WSUV students raise voices, protest potential cuts
There’s no fluff in budget, chairman of board says at rally
Hundreds of Washington State University Vancouver students and some faculty came together for a rally in protest of recent changes in state funding for higher education at the Salmon Creek campus Thursday. (The Columbian/Troy Wayrynen)
Thursday, February 4, 2010
More than 250 Washington State University Vancouver students took a midday break from classes Thursday to rally on behalf of their future.
The noon event, billed as a “mass walkout” and organized by student government and the Washington Student Association, drew students and a scattering of faculty members to an outdoor plaza to sing, clap and sign petitions protesting what they fear may be in store for higher education as the 2010 Legislature slashes spending to close a $2.6 billion budget gap.
Those actions could include more cuts to academic programs; elimination of crucial financial aid; and even further hikes in tuition, which rose by 14 percent this school year and is set to increase by another 14 percent in 2010-11.
Students also want a voice in future decisions on tuition increases, a voice they say legislation pending in Olympia could silence.
Similar rallies were held at several other state college and university campuses in advance of a student lobbying blitz in Olympia set for Feb. 14-16.
Dreams threatened
Speakers at the Vancouver rally said further cuts in financial aid could force them to defer or even abandon their dreams of a college degree.
“My mother wanted for me what she never got: a college education,” said Sierra Harris, a junior majoring in mechanical engineering who depends on a Washington State Needs Grant to make ends meet. “What happens when they cut need grants? What happens when Washington doesn’t have an educated work force?”
Spring Atkinson, a single mother who had a successful career in the mortgage business before she became a self-described “displaced worker,” hopes for a new career in social media. She is attending WSUV on a full-tuition Vocational Excellence scholarship, but that program too may be o n the cutting block.
“Either I’m going to leave here with a huge load of debt, or I won’t finish at all,” she said.
Mike Worthy, chairman of the WSU Board of Regents, urged students to become politically involved and tell their stories to the decision-makers in Olympia.
State support for higher education has declined since 2001, even with multibillion-dollar increases in overall state funding, Worthy said.
Last year, he said, the WSU system absorbed a $54 million cut in funding. This year, another $13.5 million in cuts is on the table.
“There is no fluff left at WSU,” he said. “Further cuts will erode the quality of a WSUV diploma. More programs will need to be eliminated and visionary initiatives that have been started will not have funding to evolve.”
Because most state higher education spending falls in the category of “discretionary,” it’s especially vulnerable as the Legislature searches for ways to trim.
Vancouver Mayor Tim Leavitt, a graduate of WSU Vancouver, said today’s students have a right to expect help paying for a college education, just as state taxpayers helped him when he was a student.
“Anything I can do to work with our delegation, I am more than happy to do,” he said in an interview. “The education I received at WSU and Clark College was critical to my success.”
Tuition rate debate
On one key issue — who has the authority to set tuition rates, the Legislature or university regents — student organizers suffered a setback this week.
On Wednesday, the Senate Higher Education and Workforce Development Committee voted out Senate Bill 6562, which assigns that authority to the regents at WSU, the University of Washington and Western Washington University, at least through 2018.
Currently, the Legislature sets the upper limits of annual tuition increases.
Under SB 6562, which is supported by the state’s five university presidents and a number of business groups, the regents would set resident undergraduate tuition rates as long as the average annual compounded rate of increase did not exceed 9 percent over the previous 15 years or 14 percent in any one year.
Max Ault, the lead organizer of Thursday’s event, said giving that authority to the regents would cut students out of the tuition-setting process altogether.
“A board of regents could set the limits, but the regents are not elected and are not accountable to the voters or to students,” he said. “If that happens, students will have no voice.”
Ault said he was pleased with the turnout at the rally, which yielded 264 signatures on petitions to the Legislature, asking it to protect funding for higher education.
“I do feel like it was a success, especially for a commuter campus like this,” he said. “It brought students and faculty together.”
Kathie Durbin: 360-735-4523 or kathie.durbin@columbian.com.
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"""More programs will need to be eliminated, and visionary initiatives that have been started will not have funding to evolve."""
Yet the administrators can still receive pay raises. Who'da thunk it!
goldenoldie — February 4, 2010 at 3:16 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Negative Nellie comments again.
Retiree — February 4, 2010 at 3:18 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Hey Retiree, I like your Driver License Photo next to your penname. It is so YOU!
goldenoldie — February 4, 2010 at 3:28 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
No that's not my picture. It's a picture of the typical resident at LaBella Villa.
Retiree — February 4, 2010 at 3:43 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Ah!!! You must've stayed there then!
goldenoldie — February 4, 2010 at 3:47 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
More Hope and Change!!
jollie — February 4, 2010 at 4:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
I wonder how many of those crying they have a right to an education did so with public financial assistance. How many paid anything back?
Funny how so many feel the have a right today to whatever they want, but on someone else's dime.
At one time, people worked to earn funds to pay for their education as they could. The concept of working your way through college seems largely gone now as more and more stand with their hands extended, open and up.
LewWaters — February 4, 2010 at 4:26 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
My kid is paying his own way through college because my wife (who is our sole means of support) makes a little too much for the Pell grants and such. He is fortunate enough to be a good enough student to get some scholarships too. Seems if you are white and middle class you don't get any help at all, you just have to earn it like in the good ole days when I was college age.......
jack28 — February 4, 2010 at 4:52 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
No more Kent State, that was horrible.
jack28 — February 4, 2010 at 4:54 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Welfare for everyone, free school, free healthcare, free housing, free money for all. Just believe in Obama and remember the slogan "Yes We Can!!"
jollie — February 4, 2010 at 5:14 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Education may be a right in Saul Alinsky's world...
What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Thomas Paine
bohicababy — February 4, 2010 at 6:17 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
you had a few glasses of wine tonight, s_mac??
jollie — February 4, 2010 at 8:50 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Ok, something you're all missing is that the state used to subsidize a significantly larger portion of your education. Prior to around 1980, the state (and most states were similar) paid for approximately 70% of the cost of instruction, while the student paid for 30%. Tuition is the 30%. The costs were also much lower.
At most universities in Washington today, the state subsidizes less than 50% of the cost of instruction, with students picking up over 50%. This trend of disinvestment by the state illustrates an alarming shift of public universities becoming private...
Public universities exist because it has been believed in our society that higher education is a public good--the public benefits from having educated citizens. It is certainly a private good as well, as graduates are able to increase their earning power. But we cannot ignore that having a well educated public has significant benefits for society as a whole, and that it is something that society should invest in.
I am also not sure how any of you can respond that students aren't "paying their way" or are "wanting a handout" by protesting legislation that has the potential to double tuition in the next 5-6 years. Tuition is already right around $7k... are you telling me that you feel that it is alright if tuition doubles to $14k? How can you expect any student to work their way through a school that costs $14k a year--not including books (another $1k) or living expenses?
Students aren't asking for a handout--we're asking for the state to continue to invest in funding higher education, to provide financial aid to help those low and middle income students that are qualified to attend but would not otherwise be able to, and to keep tuition affordable and predictable.
WSUStudent — February 4, 2010 at 9:05 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
WSU Student---You say--Students aren't asking for a handout, we're asking for the state to continue to invest in funding higher education. NO, your asking the taxpayer and guess what? the taxpayer is broke. This country is on the verge of economic collapse. Look at California. Their simply is no more money and the government has no idea what to do. We cant buy our way out of debt.
jollie — February 4, 2010 at 9:45 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
time for another Kent State? That has to be one of the dumbest comments ever?
These college morons thinking it is their right to a free college education is also pretty dumb!
vancguy54 — February 4, 2010 at 10:07 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
There cant be another Kent State since our National Guardsman are all in Iraq and Afghanistan plus that was a pretty ridiculous statement to begin with. These college morons you are speaking of are the same ones that elected the guy in the White House who couldn't even run cool-aid stand since he has never had a real job. Unless you call a community agitator a profession.
bohicababy — February 4, 2010 at 10:32 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Too many American students waste too much of their time and our tax dollars getting useless degrees. They graduate with a lot of debt and a degree in Sociology, Womens Studies or something and wonder why they can't get a decent job. I am like a lot of people who worked three jobs, got a practical degree (engineering) and graduated debt free. It took me 7 years and a lot of toil and sweat. Secondary education is not a right. We have become such a weak society of entitled lazy sniveling brats.
EdYoung — February 4, 2010 at 10:48 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Excellent post WSUstudent, thanks. As one who is old enough remember the "old days", I have a problem with the BS that the "kids" should stop whining and work their way through school like we did. When we were in college it wasn't that difficult to earn enough with a summer job to pay for a year's expenses. There was never a shortage of flexible jobs during the school year to augment that income. The current costs require a full time job, with decent pay. We were also fortunate to have a social structure that recognized the value of education. I will admit, however, even way back then there were those who ranted about "this bunch of hedonist spoiled brats", and they were the same fools who cheered the actions at Kent State.
whynot — February 4, 2010 at 11:10 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
What did they do with all that stimulus money?? A Large portion went to education. Hard times in the country require them to eliminate waste . They can start with the stimulus funded Marijuana/Pain Management study that cost a 150,000.This was to study if pot was better with morphine as a painkiller. And Drum Roll Please "HELL YES"!!!!
Zoro — February 4, 2010 at 11:17 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Cost of college has doubled in last 10 years. Pay of college jobs has done nothing in 10 years. Pay of AFTER college jobs has done nothing in 10 years.
BillyDee — February 5, 2010 at 3:03 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Sniveling brats who want a hand out, is exactly what I see and hear. There is no "right" to college. Get off you dead rears and figure out how to pay for it.
I lived in a 3 foot by 6 foot by 3 foot bunk, floating around the world's oceans to pay for my education. Don't like the cost of WSUV get over it and go find another school.
I'm a taxpayer and I'm sick and tired of funding everyone elses "right to ___". This taxpayer is sick and tired of supporting the wants and desires of others.
spdavis68 — February 5, 2010 at 3:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Did any of these students, who are aspiring for higher education, consider organizing a protest in Olympia? That is where the politicians are who pass these laws. I wonder if any of them even know who their representatives are. Hopefully none of them skipped class to attend.
knitkitten — February 5, 2010 at 5:48 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Bring back jobs to America. At the same time, do everything possible to discourage it!! Yeah! It's the American way.
LB — February 5, 2010 at 7:40 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
KNITKITTEN---Students from the entire WSU system, including here in Vancouver have put together a 3-day long event in Olympia to meet directly with legislators on these issues this month...and yes, they do know who their representatives are as they spent two hours yesterday personally calling each and every one of them. Furthermore, Since SB 6562, 6625, and 6276 have been proposed, WSUV students have been in Olympia personally testifying in front of the Senate Committee on Higher Education and Workforce Development.
Communityvoice45 — February 5, 2010 at 7:58 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
A bunch of spoiled brat's!! Here's an idea, why don't they go serve our country, they can earn degrees all the while serving and can even use thier GI Bill afterwards. My son spent 6 yrs serving our country and is looking to use his GI Bill to further his career.
Oh but wait, those who are protesting and throwing their tantrum that they want the taxpayers to pay more wouldn't even begin to think abt serving thier country as it wouldn't fit their agenda.
Instead of asking for more of a handout, why don't they protest and demand that the wages of those teaching and running WSU to take a PAY CUT like most Americans are doing just to keep thier jobs. Lower the cost of tuition in other ways instead of expecting taxpayers to foot the bill.
BTW, the grants are a joke, one young man we know got a grant to go to college he is currently attending yet he seems to have ran out of money, why, because he bought parts for his jeep and other toys and no he didn't need the jeep to attend school, it's being fixed up for 4 wheelin. He also bought a $100+ backpack for school, there's a lot of wasteful spending.
Sorry, no more handouts, tighten the belt like the rest of us and deal with it. The wallet is closed!!!
Ladyhawk61 — February 5, 2010 at 8:01 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
They are a public university. All this animosity seems to indicate that we don't have very educated tax payers here in Clark County. State universities are STATE FUNDED. Students aren't asking for hand outs, those allegations couldn't be any more ignorant. This event was staged in order to mark the beginning of more active involvement of students, university staff, the legislature, and our community to begin working together to preserve the gift of our outstanding higher education here in Washington while developing a stream-lined and more effective budget that doesn't cripple the next generation of the American workforce.
Communityvoice45 — February 5, 2010 at 8:12 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
How about putting passive-aggressive-hatred-spitting-menopausal-old-timer-thinking aside? Just a thought.
Good luck WSUV students and the other students who protested across the state.
I’m a recent grad and WSUV alumni who took no loans and checks from home. However, I studied and worked with many younger students at WSUV that work their butts off doing some less than desirable manual labor to pay for their bills each month. Higher tuition is costing some students to consider putting their dreams on hold.
There are some extremely intelligent students who are becoming first-rate teachers, health-care workers, social workers, scientist and engineers. Some are even becoming entrepreneurs.
Our society needs more intelligent and forward-thinking individuals to help our economy grow and provide jobs.
Overcoming negativity with positive words,
NN
NaterNewman — February 5, 2010 at 8:21 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Tuition should be kept to a level that is affordable to anyone willing to work. Obama had one great idea during his campaign (a broken promise like so many others) that a $4000 annual tuition credit could be earned through community service. Tuition assistance in exchange for service is a good thing to me - not everyone is willing to commit to our military but this is not the only way to serve our nation.
Professors who teach students should be paid a decent salary. Administrators should not be paid more than professors. Coaches... these people should not be paid any more than what is raised through the sports program they coach. If a sports program is a revenue raiser, then by all means pay the coach in relation to that. But if the sports program is sucking money from education it needs to go. Our universities should focus on education FIRST, football dreams second. We can't all play in the NFL.
Grants should not be given period - this is a hand out and nobody needs a hand out. Anyone capable of going to school is capable of giving something in return. Low interest subsidized loans are fine. Maybe that will encourage students to pursue degrees that are useful since they'll be on the hook to repay the funds.
This stuff is not rocket science so why don't we just demand it as voters? If we don't provide a way for higher education for the masses, we're going to have negative consequences - high numbers of unskilled people, high poverty, high crime, and eventually, a socialist revolution.
LB — February 5, 2010 at 8:30 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
It's okay for the Tea Party types to petition for redress of grievances, but not students. By asking for reasonable tuition rates, or at least less insanely expensive tuition rates, you have disturbed the imaginary Fox Noise Bubble of the Grumpy Old Party. You are paying the price in comments, that'll learn you.
Look out kids, it's something you did....
JonADeVore — February 5, 2010 at 9:03 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
NaterNewman, you throw out a spitball like lets get rid of "passive-aggressive menopausal old timer thinking" then go on to complain of the others negativity! LOL. You seem to be the one with the negativity problem so walk the walk and talk your own talk hypocrite. Find constructive solution not just fault and name calling. You have to admit there is an entitlement mentality among younger people today. I agree with EdYoung and others above. I am perfectly willing to pay for/subsidize vocational and technical education for young people that benefits greater society. Engineering, nursing, business,mathematics, education, computer science-YES YES YES. Sociolgy,political science, ethnic and womens studies and most but not all liberal arts-not so much. The weakness in our secondary system is China, India and other economic competitors are churning out students with degrees in hard sciences and we are churning out soft social science degrees.
DawnMiller — February 5, 2010 at 11:59 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
I have to agree with Dawn here. Other countries value skills. Our country puts value on fluffy feely crap and making sure our kids can pursue their baseball dreams.
Ask me to subsidize skills with economic impact and you will have my absolute support. Ask me for grants so you can get a degree in philosophy with a minor in PE and you get a much different response.
China is kicking our tail. Even kids in Mexico have a stronger work ethic in regard to education IME.
LB — February 5, 2010 at 12:05 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
"Overcoming negativity with positive words," Good idea NN. So why do you start your post with "How about putting passive-aggressive-hatred-spitting-menopausal-old-timer-thinking aside? Just a thought."? As one whom you would apparently write off as a "menopausal old timer", I find it offensive. The support for having a strong educational system is not limited to any particular age group, nor do the objections come from any one age group. To start your otherwise excellent post by implying otherwise is unnecessary.
whynot — February 5, 2010 at 12:20 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
The fact is that the cost of attending college has skyrocketed past the point of being attainable, and anyone complaining that students should just "work it off" or "figure it out" is clueless and hopelessly out of touch with reality. Perhaps twenty or more years ago school could be paid for by working part time, but not today. Tuition, books, materials, website access, fees and so on drive the cost of one year of college up past twenty thousand dollars or more. How can anyone expect a student to not only earn that much at a part time job, but also support themselves at the same time? The answer is, they can't. And, despite the sour, bitter resentment displayed here by the negative nancies, these students aren't asking for a handout. They want the costs to stop going up. There is a difference, as anyone who has been irritated by four dollar a gallon gas should understand. Nobody who complains about rising gasoline costs is asking for a handout; they're crying foul on the asinine increases in price. Same thing here. An education is a right (another failing point in the arguments of the bitter trolls here) and pricing it out of reach violates the rights of to populace, not to mention, flies in the face of the very point of state universities, which were never meant to compete with private schools for prestige or charge a premium.
Bottom line, these students are correct. A college education is a right, and state universities are trampling on that right. The bitter, clueless mob can grouse and attack all they wish, but their archaic opinions are as outdated as the belief that the Earth is flat. Education is power, and if America wants to continue leading the world, we need that power.
Jeff_Johnson — February 5, 2010 at 2:40 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
clarkcountie, if you can't grasp the reality of the situation, then please, either educate yourself or spare us your nonsensical ranting. These students are not petitioning for more aid, they are petitioning against the constant rise in tuition rates, which is regulated by the government. If the state didn't allow tuition rates to keep rising out of hand, then there wouldn't be a problem. However, they not only allow state universities to continue raising their rates, but they have been pushing to strip the caps on yearly increases, and that is why there is unrest.
Honestly, get with it, or move on. You may as well blame them for Global Warming if you're only going to post your poorly informed opinions and complaints.
Jeff_Johnson — February 5, 2010 at 6:23 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Jeff Johnson, I have read the constitution and the bill of rights but can't find the part where secondary"education is a right". Maybe there is a amendment somewhere I missed? As to the continuing sob story about it costing twenty grand a year to attend WSUV. Do this: Live at home (room & board covered), work part time, major in something where there will actually be a job when you graduate, borrow as little as needed, repay as quickly as possible. I know I am a radical here in advocating self reliance and personal responsibility but it has worked for a lot of us. The irony here is the older group giving you a hard time are actually be positive in challenging assumptions of entitlement such as your views. If you don't like it perhaps move to Europe or one of the socialist utopias.
EdYoung — February 5, 2010 at 6:52 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Ed.
The Constitution is not the only document granting rights. In other words; just because it isn't in the Constitution does not mean it is not a human right. That simple enough for you?
Your strategy for achieving an education may work, if this was 1975. However, check your calendar and you'll see that this is, in fact, 2010. Your outdated ideas about college don't hold water in modern times. Sorry Skippy, but that's just how it is. Times change. Get with 'em, or get out of the way.
I'm all about self reliance. But I'm also all about fairness and justice, and pricing an education far too high for the majority of Americans to afford is neither. It isn't entitlement or socialism, it is about what is right and fair. Embrace ignorance if you like, but the reality is that education is the gateway to success and power, and holding education out of reach will only hurt America.
Cheers on your heartfelt effort Ed, but you only add to the monotonous chorus of out of touch malcontents who seemingly wish for America to revert to the Dark Ages, and thankfully, you are easily ignored.
Jeff_Johnson — February 5, 2010 at 7:10 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Thanks Ed, for adding the one comment missing in the usual rants about anyone who is concerned about a current situation. "If you don't like it perhaps move to Europe or one of the socialist utopias." Good thing the people who have made this country what it is decided to stick around and work towards change, rather than listening to the "love it or leave it" crowd.
whynot — February 5, 2010 at 7:33 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Why Thank You for your comments. It is good the "something for nothing" crowd is alive and well. I will take your response as a standing ovation. What I love about the United States is EQUALITY OF OPPORTUNITY i.e. if you work hard toward a goal you can achieve the American Dream. I am sorry you find that oh so 1975 and passe. Must be depressing to be so relentlessly pessimistic like you living in a world of diminished expectations without a hand out from the productive. Self reliance and hard work: TIMELESS CONCEPTS. Seems to work for a lot of yong people I know. Sorry you have given up.
EdYoung — February 5, 2010 at 8:48 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Ed, you are truly out to lunch if you believe that higher education in America has anything at all to do with just "working hard toward a goal" or "equality of opportunity." But go ahead and keep desperately clinging to your tunnel visioned, anachronistic view of things if it makes you happy. Some of us choose to dwell in reality, but good for you dreamlanders. I'm sure your fantasy world is a beautiful one.
Jeff_Johnson — February 5, 2010 at 9:17 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Thank you Jeff, and you keep working toward your delusional goal of a shared collectivist utopia. A fantasy equally or more unrealistic than my admittedly hard-nosed worldview. Confiscation of others hard earned wealth with lofty goals of redistributing it under your idealistic ideas of "fairness". It's amazing how easy it is to be generous when you are spending other peoples money. I want to create a new role for government with "rights" such as a new Escalade (or Prius in your case) in every garage, two weeks in Maui and on-demand Michelin 5 Star dining for everyone. While these rights aren't explicitly spelled out anywhere lets just say using your logic their "implied". Transportation, food, clothes, health care, cable &internet access, shelter, secondary education - All basic "rights" on demand. Man the barricades!
EdYoung — February 5, 2010 at 11:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
It's nice to know that the Eds of the world got where they are today with no help from anyone, by golly! No public schools, no police nor fire protection, no roads,highways, nor power grids in place to help them build whatever business they may have been in. No siree bob. They did it with nothing more than the timeless concepts of self reliance and hard work. Lets hear it for those who didn't need those handouts! clap....clap......clap.
whynot — February 5, 2010 at 11:28 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Whynot there are people like myself (and I believe Ed) who believe in a limited role for government which tends to grow like cancer when "rights" such as Jeff above are created. Universal health care, mediocre students getting useless and subsizdized degrees. No one is opposed to basic government functions here. Why is it either a gold plated model or nothing? Nice false dicotomy there. Only government through it's power to tax can deliver certain common goods (police, courts, military, roads, regulation of drugs, airspace, etc). We don't want the European "Government as redistributor/nanny" here. You and Jeff may want us to become more dependant on Big Government. We don't. By the way hows that Health Care thing working for ya? Going to bribe anymore States? Payoff anymore Unions?
DawnMiller — February 6, 2010 at 8:48 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Education is essential to our countries future success. I cannot tell you how many motivated students are attending this school in order to enter the work force or go on to grad school (medicine, pharm, business etc.). I have no sense of entitlement. I study over 40 hrs a week in order to achieve top grades along with a part time job. There is no way I would be able to achieve my goals without some type of financial assistants. On another note - those who are attending college know this: the voting base is older. The baby boomer gen doesn't have our interest in mind. They have eyes on medicare/SS not our education. It is our obligation to stand up and be counted.
grimace — February 6, 2010 at 10:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
"It's nice to know that the Eds of the world got where they are today with no help from anyone"
That's the ultimate irony. Despite his asinine, frothing at the mouth whining about evil college students stealing his money, the truth is that if he got a degree (which based on his posts, I am doubting actually) he received more of a hand-out than anyone attending school today. Classic case of the pot calling the kettle black. Sadly, he and his anti-education ilk here are too addle brained to see that. They got theirs, but just don't want anyone else to get too. They're not anti-entitlement (especially considering that despite their trite rantings, this isn't about entitlements), they're just greedy and self absorbed. Sad that these kind of people have a vote...
Jeff_Johnson — February 6, 2010 at 1:46 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
clarkcountie said "Again, the students should be waving signs at the administration buildings..."
I think YOU should be out waving signs at the administration buildings. The benefits would be two-fold... You would be helping out students who are trying to better themselves, and WE would see fewer of your tired, ill-informed rants. Win/Win situation.
columbianreader — February 6, 2010 at 2:57 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Jeff, again thanks for the ad hominem attack. For the record I graduated from a private University in the early sixties, was a partner in a startup ten years later in a small medical device company which was later sold for stock to a much larger company, started and sold another small company, invested in real estate. It took me seven years to graduate because the college I attended, Drexel required a work-study program and I worked a full time job all through college. I have the been the beneficiary of living in this great country and am grateful. Where you and I disagree mainly is whether subsidized secondary education is a right (your view) or a privilege (my view). The day you convince me our Universities are efficient with our tax dollars and the monies well utililzed I will join your view. Also as to the charge of me being selfish. I have donated probably more than you ever earned and plan to leave my estate ironically to a college scholarship fund at my Alma Mater. I sleep well at night.
EdYoung — February 6, 2010 at 2:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Ed, the ignorant usually do sleep well. They have no conscience to keep them awake.
Jeff_Johnson — February 6, 2010 at 4:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Oh, and by the way, even private universities (Drexel among them) receive public subsidies and tax breaks, which all come from... public tax dollars! Drexel itself even just took fourteen million in stimulus funds. So sorry Ed, but your lame "I'm better because I went to a private school! I'm a self made ubermensch!" argument falls as flat as your lame "these kids are just spoiled, entitlement driven brats!" argument. Neither draws upon facts, logic or even reality. I'll let you decide whether you are being hypocritical, ignorant, or both.
Jeff_Johnson — February 6, 2010 at 4:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Uh, Jeff, in the early 1960's Drexel like most private colleges took little if any aid so to compare 2010 with 1963 is patently absurd. We had a few students going to school on the G.I. Bill so I guess technically we took some aid.The big money started pouring into colleges in the 1970's and has grown bigger every year hence my government money=dependency argument. It's funny how you cite "facts" without actually listing any. Nice self serving platitudes however. If I can get anything from this exchange it is a clear snapshot of the product our fine State universities are producing. Incidentally I have always supported every K-12 levy and tax increase as I feel we good value from that system and it is a fundamental underpinning of our democracy. I've enjoyed the gratuitous name calling and lack of logic you have flung my way. With a 1.7 trillion+ federal/2.9 billion state deficit good luck funding your boondoggles. The least of your worries will be conservative old cranks like me who vote. The November midterm elections will tell the story about how thin the support is for profligate spenders like yourselves. Trust me on that one! Clarkcountie: Shouldn't it be mommy not mommie.
EdYoung — February 6, 2010 at 7:04 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
I gave her a pass on the spelling of mommie. I assumed she meant "mommie", as in the film "Mommie Dearest", since we're referring to her disposition towards youth.
columbianreader — February 6, 2010 at 9:19 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
And here I didn't think you knew much about anything, countie. But you had it right this time- it IS time for my nap.
columbianreader — February 7, 2010 at 6:11 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
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