunity to save America” to the conservative who comes up with the best plan to “take over the Republican Party, win the November 2016 elections, and govern America by 2017.”

Viguerie, who was a big fan of Rick Santorum in the 2012 presidential race, writes in his announcement:

The most important political battle in America is not between Republicans and Democrats or between conservatives and liberals. It is the battle for control of the Republican Party between establishment big government Republicans and limited government, constitutional conservatives. It has become clear that establishment Republican and Democratic politicians have failed America because they have both accepted big government as the solution to every problem.

He continues by referencing Karl Rove’s new initiatve to steamroll far-right conservatives, called the Conservative Victory Project, which he writes means that “conservatives must have a well-organized and well-thought-out plan to take control of the GOP from the grassroots up.”

The Conservative Victory Project, pushed by Rove’s Super PAC American Crossroads, has led to a kerfuffle between mainstream Republicans and Tea Partiers who see the new effort as “bullying,” among other things.

http://www.salon.com/2013/02/19/conservative_offers_10k_for_plan_to_overtake_gop_establishment/

nailingit — February 20, 2013 at 8:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 19, 2013 at 2:39 p.m.

A too clever by half attempt.....

The 98% figure is based on the PUBLISHED PAPERS. It isn't an ' I agree', but rather the data that shows that those who know what they are talking about having reached the same conclusion through their research.

Naomi Oreskes' work has been replicated. We have papers such as http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2010/06/04/1003187107.full.pdf+html?with-ds=yes.

And http://www.desmogblog.com/2012/11/15/why-climate-deniers-have-no-credibility-science-one-pie-chart

And http://skepticalscience.com/global-warming-scientific-consensus.htm

And http://www.skepticalscience.com/Interactive-History-of-Climate-Science.html

What do you have?

The oft-cited Oregon Petition, or letters to the WSJ editors signed by a bunch of people without the data to support their claims.

I suspect you know that and made a conscious choice to attempt to derail a conversation rather than bring something substantive to the table.

*98% of scientists at one time disagreed with Newton, Einstein and Tesla, does that invalidate their findings?*

Any chance you'll bring the data to support that claim, or should we be citing nizkor.org?

Or maybe you could show us all the papers written that tried to disprove Einstein, et al.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 8:27 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Madore video today: First of all, what was going on in the background there, Lou? New construction?

Here is the big issue with Madore's personal assistant. Lou touched on it at the end: public disclosure. Madore did not want to reveal what he is paying her (probably because it amounts to slave wages), citing he does not reveal personnel information. Clark County salaries, however, ARE public record, as they should be.

What about her emails? Documents she generates? Can those be kept from the public view as well just because she is not a public employee.

Transparency, David. Remember? Or, is it only transparent when it is convenient for you and you alone?

I smell a potential lawsuit in the wind and Madore's plan to save taxpayers' funds will wind up costing hundreds of thousands in litigation challenges.

Just a matter of time.

manthou — February 20, 2013 at 8:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 7:52 a.m

My premiums actually went down this year. Not by much, but at least it didn't go up.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 8:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*As I'd asked before, show me the data which shows light rail from the very beginning of the process*

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 4:05 p.m

And, likewise, where is your data that building 2 ton multi hundred horsepower vehicles to haul one person to work, the energy and resources building wider and wider and heavier and heavier roads and all the supporting infrastructure, and the drilling and excavating and refining of petroleum is a better use of resources?

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 8:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal- The next time one of your detractors claim you never support argumentation with dialogue, only links, refer them to yesterday 10:11-1:08.

Great example of schooling someone while displaying patience, a thick skin and maintaining forum decorum.

Bravo!

nailingit — February 20, 2013 at 8:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou — February 20, 2013 at 8:31 a.m.

My favorite quote of his today; "You get so much done when other people do it". What a smug POS.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 8:48 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 8:27 a.m.

Thank you for your totally pointless post that did nothing to refute mine.

You have cited political publications to support science?

Do you have a non political source for your claim that 98% agree with your point of view a recent study of 1077 professional engineers and geoscientists found only a 36% consensus on global warming.

http://oss.sagepub.com/content/33/11/1477.full

I

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 8:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye: I know. I know. This is a guy who is used to having a lot of staff do a lot of things he has not had to worry about for a long time. Now he is faced with doing it like most of us lowly peons: juggling a lot of daily tasks on our own.

Who knows. I swear though, I want a full accounting of how much Clark County will be spending on clean up and lawyers fees for Madore's well-meaning, but misguided ideas.

manthou — February 20, 2013 at 8:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 8:54 a.m.

Previously cited (http://www.columbian.com/news/2013/feb/18/open-forum-feb-18-24/#c219294): http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2010/06/04/1003187107.full.pdf+html?with-ds=yes

Here, we use an extensive dataset of 1,372 climate
researchers and their publication and citation data to show that (i) 97–98% of the climate researchers most actively publishing in the field support the tenets of ACC outlined by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, and (ii) the relative climate expertise and scientific prominence of the researchers unconvinced of ACC are substantially below that of the convinced researchers.

The "political publications " actually mention they use the similar protocols as Naomi Oreskes' work; essentially replicating and updating peer-reviewed work that has stood up to scrutiny.

Now your cited paper - one just published and being widely disseminated through the denier blogosphere - is a SURVEY of a very specific group. Sorta like asking people standing around the Vatican what they think of the pope.....


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 9:15 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Oh, btw, the survey actually shows that even amongst that self-selected group, the majority realize humans are a cause for the current changes we are seeing in the climate:

"There is even less agreement as to the cause: 27.4% believe it is caused by primarily natural factors (natural variation, volcanoes, sunspots, lithosphere motions, etc.), 25.7% believe it is caused by primarily human factors (burning fossil fuels, changing land use, enhanced water evaporation due to irrigation), and 45.2% believe that climate change is caused by both human and natural factors."

http://www.apegga.org/Environment/reports/ClimateChangesurveyreport.pdf

So basically, ~70% of the respondents of the survey - members of an organization highly involved in the oil industry in Canada - realize that what we humans are doing is effecting the planet.

Welcome to the Anthropocene......

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 9:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal


***Will those silly Christians ever learn?***

LAS VEGAS (FOX5) -

A Southern California woman says she was sexually assaulted by a man she went on a first date with.

The two developed an online relationship through ChristianMingle.com.

ChristianMingle.com advertises as a place where Christians can find other singles who share values and love for God.

Police in La Mesa, CA, just outside of San Diego say Sean Banks used the site to gain a woman's confidence and then rape her.

It was their first in-person meeting after a lengthy online relationship.

But the woman only knew him by his online name of "Rarity".

Police say it was one of several fake names Banks used which complicated tracking him down.

Reaction around the valley was shock and anger.

"Unbelievable," said Courtney Kaplan. "Of all the sites, of all the places, there's no safe place anymore. Unfortunate."

"Somebody that is using a Christian-based online service is probably thinking that it's safer than using the regular internet and, for me, it makes it even more tragic," said Yvonne Wagner.

Spark Networks, which owns ChristianMingle.com and other faith-based dating websites, says it's cooperating with police and has experts manually reviewing all profile content and photos and has developed several proprietary automated tools to ensure the highest possible level of safety and privacy.

As for Banks, he has been charged with two counts of rape and pleaded not guilty.

The former Navy intelligence officer posted bond of $500,000 and is free.

But police want to know if there are other victims who fell prey to an alleged online dating rapist.

At the bottom of the homepage of the website it says background checks on members are not conducted.

Copyright 2013 KVVU (KVVU Broadcasting Corporation). All rights reserved.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 10:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal


MRD-
*The economy tanked. Sound familiar? Deal with it. Mine tanked, too, but I'm surviving. The rates are lower, but I'm still able to turn away work-too busy*.

Talk about not making sense, economy tanked yet your surving, and yet your turning work away.. HUM.. something doesn't sound right in your world...And what rates do you speak of????

Maybe the Long nights and days up yonder are getting to ya .. don't they have a saying for that...anyway take care and stay busy....doing what you do

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 10:11 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**SEEMS LIKE HUMANS WERE INEVITIBLE**

http://www.scienceworldreport.com/articles/5071/20130220/evolution-surprisingly-predictable-specialization-isnt-special.htm

> Evolution is Surprisingly Predictable:
> Specialization isn't so Special

DeeLittle — February 20, 2013 at 10:27 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 9:42 a.m.

A 5 year old survey of opinions is too stale to have any bearing on the discussion.

The debate on global warming is still very much active, dispute the efforts of groups like "skepticalscience" to suppress valid but differing viewpoints.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 10:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 9:42 a.m.

*A 5 year old survey of opinions*

A citation would be nice.....

As would something that supports your "dispute the efforts of groups like "skepticalscience" to suppress " ( I think you meant 'dispite').

And some actual support for your "valid" would look like you aren't talking through your hat in that regard also.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 10:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal


BTW, the "differing viewpoints" are most likely included in this list:

**Climate Myths sorted by taxonomy**

It's not happening
Temp record is unreliable
Hockey stick is broken

....

It's cooling
We're heading into an ice age
....

It hasn't warmed since 1998
Phil Jones says no global warming since 1995
Global warming stopped in 1998, 1995, 2002, 2007, 2010, ????
.....

Climategate CRU emails suggest conspiracy
Scientists tried to 'hide the decline' in global temperature

....

Skeptics were kept out of the IPCC?
Sea level rise is exaggerated
....
IPCC is alarmist
....
IPCC ‘disappeared’ the Medieval Warm Period
The IPCC consensus is phoney
Al Gore got it wrong
Less than half of published scientists endorse global warming
500 scientists refute the consensus
Naomi Oreskes' study on consensus was flawed
The science isn't settled
They changed the name from global warming to climate change
Over 31,000 scientists signed the OISM Petition Project
....
Climate 'Skeptics' are like Galileo.
CO2 is just a trace gas
....
It's the sun
It's cosmic rays
Solar Cycle Length proves its the sun
The sun is getting hotter
Water levels correlate with sunspots
Solar cycles cause global warming
....
CO2 is not the only driver of climate
It's soot
It's aerosols
A drop in volcanic activity caused warming
It's ozone
It's methane
....
Water vapor is the most powerful greenhouse gas
....
CO2 is coming from the ocean
Volcanoes emit more CO2 than humans
CO2 emissions do not correlate with CO2 concentration
....
Models are unreliable
Climate is chaotic and cannot be predicted
....
It's not bad
Climate sensitivity is low
Earth hasn't warmed as much as expected
....
Animals and plants can adapt
....
CO2 is not a pollutant
CO2 is plant food
Ocean acidification isn't serious
Corals are resilient to bleaching
Sea level rise predictions are exaggerated
Scientists retracted claim that sea levels are rising
Coral atolls grow as sea levels rise
Greenland has only lost a tiny fraction of its ice mass
It's only a few degrees
It's too hard
CO2 limits will harm the economy
Renewable energy is too expensive
Renewable energy investment kills jobs
CO2 limits will hurt the poor
CO2 limits will make little difference
CO2 limits won't cool the planet
Renewables can't provide baseload power
It's not urgent

Why they aren't valid is well documented at http://skepticalscience.com/argument.php?f=taxonomy

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 10:53 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 10:39 a.m

Look at your own link you are the one who cited a 5 year old study.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 10:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Basil-
7:52am

So your spending about those amounts which you wrote of this morning... Hmmmmm... not so fast there.... You went backwards just like Obama has done for 4 years blaming Bush.. I didn't say anything in my write about past health care costs only the new costs moving forward which you failed to mention once.. So your point was to discredit something that I didn't even discuss. Thats what a few of you do here..Thats what your elected leader does... I doubt you pay even close to any of those prices...

Try buying one of Obamas new programs, Bronze, gold, Silver or Platinum out of your pocket and tell me which one it will be... I already have the answer... And whats going to happen is companies will be forgoing there own Insurance and going with the new plans..Lets see how you will like it then.. Oh how about answering this, why didn't you tackle the question of the acrued tax to people if they don't buy health Insurance, Some call it a tax since it is a line item on the 2014 tax return...I'm sure 32 million who will still be off health care will smile and pay that tax...and you didn't even touch on who may get subsidies and who won't.. If your in a state that doesn't have an exchange = no subsidy... You failed miserably to actually answer any of my earlier points... Try again... But don't let arrogance get in your way this time.... lots of good reading below... if you want help i would be happy too..

Another question to everyone here. How many people do we know that don't have health Insurance??? I could write down at least 15 people I know and most will continue without due to it being too expensive.. we all know one trip to the doctor could break us though.. It's an individual choice...

http://www.forbes.com/sites/sallypipes/2013/01/07/obamacare-guarantees-higher-health-insurance-premiums-3000-higher/

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/11/13/Obamacare-Will-Create-Two-Americas-for-Healthcare

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 10:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 10:53 a.m

Again, I would not go to a political publication for scientific fact, would you accept Heartland or CATO as fact?

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11 a.m

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 10:56 a.m

Seems you'd rather not actually support your claims.

Good to know.....

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 11:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*You failed miserably to actually answer any of my earlier points... Try again... But don't let arrogance get in your way this time.... lots of good reading below... if you want help i would be happy too..*

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 10:57 a.m.

If I missed the main points of your various diatribes on healthcare, perhaps it was due to your writing skills.....

What Obama campaigned on and what was eventually signed are pretty far apart; we don't have anything approaching universal, we still have a system dominated by a for profit insurance industry, the politicians did not follow any sort of 'best practices' and model the legislation on successful programs.

"your elected leader " What country are you writing from?

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 11:25 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11 a.m.

About the author
Skeptical Science is maintained by John Cook, the Climate Communication Fellow for the Global Change Institute at the University of Queensland. He studied physics at the University of Queensland, Australia. After graduating, he majored in solar physics in his post-grad honours year. He is not a climate scientist. Consequently, the science presented on Skeptical Science is not his own but taken directly from the peer reviewed scientific literature. To those seeking to refute the science presented, one needs to address the peer reviewed papers where the science comes from (links to the full papers are provided whenever possible).

There is no funding to maintain Skeptical Science other than Paypal donations - it's run at personal expense. John Cook has no affiliations with any organisations or political groups. Skeptical Science is strictly a labour of love. The design was created by John's talented web designer wife.

http://skepticalscience.com/about.shtml

So, what actual evidence are you going to bring forward to support your claim of "political publication"?

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 11:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawk-

Some people Health premiums might have gone down or stayed the same depending on when they were purchased and which insurance comapny. Yours would be in the vast Minority...We will

Flexible Spending Accounts: The maximum amount you can set aside pre-tax for health care costs in a flexible spending account will be reduced from $5,000 to $2,500.
(source: Obamacare wins: Now the pain begins)

46%: The percentage of Americans in favor of health care reform, according to a Wall Street Journal-NBC News poll.
45%: The percentage of Americans against the bill according to the same poll.
36%: The percentage of Americans who think the bill is a “good idea,” according to the same poll.
(source: American Public Divided On Health Care Reform (POLL))

Now it’s your turn–what’s your opinion about the health care reform bill?

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 11:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 11:33 a.m.

"So, what actual evidence are you going to bring forward to support your claim of "political publication"?"

Their mission statement.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11:48 a.m. ( | suggest removal


WASHINGTON — Former U.S. representative Jesse Jackson Jr. pleaded guilty Wednesday to using campaign money to buy more than $750,000 worth of luxury items, collectibles and clothes — marking the fall of a man once heralded as one of Illinois' most promising politicians.

Jackson, the son of civil rights leader Rev. Jesse Jackson, entered his guilty plea in U.S. District Court and now faces up to five years in prison. Judge Robert Wilkins set Jackson's sentencing hearing for June 28.

Jackson's wife, Sandi, a former Chicago alderman facing a separate felony charge for filing false tax returns over six years, will appear in court in Washington later Wednesday and is also expected to enter a guilty plea.

"For years I lived off my campaign," Jackson said before entering his plea. "I used money I shouldn't have used for personal purposes."

The Democratic congressman, who represented a district that included parts of Chicago's South Side and south suburbs, was first elected to office in 1995, replacing Democrat Mel Reynolds, who resigned after being convicted of statutory rape.

Read more at

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/02/20/jackson-fraud-charges-pleads/1931581/

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Basil,
So your diminishing your own answers because what the president pushed through and every democrat cept for 35 voted for is so different form what he actually proposed. So basically we got something that is totally not what the Prez wanted.. way to back off and retract... Gotta love You dems.. What school did you all go too.. You abswer questions like Hillary by saying what does it matter now ..

You say our leaders didn't do there due dilligence.. Wow I suspect many more Rep read the 1000 pages than the Dems.. Just my opinion...Wasn't Obama elected our country's leader , isn't he the Presdient.. Oh I get ya he is more like our countys dictator... I saw him speak yesterday with all these Firemen warning all those bad republicans that if the speding cuts come these folks are going to loose there jobs... Well on March first i'm going to walk next door and see if my neighbor still has a job.. I'm thinking he will...Dam he just bought a new car so he better...These supposed cuts were proposed by Obama himself last year..and now he is trying to paint the R as the bad guys when in fact it was him and Geitner who put the package together... GEEZ people wake up.. Ignorance is not bliss.

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at noon ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11:48 a.m.

About Skeptical Science

The goal of Skeptical Science is to explain what peer reviewed science has to say about global warming

http://skepticalscience.com/about.shtml

As before, IF you have something that supports your claims, let us see it.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 12:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal


way to back off and retract... Gotta love You [sic] dems.. What school did you all go too[sic].. You abswer [sic] questions like Hillary by saying what does it matter now ..

You say our leaders didn't do there [sic] due dilligence [sic].. Wow I suspect many more Rep read the 1000 pages than the Dems..

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at noon

I wonder what evidence you can bring forward that ties me to the "dems".....

The bill, as signed was a compromise. A poor compromise that heavily favored a 'do nothing' policy promulgated by a 'business as usual' consortium. However, it did bring some very needed changes - reducing un and underinsured, bringing some control of the insurance industry, pre-existing conditions, etc. Not enough by far. And certainly not as much as 'best practices' has shown to be attainable. And, unfortunately, not as much as the Eisenhower era Republican platform or the Johnson and Carter administrations' efforts.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 12:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11:54 a.m.

Just 'reporting the news', or trying out a few implied logical fallicies?

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 12:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11:54 a.m.

Maybe you could spend your time more profitably by trying to support your claims:

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11:48 a.m.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 8:54 a.m.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 11 a.m

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 10:56 a.m

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 12:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 11:40 a.m.

It's my turn for WHAT? I have no idea what you were writing about.

As far as the healthcare reform bill goes, I don't think it goes far enough. If it was up to me, I would change the whole healthcare system to be completely non-profit. They should take the current Medicare system and totally expand it to include everyone. I know what you are going to say, I'm a Socialist, maybe so but it's the only way everyone is going to be covered and they don't seem to have a problem with it in Canada.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 12:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7QDv4s...

Georgia Legislators Want To Change 17th Amendment, End U.S. Senate Elections

A group of Republican state lawmakers in Georgia wants to end direct election of United States senators and return the power to state legislatures.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/20/georgia-17th-amendment-senate-elections_n_2725595.html?utm_hp_ref=politics

nailingit — February 20, 2013 at 12:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 12:28 p.m.

It seems like a couple of posters on here insist on posting a story every time a republican gets a citation for j walking, so, I thought I would reply in kind. That being said you are correct that it is a good example of a "strawman" fallacy. Maybe those that have a hard time grasping the concept should take note.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 1 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 12:12 p.m.

Nice job of "cherry picking" by omitting the two paragraphs they use to insult anyone who disagrees with their position you remove the political basis.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 1:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Well, perhaps a bit late to weigh in on yesterday's LRT vs. global warming discussion Sir Basil and Goldie had, but here goes anyhow. Your discussion was on the macro scale; try reducing it to the area the CRC affects and the amount of pollution generated by vehicles idling in traffic will increase - not decrease.

As has been repeatedly addressed, the number of cars won't drop - in fact, if they do the two states are in a world of hurt because the tolling estimate requires vehicular traffic to increase to pay the tolls needed to pay the loans and bonds. LRT has a finite capacity, and the number of cars traveling I5 is actually supposed to go up. The congestion will still happen - it'll just be further south in Portland, and last longer down there. Several of the neighborhood association and environmental group complaints in Portland addressed this point.

The number who will shift to the I205 bridge, to avoid tolls, is unknown - expect that the higher the tolls, the greater the number. I205 already has congestion from the Sandy Blvd south, and the highway and several access roads like Airport Way are already parking lots during the evening commute. These backup periods will grow. Again, more time sitting and idling, or taking a half hour or more to get on the freeway, will increase the pollution generated.

Downtown Vancouver will experience its own problems. Planning has 8 runs per hour during peak (rush hour) periods. So, with coming and going, traffic will be stopped for LRT 16 times per hour. Traffic on Evergreen, Mill Plain, and other east/west streets will be sitting rather than moving, and thereby increasing the levels of pollution generated in those areas.

roger — February 20, 2013 at 1:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbc064...

Man, I'd be afraid to ask this guy what he thought of Light rail!

He might trip and impale himself.

A little humor for most...

...but for some measured solidarity.

Granted this guy is unbalanced, yet he still represents what attracts many to this movement.

Political Pyromania.

nailingit — February 20, 2013 at 1:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal


And complete irrelevance to the topic. You're just buying into the "angry old man" argument being used by CRC proponents to describe the people arguing against it. This totally ignores a discussion of the points or facts presented. And to take this a step further - the CRC crowd is the worst of all. This "a big one is coming at any time" is fear mongering at its best.

roger — February 20, 2013 at 1:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — February 20, 2013 at 1:16 p.m

I guess I hadn't put too much effort into thinking about what Downtown Vancouver was going to experience with LRT in town but you are 100% correct. Not only those streets but all the other streets and the extra stops between the bridge and the college. And the city thinks this will bring more people downtown? It's going to chase people away and I'll bet there will be lawsuits for restraint of trade due to people not being able to park anywhere. Restaurants will close.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 1:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger- Please...a little humor roger. You hard line light rail opponents see a black cat around every corner! :))

nailingit — February 20, 2013 at 1:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 1 p.m

I've linked to the SS About page with my quoted selections; now, IF you can show exactly where the science is politicized by the author, show us. My reading is how he is using the science to de-politicize the arguments and focuses on the broad sweep of research to explain how the " focus on narrow pieces of the puzzle" by skeptics and deniers are invalid.

IF you see something significantly different, perhaps you could clarify your opinion by some 'cherry picking' of your own.

Further, at 10:28 a.m., you stated, "The debate on global warming is still very much active..." without making a single effort to support what you think are "valid but differing viewpoints" or how groups like SS attempt to "suppress" those viewpoints.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 1:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger and hawkeye and nailingit: Let me add another issue to downtown traffic that has me concerned: truck freight to the Port of Vancouver. We love it that business at the Port is doing well, but the extra truck traffic and the oversized cargo (think huge wind turbines) it carries makes it dangerous for pedestrians.

The "official" truck route is Mill Plain, but this is ignored by truckers due to the short intersections.

4th Plain has become the unofficial truck route. Anyone waiting for a light to cross 4th Plain knows that the lights are timed to favor freight traffic east and west on 4th Plain. Woe be to the pedestrian or auto that actually enters 4th Plain from the south or north when the light finally does turn green: those 18 wheelers just run the light time and again. There is a plan in the distant future to widen 4th Plain, taking out residences, churches, and business.

39th Street, with the new railroad overpass, is starting to attract new freight traffic now, angering the residents on 39th. They want to restrict truck traffic there: will not happen. The Port is king and probably should be, since we need the economic boost it brings.

Light rail has signal dominance, which means the trains get a green light whenever they need to go through.

Downtown will be a mess, for sure, for years during construction.

manthou — February 20, 2013 at 2:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — February 20, 2013 at 1:16 p.m.

The focus by the 'anti' is the micro argument. I'm pointing out that that 'couple of miles of track' are a part of a much larger issue.

There are lots of things in this particular plan that aren't optimum; Light rail probably should go on up to Salmon Creek or Ridgefield, have an East West line, have a more comprehensive bus system.

But the 'we can't let LR into V because the riff raff will come' and 'the traffic problems are further south' and such arguments are micro and solvable within the context of the larger picture. Tell the Japanese that planning for a 'big one' is not being realistic.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 2:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal


***And the HITS just keep on coming***

LAS VEGAS (FOX5) -

A Las Vegas woman was arrested Tuesday after authorities caught her having sex with a pit bull in her back yard, according to Metro police.

In an arrest report released Wednesday, police said they were called to a home in the 300 block of N. 16th Street, where 23-year-old Kara Vandereyk was engaging in sexual acts with the animal in full view of neighbors.

Police said the woman stood-up and greeted officers with a "Hi".

Vandereyk appeared to be under the influence of drugs or was mentally ill, according to the report.

Police said she could not identify herself and was unable to answer questions about the current date or name of the President of the United States.

Vandereyk is quoted in the report telling officers, "I'm bipolar." She also admitted to taking prescription medication but was not sure if she was on them at the time, police said.

Vandereyk is charged with open and gross lewdness.

The canine was taken into the custody of Animal Control.

Copyright 2013 KVVU (KVVU Broadcasting Corporation). All rights reserved.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 2:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 1:54 p.m.

The author of skeptical science is not peer reviewed in climate science and does nothing but cherry pick data. If you want a climate change blog by a peer reviewed scientist I could suggest Anthony Watts.

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 2:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqHw5IY6lXA

How about Light Rail to and from Mexico?

Let's wrap up pending immigration change and stick a bow on it.

America/Mexico Light Rail. AMLR

It would create jobs and at the same time expedite the transitional process for millions of our friends across the border to seek residency/citizenship in our great country.

The ends do justify the means in this case.

Teabagger's heads would explode and we'd be rid of 38% of the Republican party.

A win win win win win....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iknreB...

nailingit — February 20, 2013 at 2:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal


"The author of skeptical science is not peer reviewed..."

You probably meant 'his writing is not peer reviewed'.... But the basic fact is that he links to and uses peer-reviewed science to show how the various denier/skeptic arguments do not hold up to basic scientific scrutiny.

"...does nothing but cherry pick data."

Cook uses science that has withstood close scrutiny and all his data is cited for those who want to delve further.

You might be able to prove this part of your argument - an argument that can be found in the nitzor.org Fallacy site, btw - IF you take a large enough % of the points he discusses and shows a consistent ignoring of a large body of evidence to the contrary.

You haven't done that; just made a broad, sweeping statement with no supporting data.

"If you want a climate change blog by a peer reviewed scientist I could suggest Anthony Watts."

Watts, a person with less creditably than Cook; certainly with less expertise in the field, is actually a classic example of cherry picking; look at the published articles he cites in his articles, look at his use of selective quoting, reliance on press releases and newspaper articles. And for an example of the politicizing of science, look at how he name calls, the semantics of his headlines. Also question why he doesn't note his guest posters' connection to conservative thinktanks or fossil fuel industry. And we should also mention Watts consistent use of 'experts' writing outside their field of expertise.

We could also discuss his failed efforts at disputing Mann's, Hansen's, and most any scientist working on Arctic or sea ice's results. Not to mention his failure to support his claims about surface temperature recording.

However, he has established a blog that works well as a mouthpiece/megaphone for a select group of skeptics; one that repeats the tropes used by the deniers, thus supporting that message to the low information readers.

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 3:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal


23-year-old Kara Vandereyk was engaging in sexual acts with the animal in full view of neighbors.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 2:14 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal | Ignore User )

Tough one to explain to the kids!

nailingit — February 20, 2013 at 3:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Go to the face book side and read what Moeller and his cronies want now.A 10 cent gas tax which we already knew they wanted but now he wants a 7% increase in vehicle tabs.This will all be on top of the tolls we will be paying.Did everybody all of a sudden get back to work?I don't understand their thinking.Or should I say lack there of.

timerick — February 20, 2013 at 3:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 3:19 p.m.

"Watts, a person with less creditably than Cook; certainly with less expertise in the field"

Yet the IPCC chose him as an expert reviewer? Wouldn't that make them as incompetent as you claim he is?

frobert — February 20, 2013 at 4:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 20, 2013 at 4:19 p.m.

Ahhh, yet another logical fallacy in action! Thanks for showing us the best you can do.....

FYI, [you might want to read up on what "expert reviewer" really means.][1] (blog linked to because IPCC site is down)

Esp. in light of the [unqualified guy][2] who signed up and then broke the non-disclosure agreement for draft versions.....

Oddly, it quickly wound up on Watts' site.....

[1]: http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/2006/05/09/you-too-can-be-a-leading-clima/
[2]: http://errortheory.blogspot.com/

mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 4:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawk,
canada's health care system will be an example close to Europes in 10-15 years. Canadians are currently paying anywhere from 10-17% of their income depending on province and tax bracket just for there healthcare...So you would drive to Winnepeg and have your heart transplant instead of OHSU, is that what your saying....Move there, go for it.. I have several canadian clients with us citizship that use our healthcare exclusivley.. There are so many problems up there... Obviously you don't or can't answer my question so Instead of beating a dead Horse I'let it go, you can't seem to grasp the situation of how Obamacare will not only cost everyone more, but it will insure only maybe 10% - 20% more peole of the 40 million who currently don't have health Insurance...

One thing I do agree with you is we need Healthcare reform. And if you make it for non profit yes people will loose millions of jobs.. Socialized medicine does not work...Doesn't work in socialized nations...Since it is here until 2016, everyone including the president should be on the same four plans..that are offeredunder obamacare... I bet we would see accross the board changes in no time...

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 5:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 5:20 p.m

So who wrote this little diatribe because it wasn't the same person that wrote vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 11:40 a.m.

And why would I go to Canada to get healthcare, I have it right here thanks to my years of working at a great job with union benefits.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS ***OBAMACARE***

It's called **The Affordable Health Care Act**. If you know so much, you should know that. And if the Republican'ts hadn't taken it apart in order to pass it, it would have been much better. It's not perfect but it's a start.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 6:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou — February 20, 2013 at 2:06 p.m.,

You're right; how much did we spend to build up Mill Plain so the truckers would have a route to the Port? And that was just a few years ago. Hmmm... As you note, it's not at all conducive to trucking. Is it possible there was another plan all along?

roger — February 20, 2013 at 6:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — February 20, 2013 at 1:16 p.m

Roger, you need to post your last paragraph on this

http://www.columbian.com/news/2013/fe...

People need to know about the LRT stopping traffic.

hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 6:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — February 20, 2013 at 2:14 p.m. -- "...and was unable to answer questions about the current date or name of the President of the United States."

I'll be she's not the only one; I wonder if we set up at Van Mall and ask these questions - bound to turn up several who can't answer either.

roger — February 20, 2013 at 6:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger: Makes you wonder, doesn't it? Make the preferred route a real stinker and let freedom of choice make the decision. Right now, I would say Fourth Plain is the busiest, most popular route from my perspective.

I am interested in this new anti CRC campaign initiated by some downtown businesses. This subject is so polarizing and now we will be seeing the CRC red slash NO sign in the windows of some, pro CRC in the windows of others.

Free speech: it's a right businesses enjoy, too.

Customers may be making their future purchase and service choice accordingly, I predict.

More ways to divide us. Ugh.

manthou — February 20, 2013 at 7:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawkeye - Done. Also answered Mike from Portland. What a nut!! I also read The Oregonian (OregonLive) - The rules are a little looser there, and every time Mike would post there he would get torn up. He doesn't say much there anymore.

roger — February 20, 2013 at 7:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou - My bet is that if the Waterfront Development project gets built and starts attracting the "upscale" tenants and businesses they want, then the next phase of downtown redevelopment will kick off. My guess is that around 2020 most of the shops downtown will be gone. Cost of maintaining shops will soar, and many will be run off to make room for more of the several story office and apartment buildings with the shops on the ground floor. I suppose the pawnshops on Main will be gone.

I drove out Mill Plain a while back - What's with that small stretch being called someone someone Memorial Highway? It's a street!!!

roger — February 20, 2013 at 7:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal


That is not all I told Cami Joner Hawkeye.I had customers in the office and asked her to call back but she had to get this printed right away.It seems as though they don't want to hear all that we want to say.She was more concerned about who was behind this movement.I was not going to give her anymore.

timerick — February 20, 2013 at 9:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Timerick, Hawkeye, Manthou - Curious that the letter the business owners wrote/signed isn't attached to the article for all to read. After all, that is the norm when The Columbian does an article around something like that. I'm also wondering about the bit about Cami being more interested in who's behind this movement. The article says the guy owning the guitar shop wrote it, and about 50 business owners signed it. Wouldn't that be sufficient? Or is someone turning over rocks looking for David Madore?

roger — February 21, 2013 at 5:15 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger, which Mike were you talking about? Mike S. seems to be my "friend" if you know what I mean. He likes to come after me with meaningless rants.

I'd like to see that letter too. Good luck Tim, I'm on your side, this is a bad deal all around.

hawkeye — February 21, 2013 at 6:16 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Nike leases a bunch of buildings a doorstep from the Max line.*

holycrapola — February 19, 2013 at 6:54 p.m.

Care to explain just how far from the MAX line those "bunches of buildings" are??? And just what those "facilities" are, holycrapola???

You *know* anybody with any kind of substance with Nike will only visit those facilities as time permits...and they certainly won't be taking MAX from the Nike World Headquarters to these facilities. I'd highly doubt they'd be taking TriMet at any capacity for that matter.

Anybody who works for that corporation know the *BIG* business is done in the Nike World Headquarters, not in satellite offices.

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 6:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 20, 2013 at 8:37 a.m.

What's the matter, Basil...no data to support your claim? Seems to me that Roger has a viable argument (February 20, 2013 at 1:16 p.m.) to counter your claim, thus supporting yet a stronger argument on my behalf. (much appreciated, Roger.)

On another note, I've noticed you've mentioned a couple of times the following comment - "Welcome to the Anthropocene..."

Well Basil, I agree with that. The current era we're in is definitely Anthropocenic(???) in nature, partly due to the increase in world population, the destruction of habitat and the needs of modern society.

So maybe you can explain to me the climactic changes during the Cenozoic period and how you surmise it is anthropogenic caused Or how 'bout the climactic changes during the Mesozoic or Paleozoic Era and anthropogenic causes?

You are claiming our climate change is directly related to human causes yet the scientific global climate history states otherwise. I'd be more than happy to share the data I speak of.

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 7:02 a.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou — February 20, 2013 at 2:06 p.m.

In the 36 years I've lived in this area, I've always seen the heavy semi truck traffic on Fourth Plain, headed towards the port...except when there were roadway improvements in progress. Maybe the reason why less semi's take Mill Plain that was expected is because of the same reason less people would take light rail than expected. You can't force people to take a roadway or mass transit just because they build it. Fourth Plain is an easier access for the semi's FROM I-5. All the more reason why there must be a BYPASS for semi truck traffic TO the port.

BTW manthou...I see by an article in today's Columbian, that the number of businesses in opposition to the crossing project is growing. Fifty signatures to date!!! Are you sure that support for light rail and the current crossing is really there???

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 7:09 a.m. ( | suggest removal


timerick — February 20, 2013 at 3:59 p.m.

timerick, I cannot fathom how there could be any support to increase the gasoline tax by 10 cents for Washington State Road/Bridge improvements right now...especially since the price of fuel has jumped 43 cents per gallon in the past 33 days, nationally. If our leaders approve such a move, they're truly working with blinders. It is possible that the State Senate will shoot this ridiculous request down.

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 7:17 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Canadians are currently paying anywhere from 10-17% of their income depending on province and tax bracket just for there healthcare..*

vanwadreamer — February 20, 2013 at 5:20 p.m

Are you able to bring some evidence of that?

BTW, that would be an improvement.

"The United States spends nearly twice as much per capita on health care as Canada: $7,290 per person in the United States in 2007 compared with $3,895 per person in Canada (aOrganisation for Economic Co-operation and Development [OECD] 2009a). This difference constitutes 19% of median household income for a household of four, $72,695 (American Community Survey 2007). Sixty-six percent of this difference in spending is for hospitals and physicians. The rest is accounted for by government activities (10%); other professional services (9%); other institutions such as nursing homes (7%); prescription drugs (5%); and capital investment and other spending (4%) (Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services [CMS] 2009; Canadian Institute for Health Information [CIHI] 2008). Despite this higher spending, however, U.S. health indicators continue to lag behind those of Canada. In 2006, infant mortality was 6.7 per 1,000 live births in the United States, compared to 5.0 per 1,000 in Canada. In the same year, life expectancy at birth was 78.1 years in the United States and 80.7 years in Canada (OECD 2009a)."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3024588/

might also want to look at http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/TableofContentMetadataOECDHealthData2012.pdf for levels of health comparisons.

How Does Canada Compare
Health spending accounted for 11.4% of GDP in Canada in 2010, almost two percentage points higher
than the OECD average of 9.5%. However, health spending as a share of GDP is much lower in Canada
than in the United States (which spent 17.6% of its GDP on health in 2010). It is also slightly lower than in
certain European countries such as the Netherlands (12.0%), France (11.6%) and Germany (11.6%).
Canada also ranks above the OECD average in terms of health spending per capita, with spending of 4445
USD in 2010 (adjusted for purchasing power parity), compared with an OECD average of 3268 USD.
Health spending per capita in Canada remains nonetheless much lower than in the United States (which
spent 8233 USD per capita in 2010), as well as in Norway, Switzerland and the Netherlands.
http://www.oecd.org/canada/BriefingNoteCANADA2012.pdf

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 7:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*You are claiming our climate change is directly related to human causes yet the scientific global climate history states otherwise. I'd be more than happy to share the data I speak of.*

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 7:02 a.m.

Yes, please "share the data"......

Might want to check http://skepticalscience.com/argument.php?f=taxonomy first though.

You do realize we're in the Cenozoic Era now, right?

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 7:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 7:17 a.m.

But you are OK with our tax dollars going directly to the fossil fuel industry in the form of subsidies?

"Figures from the IEA show that global fossil fuel subsidies jumped to $523bn in 2011, which Birol said represented an incentive to emit carbon equivalent to $110 per tonne."

http://www.businessgreen.com/bg/news/2241226/iea-chief-fossil-fuel-subsidies-are-public-enemy-number-one-for-green-energy

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 8:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Limiting the Federal Government's Fiscal Exposure by Better Managing Climate Change Risks**

Climate change adaptation—defined as adjustments to natural or human systems in response to actual or expected climate change—is a risk-management strategy to help protect vulnerable sectors and communities that might be affected by changes in the climate. Adaptation measures to protect infrastructure, for example, include raising river or coastal dikes to protect infrastructure from sea level rise, building higher bridges, and increasing the capacity of storm water systems. State and local authorities are responsible for the planning and implementation of many types of infrastructure projects, and decisions at these levels of government can drive the federal government’s fiscal exposure. **While implementing adaptive measures may be costly, there is a growing recognition that the cost of inaction could be greater and—given the government’s precarious fiscal position—increasingly difficult to manage given expected budget pressures which will constrain not just future ad hoc responses but other federal programs as well.** As stated in a 2010 NRC report, increasing the nation’s ability to respond to a changing climate can be viewed as an insurance policy against climate change risks.[4]

**Furthermore, according to NRC and USGCRP the nation’s vulnerability can be reduced by limiting the magnitude of climate change through actions to limit greenhouse gas emissions.**[5] GAO recognizes that (1) the federal government has a number of efforts underway to decrease domestic greenhouse gas emissions and (2) the success of greenhouse gas emissions reduction efforts depends in large part on cooperative international efforts. However, limiting the federal government’s fiscal exposure to climate change risks will present a challenge no matter the outcome of domestic and international efforts to reduce emissions, in part because greenhouse gases already in the atmosphere will continue altering the climate system for many decades, according to NRC and USGCRP.[6]

http://www.gao.gov/highrisk/limiting_federal_government_fiscal_exposure

My bolding

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 8:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Pope Benedict XVI
"I hope that all members of the international community can agree on a responsible, credible and supportive response to this worrisome and complex phenomenon, keeping in mind the needs of the poorest populations and of future generations."

http://catholicclimatecovenant.org/catholic-teachings/vatican-messages/

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 8:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*The answer is simple. Population control in order to curve demand. How? Viruses, junk food, starvation, disease, cigarrettes, drugs, wars, depression, etc.*

holycrapola — February 21, 2013 at 8:58 a.m.

????????????? Really, what are you trying to say?

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 9:14 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*You do realize we're in the Cenozoic Era now, right?*

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 7:54 a.m.

Yes, I do realize the fact. You're anthropogene epoch could be considered as the current/next epoch phase (which I'd mistakenly said "era") of the Cenozoic Era, thus supporting anthropogenic climate change possibilities. So now...back to the statement I'd given you, suggesting your response which I believe you have evaded -

*So maybe you can explain to me the climactic changes during the Cenozoic period (Holocene and Pleistocene) and how you surmise it is anthropogenic caused. Or how 'bout the climactic changes during the Mesozoic or Paleozoic Era and anthropogenic causes?*

Here basil, I'll give you a little easy reading:

http://www.nature.nps.gov/geology/nationalfossilday/climate_change_earth_history.cfm

Furthermore, I would appreciate it if you would answer my questions in statement form with data to back up your statement (not just a link and copy/paste), first rather than sidetracking, causing confusion on the subjects at hand. Till then, I will refrain from your discussion.

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 8:35 a.m.

Not sure where you got the idea that I am okay with tax dollars going to the fossil fuel industry in the form of subsidies. Must be one of your assumptions, just because of the fact I see waste in a miniscule light rail extension which will serve no purpose other than to fatten pocket books of a few selected individuals.

You are aware there are hybrid BRT vehicles which run on self-contained electrical systems as well as LNG, CNG and hydrogen and that they remain well within the standards set by the EPA, right???

And you are aware that the LRV in Portland are equipped with propulsion converters which run from any energy source OR diesel engines, right???

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 9:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**A Convenient Excuse**

By WEN STEPHENSON | November 5, 2012

In our current media landscape, it apparently takes a magazine like Rolling Stone — in an issue with Justin Bieber on the cover — to offer a writer like Bill McKibben the opportunity to spell out the facts, in cold hard arithmetic, for a mass audience. McKibben's landmark article this past summer, "Global Warming's Terrifying New Math," boiled the hard truth about climate down to three stark numbers:

• Two degrees Celsius: the amount, according to international consensus, that we can raise the global average temperature above preindustrial levels and still maintain a so-called "safe" climate, beyond which all bets are off. "Safe," of course, depends on where you live. We've already raised it almost one degree, with disastrous results; if you live in Africa, or Kiribati, one degree is too much.

• 565 gigatons: the amount of CO2 scientists agree we can still pump into the atmosphere and hope to remain below the two-degree threshold.

• 2795 gigatons: the amount of CO2 contained in the world's proven fossil-fuel reserves, which the fossil-fuel industry shows every intention of extracting and burning.

The bottom line: we have to find a way to leave 80 percent of accessible fossil fuels in the ground, forever, and make a rapid shift to clean energy, if we're going to avoid the very real risk of catastrophic climate change within this century. When you get a grip on those numbers, something like the Keystone protest — driven by the idea that the Alberta tar sands, the planet's second-largest pool of carbon, should be off-limits — comes into focus. It's more than math: it's a moral imperative. That's why 1253 people were willing to get arrested in front of the White House in order to stop that pipeline, even temporarily.

"Unsafe" climate change is not a distant threat. It's here, now. We've fundamentally altered the planet's life-support system, and conditions are going to get much worse. If you've enjoyed this year's record heat, wildfires, drought, and spiking global food prices — if you enjoy monster storms like Sandy — get used to it.

Read more: http://thephoenix.com/boston/news/146647-convenient-excuse

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 9:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


holycrapola — February 21, 2013 at 8:58 a.m.

A 5-mile radius...rather broad area away from MAX, wouldn't you say? I'm not doubting the additional building occupancies, holyc. I'm doubting your statement you made "the Brains live in Beaverton, they take the max to the tech centers, it is all there." First of all, Nike IS in Beaverton, so why would the "Brains" use MAX to go to their own town? Secondly, do you honestly believe the "Brains" of Nike, with protected information on their person, would utilize MAX in the first place?

Just wonderin'

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 9:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Considering population control, holycrapola...your statement does raise the suspicion in the minds of those who suspect a conspiracy or two. Makes one wonder, eh!

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 9:30 a.m. ( | suggest removal



nailingit — February 21, 2013 at 9:35 a.m. (

Not *The Onion*....sigh

A Missouri bill would make it a felony for lawmakers to introduce a bill to restrict gun rights. The legislation, House Bill 633, was introduced by State rep. Mike Leara.

Read more at http://www.inquisitr.com/532591/proposed-missouri-bill-bans-gun-control-legislation

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 9:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcEXML...

nailingit — February 21, 2013 at 9:35 a.m. (

Not The Onion....sigh

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 9:51 a.m. (

:))

Yes mr_basil_seal. And to add yet another component to this much discussed topic.

Consider the Mayans...

One can extract much wisdom from parody and humor.

nailingit — February 21, 2013 at 10:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Here basil, I'll give you a little easy reading:*

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 9:23 a.m.

Yup, the climate has always changed....

"There are a number of different forces which can influence the Earth’s climate. When the sun gets brighter, the planet receives more energy and warms. When volcanoes erupt, they emit particles into the atmosphere which reflect sunlight, and the planet cools. When there are more greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, the planet warms. These effects are referred to as external forcings because by changing the planet's energy balance, they force climate to change.
....
What does that mean for today? Rising greenhouse gas levels are an external forcing, which has caused climate changes many times in Earth's history. They're causing an energy imbalance and the planet is building up heat. From Earth's history, we know that positive feedbacks will amplify the greenhouse warming. So past climate change doesn't tell us that humans can't influence climate; on the contrary, it tells us that climate is highly sensitive to the greenhouse warming we're now causing. "

http://skepticalscience.com/climate-change-little-ice-age-medieval-warm-period.htm

Here is some not quite as easy to read; but there is a pretty easy to understand graph SPM.2

http://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/wg1/en/spmsspm-human-and.html

But basically, Our profligate burning of fossil fuels has increased the CO2 levels in our atmosphere at a high rate. That increase in CO2 is a forcing that basically overpowers all natural changes.

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 10:13 a.m. ( | suggest removal


holycrapola — February 21, 2013 at 10:01 a.m.

Well ranted. Though the quote marks around 'problem' seems, well, rather problematical.....

Now, how about some hard numbers that actually support your claims?

You know, some research on the rate of decline, who, etc.

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 10:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Furthermore, I would appreciate it if you would answer my questions in statement form with data to back up your statement (not just a link and copy/paste), first rather than sidetracking, causing confusion on the subjects at hand. Till then, I will refrain from your discussion.*

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 9:23 a.m

Just what are your questions?

BTW, where is the supporting data for:

*You are claiming our climate change is directly related to human causes yet the scientific global climate history states otherwise. I'd be more than happy to share the data I speak of.*

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 7:02 a.m.

Second time I've asked http://www.columbian.com/news/2013/feb/18/open-forum-feb-18-24/#c219364

If NPS page was it, you seemed to have missed the link on that page to this:

**Clues for Understanding Modern Climate Change**

For the past 2 million years, great sheets of ice have advanced and retreated from both poles during the ice ages. The last ice advance reached its maximum about 20,000 years ago; ice subsequently retreated back to the poles. We live on an "icehouse" Earth during an "interglacial" period following the last ice advance.

However, today our climate is warming. As simply stated by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change:

"Warming of the climate system is unequivocal, as is now evident from observations of increases in global average air and ocean temperatures, widespread melting of snow and ice, and rising global average sea level." (IPCC, 2007)

The scientific consensus is that this warming is very likely (more than 90% certain) human-caused. The burning of fossil fuels—releasing long buried energy from the sun—is the source of increased greenhouse gas concentrations, and hence global warming. **Humans are not just along for the ride on this warming and changing planet, we are quite literally stepping on the gas!** For more information on modern climate change causes and impacts, visit the NPS Climate Change Response Program.
http://www.nature.nps.gov/geology/nationalfossilday/climate_change_modern.cfm (my bolding)

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 10:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Humans are not just along for the ride on this warming and changing planet, we are quite literally stepping on the gas!**

http://www.nature.nps.gov/geology/nationalfossilday/climate_change_modern.cfm

So, when is somebody going to show us the numbers that support our continuing use resources to build multi-ton multi-hundred horsepower fossil fueled vehicles to move one person to work and grocery shopping and back?

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 10:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal


holycrapola — February 21, 2013 at 10:34 a.m.

got it, analogies and no numbers......

BTW:

**About That Overpopulation Problem:
Research suggests we may actually face a declining world population in the coming years.**
By Jeff Wise

"The reason for the implacability of demographic transition can be expressed in one word: education. One of the first things that countries do when they start to develop is educate their young people, including girls. That dramatically improves the size and quality of the workforce. But it also introduces an opportunity cost for having babies. “Women with more schooling tend to have fewer children,” says William Butz, a senior research scholar at IIASA."

http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/future_tense/2013/01/world_population_may_actually_start_declining_not_exploding.html

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 10:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawk-

I wonder how many of the 219 Democrats actually read the bill prior to voting. I know most all of them during the debates hadn't read the entire 1000 pages of the bill. I would wager more R read it than Demogods did.. OBTW 35 Dem also voted against it.

How about small businesses that fail to provide healthcare to employees because of the cost, yeah lets tax and Gouge the small guys who make up 80% of the American work force...If you have a small business and hire someone lets say 50 years old and the rest of your employees are 35 in age average, your health care cost just went up, Possibly by as much as 50%... This can make or brake our business. You are right reform is needed...Once the Affordable Care Act aka: Obamacare takes full effect, about 18 million individuals and families will get tax credits for health insurance coverage averaging about $4,000 apiece....I guess thats better than poke in the eye with a sharp stick...

BTW- I belonged to a union, local 555 for 10 years... back a few years ago...Always had someone trying to push unionism down my throat like some ... I have firends in Unions... I'm not against Unions per say but there is a huge disperity between private sector and Govt unions and unions like Longshore and others...

Take for example a local person working for our county who has acrued more than a years sick leave time...And they can cash it in... Thats waste.... Thats unheard of in the private sector... We in the private sector have to watch or pennies much more closer... If you have vacation time or sick time it doesn't roll over into the following year and we don't re imburse you money for actually showing up for the job were paying you to do... Unlike my buddy in the union who can get paid 8hrs for 2 hrs worth of work...I also know it's hard to get rid of someone in a union, so what happens is over time you have people who are less productive.. I think that may be an area Madore may look at in the upcoming contract negotiations if that is in his Job Description...

vanwadreamer — February 21, 2013 at 11:22 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Goldie and any others that are interested.There is a meeting at the Old Acadamey bldg. down town today at 3:00.I know that the CRC will be talked about and I believe the BRT also.I am not sure which bldg.

timerick — February 21, 2013 at 12:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — February 21, 2013 at 11:22 a.m.

First off, it's almost impossible to accrue a year's worth of vacation time. If you start off at two weeks a year and then after 5 you get three and after 15 you get 5. You would have to work 18 years straight to get enough time to take a year off. The problem is, most companies have a use it or lose it clause and you HAVE to use it in the same year you got it. And even if they can accrue that much time and their employer allows it, why can't they take it? They earned it, didn't they?

Think of it this way, if you get a $50 bonus put into an account for you every year you don't take a sick day and you don't take a sick day for 20 years and you leave it there for 20 years, do you think you should have the money or should the company be able to take it back because you didn't use it? I'll bet you think it's yours, don't you.

As for your buddy getting 8 hrs pay for 2 hours work, I'm sure it was negotiated in his contract. I know it was in mine. The reason is, if you are called in, they have to guarantee you 8 hours of work. If they don't have 8 hours of work, they need to pay you for at least a full day's wages for calling you in and wasting the rest of your day. It's an incentive for you and a deterrent for them. It insures you that they won't call you in for a 1 hour job and send you home and screw up you whole day for a few bucks. Trust me, it used to happen all the time.

I don't know if contract negotiation is in Madore's job description or not but unfairly screwing with a contract is more of a detriment to production than anything. People will understand taking less in wages or a flat cost of living if management is straight with them. But if they try to be tricky or deceptive, that's when bad things happen.

hawkeye — February 21, 2013 at 12:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Gouge the small guys who make up 80% of the American work force...If you have a small business .....*

vanwadreamer — February 21, 2013 at 11:22 a.m.

Let's talk about that "small guys".

Size Standards for principal NAICS Sectors

Construction

General building and heavy construction contractors: $33.5 million
Special trade construction contractors: $14 million
Land subdivision: $7 million
Dredging: $20 million
Manufacturing

About 75 percent of the manufacturing industries: 500 employees
A small number of industries: 1,500 employees
The balance: either 750 or 1,000 employees
Mining

All mining industries, except mining services: 500 employees
Retail Trade

Most retail trade industries: $7 million
A few (such as grocery stores, department stores, motor vehicle dealers and electrical appliance dealers) have higher size standards, but none above $35.5 million (or 200 employees for New Car Dealers only).

http://www.sba.gov/content/summary-size-standards-industry

So while the rw trope wants to make it look like the little mom and pop store, the actual def is quite a bit more encompassing.

Then:

" Of the nine size classes in the BED series, the six smallest (249 employees or smaller) have seen their shares of private sector employment decrease since the early 1990s, while the three largest size classes (250 or more employees) have seen their shares of total employment increase."

http://www.bls.gov/bdm/entrepreneurship/entrepreneurship.htm

Of course, with no numbers, your results might look different. Though it is a bit difficult to graph non-data....

Speaking of which, if vanwadreamer was really sure their claims were accurate, then there wouldn't be any issue with showing the data that drives the thinking.

And we note that there doesn't seem to be any....

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 12:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal


For those who like German Cuisine have you tried, Edelweiss Sausage Co & Delicatessen? YUMMMMY!!

ELISI — February 21, 2013 at 12:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal


And speaking of lifeboats and greed as an analogy of overpopulation and greed, perhaps *In the Heart of the Sea: The Tragedy of the Whaleship Essex* offers up a better story; cooperation in an effort to maximize survivors.

True story; data.

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 12:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal


holycrapola — February 21, 2013 at 10:01 a.m.

In other words...an implosion of human existence due to self indulgence???

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 1:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal


timerick — February 21, 2013 at 12:27 p.m.

Oh, how I wish I'd know about the meeting yesterday. Maybe you can be my eyes and ears if you're attending. It would be greatly appreciated.

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 1:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal


a conversation from one of the lifeboats of the Essex-
"Matee, how's the captain"
"Not too bad, 'specially at medium rare."

mrd — February 21, 2013 at 1:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mrd — February 21, 2013 at 1:11 p.m.

By all available accounts, one person was killed for food. After something like 8 weeks at sea. They buried at sea a few before resorting to eating those who died of exposure, starvation, etc. One time they drew cards to execute one sailor. By all accounts, he accepted his lot.

And of course,we have holycrapola 's 'Nature, red in tooth and claw ' claim vs something that actually happened.

mr_basil_seal — February 21, 2013 at 1:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Basil...it is obvious you believe in scientific theory as it is presented...and I admire that about you in your posts.

A silly question by me...in scientific theory, do you believe in evolution?

If so, then you would also believe in the theory that our planet has evolved through centuries which also included periods of climate change as you have admitted in your comment at 10:13.

Human existence...in scientific theory...has evolved and so have the capabilities of humankind. Is this anthropogenic global climate change or is this a natural cause and effect of evolution of not only our planet and what is produced beneath the ground on the surface and in the air/atmosphere...but also of our own evolution which brings my comment in the direction of what holycrapola began at 8:58 am. Just as animals and plant life have evolved while others have disappeared with extinction, so could our planet and our existence. Is this a natural course of things to happen? Are we wasting our time trying to save that which cannot be saved...only prolonged as long as the world's population isn't working at 100% cooperation? And basil...does anybody know for sure - 100%, that we can save our planet or is it too late?

I question the methods of "greening up" our planet, although I find it important that *everybody* does their part to reduce our carbon footprint at least by 1/3rd or more (in my case, 1/2 by eliminating one vehicle and at least carpooling with one other person 100% of the time) much more effective in reduction of GHG than a couple of miles of track into Vancouver...but I'm wondering if that is enough. I reference the chart on the EPA GHG emissions link which shows transportation makes up only 27% of total GHG emissions. Even IF we eliminated fossil fuel energy in the transportation sector, there's still another 73% of GHG emissions to deal with. We could go all electric in transportation, but that too has implications of resources and generated energy to maintain and operate...and we'd still have that 73% to deal with.

http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/ghgemissions/sources.html

It is my opinion, that it is too little, too late and that now...more so than ever, the world population must come together to clean up the emissions in each country...but I don't believe it's going to happen. Do I believe in 100% mass transit? In a utopian sense, it would work but in our society of 9 to 5-ers who rely on their driving independence, no. In the case of people who have no choice but to transport their own equipment for jobs, no. In the case of companies moving their goods, no. In the case of commuters who must drive more than 10 miles to their destination away from light rail lines or to have to make multiple transfers, no.

It's just not in the numbers to show the improvement by increasing light rail just a couple of miles into an already congested community, thus increasing emission issues during peak hours.

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 2:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Goldie there is going to be a forum @ 7:00 pm on monday @ Skyview High School.It has seating for 900.They will have a panel of experts on light rail,congestion/traffic issues,money issues,current status of the CRC and how to communicate and work with elected officials.Believe me the people putting this on are not friends of the CRC.

timerick — February 21, 2013 at 4:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


timerick....this sounds interesting. Do you know if the audience will have a chance to speak up? Will there be any representatives of RTC, WSDOT, elected officials or CRC officials? Also...is there any official notice of this forum available?

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 4:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — February 21, 2013 at 6:16 a.m.

Wrong Mike. I meant the goofy guy from Portland that keeps making all the Vantucky comments. The guy that is either brain damaged or is playing a little game of talkin' real dumb so us hillbillies can understand him.

roger — February 21, 2013 at 5:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal


timerick — February 21, 2013 at 4:50 p.m.

Is this a one-time presentation, or do they plan on repeating over on the east side? And who exactly is putting this on, and who are the experts? I'm definitely interested, but can't see driving "way over there" just to hear people carrying on without a real plan. There has to be a solid leadership with focus; movements like Occupy are a waste of time.

roger — February 21, 2013 at 5:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hey, Jamie is having a meeting... TOMORROW Open to everyone and she's going to be there ***A WHOLE HOUR***

http://www.columbian.com/news/2013/fe...

hawkeye — February 21, 2013 at 6:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger- I'm thinking that DM has something to do with this. His girl Tiffany is one of the speakers.

http://www.columbian.com/news/2013/fe...

hawkeye — February 21, 2013 at 6:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**SNIT ALERT!!!! THIS POST CONTAINS WORDS FROM RUSH LIMBAUGH**

was browsing the 'net, when i came across this limbaugh piece. normally, i'd skip it, but the tag got me interested. posting two paragraphs from it.

like him or not, he's got a point.

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2013/02/21/for_the_first_time_in_my_life_i_am_ashamed_of_my_country

> We hear the most outrageous things.
> The government's gonna shut down. Life
> can't go on as we know it if we don't
> spend $22 billion this year. For 15 to
> 20 years, I have been behind this
> microphone, and I've actually been
> defending the accusation that
> Republicans want to starve children.
> It comes up -- predictably, regularly
> -- and for 15 or 20 years I have been trying to tell people in this country
> via this radio show, "No, the
> Republicans are not trying to starve
> children."
>
> The allegation itself ought to
> disqualify the people who make it,
> because it's patently absurd. There's
> nobody trying to starve anybody in
> terms of food, but particularly
> Republicans trying to starve children?
> Republicans trying to deny people
> health care? The Republicans want big
> business to be able to pollute the
> air? The Republicans want their
> children living in an economic and
> environmental sewer? It's an insult to
> my intelligence to have to even try to
> defend this to people.

DeeLittle — February 21, 2013 at 7:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger these people are very focused on what they are doing.And yes there will be political reps. there.Who I don't know.I doubt you will see Moeller but mayby.As far as the east side goes i am not sure of that either.This was the first time that I have attended one of the meetings.This has nothing to do with occupy.These people all have a vested interest in Vancouver.Some I have known for over thirty years.After my interview today in the C I think you know how to get ahold of me.Please feel free to do so.

timerick — February 21, 2013 at 7:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Yes Hawkeye she is supposed to speak,so are several others and it will be open for anyone to speak no matter what side they are on.This is to get true information out about the CRC.Something I feel we have been lacking.I guess it will be up to those that are there to believe what information is presented.It may take a open mind.At least that is what I am going to try to do.

timerick — February 21, 2013 at 8:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*talkin' real dumb so us hillbillies can understand him.
roger — February 21, 2013 at 5:40 p.m.*

RogerYouIgnorantVantuckian

there. that should feel the troll for a coupla weeks :)

DeeLittle — February 21, 2013 at 8:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal


OK, I now know why Debbie Peterson lost her election.

hawkeye — February 21, 2013 at 8:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Dee, take your pill and go to bed now.

hawkeye — February 21, 2013 at 8:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**hawk**

IF ONLY....

DeeLittle — February 21, 2013 at 8:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal


.After my interview today in the C I think you know how to get ahold of me.Please feel free to do so.

timerick — February 21, 2013 at 7:53 p.m.

timerick- Would you provide a link? Thanks

nailingit — February 21, 2013 at 9:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal


The CRC presentation at Skyview should be worth the drive. Hawkeye - Tiffany may have been paid by Madore to conduct her study, and she also tends to spend an inordinate amount of time focusing on seemingly mundane accounting details, but if you read her report there are things that she says that stand out. A primary one is the apparent lack of control over CRC financing - limits are set and routinely exceeded without a care in the world. And the number of companies involved is almost mind boggling - seems like every engineering firm in the area has a piece of the pie. Joe Cortright, of Impresa, is a well known economist who specializes in city design. He's the godfather of the Portland bicycling lanes craze. It's his analysis that says this project will cost closer to $10 billion when done. I just hope they limit the speakers to people like this - we've got a few conservative types in that area who tend to try to lead the conversation into the political realm. The best bet to stop this project is to continually hammer home the cost and the lack of hard numbers to support the claims of economic benefit.

roger — February 22, 2013 at 5:30 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Dee - Yep. I live in an area where, after 9/11, the primary mode of transportation seemed to be an old Toyota pickup, raised with over sized off road tires, flying an American flag that was as large as the truck. We in Bubbatown are quite content to have that Keep Portland Weird crowd think of us as hillbillies.

roger — February 22, 2013 at 6:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Creepy...

**Pope Benedict XVI Resigned Partly Because Of Powerful Vatican Gay Lobby, Italian Paper Claims**

Was the pope under the influence of a secretive "gay lobby" within the Vatican itself?

That's the claim put forth by Italian daily newspaper La Repubblica.

On Thursday, the popular paper published an article alleging that Pope Benedict XVI's decision to resign this month was partly prompted by a report that accused Vatican officials of being under the influence of several internal lobbies, reportedly including a gay one.

The Irish Times reports that Benedict commissioned the report after the Vatileaks scandal broke last year. The report, written by a trio of cardinals, concluded that "various lobbies within the Holy See were consistently breaking" the sixth and seventh commandments, "thou shalt not commit adultery" and "thou shalt not steal."

(The sixth commandment referencing adultery has historically been tied to the Catholic Church's doctrine banning homosexuality.)

The nearly 300-page dossier would be passed on to pope's successor, the report added.

Father Federico Lombardi, the Vatican spokesman, released an arguably vague statement about the accusations.

"Neither the cardinals' commission nor I will make comments to confirm or deny the things that are said about this matter," he said, according to the Guardian. "Let each one assume his or her own responsibilities. We shall not be following up on the observations that are made about this."

The Guardian also reported that a separate Italian daily, Corriere della Sera, mentioned a "disturbing" dossier in an article published soon after the pope's resignation announcement.

Scandalous revelations involving the Vatican and gay sex have been published by La Repubblica before. In 2010, the newspaper revealed wiretaps and police documents that showed a Vatican chorister and an elite papal usher had been involved with a gay prostitutes ring. Both men were dismissed from their duties, the Telegraph notes.

La Repubblica's allegations are only the latest in a string of theories relating to the pope's sudden departure, which has prompted rampant speculation.

Benedict himself has further confused matters with his Ash Wednesday homily, in which he referenced vague internal "divisions."

“I am thinking in particular of the sins against the unity of the church, of the divisions in the body of the church," Benedict said, according to the Washington Post.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/21/pope-benedict-resigned-vatican-gay-lobby-paper-claims_n_2735642.html

nailingit — February 22, 2013 at 7:24 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Next time Lou is on the public/private sector wage thingee, he ought to look at Congress. $107,000 per year pensions? Medical care? Years and years of freebies? And the congressman from Wa is still working as a "consultant". Wow. Next time I hear these guys refer to themselves as "public servants", I'll probably laugh or blow chips.

mrd — February 22, 2013 at 8:15 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*but in our society of 9 to 5-ers who rely on their driving independence,*

goldenoldie — February 21, 2013 at 2:24 p.m.

Ahhh, got it. Complain about the amount of resources to build the mass transit infrastructure but justify the continuing building of multi-ton, multi-hundred horsepower vehicles and the attendant roads, drilling for oil, etc so a single person can get to work and the grocery store.....

BTW, are you aware that China is instituting a carbon tax? So, between growth in wind and solar and 'social engineering', they are doing more for the environment than we can come up with.

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 8:38 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Buffett Buys More Solar But The Big News Is The Crowd Following Him**

The key to understand the story is that as soon as an opportunity was available for normal Californians and New Yorkers to buy a piece of a solar project and earn 4.5% returns they lapped it up, with $300,000 in debt being sourced from the crowd in 24 hours. The average was in the hundreds of dollars invested – “small is big” as one author says, who thinks the significance of successful solar crowdfunding may be biggest in the developing world. But for mom and pops in America, we want a better return than what the banks give us and solar is better in a number of ways – for our community and for our back pocket.

People want solar. People pay for solar assets. People make good money in solar.

That’s the solar story so far in 2013. Oh, and that little bit of news that China has just upp’ed their installation goals for this year to 10GW – 5x what it was 2 years ago. And India may more than double the global market this year as they look for ways to build a sane, non-fossil fuel dependent electricity supply for the masses of folk there who still don’t have electricity. More on that later. For now, shine on!

http://www.forbes.com/sites/dannykennedy/2013/01/14/buffet-buys-more-solar-but-the-big-news-is-the-crowd-following-him/

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 9:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Latest Polling Finds Strong Support For Clean Energy And Stricter Carbon Pollution Standards**
By Jeff Spross on Feb 21, 2013 at 3:56 pm

Evidence of a striking shift in public opinion has begun to crystalize over the last few months: Poll after poll is finding staunch majorities of Americans view global warming as a “serious problem” and that human activity is a major driving cause.
In defiance of received Beltway wisdom, voters even told a recent Yale poll that a candidate’s views on global warming will affect their vote, and that the issue should be a top priority for the President and the Congress. Majorities have even stated that when it comes to deficit reduction, they prefer a tax on carbon emissions to cuts in education, Social Security, Medicare, or environmental protection.
Yesterday, Pew Research released new poll research that re-confirms the trend. When asked to choose between developing “alternative sources such as wind, solar and hydrogen” and expanding “exploration and production of oil, coal and natural” gas as their preferred priority for addressing America’s energy needs, 54 percent of Americans went with alternative energy. Only 34 percent chose continued prioritization of fossil fuels. That’s a drop from the 63 percent high in 2011, but an uptick over the 52 percent response last year.
Furthermore, Independents and Democrats were largely in concert, preferring alternative energy sources by 64 and 59 percent, respectively. Only 33 percent of Republicans went with solar and wind, in contrast to the 54 percent who preferred expanded fossil fuel use. But the distance between the two positions within the Republican group was smaller than the distance in the other two collections of voters.
And that wasn’t all. 62 percent of overall voters favored “setting stricter emission limits on power plants to address climate change,...”

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2013/02/21/1623531/latest-polling-finds-strong-support-for-clean-energy-and-stricter-carbon-pollution-standards/

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 9:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**GOP activists behind three troubling Supreme Court cases**

*America's highest court will be debating and deciding on the possibility of dismantling decades of progressive law*

Three troubling U.S. Supreme Court cases — one that has already undermined public participation in elections and two new ones threatening to further tilt the balance toward wealthier and whiter slices of society—have all been brought by Republican activists who want to change the rules to benefit their shrinking political party.

On Tuesday, the Supreme Court agreed to hear a campaign finance case in which a wealthy Alabama Republican sued because he wanted to give more money than federal law allows in two-year election cycles. Shaun McCutcheon, the businessman-activist, joined by the Republican National Committee, challenged the $46,200 limit on donations to candidates and their committees, and $70,800 donation limit to other political committees. Less than 1 percent of Americans give this much to campaigns.

Next week, in another lawsuit originating with activist Republicans, Shelby County v. Holder, the Supreme Court will hear a case on whether the heart of the federal 1965 Voting Rights Act, Section 5, is outdated and should be overturned. That section lets the Justice Department veto changes in election laws in 16 states that have had histories of race-based discrimination in elections. The VRA was used in 2012 to block GOP-backed voter ID laws in several states, as well as to overturn GOP-drawn legislative districts in Texas that diluted the possibility of electing Latinos to Congress. Republicans argue that racism in elections is a thing of the past. However, dozens of briefs filed by liberals argue that is not the case.

..

The Republican Party may be in disarry and fighting among themselves—such as the Tea Party faction accusing and backtracking from calling Karl Rove a Nazi—and it may be increasingly unpopular among young voters and communities of color. But when it comes to targeting the rules that dictate who can participate in and influence American elections, it has been successful in bringing cases to the Supreme Court that have and can continue to further unbalance participation in American elections. The Republican Party may be declining, but it is not going quietly into the night.

Read more @ http://www.salon.com/2013/02/22/gop_activists_behind_troubling_new_supreme_court_cases_partner/

nailingit — February 22, 2013 at 9:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Investigation Finds High-Class, Crisis-Peddling 'Astroturf Supergroup' Behind 'Fix the Debt' Campaign**
New investigative project looks to expose deficit debate subterfuge pushed by Pete Peterson, Erskine Bowles and Alan Simpson

Jon Queally, staff writer

A new online resource launched on Thursday aims to show that behind the scenes of the ongoing fiscal battles in Washington—including the current fight over 'sequestration'—a billionaire-funded and CEO-backed media campaign is operating as an 'astroturf supergroup,' using its outsized pocketbook and influence to peddle long-discredited policy prescriptions for the ailing economy.

According to a new joint investigative project between the Center for Media and Democracy and The Nation magazine, the 'Fix The Debt' campaign—which launched itself last year in the midst of an earlier episode in the "fiscal crisis charades" that have plagued Washington since the Republicans regained control of the House of Representatives in 2010— is "one of the most hypocritical corporate PR campaigns" created in Washington in decades.

This group is comprised of an all-too familiar chorus of people—culled from a cadre of politicians and wealthy elites—who spend their days voicing the mantra of 'deficit reduction' and 'entitlement reform' as a way to liberate the federal budget from debt and kick start the economy with promises of jobs and growth.

And according to the new investigation—in addition to being wrong most of the time—the members of the group share two other common bonds. Wealth and corporate power.

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2013/02/21-6

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 9:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal


An excellent read in Willamette Week concerning funding for the CRC from an Oregon perspective. The tolling study is based on vehicle counts that are woefully off, yet both states are rushing toward committing to the project without knowing whether the loans and bonds can be paid as planned. And the $400 million the Feds are supposed to commit for the bridge itself doesn't exist. (Not mentioned is that we also have no guarantee for the $800 million New Starts money for LRT.)

http://www.wweek.com/portland/article-20291-making_it_up_as_they_go.html

roger — February 22, 2013 at 10:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal

With as outspoken as you are on the subject of climate change, I would like to ask you a question based on general observation, you might not fit into this category but it seems that many do.

Why is that so many people who share your view on climate change also feel we should add to the carbon problem by paving as much of the earth as possible?

frobert — February 22, 2013 at 10:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 22, 2013 at 10:06 a.m.

???????

No documentation?

That's sorta like the RL rant posted by Dee; if he really had a case, he'd post a list of rw legislation that shows the opposite ....

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 10:30 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 10:30 a.m.

That is why I said "general observation" you might want to look up the definition.

You might want to look up "opinion" while you are at it.

frobert — February 22, 2013 at 10:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Got it. Unsupported "opinion", "general observation"

Generally, one would form some hypothesis after some 'observation' and analysis...

But, it seems that the tenor of the discussion would be more akin to just making up some stuff about Libertarianism and then ask you why...

Maybe you are just working your way through nizkor.org/?

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 10:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal


The democrats are proposing a huge tax increase that includes an awful lot of additional pavement. If they are serious about climate change, why are they proposing increasing the amount of area that is paved? A good start would be to stop paving strictly residential side streets, that the government never should have paved in the first place. Before you jump in and say it is for State highway system, read it, it includes huge amounts of money for local paving.

frobert — February 22, 2013 at 10:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal


| sarc on |
Thanks for the continuing to not source your "general observation" and "opinion"

|sarc off |

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:08 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Want to take a break from politics tomorrow? Come out and join me and my neighbors and Friends of Trees for the largest Vancouver planting ever!

Truly, if you have not ever done this, it is like an old-fashioned barn raising where the community comes together for most of the day in cooperation, good will and fun. There is delicious potluck food (breakfast and lunch)and a chance to make a difference in the urban forestry canopy.

Check it out:

http://friendsoftrees.org/blog/2013/02/14/get-ready-to-get-greener-vancouver/

manthou — February 22, 2013 at 11:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:08 a.m.

The proposed highway bill is not a source?

frobert — February 22, 2013 at 11:14 a.m. ( | suggest removal


IF you have a cogent observation, perhaps actually making a coherent statement with some supporting detail would be in order.

What, specifically, is "awful lot of additional pavement" supposed to mean?

Is the proportion of money going to mass transit out of line with the money going to "awful lot of additional pavement"?

| sarc on |

Thanks for the continuing to not source your "general observation" and "opinion"

|sarc off |

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal


"stop paving strictly residential side streets"

??????????????????

Why, because you don't drive there?

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal



*Why is that so many people who share your view on climate change also feel we should add to the carbon problem by paving as much of the earth as possible?*

You have a source for that "general observation"?

Or just forgot to check nizkor.org ?

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:23 a.m.

I'm not surprised that when asked for your honest opinion on a subject, you have none to give and respond with an ad hominem fallacy‎.

frobert — February 22, 2013 at 11:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:32 a.m.

"Why, because you don't drive there?"

Because paving them does not add to the "greater good", it only serves to enhance property values for upscale neighborhoods and spread the cost to the lower income areas. A drive around Vancouver would show you that working class neighborhoods get little if any road maintenance, so this policy would not effect them much, other than reducing their money being "redistributed" to the more affluent.

Additionally, we are constantly paving residential streets and than adding "speed bumps" to simulate the effects of not paving the road in the first place.

frobert — February 22, 2013 at 11:49 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Ah.....

A vague, politically charged statement comprising of multiple logical fallacies...

A vague, politically charged statement that the OP fails to back up with a single piece of data.....

And then a whinging on with more logical fallacies.

Got it.

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:51 a.m.

I asked your honest opinion, therefore I made no argument, therefore I could not have a logical fallacy.

frobert — February 22, 2013 at 11:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal


And, perhaps instead of starting a new argument, you could address the issues with [your last attempt at discourse.][1]

[1]: http://www.columbian.com/news/2013/feb/18/open-forum-feb-18-24/#c219309

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 22, 2013 at 11:49 a.m.

No data. No map.

Just another "general observation"

Got it.

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 11:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou-

I live on the west side and when pulling out onto streets there are sevral trees that either need to be taken out or trimmed up quite a bit. I wonder if this group ever looks these types of issues? I don't know if you have driven up and down 39th St since they "Beautified " it but they really screwed it up in my opinion... They put those bump outs in which has made it a very winding road.. I've seen a few more fender benders since the change...Planting the right trees in the right area is a good thing...

vanwadreamer — February 22, 2013 at 12:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*BTW, are you aware that China is instituting a carbon tax? So, between growth in wind and solar and 'social engineering', they are doing more for the environment than we can come up with.*

*mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 8:38 a.m.*

So what improvements are they doing with regards to coal pollution, Basil???

BTW, are you aware of just what a carbon tax is, Basil??? Maybe you need to read the information on this link:

http://www.carbontax.org/

What's so different with a carbon tax and a tax dollar subsidy you were complainin' about??? As they said on the link...it's ***tax shifting***. And that comes straight from the horse's mouth.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 12:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Complain about the amount of resources to build the mass transit infrastructure but justify the continuing building of multi-ton, multi-hundred horsepower vehicles and the attendant roads, drilling for oil, etc so a single person can get to work and the grocery store.....*

*mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 8:38 a.m.*

Are you serious??? Do you even know how ridiculous you sound??? In order to build the "mass transit infrastructure of what...say a total of maybe 4 miles of light rail (round trip) which includes an entire needless bottom deck of a bridge as well as compensating for the incline and decline of the bottom decks and the distance needed which includes multiple structural bases, support structures, materials mined, processed AND transported, equipment developed etcetera, etcetera...let alone the fact that these current LRT's utilize diesel in their propulsion systems...in order to accommodate the light rail??? The initial impact of this construction which would last 10-14 years, pouring additional GHG into the atmosphere, not just in the immediate area but also in the regions where the mining is done, the processing of the products needed in order to construct, the transport of those products with the *multi-ton, multi-hundred horsepower vehicles* as you referenced...in order to accommodate a minimal number of commuters who would elect to ride MAX as well as the pockets of those with vested interests???

Come on man...whatever it is you're smokin', it's foggin' yer brain!

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal


WOW, Basil, I guess I live in an "affluent" neighborhood since the street I live on is PAVED! Sadly we don't have sidewalks but then again, nobody really walks around here.

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 1:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**Time for change: China flags peak in coal usage**


John Garnaut

"China’s decade-long boom in coal-driven heavy industry is about to end as the leadership shifts priorities towards energy conservation, say officials and policy advisers.
The advisers predict China’s coal consumption will peak at only a fraction above current levels after the State Council, or cabinet, last week set an ambitious new total energy use target for the five-year plan ending 2015.
“Coal consumption will peak below 4 billion tonnes,” Jiang Kejun, who led the modelling team that advised the State Council on energy use scenarios, told Fairfax Media.
“It’s time to make change,” said Dr Jiang, who is director of the Energy Research Institute under the National Development and Reform Commission (NDRC). “There’s no market for further development of energy-intensive industry.”
Advertisement
The imminent stabilisation of coal usage, if broadly achieved, would mark a stunning turn-around for a nation that is estimated to have burned 3.9 billion tonnes last year, which is nearly as much as the rest of the world combined."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/carbon-economy/time-for-change-china-flags-peak-in-coal-usage-20130206-2dxrv.html

**China’s Strong Renewable Energy Growth Continues**
January 7, 2013 Joshua S Hill


In good news for planet Earth, and news that should conversely kick us Western nations up the proverbial, China has again stretched its renewable energy installed capacity, increasing its wind energy capacity up to 56,000 megawatts at the end of October 2012, and increasing its hydro power capacity to 206,000 megawatts.

China’s renewable energy capacity installation growth has been impressive, and even more so when you consider that its growth has been higher than the global average.
The global average growth of wind energy capacity over the past decade was only 25% while China’s wind energy capacity rose at an annual average growth of 60%.

http://cleantechnica.com/2013/01/07/china-increases-overall-renewable-energy-capacity

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Just remember this, Basil...the number one reason for the Columbia River Crossing Project is not to incorporate light rail. Here's the quote from the FHWA website I've referenced below:

"The projects proposed in the application offer the opportunity for *moderate congestion reduction and mobility improvements*. The CRBC offers the opportunity for significant congestion reduction and mobility improvements within the Portland, OR and Vancouver, WA metropolitan area."

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/pressroom/fsi5.cfm

So my fellow forum dweller, keep the real reason for the crossing in perspective. There are other viable alternatives...energy-efficient alternatives proven to reduce GHG emissions that are well worth the time to review before it's too late.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Come on man...whatever it is you're smokin', it's foggin' yer brain!

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:01 p.m

Glad to see you STILL won't bring the numbers to support your claims. Or are they just like frobert's "opinion" and "general observations" and thus -according to frobert - not needed to be supported?

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**China's state media finally admits to air pollution crisis**

BEIJING -- If you have been following China’s state-controlled news media you could be forgiven for thinking that clear blue skies -- not oppressive and choking smog -- have been the rule this winter.

But, finally, they seem to have noticed there is a problem.

Days after huge smog clouds settled on some of China’s most important cities, The People's Daily ran two articles on the pollution crisis Monday.

And while one headline declared that “Beautiful China begins to breathe healthily,” the article itself detailed the extent of the problems.

**Visibly high levels of air pollution were probably behind the admissions that the smog -- dubbed “fog” by many -- had reached dangerous levels.
On Monday, air pollution reached "critical levels" in 67 of China's cities, CCTV reported.**

http://behindthewall.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/01/15/16523268-chinas-state-media-finally-admits-to-air-pollution-crisis?lite

Oh my, China is cleaning up their pollution problem...LOL, yeah, riiiiiiiiiiiiight....

ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 1:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 1:03 p.m.

Wow! So are ours. We even have storm water drains!

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:13 p.m

"According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, China is using nearly as much coal to support its economic and population growth as the rest of the world combined. With its demand already accounting for 47 percent of global consumption, the country is expected to dominate the coal market in 2013 as it continues to rely on the fossil fuel for **70 percent** of its energy generation."

http://www.energyxxi.org/china-coal-consumption-rising

Their intent is to cap coal energy usage...not reduce it, Basil. As long as there's a market for coal for China, that 70% isn't going to be reduced...and those *multi-ton, multi-hundred horsepower vehicles* as you referenced which BTW, we can add coal trains to the list...will continue to pound GHG into the air.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**Choking on Growth: China's Environmental Crisis**

A series of articles and multimedia examining the human toll, global impact and political challenge of China’s epic pollution crisis.

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/international/countriesandterritories/china/environment/index.html

ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 1:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 1:23 p.m.

Yup, one reason they are instituting a carbon tax.

Reality based, best practices.

And don't forget that much of their industry is driven by exports.

And that our industry outsources....... to save money, increase profit, and avoid environmental control.

Now, what are WE doing?

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal



mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:20 p.m.

Seems to me you've forgotten to answer this request by me, so here it is presented to you once again:

"...how would increasing taxpayer dollars in order to maintain and operate a rigid rail system...riddled with financial/mechanical/safety issues...to a dead end, 1-1/2 miles north of the Columbia River be considered an improvement to our overall transit system here in Clark County? Would it serve the needs of enough of the Clark County citizens to be considered a money-worthy cause??? Just saying it's an improvement doesn't mean it is. I want to see data which supports that extension - LOCAL data which correlates the difference with regards to construction and maintenance, energy costs, energy efficiency, safety improvements and time saved with the extension of LRT to Clark College as opposed to bus rapid transit. Please explain how it's an improvement, given the questions I have presented."

goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 11:26 a.m.

-and this-
goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:52 p.m.
-and this-
goldenoldie — February 19, 2013 at 12:57 p.m.

Yet, all I'm getting is consistent rambling dialog from you about how climate change is increasing due to global issues...something we are all aware of. Global issues which need immediate change are those like in China (and the regions of the US still using coal as an energy source including Oregon). Global issues such as rainforest destruction, increased roadways and developments which still remain empty, just to name a few...not 2-4 miles of light rail into Vancouver to suit the needs of special interests.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:24 p.m.

Hey, you guys really are fancy, mine just runs into the ditch then out into a field.

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 1:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:39 p.m.

A generalized average...not 100% accurate, given the fact that there are many of us in the US who are already consistently utilizing drastic energy reduction in our homes and methods of transportation.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal


-continued from 1:44 pm-

I also won't get into the issues of pesticide/herbicide spraying and what it is doing to our ecosystem and atmosphere. I also won't get into the issues of strip mining and what impact it has on our atmosphere, even though the strip mines here in North America must be returned to a natural habitat...but the damage was already done.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


***I wonder if they will OK gay, next?***

LONDON (AP) — Roman Catholic priests should be allowed to marry and have children, Britain's most senior Catholic cleric said Friday.

Cardinal Keith O'Brien, who heads the Roman Catholic Church in Scotland, said the requirement for priestly celibacy is "not of divine origin" and could be reconsidered.

He told BBC Scotland that "the celibacy of the clergy, whether priests should marry — Jesus didn't say that."

He said that "many priests have found it very difficult to cope with celibacy," and while he had never considered marriage himself, "I would be very happy if others had the opportunity of considering whether or not they could or should get married."

http://news.yahoo.com/cardinal-married-catholic-priests-possibility-172115510.html

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 1:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Yup, one reason they are instituting a carbon tax.

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:28 p.m.

Yup! More taxes. That's what everyone needs everywhere...more taxes which means more people needing to work to pay those gosh darned increased taxes which means more drivers on the road which means more GHG emissions which means more emissions taxes which means....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-y_1Tm...

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hey, you guys really are fancy, mine just runs into the ditch then out into a field.

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 1:45 p.m.

I'd rather have my rainwater run into rain barrels for this summer's watering needs.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 2 p.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 1:44 p.m.

Mass transit, in general, offers a more efficient use of energy, space, and natural resources in moving people. You are attempting to equate one project of a small size and imply that it isn't enough to make a difference in a much broader context.

And we are still waiting for your evidence that building and running multi-ton multi-hundred horsepower vehicles to move one person to work and back is a more efficient method.

Your argument basically is that we already have roads so we should just continue using them as we are.

But the real issue is that that mode of transportation is producing a big chunk of the giga tons of carbon we are putting into the atmosphere. Reducing that chunk is one part of the projects needed to keep us back from several tipping points.

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 2:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal


heck, I ain't got paved rowds and thar ain't no sidewalks for milz. Wut is one of them thar storm dranes anehow? We's do hav a rane barrl tho.

mrd — February 22, 2013 at 2:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mrd — February 22, 2013 at 2:23 p.m.

Hay!, duz u go owt an tak a baff in them rane barrlz? how doz u git thm hot? duz u blo dri, lik stan in th wind?

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 2:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwa: 12:43 PM: Those "traffic calming" devices on 39th and 33rd and Columbia were installed by the city at neighborhood association grant requests in an attempt to discourage speeding. You won't be seeing any more of them for quite some time since the city has abandoned that program due to lack of funds.

Trees and vegetation are not supposed to block vehicle views for safe entry into intersections. I think there is a place on Vancouver's Code Compliance website that allows you to enter a complaint about that online.

You can always call the Urban Forestry Department, too, for any street tree questions. Even though parking strips are part of city easement, like sidewalks, the owner whose property is next to them gets the privilege of taking care of maintenance and replacement. I have noticed that many homeowners, maybe in a display of civil disobedience, have commandeered those parking strips for their own urban gardens or compost bins. No one is complaining about it in my neck of the woods. In Seattle, there is a real stink about it, though. :)

manthou — February 22, 2013 at 2:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou-
I know the city got a 400- or 600K grant to change and re pave 39th ST.." BeautifY" I spoke with the head of maintenence and repair for city roads, very nice guy and he pointed me that way but nothing has been done....Those Occupy Parking Strip folks can be downright thrifty...

vanwadreamer — February 22, 2013 at 3:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 1:28 p.m

Hmm not one of the links I went to when I Googled "China and pollution 2013" say a word about carbon tax.

Polluted cities so bad they call them cancer cities, smog so bad it can be seen in space????????????

Carbon tax isn't going to help them.

ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 3:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Oh and why should WE pay carbon tax when the last report showed we were at our lowest in 20 years????????????????

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/20/china-carbon-tax_n_2727156.html?utm_hp_ref=business

ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 3:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal



ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 3:23 p.m.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ene_usa_per_per-energy-usage-per-person

(I see you did wind up finding one source...)

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 3:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal


It's been a really quiet day on the FB side. I think Lou finally ran out of "DM" stories or he's giving everybody a break. Really nice for a change.

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 4:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawk-
don't gotta wash up in them barrels no moor-we's got indoor plumbin nowadays, have had for nigh on a yeer. Isa thinkun bout gitin us a honeybucket portathingamajigger-a prety blu one. The outhouse is lookin kinda shi-oops-poorly.

mrd — February 22, 2013 at 4:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 2:19 p.m.

Again, you failed to provide answers to my request for which I repeated @1:44pm. And why is that, Basil???

Also...regarding your request @2:19 pm...I'd sure love to be present when you tell one of the drivers of those "multi-ton multi-hundred horsepower vehicles" that they'd have to switch to taking light rail. Chances are...if they're driving let's say...a 350, a 3500 (or other brand of HD trucks), and would have to change over, they'd choose one of the new up and coming plug-in hybrids rather than ride the worthless choo choo. Bet ya didn't know that even the big rigs are a changin', did ya!!! And don't ask me to share links on that one. Can't break the rules of the forum in advertising brands without permission. You'll just have to check it out yourself, Basil.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 4:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Just did a test run on TriMet's trip planner. In order for a passenger to travel from Jantzen Beach to a location in Milwaukie for example...the passenger's boss requires them to be present at work at 7:00 am, they'd be cutting it close if they caught mass transit at 5:45 am...on a problem-free day. They'd arrive 5 minutes before clock in time at the final bus stop but still have to walk about a mile.

The same person on any given day can take their personal vehicle from Jantzen Beach and arrive at work by 6:15...no problem...and still grab a cuppa java and a snack before clocking in.

So what's the incentive to ride mass transit, here???

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 5:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*that they'd have to switch to taking light rail. Chances are...if they're driving let's say...a 350, a 3500 (or other brand of HD trucks), and would have to change over, they'd choose one of the new up and coming plug-in hybrids rather than ride the worthless choo choo.*

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 4:55 p.m.

Got it. 'We got roads and big carz and we aint changun and thatz y we dont need a choo choo'.....

Except a diminishing amount of Inhofe style yahoos, the world does know we need to change and the world is working on it.

Now, maybe you should be asking why Ford, Mitsubishi, GMC, Chevy, Dodge, are developing or producing hybrid trucks.

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 5:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hehehe...not one of TriMet's trip planner included MAX, either.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 5:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal



Now, maybe you should be asking why Ford, Mitsubishi, GMC, Chevy, Dodge, are developing or producing hybrid trucks.

mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 5:23 p.m.

Nope! Don't have to ask why, Basil. My thoughts...Number One - they recognize the importance of transportation independence versus being forced onto mass transit. Number Two - they too recognize the issues of burning fossil fuels and our climate. Number Three - they're receiving incentives to study and develop such products.

And Number Four - Profit.

Still can't figure why you think just because I don't agree with the highly expensive MAX track extension into Vancouver means I don't believe in us all doing our part to reduce our carbon footprint. We can all reduce our carbon footprint simply by carpooling, changing the way we utilize our vehicles, our home energy needs, landscaping/gardening, smart shopping and so much more.

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 5:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hmm...

Holycrapola, this one's for you in response to your comment on February 21, 2013 at 10:01 a.m. Seems to me, Big Brother's already working on it:

http://www.usaid.gov/news-information/videos/pressures-planet-major-trends-climate-change-food-security-and-population

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 5:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


holyc...here's another one which is on a broader global scale:

http://www.iwla.org/index.php?ht=a/GetDocumentAction/i/1813

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 5:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Oh my I am SO LOLing here...you of ALL people THE VERY ONE that told me to have and I quote "a credible source" and you call these 2 "credible"?????? Oh my goodness...creditability...shaking my head as I laugh..

*http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/02/22/chinas-new-carbon-tax-and-the-crumbling-case-fo/192768
http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2013/02/20/china-to-tax-carbon-emissions/
mr_basil_seal — February 22, 2013 at 3:53 p.m*

ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 6:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


***FYI part 1***

Lately the news out of Washington has been dominated by “the sequester” or “sequestration.” Yet polling shows most voters don’t even know what the term means.

Sequester means to remove or withdraw. It’s most commonly used in our court system when a jury is sequestered during a highly publicized trail.

In this case, the adapted term refers to a package of automatic spending cuts that will take effect on March 1st -- if Congress and President Barack Obama can’t reach a better deal. The government will actually take back, or remove, some of the funds Congress has released.

Sequestration was part of the 2011 Budget Control Act Congress passed to stave off potential default on the federal debt. The cuts from the sequester – evenly split between defense spending and discretionary domestic spending -- would total $1.2 trillion over the next ten years.

Federal programs like, Social Security, Medicaid, Pell grants and veterans' benefits are exempt from the cuts. Spending on wars will also be spared, but many other Defense Department programs would face the axe.

The across-the-board cuts were intended to force compromise between Democrats and Republicans. Unfortunately there are few signs of progress on a broader deal. President Obama has asked Congress to pass a short-term package to postpone the March 1st deadline. But Republicans are pushing back and say they’ll allow it to be triggered if federal spending and tax reforms aren’t included.

Which brings us to today’s Just Explain It.

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 10:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal


***Part 2***

How does sequestration impact federal spending? What departments will see cuts? And what’s the impact to the economy and specific industries?

According to the White House Office of Management and Budget, here’s what will happen if there is no resolution.

Law enforcement agencies, like the FBI and Border Patrol, would lose over 1,000 agents. At the same time, the automatic cuts will trim the Department of Defense budget about $500 billion over the next ten years.

Funds for education programs like Title One, special education and Head Start would take a big hit. Over 31,000 teachers and teachers’ aides could be laid off.

$1 billion would be cut from FEMA’s (Federal Emergency Management Agency) budget. Some of that money is earmarked for first responders who react to natural disasters like Hurricane Sandy.

Furloughs at the U.S. Department of Agriculture would lead to fewer inspections at food processing plants. The department would also have to drop about 600,000 women and children from its WIC (Women, Infants and Children) supplemental nutrition program. 1,600 jobs connected to the program could be at risk too.

Up to $540 million in loan guarantees to small businesses would be reduced.

Emergency Unemployment Compensation benefits would be decreased by up to 9.4%. And if the proposed cuts take effect, the Congressional Budget Office estimates 1.4 million jobs will be lost.

Parts of the economy are already showing signs of a slowdown due to uncertainty over the spending cuts. The Gross Domestic Product declined 1.3% in the fourth quarter last year. Some economists say that’s because defense spending dropped by an annual rate of over 22% that same quarter.

Sequestration is a mechanism used to reduce federal spending across the board. There’s a lot at stake and both sides need to come together to avoid the consequences of the proposed cuts.

hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 10:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal



ELISI — February 22, 2013 at 6:28 p.m.

IF you find any inaccuracies in those two reports, show us.

Otherwise, join frobert at nitzor.org.

Remember, you said you couldn't find ANYTHING, I just pointed it out that the story is covered from right to left.

mr_basil_seal — February 23, 2013 at 6:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*We can all reduce our carbon footprint simply by carpooling, changing the way we utilize our vehicles, our home energy needs, landscaping/gardening, smart shopping and so much more.*

goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 5:35 p.m.

All good strategies. But not enough. We still are a large contributer of the CO2 that is the root cause:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ene_usa_per_per-energy-usage-per-person

And though it is 'only a couple of miles of choo choo' it is a part of the solution. Just as is some of the efforts you are doing.

But there is still:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ene_usa_per_per-energy-usage-per-person

mr_basil_seal — February 23, 2013 at 7:19 a.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 10:41 p.m.

When you copy paste it is proper to cite your source.

frobert — February 23, 2013 at 7:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrnRU3...

**John McCain Shoots Down Obama Impeachment Question At Town Hall**

Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) defended President Barack Obama at a Phoenix town hall Wednesday when a constituent asked him why Congress had not impeached the president.

"I do not believe that the President has committed impeachable offenses -- that's high crimes," McCain said in response to a woman named Angelica. While McCain received scattered applause for his answer, Angelica received significantly more cheers from the audience for her question.

"But I would remind you, and I hate to remind you, I really dislike reminding you -- the president just was reelected by a majority of the American people," he added.

It was a strangely familiar position for McCain, who, during the 2008 presidential election, famously defended then-candidate Obama at a town hall when a questioner said the Democratic candidate was "an Arab."

Over four years later, McCain is still dealing with conspiracy theories. One of the last people to ask McCain a question on Wednesday asserted that Obama won elections "because of voter fraud."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/22/john-mccain-obama-impeachment_n_2743869.html

nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 7:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 7:34 a.m.

Because assassination of citizens and their minor children is not a "high crime"?

frobert — February 23, 2013 at 8:11 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — February 22, 2013 at 5:18 p.m.

You may or may not recall pdxtech91 and I discussed this timeliness problem with using mass trans a year or so back. There are several thousands of Washingtonians who work in the area of PDX, yet public transportation does nothing to support them. First, C-Tran's only buses to that side are to Parkrose, and run from Fishers Landing. The other alternative is to go down the I5 corridor taking two LRT lines or the Yellow and a bus - about an hour. And to support the Red line, there is no bus service in the PDX area to transfer to - most will have to walk a mile or two when done riding. Which is why the streets in the area are crowded with WA tagged cars - and the Red line run from Gateway north rarely has more than 5-10 people on it. Even during the heaviest traffic, the commute is usually faster by car.

Looking at MAX ridership for the past year, three of the four lines are losing riders. (The Blue line is the only one staying up there.) The Yellow line is dropping most of all of them - could they maintain this line without the plan to extend it to Vancouver? TriMet says these drops are due to ticket enforcement and eliminating the Free Zone. Whatever. TriMet is currently saddled with about $1 billion in debt and operating with an annual deficit in the range of $20 million. And when the bill soars due to their Orange line project, they will be hurting. Their proposed fix? Reduce bus service by 70% over the next 10 years, unless the union agrees to massive reductions in pensions and health care. However, there's no consideration being given to curtailing their LRT expansion, which is the single largest contributor to their fiscal problems.

And all of this is why I consider LRT expansion to Vancouver to be such a bad idea. The main groups of commuters it could benefit are those who work in downtown Portland, and those in Beaverton/Hillsboro where bus service still complements LRT use. Most of us will continue to find this system useless - and numbers will grow when they cut more of the supporting bus routes.

roger — February 23, 2013 at 8:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 23, 2013 at 7:34 a.m

I know it's hard for you, fro. If it isn't spelled out completely in easy words and all together, you have difficulty (that means a hard time) understanding. There were three parts to my post- part 1, part 2, and where it came from. I wasn't sure I would get to post them if it was all together and I accidently hit the button before I included the link. You should have been able to put them all together in your mind but if you couldn't, I'm really sorry.

Did anybody else have a problem putting it together?

hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 9:04 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*And though it is 'only a couple of miles of choo choo' it is a part of the solution. Just as is some of the efforts you are doing.*

mr_basil_seal — February 23, 2013 at 7:19 a.m.

I understand what you are saying, Basil...but whatever is done to reduce the carbon footprint, it shouldn't have a negative effect before the fact, and in the case of a light rail extension(which was my point from the get go) to Vancouver which doesn't have future plans of expansion in Clark County, and the costs incurred as well as GHG numbers inevitably increasing due to development and construction, you have to ask yourself...is this the best choice of reduction of carbon emissions with cost effectiveness as opposed to the actual improvement of GHG to our county??? Should we really consider such an extension, knowing the negative effect it will have on downtown businesses, the commuters and taxpayers during construction? It's definitely a catch-22 which I believe there really is no perfect solution. There will still be a greenhouse gas effect whether we extend the light rail or if we don't. Unless data has been collected in regions as small as from Delta Park to Clark College, it's merely an educated guess.

goldenoldie — February 23, 2013 at 9:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal


mr_basil_seal — February 23, 2013 at 6:56 a.m

Shaking my head...Basil, Basil, come on guy..
Over and over you and others have stated that Fox news isn't accurate, and media matters (LOL) is owned by a power that be that came within a thread of totally bankrupting England, put 100's of thousands into dem's campaigns and you say that media matters is accurate? (MM is kind of one sided there don't you think) LOLOLOL

Oh but wait, as long as it feeds what you want to hear, read for the your side they are accurate, right?

ELISI — February 23, 2013 at 9:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — February 23, 2013 at 8:20 a.m.

Very well presented, Roger...and I am in agreement with you.

..

holyc...thanks for acknowledging, although I already had a feeling you'd known about what was on the links I'd shared. BTW...nice selection of songs. I'll be thinkin' of the Freedom Song all day, now.

goldenoldie — February 23, 2013 at 9:44 a.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 7:34 a.m.

Because assassination of citizens and their minor children is not a "high crime"?

frobert — February 23, 2013 at 8:11 a.m.

Just so we are clear.

Noun 1. logical fallacy - a fallacy in logical argumentation
fallacy, false belief - a misconception resulting from incorrect reasoning

hysteron proteron - the logical fallacy of using as a true premise a proposition that is yet to be proved

ignoratio elenchi - the logical fallacy of supposing that an argument proving an irrelevant point has proved the point at issue

petitio, petitio principii - the logical fallacy of assuming the conclusion in the premises; begging the question

post hoc, post hoc ergo propter hoc - the logical fallacy of believing that temporal succession implies a causal relation

.

Your.. logic .. would include how many presidents?

You folks who refused to hold Bush accountable and still don't to this day, yet make statements like this are kinda amusing.

Partisanship at it's worst.

nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 10:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal


...and right wing senators bought into it. Moments like these make it easy to understand Iraq.

Believe anything, digest anything, and promote anything as long as it fits your mindset.

This republican circus around the Hagel nomination, historians will have America hanging her head with this one.

**Media Scandal Surrounding a Fake News Story Epitomizes the Sorry State Of Journalism Today**

On February 7, Ben Shapiro, a contributor to conservative media outlet Breitbart.com, published an incendiary story linking President Obama's secretary of defense nominee, Chuck Hagel, to an organization known as "Friends of Hamas." The story elicited predictably fervid responses from various conservative pundits and politicians, including Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) and former Arkansas Republican Gov. Mike Huckabee, both of whom relied on the article's allegations in their own interviews. Famously conservative sources RedState.org and the National Review also pursued the story. The assertions complicated the already messy nomination process, especially considering the Hagel anti-Israel narrative pushed by such conservatives as Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.).

There's just one problem: Friends of Hamas doesn't even exist.

Apparently, Daily News reporter Dan Friedman wrote that he was interested in knowing the groups that paid Hagel for speaking tours and concocted the exaggeratedly-named Friends of Hamas as a hypothetical group. However, Breitbart.com, without expending even minimal fact-checking resources, perpetuated the false link between Hagel and the nonexistent terror group. Friedman later wrote: "The names were so over-the-top, so linked to terrorism in the Middle East, that it was clear I was talking hypothetically and hyperbolically. No one could take seriously the idea that organizations with those names existed — let alone that a former senator would speak to them."

But even as it has come to light that Friends of Hamas does not exist, Breitbart.com continues to claim the story was accurate and criticize the ostensibly liberal mainstream media for failing to pursue full disclosure — which probably won't do much to endear it to its ample skeptics.

Read more @ http://www.policymic.com/articles/27168/breitbart-friends-of-hamas-controversy-epitomizes-the-sorry-state-of-journalism-today

nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 10:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal


The old face, yet the new darling of today's Republican party.

**IS SENATOR TED CRUZ OUR NEW MCCARTHY?**

Last week, Texas Senator Ted Cruz’s prosecutorial style of questioning Chuck Hagel, President Obama’s nominee for Defense Secretary, came so close to innuendo that it raised eyebrows in Congress, even among his Republican colleagues. Senator Lindsey Graham, Republican of South Carolina, called Cruz’s inquiry into Hagel’s past associations “out of bounds, quite frankly.” The Times reported that Senator John McCain, Republican of Arizona, rebuked Cruz for insinuating, without evidence, that Hagel may have collected speaking fees from North Korea. Some Democrats went so far as to liken Cruz, who is a newcomer to the Senate, to a darkly divisive predecessor, Senator Joseph R. McCarthy, whose anti-Communist crusades devolved into infamous witch hunts.

..

Boxer’s analogy may have been more apt than she realized. Two and a half years ago, Cruz gave a stem-winder of a speech at a Fourth of July weekend political rally in Austin, Texas, in which he accused the Harvard Law School of harboring a dozen Communists on its faculty when he studied there. Cruz attended Harvard Law School from 1992 until 1995. His spokeswoman didn’t respond to a request to discuss the speech.

Cruz made the accusation while speaking to a rapt ballroom audience during a luncheon at a conference called “Defending the American Dream,” sponsored by Americans for Prosperity, a non-profit political organization founded and funded in part by the billionaire industrialist brothers Charles and David Koch. Cruz greeted the audience jovially, but soon launched an impassioned attack on President Obama, whom he described as “the most radical” President “ever to occupy the Oval Office.” (I was covering the conference and kept the notes.)

He then went on to assert that Obama, who attended Harvard Law School four years ahead of him, “would have made a perfect president of Harvard Law School.” The reason, said Cruz, was that, “There were fewer declared Republicans in the faculty when we were there than Communists! There was one Republican. But there were twelve who would say they were Marxists who believed in the Communists overthrowing the United States government.”

“We are puzzled by the Senator’s assertions, as we are unaware of any basis for them,” Robb London, a spokesman for Harvard Law School, told me. London noted that Cruz had contributed “warm reminiscences“ of the school by video for a reunion of Latino alumni. “We applaud the fact that he has pursued public service, as so many of our graduates have done. We are also proud of our longstanding tradition of freedom of speech and the robust range of views and debates on our campus.”

Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/comment/2013/02/ted-cruz-sees-red-not-crimson-at-harvard.html#ixzz2Lkabbb59

nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 11:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawkeye

Sequestration for Dummies

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/23/opinion/collins-sequester-for-dummies.html?_r=0

------------------------

I'm disappointed that the day long C-Tran workshop is not being televised. They are using a facilitator. However, Eric Florip is live tweeting:

Eric Florip ‏@col_enviro
Also, this just in: "There is a lot of controversy about light rail," facilitator says. #ctran

Eric Florip ‏@col_enviro
In pre-workshop interviews, facilitator said he found "divided, political, gridlocked" board with minds already made up. #ctran

-------------
I thought there would be reports of the JHB "Town Hall" today.

------------------------
Evolution of Mom Dancing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq-URl...

langenthal — February 23, 2013 at 11:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal


MoBama rocks! My favorite 1st Lady of all time. Without a doubt.

nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 12:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


> No one but the state and psychiatry
> can profit from another's misery, and
> they are the same thing, so let's see
> why Election Day doesn't matter

http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2012/11/hipsters_on_food_stamps.html

DeeLittle — February 23, 2013 at 12:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 10:10 a.m.

You can copy paste quite well, but you still have no clue about logical fallacies. McCain, in your post wrongly stated that Obama committed no "high crimes", I pointed out that in my opinion ahe did, there was no logical fallacy on my part. Maybe Basil can explain it to you, because you are just not getting it.

frobert — February 23, 2013 at 12:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Related to SYCOPHANT

Synonyms
apple-polisher, bootlicker, brownnoser, fawner, flunky (also flunkey or flunkie), lickspittle, suck-up, toady

[http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sycophant][1]

[1]: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sycophant

kn_dalai — February 23, 2013 at 12:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Coolest 1st Lady EVER!!! I love her!!!

hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 1:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Hillary and Michelle in 2016 and 2020. Then Michelle and and Assley Judd in 2024 and 2028. Then Assley and Chelsea in 2032 and 2036. Then Chelsea and Malia in 2040 and 2044. Then…

(Thought I’d just throw that one in there about Ms. Judd. Heck, I might even vote for her myself. )

BTW Hawkeye, your Santiam corn and green beans are on sale at Winco again (yesterday) for 33 cents a can. And Dole canned pineapple is on sale for 68 cents for a 20 ounce can. And I thought 98 cents a can, like last time, was a good buy. And it's in it's own juice, no GMO sugar added.

kn_dalai — February 23, 2013 at 1:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert — February 23, 2013 at 12:49 p.m.

Even when definition stares at you!

I will say frobert, not many employ your brand of CYA...then to couch your remark with implied insult.

Quite the charmer.

Never the wiser.

One thing forum conservatives seem to have in common. You guys love to provoke.

nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 4:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal


kn_dalai — February 23, 2013 at 1:53 p.m.

Just got back from there, actually. I really can't believe the prices there. Best store ever. We save so much money there, it's well worth the trip. We also got some fresh strawberries for Belgian Waffles tomorrow. YUMMMMMM

hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 4:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal


kn_dalai- oh and who are you calling a dummy?

hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 5:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal



> I really can't believe the prices there. Best store ever.

hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 4:12 p.m.

Yep. One thing we can agree on. However, do you recall the comments once made about Winco, I think it was by Jon, about how Winco, a co-op I guess, would find ways to fire employees just before they became vested?

As far as the dummy comment goes; I don't really know what you are talking about. Generally, I think that Leftists are dummies, no offense or anything, but that goes without saying. Nothing in my above comments should have elicited your question. Considering your prolific comments on Republicans, well Hawkeye, you really do not have any room to talk.

______________________________________________________

I know most of you can’t stand Rush Limbaugh. But Leftists are naturally enough going to hate anyone who doesn’t share their Marxist ideas. OK. Fair enough. Understood.

I do like Rush. He has never claimed to be a presenter of news. Always a presenter of opinion. And he’s very good at that. He’s funny and entertaining, and can use rhetoric with the best of them.

I used to listen to Rush years ago, when I had the chance. In more recent years; hardly at all. Not because of Rush, but I just haven’t really felt like it.

However, yesterday I tuned in, for the first time in a long time, to find that Rush was downplaying the negatives of sequestration.

Considering Rush’s “in” with Republicans, what this tells me, is that sequestration is pretty much a given. And in spite of what you on the Left think – this government cannot keep spending money that just isn’t there.

On a little different note: many of you blame the R’s for not being negotiable. Nope. The R’s have been too negotiable for too many decades. The goal posts have been moved far to the Left for eighty years now.

Frontline, on PBS, had a good installment a week ago, on what lead up to the Fiscal Crisis showdown. One thing that came up was BHO’s own partisanship. There was some annual meeting of Dems, in which Obama lambasted the Republican’s suggestions for a budget deal. It was not statesmanship, there was not an olive branch. It was pure partisanship. Funny thing is, that Republicans are invited to this event, as a token. Republicans never show up. Except this time. Eric Cantor, for one, showed up. Oh boy. BHO didn’t see him in the audience. After BHO’s excoriating of Cantor, it was lights off.

Don’t tell me about coming together.

kn_dalai — February 23, 2013 at 5:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 4:08 p.m.

In the words of The Kinks
"Paranoia will destroy ya"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSbSue...

frobert — February 23, 2013 at 5:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Sorry kn_

It wasn't you, it was the article langenthal, put up. My mistake.

And I NEVER talk about Republicans... I talk about RepubliCAN'Ts

hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 6:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal


NaiL

aS son as you put rt wing it had to ne you or Hawk...My oh my you two must be twins...

If your watching channel 8 rt now you woukd be watxching Sen from Oregon Wyeden,, He is so muuch more rep thinker than I ever thought.... Especialllllly on Drown and the Sequester.... Wow has he Nailed it on the button,,, Too bad more Dems are not on board. mayne in next couple days....Sure hope so as the R program and a few Dems have it right......

Channel 8 rt now

vanwadreamer — February 23, 2013 at 7:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — February 23, 2013 at 7:01 p.m

I vker cggkk lk, mmngv. Hcnm jkmdcgh usnm bu jmnnm,! Frmgfvkmk gkncytkmliik kjlkki fjnmnk omm;;; kgbb,l km kno wat I meen?

hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 7:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nice choice, frobert. One of my favorite bands back in the day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if2l4GhTf3s

roger — February 23, 2013 at 8:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal




roger — February 23, 2013 at 8:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger

You forgot this classic

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVXmMM...

frobert — February 23, 2013 at 8:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — February 23, 2013 at 7:01 p.m.

All righty then.

nailingit — February 23, 2013 at 10:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal


holycrapola: I certainly think the legal sale of weed will bring in tax dollars to WA and CO.
________________

Have y'all watched *Argo* yet?

My favorite line in the entire movie was spoken wisely by Alan Arkin:
**“If you want to sell a lie, you get the press to sell it for you.”
**

manthou — February 24, 2013 at 7:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal


So the Regional Transportation Council had an all day retreat meeting yesterday with Portland consultant Richard Howells. Was the press allowed to observe? The public was not and it was not broadcast or recorded, as far as I can tell.

Mr. Howells is distinguished and has been facilitating troubled Boards for years, trying to find a way to help them reach consensus.

Did Jeff Hamm hire this gentleman because of a couple of new RTC Board members? Who needs to get "on board?" Madore and his Battle Ground pal? How much did Mr. Howell's services cost the taxpayers? From The Columbian's story yesterday, I get the sense that the consultant was left with the realization that we need compromise to move forward.

Sounds a little like Congress.

Do not get me wrong: I am all for spending money on productive retreats and expert advice to assist our public servants in doing their jobs smarter. I am not disparaging Mr. Howells. I wish he and his business well.

However, do I add this consultant's fees to my David Madore "Expense Spreadsheet?"

Columbian: where are you on this?

I truly believe Madore's resistance to compromise, while lauded by so many (that's OK, free speech reigns hooray), will cost our county government quite a chunk of change during his tenure. I believe his resistance to following established policies and procedures will cost Clark County lost revenue in legal fees and lost credibility with some citizens and state, national government.

Time for a FOIA request on Mr. Howell's expert support services contract with the RTC.

[link text][1]

[1]: http://www.richardhowells.com/board-facilitation/

manthou — February 24, 2013 at 8:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Good morning, manthou. I hope your Sunday morning is going well. I absolutely love the quote from *Argo* which you shared with everyone. It says it all in a nutshell for sure! Looks like a movie worth watching.

Regarding Madore...you make some claims well worth considering when it comes to his methods of conducting business but in another perspective, it is my opinion that I would rather he raise the questions for consideration and stand up and fight for what he believes is right even if it takes time and some $$$ away from the taxpayers IF we get the end result which we can all live by AND it ends up saving us $$$ in the long run.

Like you though...I am a skeptic when it comes to Madore. I believe if and when the crossing project is up and running, that he will still push for his eastside bridge pet project.

Also, I believe the funding for the retreat and Mr. Howells expertise (why does Gilligan's Island come to mind every time I see that name...8)..???) is something funded by the taxpayers OR riders of C-Tran but I'm not sure if it's truly tied into expenses of the crossing project in itself. Most likely, it isn't.

I definitely agree with a comment in the Columbian's article on the retreat which states the following -

*The clearest consensus emerged on how agency leaders should link -- or not link -- light rail and bus rapid transit, known as BRT. Board members said the two projects are separate issues, and should be treated as such. That's something BRT supporters have pushed for, arguing a perceived connection to light rail only hurts its chances of success. BRT should be allowed to succeed on its own merits, supporters say.*

We need to hold to *OUR identity of OUR county and its transportation needs*...and the mass transit needs as they increase (or decrease, depending on ridership numbers...even keeping TriMet's numbers as a reference of trends). These times...they are a changin' - hopefully for the better.

goldenoldie — February 24, 2013 at 8:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Hi, goldie:

The CRC project certainly has to take in our local needs and protect our local interests.

I think there is a huge conflict between that and the entire "big picture" view: the transportation needs of an entire region, an entire state, three states, three countries.

Will Clark and Multnomah Counties be paying more than their "fair share" in terms of monetary and environmental cost and inconvenience?

Does the "good of the whole" trump the "good of the part?" When that answer is a resounding NO, we get gridlock (as in Congress right now) and absolutely nothing is done. But maybe that is the strategy.

I did find a list of contractors paid by Sound Transit in Seattle in 2010. Richard Howells was paid $34,500 for services rendered there. Worth every penny, I am sure of it and I am not being sarcastic, for the record.

As for the RTC, I can be sure that the CRC did not cough up the funds for Mr. Howells here.

We did.

Would we have needed Richard Howells services if the gridlocked RTC Board members were more willing to compromise?

Maybe not.

Just my theory. That and $2 won't even get you a latte these days.

manthou — February 24, 2013 at 9:03 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Will The Columbian join the Seattle Times in setting up a paywall for online access?

Starting mid-March, the Seattle Times online will cost you:

[link text][1]

[1]: http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2020414873_boardmancolumnxml.html

Start asking yourself: would you pay for The Columbian for online access?

This Forum stuff is addicting. Worth the price for the fix? :) Kind of like what the food industry does: get the public hooked on all that sugar, fat, and salt so they keep coming back for more.

manthou — February 24, 2013 at 9:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou - We're having the fight we have now with the CRC project because Portland refused to compromise. That position of LRT or no bridge has us where we're at now.

The OR State Legislature, in HB 2800, is trying to limit their cost to the $450 million cost share. The only way this will be possible is to push any cost overruns or lack of federal funding to WA or onto tolling. Will Multnomah County pay more than their "fair share"? Their commuters to jobs in WA will, but the financial support they'll get from us for MAX and the increase in jobs at Port of Portland will balance this out. Will Clark County pay more than our "fair share"? Most definitely - the loss in spending power from the tolling alone will lead to businesses closing shop.

So, is the good of the whole of greater importance than of the part? I guess it depends on who you talk to. I personally believe that between this project and the BPA power line one, our suburban quality of life will suffer. I have absolutely no desire to participate in the downtown revitalization and move into an apartment building. And with the potential cost of tolling, Yamhill, Clackamas and Washington County are looking better all the time.

roger — February 24, 2013 at 10:07 a.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou — February 24, 2013 at 9:54 a.m.

From the comments on the 4 Feb "Clash of Titans" story.

"Lou Brancaccio · Top Commenter · University of Florida
"Clash of the Titans!" might not have happened in the council chambers but **free of charge (for now at least)** I bring you Clash of the Titans gangnam, er, comment style. ;-)
Reply · 2 ·
· February 5 at 10:32am"

So what do you think?

dfsadfh — February 24, 2013 at 11:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger at 10:07 am: I worry about quality of life, too. I think you posted a glossy publication last week that shows, in full color, what downtown Vancouver is supposed to look like when this project is said and done. What it did not show was the chaos and construction needed to get there.

Too bad we can't fast forward to that point without all the hassle in between.

I jokingly posed this question to my spouse: Is it time to move back to Oregon? Since he likes not paying the state income and property taxes we used to there, the answer was a resounding negative.

If we were younger, it might be a fun adventure to live with chaos and uncertainty. Been there. Done that. Had enough thrills to last the rest of my lifetime.

I really want the convenience of light rail to Vancouver. In all honesty, I probably do not want to live with the troubles it seems to be bringing to our otherwise peaceful life here.
______________________
dfsadfh: I think Lou B was referring to the Clark County Commission meeting. I would bet my sinful dessert tonight that the Regional Transportation Council (RTC), the entity that held the all-day retreat yesterday, is paying for the services provided to them by Richard Howells.

Money well-spent if he can try to bring those stubborn sides together for the sake of the community they serve.

manthou — February 24, 2013 at 11:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — February 23, 2013 at 6:35 p.m.

I was just adding to your excellent post --- hawkeye — February 22, 2013 at 10:41 p.m. Sequester for Dummies is the title of the NY Times piece. It wasn't a comment on your helpful article.

--------------------------------------------------------
Roger and anyone who is planning to attend meeting tomorrow evening --- I don't know if you watched this or not.

This is the City Council Workshop from 2/4/13. Columbia River Project Update --- http://www.cityofvancouver.us/cvtv/cvtvarchive2/City_Council_Workshops/2013_Events/February_2013/02-04-13/1_Columbia_River_Crossing_Project-Information_Update.mp4

langenthal — February 24, 2013 at 12:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEBN30...

*Have y'all watched Argo yet?*

manthou — February 24, 2013 at 7:42 a.m.

What timing!

Last night!

My wife and I scrolled through Comcast movies, narrowed it to a few trailers and decided on Argo.

The best movie I've seen in quite some time.

Affleck is turning out to be some exceptional talent, both in front and behind the camera.

Given his age and success, he could turn out to be this generations Eastwood in scope and depth.

I flew in and out of Manilla in Feb of 2002. 'Argo' Airport security somewhat mirrored my experience. (no kidding) While waiting in line for my return flight, a guy a line over from me was pulled out, billy clubbed, (for I don't know what, attitude?) and hauled off. A few more people were grabbed and taken away during this wait.

A few dozen military/militia and police toting automatic weapons and shotguns guarded AP entry points while others walked up and down 8 outside 3 hour plus long lines looking for trouble, emptying luggage and harassing whoever. Not a whole lot makes me nervous, but flying back alone, (ahead of my friends) not knowing the language and looking much different than the local pop, and given this kind of intensity, (plus a major hangover) let's say I was glad to finally fly out.

Days before my trip started Al-Qaeda Pakistan executed Daniel Pearl. It was all over Pilipino news 24/7, and to lend perspective this was only months out from 9/11. In the PI., Al-Qaeda had/has a formidable presence in the southern province of Mindanao, to include being led by Abu Sayyaf. They were creating quite a local stir at the time, to include kidnappings and executions. (Later that year Sayyaf took personal credit for killing a Green Beret down south and no doubt had ties to the Bali bombings around the same time. Quite a guy!)

My bud's wife is from Angeles City, (former dancer) a couple hours south of Manilla, but well within what we considered to be safe. Angeles City and surrounding area is primarily Catholic as opposed to the predominant Muslim south, and Angeles City doesn't exactly attract the religious folk. :)

My base went from Threatcon Bravo to Charlie days before our flight and deemed the PI off limits for Military personnel. My buddy, (military) made a successful plea to base command and argued based on pre-paid/other arrangements. His wife is a Pilipino national and needed his help to conduct family business. (That, a promise not to travel south of Angeles City and a promised bottle of Tanduay rum to somebody up the chain)

All's well that ends well. :))

(Sorry, I've had waay too much coffee today)

nailingit — February 24, 2013 at 12:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal


langenthal - Thanks for the link - I don't use Comcast, so this is the first I've seen it.

Most was info that's already been circulated.

Ms. Hammond was less than accurate with her claim that the new bridge would withstand an earthquake. If we have the quake's epicenter off the coast of northern CA/southern OR, the historical data indicates it will probably be around 8.0. Our best "earthquake proof" bridge construction can probably survive this without major structural damage. However, if we get hit by the "big 9.0" with an epicenter off the coast of northern OR/WA state - we do not have the capability of building anything to withstand this. And every design I've seen for higher magnitude "earthquake proof" bridges is a single level suspension bridge. I'm thinking we're going into uncharted territory with this double level bridge with LRT on the bottom of one. And also, there is some info out there that suggests anchoring the bridge in the bedrock will actually make it more susceptible to failure with the lateral shockwaves the subduction zone quake will produce. That theory is that unanchored pylons will move back and forth in the soil, while anchored ones will start rocking back and forth - if the quake persists for several minutes (as is possible), then the bridge will basically keel over to one side.

As has been addressed - all the talk of economic benefit is on a regional basis. The CRC Economic Benefits Analysis suggests must of this will be with Port of Seattle and Port of Portland. I was hoping one of the council members would ask to see this info broken down further - what specifically is our gain supposed to be?

Jeanne Stewart had some good questions about funding that Paula Hammond avoided answering completely. Ms. Hammond is too certain the Feds will produce the entire amount for New Starts. She did note a problem with IDing the source of the other $400 mil, and stopped just short of saying this cost will probably end up in the tolling. And instead of answering what happens if no LRT O&M;, she deferred to C-Tran identifying this source. Interesting. New Starts requirements say it must be established; Stewart noted C-Tran Board has committed to a vote on the source, and wanted to know what happens if we say No period.

And while I suspect there's some major wheeling and dealing going down in Oly, I still think they're going to have a very hard time getting this approved by the Senate this year. Depends on that little $10 billion plan from the House - how much goes to districts that will sway a couple of votes in favor of the bill.

roger — February 24, 2013 at 2:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — February 24, 2013 at 12:54 p.m.

We US citizens tend to be shocked when other countries don't share our views on rights. Those no nonsense Filipino military guys are much like what I've seen in several places overseas.

Colon, Panama - 1985 or 86 - my wife and her Puerto Rican girlfriend were shopping there. Some guy tried to snatch my wife's purse - she reacted and pulled it to her chest, clamping down with both arms. She said the guy was probably a junkie - skinny and didn't have the strength to pull the purse away from her. Her girlfriend was screaming in Spanish - two plain clothes guys (Defense National Force - we called them Denny's) came from somewhere with their red rubber batons and started beating the guy to the pavement. A uniform came and grabbed the guy by his feet and began pulling him to an alley, while Denny get beating him. My wife said she knew they were going to kill him and started to say something - another uniform said something to her girlfriend, who grabbed her by the arm and drug her away. Basically, be a nice little lady and mind your own business or you'll end up going to jail.

But I was also warned not to argue with the German and the Korean police too - that it could prove painful. (And at least the Panamanian ones expected and accepted bribes from US GIs - so much more civilized an arrangement!!) So....

roger — February 24, 2013 at 2:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**ROGER**

looks like we're still tops in 'human rights'.

beating thieves....maybe....but only as a quick lesson, not as population control.

DeeLittle — February 24, 2013 at 4:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Dee - I'm thinking the quick lesson hasn't had much of an impact on crime here. Oh well.

roger — February 24, 2013 at 4:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Anybody been getting 503 errors today?

hawkeye — February 24, 2013 at 7:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*But I was also warned not to argue with the German and the Korean police too*

roger — February 24, 2013 at 2:31 p.m.

Yes! Not good to screw with German Polizei!

I've heard many stories from credible sources, and a few first hand accounts as well. These guys would give Vegas cops a run for their money, and that's saying something. I'd still take them over most 3rd world countries, at least you'd have a better shot facility wise.

Then again maybe, maybe not.

In Japan when incarcerated they don't feed you. Period. If friends or family won't bring you food then you're pretty much SOL if SOFA status doesn't apply.

I suppose one could work out a FWB relationship with Bubba-san, but certainly not an ideal, eh, position to be in.

nailingit — February 24, 2013 at 7:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Anybody been getting 503 errors today?

hawkeye — February 24, 2013 at 7:17 p.m.

Yes. Several in the last week to include posting tonight.

nailingit — February 24, 2013 at 7:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawk

yesterday

DeeLittle — February 24, 2013 at 9:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Argo won best picture.

Bravo!

nailingit — February 24, 2013 at 11:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal


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