Open forum, March 17-23



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Okay, so -now- there's content. Heck, it's going on 11:00 and not a peep about the Board opening, crazy politicians, bridges, or news agencies.

What gives?

Drift — March 17, 2014 at 10:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Outside the daunting realm of political machinations, the world continues to whirl...

I Googled 'medical marijuana' just to see how many results it came up with...260,000,000. Parents are seeking miracles, pharmaceuticals speculating, and researchers are actually beginning to pry the door open a crack on its possibilities. This genie plant is never going back into the bottle. Personal story - darling DIL was diagnosed with second stage Hodgkin's Lymphoma. So far she's had two chemotherapy treatments, has loads of diet restrictions, and is so immune-compromised she can't even be around her dog lest she get a flea bite. Point of sharing story... she lives in CA. They gave her some sort of marijuana candy that reduces side effects of chemo with only mild nausea that lasts for about a week after each treatment. Amazing.

But I, like so many others, thinks it will be the money that is the clincher for both medical and recreational marijuana, no matter how many patients tell their stories or how cavalier Paul Harris is when asked about the dilemma of doctors and their marijuana patients in WA State. In America marijuana was part of every pharmaceutical company's pharmacopeia before 1934. It will be again, instead of some state by state fringe area of research and prescribing deal.

Okay, guess this was sort of political, at that.

jacjak — March 17, 2014 at 10:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Here's another 'world whirling' post...

Completely fasinated by 3D printing since I first read about it. Look what they're doing now!!

Now, heading off to the gym with my newly discovered Ft. Vancouver Library PlayAway book. It's an unabridged audio book worn around the neck...a tiny thing about the size of a iPod, and all I need is earphones. Who knew?!

jacjak — March 17, 2014 at 11:19 a.m. ( | suggest removal

IIRC cannabis appeared in the U.S. Pharmacopoeia in 1851. It was pulled in 1942.

When many people think of medicinal cannabis what comes to mind are wasting diseases and the nausea associated with chemo. Man, there's sooo many more maladies being researched.

Doc Guzman, over in Madrid, appears to have cured a blastoma by injecting the tumor with synthetic (I think it was) cannabinoids.

Research indicates cannabinoids kill leukemia cells. Other cancer work is currently in process (prostate, breast...).

Families are moving to Colorado for the purpose of treating infant children (with epilepsy) with a cannabidiol extract. The legalities, dontcha know.

When you (collective "you") have a little spare time do some schooling on the human endocannabinoid system. Myself, I find neurology fascinating.

But then, I suppose none of that has anything to do with smoking a joint just to take the edge off, or get the juices flowing. Heaven forbid!

Drift — March 17, 2014 at 11:49 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift: I had a student who controlled his seizures with cannabis. Nothing worked better.
A diversion: Want to help search for Flight 370? While I am worrying that the possibility that it landed somewhere may be an ever-increasing reality, we can do a visual grid search over water, thanks to Tomnod dot com. It is high tech crowdsourcing and you can identify and report anything that looks like a raft, debris, etc.

It is early morning and still dark over the seas, but wait three or four hours and give it a shot.

Go to:

Select "Jump to Random Map."

manthou — March 17, 2014 at 12:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Why just today.....

-Federal Government Signs Off On Study Using Marijuana To Treat Veterans' PTSD-

The federal government has signed off on a long-delayed study looking at marijuana as a treatment for veterans with post-traumatic stress disorder, a development that drug researchers are hailing as a major shift in U.S. policy.

The Department of Health and Human Services' decision surprised marijuana advocates who have struggled for decades to secure federal approval for research into the drug's medical uses.

The proposal from the University of Arizona was long ago cleared by the Food and Drug Administration, but researchers had been unable to purchase marijuana from the National Institute on Drug Abuse. The agency's Mississippi research farm is the only federally-sanctioned source of the drug.

In a letter last week, HHS cleared the purchase of medical marijuana by the studies' chief financial backer, the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies, which supports medical research and legalization of marijuana and other drugs.


The Veterans Administration estimates between 11 and 20 percent of soldiers who served in the recent Iraq and Afghanistan wars have PTSD, which can cause anxiety, flashbacks, depression and sleep deprivation. About 7.7 million American adults are estimated to have the disorder.

Physicians have long speculated that marijuana could be used to calm parts of the brain linked to overstimulation and anxiety, though little formal research has been conducted.

The American Medical Association has called for a change in marijuana's classification to make it easier for research to be conducted. The current classification prevents physicians from even prescribing it in states where medical use is permitted. Instead, they can only recommend it to patients who can then buy it through a government-approved dispensary in most states.

Parents of children with epilepsy have petitioned lawmakers in several states to grant access to a strain of medical marijuana known as "Charlotte's Web," which contains low amounts of the drug's active ingredient, THC. Available in liquid form in Colorado, the strain is believed to be effective in controlling seizures in children, though the Institute of Medicine and the American Medical Association have said more research needs to be done

Read More @

nailingit — March 17, 2014 at 2:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 17, 2014 at 12:21 p.m.

You never know.

-Courtney Love thinks she found missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370-

The rock singer and self-styled sleuth tweets a coordinate with the question "PLANE?"

If this turns out to be true, we’ll finally have closure — and be astounded at the source of unlikely intuition.

Courtney Love, the rock singer, actress, and ’90s style icon, maintains an active presence on Twitter, where she shared images of the open ocean near the Malaysian island of Pulau Perak, with what she claimed were the shadow of a submerged plane and an oil slick.

She used Tomnod, a website that uses satellite images of earth in order to crowdsource information; she then shared the image with a hand-drawn “C-L” watermark via Twitter.

Courtney Love Cobain        


I'm no expert but up close this does look like a plane and an oil slick.

… prayers go out to the families #MH370
12:28 AM - 17 Mar 2014

nailingit — March 17, 2014 at 10:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Courtney Love - front for one of my favorite Northwest bands. They had a rawness and a passion that most of the bigger named bands lost when they set out on the road to stardom.

Violet, from the '95 MTV Awards. (If you like your music all pretty sounding, you may as well skip this.)

roger — March 18, 2014 at 5:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: I posted the Tomnod website yesterday. Intriguing way for a helpless public to pitch in. I have been perusing the satellite images when I can.

Bless Courtney Love's heart for joining in and reporting what she thinks may be the plane. Wow.

Just wow.

manthou — March 18, 2014 at 7:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 18, 2014 at 7:55 a.m.

"nailingit: I posted the Tomnod website yesterday."

That's why I thought to post it. I doubt we'll ever know what happened to this flight. I wouldn't be surprised if some "credible" wreckage showed up someplace. It seems this story is being made up as we go along.

Any theories?

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 8:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: I have been on Reddit to evaluate theories (entertaining reading at best), but the most credible ones come from experienced pilots themselves, ones who have flown this type of airbus.

There is a commenter on Oregonlive called patpilot, I think. Anyway, he (and other pilots) have reported that this plane can fly under radar detection and worry that it landed somewhere and is being prepared as a giant, flying weapon.

My uneducated gut feeling is pilot suicide. Makes me crazy that, if this is true, that he took 200 innocents with him when there are so many other ways to accomplish his goal without taking others with him.

The thing to remember, however, is how sinister and diabolically brilliant the 9/11 attacks were. We never imagined such a thing before it happened.

So I ask, "What other unimaginable act is waiting in the wings to surprise us next?"

I looked at the images that caught Courtney Love's eagle eye and that part of the ocean sure has a different reflective quality where she thinks she may have identified a slick. The shadow underneath the waves may be a plane, but it is more difficult to tell for me. I am sure the experts are on it.

Veteran journalist Jack Shafer, a professional who has "seen it all", wrote about how this story has consumed him (and others):

What do you think happened?

manthou — March 18, 2014 at 8:24 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Your new avatar may have answered by last question to you, above. :)

What did Stephen Hawking say? There never has been a friendly takeover in the history of the world.

manthou — March 18, 2014 at 8:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 18, 2014 at 8:24 a.m.

As far as location-

Theory #1

The plane is in the drink.

Theory #2

The plane is at an undisclosed location being weaponized, to be used at a later date to blend with American air traffic and create a catastrophic event.

Theory #3

The Grey's have amped up their research into human transportation needs. If that's the case, they should take the I-5 bridge with them.


Quite a scene.

-Helicopter Crashes Near Seattle Space Needle, Killing Two-

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 8:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Theory #4

Chris Christie ate it.

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 8:53 a.m. ( | suggest removal

It's also being reported Chris Christie is devouring, among other things, the New Jersey Turnpike.

If the Governor is capable of this, he's capable of anything, to include this Malaysian flight thing.

And if anyone thinks I'm kidding...

Here is photographic evidence documenting Chris Christie's latest insatiable gluttonous binge.

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 9:07 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou: Have you started to post on the Face Book side? Someone over there who I thought might be you.

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 9:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Yes Nail she sure writes and sounds like Manthou. Very polite and well thought out.

timerick — March 18, 2014 at 11:13 a.m. ( | suggest removal

And I thought we respected anonymity here. I'm under the impression most of us post there, though Tim and I are the only ones who don't bother to conceal our identities.

roger — March 18, 2014 at 12:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger I saw your post on the 5 dollar and 12 dollar vehicle license and transaction fees. Have you heard if there is to be a sunset on that when the ferries are paid for? Also I was at a meeting three weeks ago and the subject of Gramor came up. I am not sure if true or not but from a very reliable source it was said that Gramor as of then was 16 mil. in the red on the waterfront project. That why I asked Lou for more information. If they aren't going to go through with the project than the city has just wasted 45 mil. on their end.

timerick — March 18, 2014 at 12:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Aack.... just got back (escaped?) from a slog through...what? Some sort of insanity innerspace? Not sure how, but followed the Courtney Love link on that nailingit posted. Started reading other tweets about landing strips found on pilot flight simulators, a tanker ship found floating suitcases, etc. Then clicked onto links that talked of dead Navy Seal guarding a secret shipment (never mentioned they were actually former Seals or that the ship was a container ship), disappeared clandestine shipments of chemicals from a US ship, secret flights of disease experts from China and US flying to same island as flight simulator landing strip, etc. That last was from a site called Sorcha Faal. Which, when I started digging for credentials lead to something called, Got totally strange from there with sites like Golden Age of Rachael, and The Best of Genesis, and someone named David Booth. Who is he? CIA is the most popular guess, but he's all over the internet with all sorts of references to interpol-type organizations worldwide. WTH!

Conclusion... Obama! It's all Obama. Obama is plotting to take over the food sources of the world...Obama is working with leaders in France to invade Crimea... Obama, the dark prince, the 4th horseman, the false christ, the end of everything . Holycrapole, surprised I didn't read how he wanted all men to wear Burberry or Hartmarx suits, too.

Always hear about the conspiracy and hater nuts, and those that actually work to end the world so heaven can come back or whatever, but had no idea there must be whole armies doing website development, writing, editing, etc. I need to get off the main road more,

jacjak — March 18, 2014 at 12:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Missed the BOCC meeting today, but I hear it is a doozy. Must watch on CVTV later.

Reading Tyler Graf's tweets, it appears that two out of three Commissioners decided to make The Reflector the official newspaper to publicize public notices, against overwhelming staff recommendations to use The Columbian due to larger subsription coverage. Not surprising, but I anticipate this will generate another lawsuit on behalf of the public interest. Just wait.

I told you these clowns were going to cost us more money than they save.

Also hear that Royce Pollard promised to kiss Madore's behind if his East County bridge gets built. :)

C-Tran meetings today starting at 4. More entertainment.

I can't go anywhere without missing something critical and significant in CC Politics, it seems.

Did anyone watch it?

manthou — March 18, 2014 at 12:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Jim Moeller posted this great Wired piece from an experience pilot:

What probably happened to Flight 370 is tragic, but simple.

manthou — March 18, 2014 at 1:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hey Cool! Vid covers are showing up again!

Inspiring! :)

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 4:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou- Did not mean to put you on the spot. I'll take a non-answer as a no. Understanding your hard core stance against FB, and thinking it was such a ridiculous question, you must have thought I was being facetious.

Whew! :)

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 4:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

OK - Why did yours show and not mine?

That's the Dead - New Speedway Boogie.

roger — March 18, 2014 at 5:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I've not heard of a sunset on the tab fee, which is why I did my little calculation exercise to bring that point up. Frankly, I think with the title fee, that 5 years I mentioned probably goes down to about 2-3 years. I suppose I can check the bill as signed, but I would think if there's a terminating event (paying off), at least one of the news articles would have mentioned it. But my gut reaction is that with the two fees combined, they're planning on around $50K per year.

Gramor (and others) were counting heavily on light rail for their downtown development projects. Someone called for some investigative reporting into the money trail for the Port and Tesoro - my response to that is they'll have to get in line - plenty of us have been asking for the same with the CRC for a few years.

roger — March 18, 2014 at 5:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

OK - Why did yours show and not mine?

roger — March 18, 2014 at 5:21 p.m.

Clean living?

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 6 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Well, that wasn't the case.....maybe it's when text is applied to it.

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 6:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Apparently that's it!

roger- I posted the same link @ 6:00 as I did 6:05. The difference is the accompanying text.

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 6:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

OK - I'm clueless as to differentiate the accompanying text. I'm looking to see if Google Chrome works better than firefox.

Mannfred Mann - Solar Fire

roger — March 18, 2014 at 6:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — March 18, 2014 at 12:48 p.m.

OK - my gut reaction is that this tab and title fee is intended to be a permanent funding source for the ferry system. There is no discussion of expiration.

"Expenditures from the account may be used only for the construction or purchase of ferry vessels and to pay the principal and interest on bonds authorized for the construction or purchase of ferry vessels. However, expenditures from the account must first be used to support the construction or purchase, including any applicable financing costs, of a ferry vessel with a carrying capacity of at least one hundred forty-four cars."

roger — March 18, 2014 at 7:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

It is nice Roger that we get to fund King County and all the island county's again. We seem to be always the brides maid and never the bride. You would think that our legislators would do better by us. Probably pay back for not funding the CRC.

timerick — March 18, 2014 at 8:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm getting tired reading about seniors having senior moments behind the wheel and costing lives. Drivers should be tested frequently when we reach a certain age.

Besides, with light rail coming, it well.....oh yeah. Well, there's always the bus...

(a weak rant, but a rant nonetheless)

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 8:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — March 18, 2014 at 9:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Holy crap, M&M; are at it again;

Hawkman — March 18, 2014 at 9:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Your right Hawk. This is carrying it to far. I understand their hate for the C and I don't blame them for that. But this is just stupid. It is like you pick on me and I will take my ball and go home. This stupid stuff has to stop. They are going to lose any support they may have had. It was just as stupid for our legislators to vote for the tab increase for King County and the Island countys. What are these people thinking? Maybe SW Washington should cede to Oregon. We get the shaft from both ends anyway.

timerick — March 18, 2014 at 10:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick and others: You must watch the BOCC on CVTV for the entire discussion on which newspaper of record to choose. It is torture.

I estimate Mielke's IQ range to be about 82-87 based on his stunning inability to comprehend a critical, but simple concept: all legal notices must first be published in The Reflector before they can be supplemented in The Columbian. Therefore, the turnaround time is significantly greater and the county's business will slow down as it must wait for legal notice in a weekly newspaper. Their ability to reach the maximum number of citizens is significantly reduced, as well.

Mielke's reading of one paragraph later in the meeting on another topic was halting and he mispronounced words that fifth graders should know.

I am not making fun of him or the cognitive limits he was likely born with. I am just saying he is way in over his head and his cognitive brick wall is causing harm to Clark County. I am objectively describing the behavior I see from him weekly.

You've got Madore's brilliance on one hand, which is limited by his ideology, manipulation, grandiosity, and narcissism. Mielke is the polar opposite: his lack of critical thinking skills is what makes him dangerous.

I continually am amazed at the decisions being made at the County.
But the off-center we experience from M and M is becoming so commonplace, that we may become de-sensitized to it. The new normal for Clark County would make other government leaders incredulous and embarrassed.

The voters are in trouble, too, if they start to accept this shite show as something within acceptable ranges.

manthou — March 19, 2014 at 5:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal

There is a common denominator to just about everything M&M; are doing that's raised the ire of so many - Identity Clark County. Or, more accurately, the "downtown-centric" focus that they are in the forefront of promoting. M&M; represent the opposition; those who want to keep our side of the river from becoming like Portland. Put in simplified terms - this is a fight between Red and Blue. And historically, much of the area outside of downtown is solid or leaning Red.

The continued relocation from Oregon, California, etc, helped along by the lax enforcement of our own taxation laws, is eroding that Red control. But I don't see a shift to Blue - rather, I see the Repub party moderating their views and voters continuing to support their candidates. Mielke will probably retire - perhaps Brandon Vick will replace him? Madore remains a wild card - the Jesus crowd and others will continue to support him.

roger — March 19, 2014 at 6:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Your right Roger. Madore wanted to take the focus away from the old Downtown group. What he didn't see was that most of them are also invested out your way also. Their reach spreads far and wide. ICC was started to promote business in Vancouver and Clark County. But they really didn't do much to help the average guy. They did manage to line their own pockets quite well. When they lost Pollard it was a big hit for them. Pollard was their yes man. Mayor Tim is trying to carry on but he didn't count on Madore being in his way and I don't think he knows how to handle Madore.

timerick — March 19, 2014 at 8:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal

As a distraction from CC "matters of consequence," I am planning some European metro trips online, before a pending trip.

The Paris Metro and Bus trip planner, for example, shows the amazing data of CO2 emissions saved by my using public transport. For example, my future trip from the Gare du Nord to Musee d'Orsay via Metro emits 15 gr. CO2 vs 715 gr. if I were to take a car. The bus is a little higher: 116 gr.

Interesting factoids to include. Wonder why C-Tran and Tri-Met don't offer that.

manthou — March 19, 2014 at 9:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal

The walls and everything with it are tumbling down. A simple and refreshing read.

-Confessions of a Pothead Mom-

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 9:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal

"(Plus, I figure it should be someone living in Colorado or Oregon, so that no one gets thrown in jail or loses custody of their kids for being honest.)"

Those pothead moms...I tell ya. Sheesh.

Drift — March 19, 2014 at 10:15 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift — March 19, 2014 at 10:15 a.m

...she's now blogging about geography from the Multnomah County Jail.

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 10:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger- I remember during the CRC debacle, the anti-CRC crowd were denouncing the mention of party line differences and criticizing those of us who insisted this was more about ideology than anything else.'s red v blue?

There seems to be a strange paranoia that exists with some, about our side of the river turning into Portland. I think I've found the strange.

The conservative voting block would be compromised.

"But I don't see a shift to Blue - rather, I see the Repub party moderating their views..."


Can't we all just learn to live together?


-County changes paper of record from Columbian to first page of Madore's pocket Bible-

In a bold move yesterday, Clark County commissioner and motion-control enthusiast David Madore led a vote to change Clark County's paper of record from the daily Columbian to a piece of paper he promises to tuck into the front cover of his pocket Bible.

When Madore made the motion, he was clear about wanting to leave the Columbian -- but he did not seem to realize that this meant he'd have to pick something else to replace it.

The county must provide legal notices in a publication with countywide circulation. The Columbian is the local paper that best meets this qualification. However, since it is also the paper that most frequently commits acts of journalism, Madore and Mielke have grave concerns about continuing to support its nefarious mission.

"I cannot justify paying to place advertisements in a publication whose management does not bend to my will," said Madore. "This is not the kind of democracy I paid for."

When county legal counsel advised Madore that the county has a responsibility to print legal notices, Madore scoffed. "You do know that I write daily Facebook posts that tell people what's happening in our county, don't you?"

Legal counsel nodded stiffly and replied that, yes, many people are aware of his Facebook posts, but that those posts, as brilliant and freshly worded as they are, do not meet the need for legal notice.

Madore pursed his lips and memorized the staffer's name so he could add it to his "to fire" list.

Mielke snorted awake from a nap and asked if it was time to go to lunch yet.

Read More @

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 11:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Did anyone notice a Columbian write about the JHB morning Q & A the other day? I may have missed it.


There are stark differences between the two major parties.

-Susanne Atanus, Who Blames Gay Rights For Tornadoes, Wins GOP Nomination For Congress-

A Republican candidate who believes that God dictates weather patterns and that tornadoes, autism and dementia are God's punishments for marriage equality and abortion access won the GOP nomination to challenge Rep. Jan Schakowsky (D-Ill.) in the Chicago-area 9th Congressional District.

Susanne Atanus, of Niles, Ill., garnered 54 percent of the vote in her Tuesday win over David Earl Williams III.

"I am not in favor of abortions, I am not in favor of gay rights," Atanus told the Daily Herald, a suburban Chicago newspaper, in January.

She blamed natural disasters and mental disorders on recent advances in LGBT equality and legal abortions.

"God is angry. We are provoking him with abortions and same-sex marriage and civil unions," she said. "Same-sex activity is going to increase AIDS. If it's in our military, it will weaken our military. We need to respect God."

Atanus also reached out to the Windy City Times, an LGBT publication, in an attempt to explain her views.

"Everybody knows that God controls weather," she told the news site in January. "God is super angry," she added. "Gay marriage is not appropriate, and it doesn't look right, and it breeds AIDS."

Jack Dorgan, chairman of the Illinois Republican Party, and Adam Robinson, chairman of the Chicago Republican Party, both condemned Atanus' comments and distanced the party from her candidacy.

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 12:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 12:34 p.m.

Your topic goes well with this one:

The head of a right-wing Christian advocacy group warned that the United States was risking God’s wrath by backing President Barack Obama – whom he suggested may be the Antichrist.
Rev. Mark Creech, the head of Christian Action League, said the biblical account of the Tower of Babel served as a warning of “government gone awry,” reported Right Wing Watch.
The Book of Genesis describes the destruction of Babel, which historians believe likely referred to Babylon, after its leader Nimrod acquired great power and united humanity following the Great Flood.“Our culture has largely abandoned trust in God for the opiate of government provision and hope, while endorsing via legalization abominable acts that God condemns,” Creech continued.

etc. bla bla.

So insane it's worth reading.

I am starting to think someone is paying all these people on the right. Or are there really that many stupid ones?
Maybe there are.

luvithere — March 19, 2014 at 2:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Or are there really that many stupid ones?
Maybe there are.

luvithere — March 19, 2014 at 2:11 p.m.

Invented words -- stupitopian, obsessist, thoughtphobic, ignorantist.

Actual words -- anti-scholastic, centophobe, epistemophobe, sophophobe,

Ever since discovered the word 'scholastic' has it's roots in research within the religious community (think 12th Century), I make a point to use it in regards to those who, by their religious philosophies, distain critical thought.

jacjak — March 19, 2014 at 4:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 11:35 a.m.

The anti-CRC crowd crossed political lines - you might recall that a lot of environmentalists were also in that camp? And a lot of us just didn't buy into the claimed benefit vs. cost.

County politics is Red vs Blue. Look at voting patterns. Read the various political websites. Drive around the east side and start counting all the different who knows what the hell they are churches. Turlay didn't lose by that much to Leavitt; want to guess the result if that vote extended into unincorporated County out to Battle Ground? I've attended gatherings hosted over on the west side (the CRC one at the Ed Svc Dist place on 65th Ave, and the recall Madore one out in Fruit Valley), and a couple of ones over here hosted by Benton/Harris and by Rivers/Pike. As popular as Moeller is in the 49th, Rivers and Pike are equally popular over here.

And I'm not seeing that this will change a lot when we old folks leave the scene. I deal with relatively young kids in their 30s - and a whole lot of them are very conservatively oriented in their politics and beliefs. Especially the crowd that finds it necessary to pray every time they get together. The way they see it, their mission is to fix what we boomers screwed up.

roger — March 19, 2014 at 5:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — March 19, 2014 at 8:20 a.m.

I figured a lot of the ICC crowd backed Leavitt. Pollard had his little cup breaking incident at Starbucks, and started demanding that the tolls had to be low enough so as to not harm Clark commuters. That wasn't going to sit with Metro, who wanted to make driving too expensive for the average commuter. Leavitt got a lot of support and money - who was backing him? Was there a concern that Oregon would drop out if Pollard pushed that agenda up to State level?

One of the requirements of the State's 2009 Transportation plan was to study the impact of a reduced toll for frequent bridge crossers (I believe the suggested was $1 per crossing for those who cross 10 times or more per week). It wasn't too long after that election that Moeller said it isn't going to happen.

roger — March 19, 2014 at 5:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Looks like Don Benton is backing off on his multi-thousand dollar special security system for himself. At BOCC today, his buddies decided a locked door would do for now. Low cost. High inconvenience.

Someone said: Don doesn't get a lot of foot traffic there.

manthou — March 19, 2014 at 6:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 19, 2014 at 6:34 p.m.

I'd be happy to "donate" the lock! AND!!! it's ADA approved. Of course, the key would be $600.

Hawkman — March 19, 2014 at 7:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — March 19, 2014 at 7:07 p.m

That's the spirit! Donate to that. Do keep the key.

manthou — March 19, 2014 at 6:34 p.m.
Wonder why? Too much public feedback aka derision?

luvithere — March 19, 2014 at 7:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 19, 2014 at 5:17 p.m.

I understand the demographics in our area and the politics surrounding them. That wasn't my point. Anyway, and yes, the crowd that prays is usually more conservative in nature. Certainly something not to be encouraged given the direction of evangelical politics today.

"But I don't see a shift to Blue - rather, I see the Repub party moderating their views..."

Just wondering how you have arrived at that, either locally of nationally.

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 8:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — March 19, 2014 at 8:39 p.m.

The Repubs are split fighting their battles as neoCons, moralists, Libertarians, populists, etc. They have allowed diverse views (within their own parameters) and are slowly working to a unification of sorts.

The Dems are still pushing to their vision of an ideal America - and have lost many (like me) along the way. The Dem leadership doesn't allow deviation from the party line (unless you're going still further to the edge). Very Stalinesque in nature, without the midnight trips to Lubyanka (that we know about, anyhow).

In a way, wave theory may apply. I'm thinking the Repubs have already reached their widest point, and will slowly start coming back to the center. There are some signs (e.g., the last national budget compromise, or the WA homeless fund extension) that they're getting to where they understand they have to either unify, and then reach to the voters at large (vice their own backers), or fade to irrelevancy. Meanwhile, the Dems are still pushing ideology.

All just guesswork. This coming November will be very telling, at the national level. The chances of the Repubs taking the Senate appear better than of the Dems taking the House. There will be some extremely ugly fights over who can vote. Poor ACA registration (except for Medicaid recipients) may indicate enough will vote for candidates (Repub) who say they'll support repeal. Will Hillary start building her power base for 2016, and wrest control from the more liberal crowd currently running the Dems?

If nothing else, we'll have plenty to talk about here in the upcoming months.

roger — March 20, 2014 at 5:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 20, 2014 at 5:37 a.m.

“That looks like a tree, let's call it a tree,' said Coyote to Earthmaker at the beginning, and they walked around the rootdrinker patting their bellies.”

~Jack Kerouac~

nailingit — March 20, 2014 at 7:03 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk @ 7:07 PM: Very clever!

luvithere @ 7:34 PM: Perhaps. I know I raised a big stink about it and that Tyler Graf was nosing around for detail. Maybe the threat of additional media exposure caused him to reconsider.

Don Benton: by the way, the staff who work at DES are not YOUR staff, OK? You use the possesives "my" and "mine" quite liberally when you are referring to adults who stand on their own in your absence.

DES lost another critical employee recently. Turned in their surprise resignation when Don was absent in Olympia, according to Board Time audio. This fellow was the one who worked on the Clean Water presentation yesterday. Another one bites the dust for greener pastures.

Luvithere: Oh. I heard back from the APA. The Seattle branch of Argosy University (online), sometimes known as American School of Professional Psychology or the Washington School of Professional Psychology is not on the accreditation list, nor was it in 2012. Not surprised, but good to see that suspicion confirmed. :)

manthou — March 20, 2014 at 7:17 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger, can you enlighten me as to the Dems ideology and how they push you out if you do not follow it? I have not yet met a really left wing Dem, but I surely can tick off a number of rw folks. I am just curious as I do not see it.

Manthou: yea, as we suspected. Every time a school has a few different names - a nice give-away.

luvithere — March 20, 2014 at 7:48 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm glad everyone in the world loves America. Otherwise, this would be a bit troubling...

-16-Year-Old Sneaks to Top of World Trade Center at 4 a.m., Tweets About It-

nailingit — March 20, 2014 at 8:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 20, 2014 at 5:37 a.m.

I echo luvit's post.

You seem to be making an argument that America has been pushed to the left these last decades. (certainly you couldn't have been referencing the current admin-if so-please provide examples) If so, this is an argument only the staunchest of conservative republicans dare to make. A continuous talking point of Lew Waters and the knd ilk as we've heard in here.

Also this comparison of Dem leadership to Stalin. (instead of past US leadership or something thoughtful) Really over the top. Rather than walk it back citing provocative entertainment, please qualify your comparison with Stalin.

The hard core right has really been amping up their comparisons of our current POTUS to the likes of mass murdering dictators like Hitler and Stalin.

Both ridiculous and unpatriotic in my opinion, and derails any meaningful conversation about the direction of American politics.

I remember you admonished me in the past to consider different viewpoints in the material I read when I trashed the Waters blog. My response was that it was a matter of taste & quality in journalism, and stated my concern about you laying down with dogs and getting fleas.

You must be scratching the hell out of yourself! You know I look out for your best interests roger, with that in mind, consider a complete revamping of your thought process. :)

nailingit — March 20, 2014 at 9:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal

If only the right were half as concerned about corporate buying elections as they are about non-exsistent/inconsequential voter fraud, maybe people would quit voting against their own interests.

-Koch Brothers' Cash Reigns Supreme In The Battles Of 2014-

WASHINGTON -- Democrats appear to be winning the fundraising race at nearly every turn in Senate contests and doing well enough at the House level this year. Their congressional party committees and super PACs are on record pace ahead of their Republican counterparts, while the majority of Democratic incumbents in key races boast a financial advantage over their opponents. And yet, it's still likely Democrats will be outspent by wide margins.

The reason can be summed up in three words: the Koch brothers.

The two billionaire industrialists, Charles and David Koch, and their dual networks of undisclosed donors and "dark money" nonprofits, have emerged as the largest independent political force on the Republican side. Already, groups linked to the Kochs have spent more than $25 million on television and radio in crucial 2014 House and Senate races, according to Democratic media-buying sources. Other reports, which also count spending on digital advertising, show a total that is closer to $30 million.

"It is clear we will be outspent in Senate races across the board just like we were outspent in Senate races last cycle," said Justin Barasky, spokesman for the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee (DSCC).

Read More @

nailingit — March 20, 2014 at 11:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Luvit and Nails -

We humans are quick to recognize the shortcomings of others, but much slower to see our own.

Ted Kennedy was the leader of the liberal wing of the Repub party - frankly, the only real leader they have I'm seeing now is Pelosi. Warren is as good as anyone to assume that mantle when Nancy retires. And they're all gathering in the back rooms, commiserating and plotting - what to do if Hillary actually runs? She's a cinch to clobber anyone they can put up, and will pull the party back to being run by her people.

Or so I hope. As I've said a few times before, I hate to have to vote for Repubs.

roger — March 20, 2014 at 1:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou --- Now you can check out Western Governors University. Lisa Phifer Ross doesn't say what degree if any she obtained in 2011 when she was around 46. She didn't include a date for the MBA.

WGU Washington
MBA-Master of Business Administration · Management and Strategy
Western Governors University
Class of 2011 · Accounting · Salt Lake City, Utah
The University of Alabama
Philosophy · Tuscaloosa, Alabama
Robert E. Lee High School
Class of 1984 · Montgomery, Alabama

Here's one for Argosy:

langenthal — March 20, 2014 at 4:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 20, 2014 at 1:23 p.m.
OK, Kennedy passed away a few years ago. What exactly makes them liberals? I figured most Dems are liberal by definition. Can you give an example of a really lw Dem? And an example of the leftie stuff they are saying?
On the right I counter with a whole slew of people talking about "legit rape", woman's place in kitchen, atheist=traitor, etc etc.

Not arguing, just trying to get an example. I just really do not see any big fanatics on the left.

And I hate to see ya vote for a Republican also for prez. :) especially given the current roster.

luvithere — March 20, 2014 at 5:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 20, 2014 at 1:23 p.m

Hmmmm. I might be wrong or maybe you have your tongue in your cheek but I always thought Teddy was a Demo and so is Nancy.

Hawkman — March 20, 2014 at 5:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Yes, they are or were Dems. Not the issue. The issue was a really really left wing Dem and the strong ideology - I wanted a good example. I can provide (and did so) a few examples of the rhetoric of the far right. I am just trying to find a far leftie to balance the far right.

if you got a good example, let me know. Again, not kidding. Just truly curious.
If I can get past captacha today....

luvithere — March 20, 2014 at 5:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

sorry Hawk, thought it was Roger answering me there. Got to pay more attention.

luvithere — March 20, 2014 at 6:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 20, 2014 at 1:23 p.m.

The only shortcomings I mentioned were with Hitler & Stalin. Not sure of your point.

The Democratic party has a pretty deep bench for leadership, starting with two-term Obama.

I think luvit's point was about extreme views dominating a party, and that your point as off base. It's happening on the right-not the left.

I had my own questions. When you say stuff like...

"Dem leadership doesn't allow deviation from the party line (unless you're going still further to the edge). Very Stalinesque in nature..." (btw-I have my own opinion of Pelosi-a good one-I never thought of her as Stalin) while saying republicans are unifying. Sorry-doesn't wash.

Of course people will want you to explain such a radical statement, as you've yet to do so. But that's cool. Please don't take it personal when folks want an explanation for something like that. Buck up soldier! :) We can agree to disagree.

Given the conservative political social agenda the right spends their time and money on, fighting for 'a strong christian moral society', I'm surprised your statement of "pushing to their vision of an ideal America" isn't geared to the right.

nailingit — March 20, 2014 at 8:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

That was a slip - racing through a comment over a late lunch and my brain got ahead of my typing. It should have said Dems and not Repubs.

Try this one on - Jim McDermott. And I'm not saying he's wrong with everything, but I am saying that a lot of what he's siding with doesn't fly with more conservative voters.

We've had these arguments before. My own "pet peeve" is the issue of requiring insurance plans that cover birth control to also cover abortions. (Yes, I know all the long term cost comparisons and sociological problems when comparing abortion and unwanted kids.) (And no, I don't mean to include abortion due to medical problems or rape in this conversation.) My sticking point is someone being forced to pay for something that relieves someone else of personal responsibility, especially when alternatives (contraception - which I believe should be free) are readily available.

But I've worked most of my adult life in the military, and more than a few have principles against that, so....

That 2008 election was a struggle between the "liberal" and the "centrist" wings of the Dem party. Bill's "you people" in NC gave Ted Kennedy the opportunity to throw his weight behind Obama and swing the nomination to him.

roger — March 21, 2014 at 5:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 21, 2014 at 5:55 a.m.

"My sticking point is someone being forced to pay for something that relieves someone else of personal responsibility..."

Chickenhawks taking us to war, GOP court costs fighting healthcare law, Roe v Wade, voting rights, government shutdown, corporate welfare, etc, etc., etc. I guess we all have our pet peeves about personal responsibility and how that relates fiscally.

As far as McDermott goes, it's a given he's not going to fly with conservatives. He's a democrat. Unfortunately the Limbaugh/Madore/Waters/Pee Wee Herman (maybe not Pee Wee) ilk live in such a political bubble, just having a D by his name makes him the Devil.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 7:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal

The proposed "litter tax", crafted so cleverly that The Columbian would be the only Clark County newspaper to have to cough it up (est $150,000 per year) is bully politics pure and simple. And Boss Benton is behind it. Afterall, he mastered the style to perfection.

Benton credits his staff with coming up with the idea, but because his buddy Tom Mielke floated the plan in 2011 (he has always hated the Columbian openly for as long as I can remember), I cannot help but suspect this idea was hatched during a three-buddy pow wow behind closed doors.

Virginia imposes a litter tax on several types of businesses, newspapers and magazines included, but know what it is? $10 flat rate fee per year per business. Some businesses that produce glass must pay a whopping $15. per year.

Benton's latest bully tactic is designed to help bankrupt our only independent, family-run, award-winning newspaper. And it is an attack on the First Amendment and Free Speech, make no bones about it.

I know some of you may not be weeping at the possibility of The Columbian's demise, but count me as one reader who will fight these clowns for their attempt to dismantle constitutional protections.

This is outright war and I don't think BM and M want to do that with a business that buys ink by the barrel.

BTW, it is not irresponsible journalism to bird dog government officials who are violating the public trust under the guise of "honoring the voice of the people."

Is there an action that can be taken against government officials who misuse their power to promote harm?

I smell another expensive lawsuit in the making, coming on behalf of citizens whose right to be kept informed about CC public notices has been seriously limited.

End of rant.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 7:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

langenthal: Just noticed your post to me at 4:31 pm yesterday.

Hmmm. I thought WGU was "sanctioned" by the governors of some Western States. Interesting rip off report.

Psychologists who practice unsupervised after getting degrees from non-accredited online schools can be a serious threat to public safety. I guess MBAs can do harm, too, but to a lesser degree, I think.

Where the heck have you been? Please chime in more often. I miss your insights and contribution to the discussion here. :)

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 7:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Of further note: Benton has refused interview requests from Columbian reporters since he was handed his plum job. He declines short comments or just does not get back to them, either.

Now, all of a sudden, he is all chatty Cathy on the record with Tyler Graf about this proposed exorbitant litter tax?

It is his "Neener, neener" raspberry blowing moment to the C.

Sorry for the Forum hogging this am. I'm loaded for bear.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 7:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — March 21, 2014 at 5:55 a.m.
Thanks for the link. I am still confused. Would you call him a lw extremist? I see him as aligned with Dems, but not too far left at all based on his record.

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 8:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 7:21 a.m.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 7:36 a.m.

I think everyone needs to take a deep breath on this one. Some of the FB comments are really out there. I think Benton likes to stir the pot and gets his kicks over how much reactionary angst he causes.

I wish Betty Sue was a stand in for Stuart.

A well thought post.

Betty Sue Morris · Top Commenter · Vancouver, Washington

Counties can only impose taxes that are authorized in state law and as I recall, there is no authority for counties to impose and collect a "Litter Tax." In a quick review of title 36 RCW (relating to counties) and title 82 RCW ( relating to taxes) I found no such authority. There is a littler tax authorized in Title 82, but it is a state tax, not a county tax. If anyone out there, including Senator Benton, can correct me, please do. It has been a number of years since I dealt with county tax issues.

Reply · · 3 · 27 minutes ago

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 9:02 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Nails, Manthou.
Between publishing in Reflector and now litter taxes - smacks of revenge to me.

Maybe the commissioners past should not have refused to implement the clean water rules as they were supposed to. Never understood why they were the only county refusing to do so. Now the little folks are supposed to pay up-while giving fee waivers to developers. I don't think so.

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 9:26 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Agreed luvit. It's always the home owners who take it in the rear.

These "fees" are nothing more than a tax, plain & simple.


They've never seen a "fee" they didn't like.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 9:44 a.m. ( | suggest removal

It sounds nicer if you call them fees instead of tax's. Your right Luvithere this would not have happened if the past commissioners had followed the rules. I think there was a county up north that did get a waiver on implementing the clean water rules. I thought the rules were a little off. I don't know if you could bring things back to the way it was in caveman days. I always wondered how they came up with that idea. The stupid thing is why did Benton come out publicly with these ideas. It is as if he is trying to rub salt in the wounds. Also I don't think it was his idea. It came straight from Madore. As it has been said in the Bible or so I have been told, an eye for a eye. Madore is looking for blood from the Columbian. I wish the C would do away with captcha. It is hard for these old eye's to read.

timerick — March 21, 2014 at 10:27 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — March 21, 2014 at 10:27 a.m.
I have no idea either how they can determine water must flow like it did three hundred years ago. Somehow, other counties are able to follow the rules. Why we could not. Now we will be paying for the obstinate refusal by three dudes to not follow the rules.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 9:44 a.m.
Amazing, isn't it, Nails. Change one word from tax to fee and it is loved by Republicans. Change it from fee to tax, the Dems are happy. Either way-stick it to the little guy is the prevailing motto. As long as the rich get off, we are ok.

A sick world getting sicker.

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 10:50 a.m. ( | suggest removal

In the interest of broadening my political reading fare, (at times without regard for quality of content, but opting for the local trashy stuff) this blog remains a source of amusement.

Hot on this week's KeisterSpeak, is an anonymous reply to a Lew Waters...."write", about a local business man raising money to promote public awareness and political support for infrastructure improvement and transportational needs.

Though that is a conversation to be had, the comments are comically troubling, but one in particular from an old friend, is well....!:)))

The Cat is still in her brain!!!

I'm not sure if local republicans are actually this far removed as the faithful few who comment here, but regardless, Lew's blog is always entertaining from a paradoxical point of view.

I just wish more conservatives would enter into the discussion over there. Some very thoughtful comments from Frank Decker recently, but I doubt he'll tread on Lew's angry old lawn again. He wouldn't conform to Lew's way of thinking, and was left feeling less than welcome.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 10:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

And goldenoldie to be fair, I'm sure I speak for most when I say we miss you commenting on the forum.

Your gardening and cooking tips are certainly a loss.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 10:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: I hear you. Benton gets off on pushing people's buttons. He is Master Troll Extraordinaire. I can visualize his dark, smelly lair as I type. :)

I wonder how the Reflector will guard its independent voice, now that M and M have gifted this newspaper new subscribers and a contract?

The Editorial page has not always been supportive of our M and M Boyz antics and Ken Vance promised: We need to do more coverage of these guys:

How much is that $20,000 contract worth to them? We shall see.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 11:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I miss Goldie also Nail. But I also miss the Cat. The Cat offered a little fire to the furnace. I pop over to Lew's blog now and then and there are some that offer interesting points of view. You don't have to agree but it is interesting reading. I miss Lew posting on the C also. He kept things lively. I think it was wrong of the C to ban some of these people.Why Robert Dean was banned I don't know. He always seemed to research very well. Opposing view points are good for all of us. It doesn't need to breed anger or hurt.

timerick — March 21, 2014 at 11:27 a.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 10:50 a.m.

The goalposts have moved so far to the right since Reagan, we're defending reasonable positions from our own 20, with people in our own party willing to compromise even further.

I like the progressive conversation politicians like Warren & Sanders are bringing to the table. It'll be great during the debates.

One positive aspect of the GOP shutting down their own debates to avoid transparency and embarrassing moments as in 2012, is more focus will be lent to solid ideas and reasonable solutions the Dems can put forth.

Sans Romney and Huntsman, the 2012 Republican candidates came off as a bunch of incompetent ideologues at best, at worst, profiteers & crazy. Maybe Donald Trump or Ted Cruz will rescue them in 2016. Imagine-Rand Paul is their leading presidential contender. They have learned nothing. And that can be a very, very good thing.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 11:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 11:18 a.m.

Thanks for digging that up. I've been going through some of their work trying to get a handle on where they stand politically.

Their editor seems to take quite a vocal stance on issues without the cheap shot BS. That is somewhat refreshing. The most this will do is boost the Reflector's viewership, which I suppose is a good thing.

Imagine, wanting to start your own paper and using your position in government to get rid of your would be biggest competitor.

I wouldn't be surprised if this doesn't stoke the recall Madore campaign, and rightfully so.

Ethics have been chucked out the window at Clark County HQ.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 11:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 11:29 a.m.
True dat. I liked Huntsman but he was way too smart for that bunch. Can't have an intellectual at the helm!
Romney just proved that he lost his brain along the campaign trail and catered to fringe. Could be called a show of true character after all. Either way, he is done. Sad, he sounded reasonable at first, especially compared with the rest. I know a number of people who thought they would vote for him at first, but they all changed their minds after a while.

I am still waiting for any example of fringe lw people throwing out nutty ideas like we hear from the far right. I just do not see much unreasonable stuff coming from that corner.

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 11:49 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — March 21, 2014 at 11:27 a.m.

Barring terminal Foot In Mouth disease, I expect the Cat will be back with us again, and hopefully GO also.

I agree about opposing viewpoints. Even one's couched in paranoia, hearsay, prejudice, bigotry and idiocy I've noticed on local blogs. :)

Without the unreasonable, we wouldn't be able to properly gauge reason.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 11:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Nails, the Cat by now must be exploding. Holding it all in for so long. That would be a helluva rant coming.
Can't wait.

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 12:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal

There goes the neighborhood………

Spotted on my walk just now, tucked up nice and cozy like in the opened garage of a neighbor:

A frickin' Tesla.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 12:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Don Benton's proposed litter fee on the C made it to journalist Jim Romenesko's national blog. Way to go! Looks like he will post Press Talk in its entirety tomorrow. :)

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 2:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou I hope Lou finds someone or something else to write about some Saturday. We all read about Benton and the M&M;'s all week. There has to be other issues to tackle. How about our new car tab fees,that are only to benefit King County and the island counties. I think we have all learned enough about Don Benton.

timerick — March 21, 2014 at 2:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 12:47 p.m

You know, they'll sneak up on you, and then they'll sneak up on you. Beautiful car, huh? Wish I could afford one.

So Donnie boy wants to charge for litter, huh. I've got a few ideas about that. Forget the paper, that's just payback. They need to go after the cigarettes and junk food sellers. You guessed it, 7-11 and Mickey-D's. Maybe just the cigs. A nickle a pack should cover it. I do my walk about every morning at the building and that's what I find. Gig butts and food wrappers from donut packages and sandwiches. I'll bet Tim finds the same crap. Bus stop people are........pigs! They have a garbage can 10 feet away and they can't seem to walk that far to throw their coffee cups and ciggy butts away. Un-friggin-believeable.

Anyway, just a thought.

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 3:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick: I don't know, but I gotta say, Benton and his pals just keep coming with the words and actions that responsible journalists cannot ignore. Even the editor of The Reflector has his doubts about them and has chided himself publicly for not doing a better job of covering these rascals.

You triage the news stories just like you triage the wounded.

I think Benton, Madore and Mielke are full body bleeds and are just getting worse as the days go by.

Believe me. I live for the day when we don't have to monitor them and read about their unbelievable actions daily. This is the worse stuff I have seen and I am a Chicago area kid from the one and only original Richard J Daley days.

It is not going to end well for our county, timerick, and I can't blame The Columbian for covering this three ring circus as much as they do.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 3:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 2:03 p.m.

I'm not so sure giving Benton a national look is the best thing.

Today a Chicago blog-tomorrow the HuffPo. After that, Benton will fundraise to his hearts delight, a pariah in the land of legal pot and gay marriage. If there is one thing a conservative politician is good at, it's wearing the mantle of victimhood. With him already on the Koch's payroll, this kind of attention could garner more $$$ for elections.

Besides, I'm sure Don loves this type of attention. He'll scream conspiracy with Chicago Lou. Lou will be branded Lou Romenesko by his detractors and Benton will be a hero for exposing this nexus of Chicago journalistic "thuggery" out to get him, and denounce ties to the Columbian. :) Maybe a stretch but...

He may be a fill-in-the-blank, but he's our fill-in-the-blank.

Just a thought.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 3:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk: I had to drag my husband by the collar off the sidewalk in front of the garage that held the Tesla. Truly. He just froze and stared. Might have been drooling, too. So embarrassing. :)

When I got home I did the online order function, just for kicks and dreams. My preferred model? Over $70,000. But, if I give up the leather interior and custom wheels, I can whittle that down to $65,000.

I am just glad that Tesla is finally getting his just desserts by this car name honor.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 3:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: There you go again, raining on my euphoria. :) You might be right, but Benton's type of folk never heard of Jim Romenesko. He's one of the "elites" they love to hate.

His Clark County buddies will read Lou's column tomorrow and get that message out quick, if they haven't already.

Lou B has tweeted the link.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 3:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 3:55 p.m.

You and me both. Edison put the screws to him when Tesla was working for him and then again after he quit so this is a fair response even if he isn't here to enjoy it.

You have heard (I'm sure) about a few states that have made it impossible to buy one in their state. Mr. Christie is one of the meanies. Tesla sells their cars in their own dealerships, no middleman. Some states say that's not legal. I say, B.S. It's no different than anything else. Seems to me they don't require a middleman for anything else, do they? You can buy fruits and veggies directly from a farm, can't you? How about insurance, right online from E-surance, right? I suspect they are going to have to back off on that one.

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 4:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Your new avatar…….could that be your salute to me? Should have the frizzy, Bride of Frankenstein hair on fire to be completely accurate, though. :D

Hawk: Why are some states banning Tesla sales? Pressure from Big Oil? I did not know that there were no dealers, either.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 4:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

After you mentioned the Tesla, I also looked and played. Wish I could also buy one. Sleek looking and good mileage.

My understanding is that NJ said that without a dealership they cannot have oversight so everything is above board. Biggest BS I read in a long time. Anything for gas buddies, down with Tesla. Times don't change.

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 4:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 4:16 p.m.

I think the pressure is coming from the Auto Dealers Assn of America. They are saying it's unfair because they aren't getting their cut and letting some independent dealer mark up the prices.

Personally, I'd like to buy from the factory, seems like you'd get a "straight" deal. No hanky panky.

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 4:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere and Hawk: Figures. Well, at least we know we can order them directly and get them licensed to drive in WA. They are a handsome car.

Hey, since I am on a roll, I need to share this gem. The Columbian has set up a countdown clock for Madore's East side bridge.

So funny that he did not bother to see that 192nd and 14 is Vancouver's jurisdiction. Watch him move it. Luvithere: you are out that way. What other East county street of 192nd can accommodate it?

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 4:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 4:16 p.m.

LOL. No. It was goldenoldie inspired after I read her her lengthy mind boggling comment on Loo Blog.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 4:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Ha Ha! I must be feeling guilty about bombarding the Forum with all my Clark County concerns and worries!

Let me add one more. Timerick, please forgive me.

The Columbian has developed an East County Bridge Countdown clock. Madore just found out this week, officially, that 192nd Ave is in Vancouver's jurisdiction, so he will have to get Leavitt's approval.

Karmic justice, right before your eyes. :)

When the bridge fails though, he can blame Leavitt now.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 5:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I tried to read Mr. Waters "blog", couldn't get through it. It takes him FOREVER to get to the point and when he does, it turns out to be a very dull nub. Lew reminds me of that guy that used to be on SNL with him standing in front of the mirror with his "daily affirmation". I get the feeling that he needs that to pump himself up every day so he can post his opinionated rubble every day. Of course he has his cheerleaders, KJ and GO. Without them, he'd be talking to himself.

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 5:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 7:21 a.m.

I really wouldn’t refer to it as “cleverly crafted” as it’s plain as day the Columbian is being targeted, and it’s only your assumption that Benton is behind it, although it’s probably a good suspicion. Whatever, it’s not going anywhere.

The article says that 14 DES managers came up with a number of proposals to present to the BoCC. Benton stated that none have been vetted by an attorney.

“None of the options are considered "recommendations," Benton said at a Wednesday work session. "It's our duty to present as many options as possible."

Really manthou, if you’re so use to big city Chicago back room deals, this all ought to be nickel and dime stuff to you and it's small potatoes compared to the CRC travesty.

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 3:42 p.m.

One option that was dismissed Wednesday as being too complicated was charging fast-food restaurants a litter fee. It would be too difficult to calculate how much potential litter waste leaves restaurants and then assess a fee, Benton said.

Newspapers, though, are easy, because they track and publish their circulation numbers, which they use to set advertising rates.”

BTW: “(Businesses) aren't causing the litter; it's people and their practices causing litter," Carlson said. "Maybe the focus should be on that." -- Sounds a lot like “guns don’t kill people, people kill people” for which the gun banners trash the NRA.

And luvithere, talking about extremism, it wasn’t Republicans who advocated for ground water flows to be as they were before European settlements arrived.

kn_dalai — March 21, 2014 at 6:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — March 21, 2014 at 6:27 p.m.

How is that any more complicated than counting newspapers? Don't you think the fast food joints know how many hamburgers they sell per day? Or how much money they make in a day? Seriously, if Benton can't conceive that in his little brain, I've got some POS (point of sale) software I could recommend for him. All that was, was an attack on the Columbian, pure and simple.

Now if you believe Betty Sue, the County can't charge a "litter tax" if it isn't allowed by the State. What do you want to bet old Donnie boy (or a "friend" of his) will introduce a bill that allows that in the next session?

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 7:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman @ 5:57 PM: Could you be referring to Stuart Smalley?

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 8:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

“One option that was dismissed Wednesday as being too complicated was charging fast-food restaurants a litter fee. It would be too difficult to calculate how much potential litter waste leaves restaurants and then assess a fee, Benton said.

Newspapers, though, are easy, because they track and publish their circulation numbers, which they use to set advertising rates.

"There's already an auditing system in place for newspapers," Benton said Wednesday. "You already know how many they put out. One daily paper with a circulation of 28,000 distributes 1.25 million pages of paper a week. It's a pretty significant amount of litter."”

“All that was, was an attack on the Columbian, pure and simple.” -- Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 7:33 p.m.

The requirement for the fast food places may involve proprietary information, among other issues. The hit on the Columbian is obvious. But it’s also only an option for consideration right now, along with others.

kn_dalai — March 21, 2014 at 8:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — March 21, 2014 at 6:27 p.m.
You know, we actually had this conversation about water flow a few months ago, you and me. I said it then and I say it now-I have no idea who and how came up with that calculation. I sincerely doubt, however, that we can point toward a single Dem or Repub for this decision. Seems as it is the law of the state, it probably got approved by a mix of folks. No idea.

And I still want to know how they did it. And I am all for clean water and say the county should have gone along. Rest of the state obviously figured out how to comply.

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 8:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 5:57 p.m.

Insightful comments hawkman. I can only skim over his writes myself. No matter how shallow, fabricated, and flawed his writes are, I suppose it keeps him busy and out of trouble. I enjoy the Crain's comments. She swooped in this time [[[SQUAWK-SQUAWK!!!]]] squawking about shadow governments and people not taking her seriously. Now that was funny on a few levels! These guys are quite a cast of characters for sure.

I bet every one of these guys belong to Glenn Beck's fan club.

nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 8:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — March 21, 2014 at 8:11 p.m.

I wondered, too, at the time who was giving CC its legal advice. Very foolish to think that it could have beaten this lawsuit back, when, as you point out, the rest of the state knew better and complied.

manthou — March 21, 2014 at 8:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — March 21, 2014 at 8:11 p.m.

No real comments of your own? just regurgitating info from the article?

You disappoint me.

As for "real littler", I hardly ever see newspaper as littler. First, people don't really buy them on the street anymore, if they read them in a restaurant, they usually leave them for the next person. Nobody carries a newspaper anymore. I'd like to see him prove that a litter tax on newspaper is warranted.

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 9:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — March 21, 2014 at 9:11 p.m.

My regurgitated facts, are those from the horses mouth which specifically address your shoot from the hip criticisms. And hardly lengthy compared your comrade who makes a habit of posting very lengthy regurgitations on a daily basis.

My own shorter comment is my own and also concisely addresses your knee jerk reaction.

I also don't see newspaper "littler" all that often, and this doesn't sound like a bird that will fly. As I say once again.

kn_dalai — March 21, 2014 at 9:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — March 21, 2014 at 10:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Although another hit piece, Press Talk nailed it today. Maybe Lou took more care with this column knowing national eyes are going to be on it. I don't know. But he tore it up pretty good today.



nailingit — March 22, 2014 at 6:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

One of the many profiteers I spoke of earlier. This huckster made it to the final two in 2012. The difference between the two parties is just amazing.

-Rick Santorum spotlights new movie, film career-

“The whole creative process has really been a wonderful experience for me,” Santorum said. “One of the things I think is important and Ronald Reagan showed is being able to tell a good story and communicate with people on that level is a great skill to have and so this is, if you will, helping me in my other craft by maybe becoming a little better storyteller.”

Santorum said there are more movies coming from the studio this year, including a documentary on religious freedom. He added that four more movies are expected to debut in 2015.

Between town halls on the trail and pitching movies to network executives, Santorum said both audiences are tough, but it comes down to what you’re trying to sell.

Read more:

nailingit — March 22, 2014 at 8:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou no reason to forgive. I don't believe we will see a east county bridge in our future. Maybe in the distant future but not now. As far as the litter I see far more empty bottles and cans and food wrappers where I am. I pick stuff up every day. Some of the bottles are filled with urine. It makes for a unpleasant morning. Also the C-Tran security people park across the street everyday. For some reason the bus stop by us seems to attract unwanted people. The upper end of town doesn't seem to get these unsavory people.

timerick — March 22, 2014 at 11:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick: Many thanks for your kind words. Always appreciated. :)

Back from the Freeholders meeting today in BG. Yep. I got up and drove there. I highly recommend at least watching them all, if you cannot attend. It is an example of a government process that is actually working. Gives me hope, because Clark County is causing me great distress.

In the audience: 12 people, one who left after he testified (Christian Berrigan). CC Auditor Doug Lasher was among us. The majority in the audience: left leaning for sure. Where were all the BG Republicans?

Ten Freeholders in attendance: Jim Moeller, Pat Jollota, Temple Lentz, Randy Mueller, Liz Pike (came in late), Tracy Wilson, Peter Silliman, Gary Lucas, Nan Henricksen, Jim Mains.

Lots of push back today from three: Pike, Silliman and Wilson. I can see them joining forces with Madore to lobby against the passage of this Charter if they don't get all the concessions they wish. Look for it. They are setting it up right now.

One good thing (and this was pushed by Peter Silliman): reconsider the way the commissioners are elected, and have them elected by District is BOTH the primary and general. One other suggestion (maybe made by Tracy Wilson): Go back to three districts, with the three elected by District in both the general and the primary, but have 2 At Large Commissioners, one of whom will be elected by the others as the Chair. More discussions for next week.

Liz, Peter and Tracy, remarkably, wanted to spend more money on commissioner salaries, where the majority of Freeholders want to set it at about $53,000. Surprising for the three most conservative Freeholders to take this stance. Ann Rivers, who was not there, told Jim Mains to share with others: cap salary at $50,000. Makes me suspect that Madore has been lobbying Pike, Silliman, and Wilson, because he swears his job cannot be done part time and has already set that argument up by diminishing the value of a part-time city council. You won't get the same quality service he is giving you now (sarcasm intended).

Please educate yourself on the issues the Freeholders are tacking on our behalf. And look for the likes of Christian Berrigan and other very right wing leaners to oppose any new Charter "just because." He ended his testimony today with a threat of sorts: do it my way or expect me to lobby against it. Way to compromise.

manthou — March 22, 2014 at 12:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Oh. The best comment of the Freeholder meeting today came from Liz Pike. It deserved cheers, but received a lot of laughter, nonetheless.

During the discussion of designing protections against double dipping, Pike asked: Can this be made retroactive?

Of course, it cannot, but it was a great comic relief. Everyone knew to whom she referred. :)

Thievery was what citizen commenter Ralph Schmidt called it. :)

manthou — March 22, 2014 at 2:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Good write regarding Rand Paul's electability.

-Ready for Rand?-

Americans hate Rand Paul’s libertarianism. They just don’t know it yet.

Read more:

nailingit — March 22, 2014 at 3:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — March 22, 2014 at 3:03 p.m.

This write by Kevin D. Williamson is a good read. I’m wondering if you even know why we agree on this. The author is a contributor to the National Review. Google the author. He’s got a real good paper on the city of Detroit debacle, among many others, and it’s got nothing to do with support of Leftist inspired paper and pencil thinking about government created human society. Just exactly the opposite. Of course, one must get past the code word of “Detroit” thing to read this. –( “Detroit is what Democrats do. The last Republican elected mayor of Detroit took office during the Eisenhower administration. The decay of Detroit is not the inevitable outcome of the decline of the automotive industry: The automotive industry is thriving in the United States — but not in Detroit.”) --

The author is making a good distinction between Conservative, Liberal and Libertarian. Based on your continual packaging of Conservative and Libertarian together; I’m sure you don’t even understand this.

I believe you think this is a hit piece on Rand Paul, which it is not. Any number of times now, I’ve tried to point out that the political divide is over what the role of government is. The author of this article is doing the same.

For “social liberals” substitute Socialist, and for “social libertarians” substitute Libertarian. The two opposite ends of the political spectrum.

You thought it was a hit piece on Paul. Dinnint you? Dinnint you?

kn_dalai — March 22, 2014 at 11:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I am waiting on coffee but will respond the best I can. :)


You always speak up when writes strike a nerve and you're afraid that these Gawd awful leftists actually understand your limp and shallow reasoning for a Libertarianpoint of view. Understanding Ayn Rand is a holy person unto you, I thought the Simpson avatar holding Fountainhead my draw your ire.

It's only a book knd, and Ayn was, well, you know........../

This isn't about any "hit piece", but contrasting ideological views and the populace grasping them in a meaningful way at election time. I'm wondering if you read it in it's entirety.

Always with the attempted insults instead of a meaningful conversation.

Rand is unelectable-period.

I suppose it can be daunting as will as disappointing to spend as many hours on various websites, blogs and folks you bump into in life, espousing a doctrine that is neither workable or wanted.

Nor adhered to by you.

Yesterday's news.

nailingit — March 23, 2014 at 8:44 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Get your brackets ready! This will be fun.

I've got Louis Gohmert and Ted Cruz fighting it out in the championship round.

-Bill Maher's Campaign To Find The Worst Member Of Congress Is Underway-

Bill Maher's campaign to find the worst member of Congress is officially underway.

Maher announced the first two members of "Flip A District" on Friday -- the viewer-driven competition to nominate representatives that they want voted out of office. Making the initial cut for the "Tweet Sixteen" are Reps. Michael Grimm (R-N.Y.) and Blake Farenthold (R-Texas), whom Maher panned as the "first two public embarrassments."

Grimm made headlines in January 2014 for threatening to "break" NY1 reporter Michael Scotto "in half." The congressman later called Scotto to apologize for his actions, adding in a statement that he shouldn't have let his emotions get the better of him.

“He seems to be all of Staten Island distilled in one man and there is a lot of enthusiasm out there for making him go away," Maher said of Grimm on Friday.

Farenthold has also made headlines in the past, headed by his September 2013 birther brain freeze on MSNBC, when he couldn't say if President Barack Obama was "legitimately" elected to office.

“He’s the poster boy for why we are doing this," Maher said. "He won in 2010 by 799 votes and then they redistricted it."

Once the "Tweet Sixteen" is rounded out, that list will eventually be narrowed to one member. At that point, Maher explained back in January that he will turn to that person's race for reelection, performing standup targeted at the chosen representative.

nailingit — March 23, 2014 at 9:17 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — March 23, 2014 at 8:44 a.m.

I have no ire. I've no idea what your avatar is, no do I care. You seem to pull these things out of thin air.

You make one erroneous assumption after another, and as I've said, you're very imitative; I think it's you that did not read the entire piece, nor comprehend its meaning. A strong offense is a good defense. A tactic which you can fool others with, but not me,

Your obsessiveness over Ayn Rand, (and other things) is too much. You may want to look at T. Jefferson, for one, as to a basic understanding of Libertarian. You obviously have no comprehension of the notion of government existing so as to protect personal liberties nor even what that means.

Actually, Williamson has sized me and others up pretty well as I'm one of those that thinks free trade should be kept only to countries with similar standards of living. I also thought his observation of the difference between "spirituality" and "religion" was astute.

kn_dalai — March 23, 2014 at 10:25 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Still trolling for a comment I see...

Who'd thought posting a short, thoughtful article about a leading republican presidential candidate would induce getting trolled by some Dittohead saying either one never read it or understood it.

You're quite a package KJ.

A legend in your own mind.

Did that do? (rhetorical)

nailingit — March 23, 2014 at 11:08 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — March 23, 2014 at 4:20 p.m.

Say what? What is this?

Payback for PNW laughing at them or what?

What research group came up with this?

luvithere — March 23, 2014 at 5:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk: The far right fail miserably at satire. They were so late to the game with this type of "humor", if you can call it that.

Did you even crack a smile? I didn't.

Now, give me Bullsh*t Mountain, any day.

manthou — March 23, 2014 at 5:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou, Luvithere,

I didn't think it was funny at all. In fact I didn't read the disclaimer before reading it and was steaming mad. Then I thought the person writing it had her head firmly planted up her rear.

Then I found out it was supposed to be "funny". Well, it isn't!

Hawkman — March 23, 2014 at 6:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal

That's the worst satire I have read in a while then. They need to read the Onion more often to get some pointers.
I read the disclaimer. You sure this is satire or a woman in need of help?

Some of the comments are kinda funny though

luvithere — March 23, 2014 at 6:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Madore Rule Book

If it's different, regulate it
If it's profitable, deregulate it
When in doubt, make a tax cut
If you can't fix it, make everyone scared of it
If you don't like it, deny it's true
If you aren't in charge, oppose everything
Smear is always better than substance
Money! Money! Money! Money! Money! Money!
This space for rent at $100,000 per word
If all else fails, blame the nearest Democrat

Hawkman — March 23, 2014 at 7:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Not sure why, but received this publication as a Sample Copy twice. May have to pay up just to keep it coming. For example...

'How USPS Could Save the Economy, Change Your Life'

jacjak — March 23, 2014 at 8:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal

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