Open forum, Nov 12-18

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269 comments

Comments

A thought on the recent elections.

On the national scene, with their publicized demands that any budget will start with tax increases on the wealthy, the Democrats are starting to act as though they've received a clear mandate from the people. This is not true - they have a bare majority.

If we're going to have anything productive come out of Wash DC, then those people need to start working together. Pres Obama in particular needs to learn the art of crossing the aisle and working with Speaker Boehner if he plans on accomplishing anything useful. Pres Bush trying to ignore Congress and Speaker Pelosi's proclamation that "we're in charge now" both failed. And Senator Murray has been around long enough to know better than to engage in saber rattling - they do need 60 votes to get a budget passed through the Senate.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 7:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger- No amount of spin changes the numbers...

**Election Results:**

Candidate Popular vote/ Electoral votes (270 to win)

Barack Obama **51%** **332**

Mitt Romney **48%** **206**

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 8:08 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger, I would hope that congress also works with the president. Collaboration goes both ways. Boehner also needs to cross the isle for a change. Enough of gridlock and stalling and stubborn resistance. Enough with signing oath to someone besides the constitution.

But I want **BOTH** sides to quit the crap and get to work. As a person who pays their salary and their BENEFITS (and such wonderful ones they get), I insist they get off their behind and actually do the work.

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 8:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal


After four years of republican obstructionism something needs to change, the American people have overwhelmingly voted for it. I'm glad to see a little backbone from the left. This is a start.

I know everyone wants a kumbaya moment but it ain't going to happen.

**Filibuster Reform: Democrats, GOP Gear Up For Fight**

WASHINGTON — A brewing and potentially bitter fight over Democratic efforts to curb filibusters is threatening to inflame partisan tensions in the Senate, even as President Barack Obama and Republicans explore whether they can compromise on top tier issues such as debt reduction and taxes.

A potential showdown vote to limit Senate filibusters would not come until January. Democrats are threatening to resort to a seldom-used procedure that could let them change the rules without GOP support, all but inviting Republican retaliation.

..

Filibusters are a procedural tactic that lets the minority party block bills that lack the support of at least 60 senators. Democrats seem likely to command a 55-45 majority in the new Senate, making 60 a difficult hurdle.

Frustrated by the GOP's growing use of filibusters, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is considering a Senate vote in the new year to limit their use.

"I think that the rules have been abused and that we're going to work to change them," Reid, D-Nev., told reporters this past week. "We're not going to do away with the filibuster, but we're going to make the Senate a more meaningful place, we're going to make it so that we can get things done."

Democrats say that vote to change the rules would require a simple majority of senators, and they argue that the Constitution lets Senate majorities write new rules for the chamber. That, in effect, would mean Democrats could change the rules over GOP opposition, assuming 51 Democrats go along.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/11/filibuster-reform-democrats-republicans_n_2113285.html

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 8:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger: you cannot blame President Obama for not knowing how to cross the aisle and extend his hand. The Republicans have to accept it. So far, most have refused to do so and are proud of it.

Another topic: I would love for Dana B or you, Roger, to weigh in on the Petraeus affair. How do you military folk regard it? Civilians may be more forgiving, but we may not fully understand the security breach implications in such a lapse in judgement.

Help fill in the picture for me from your perspective, please.

manthou — November 12, 2012 at 9:08 a.m. ( | suggest removal


US House R sent 32 jobs bills to the senate none made it out.. Now that's the kind of cooperation the democrats are talking about during Obamas first 4 years...
We should all know these next 4 years will move at a snails pace with continued slow or backward economic growth...remeber the 500K shovel ready jobs Obama promised once he was elected in 08.. He had no plan, he just said those things at "THAT TIME" to get elected... If he started a plan today by the time it came to fruition would be at least 3-5years away or longer... LOOK at the CRC project, it took over 10 years just to get all the EPA and other approvals.. Major work projects in the US take Years before an actual shovel hits the ground so Job growth will have to come from other sectors, which ones would those be should be the question. Focus on the immeadiate and work on the future,,,Just my thoughts... And you know what, "I hope Obama hits a home run" in his second term.. It can only benefit all of us...

vanwadreamer — November 12, 2012 at 9:22 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Nailingit - Your stats prove my point; 51% to 48% is NOT a clear mandate from the populace at large. And if you consider that we are 50 states that form 1 nation, then those who represent all those red states are going to continue pursuing a course different than that of The President.

Manthou - There have been many articles saying Pres Obama barely works with his own party in the House and Senate. Some members of those bodies have noted this as a shortcoming - both with their reelection efforts and with trying to get public support for legislation.

The Repubs have their own identity crisis to work through. But if anyone thinks they're going to drop what they stand for and start rubber-stamping the Democratic agenda, guess again. And the rule of thumb is that those in the position of power need to reach out - like Pres Clinton did with Newtie.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 9:53 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou,

RE: Gen Petraeus, as near as I can tell he was retired and heading CIA when this affair began. While I'm disappointed in him as an individual, I'm not sure this matters from a military viewpoint.

I'm much more concerned with the Brigadier General Sinclair case out of Ft Bragg. Pending the outcome of this week’s Article 32 hearing, BG Sinclair could be court martialed on charges that include forcible sodomy, wrongful sexual conduct, violating orders, engaging in inappropriate relationships, misusing a government travel charge card, and possessing pornography and alcohol while deployed. When confronted about derogatory comments toward women, he's alleged to have replied "I'm a general, I'll do whatever the (expletive) I want." There's a strong likelihood that the outcome of the court martial will be that he'll be reduced in rank and forced to retire - no jail time.

Also, 4 of his 5 victims were female officers - their behavior also bothers me. Some, if not all, placed their careers above the good of the Army.

The Army responded to past events - like the Sergeant Major of The Army McKinney case - by a strong campaign to instill Army Values - a code of ethics and behaviors all soldiers are expected to adopt and live by. There is (or was) ongoing training to ensure everyone understood exactly what is expected. BG Sinclair probably violated every one of them, and his victims also failed to live up to a few (moral courage comes to mind). Incidents like this from the leadership send a very negative message to the ranks.

The other thing that bothers me is that senior leaders are usually allowed to resign "in disgrace". A junior officer or enlisted person would almost definitely be looking at doing time in Leavenworth if found guilty of forcible sodomy, and possibly for the misuse of the travel card too.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 10:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger- Just wanted to add some perspective. Considering your logic with the popular vote, (for the moment we'll forget the overwhelming majority of electoral numbers and dynamics with the economy which in most times would have defeated the incumbent)) only four elections since Lyndon Johnson (in the last 48 years) have received a higher popular vote count than this election, and one of those was Obama in 2008.

Nixon in 1972- 60%

Reagan in 1984- 58%

H. W. Bush in 1988- 53%

Obama in 2008- 52%

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 10:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger, regarding higher placed officers resigning while juniors go to jail: here's a saying which I found to be true in many cases.

A rich man's folly is a poor man's felony.

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 10:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*which in most times would have defeated the incumbent*

correction; which in any other time in history would have defeated the incumbent

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 10:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Anybody read this? (posting link for first time, hope it works). All about the US being the biggest oil producer soon.

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/u-s-overtake-saudi-arabia-top-oil-producer-1C6983978

Astounding.

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 10:50 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Nails, you're changing the discussion to what suits your purpose. MY POINT was that if Pres Obama wants to be successful, he is the one who needs to reach out to Speaker Boehner and say "Let's sit down and work toward constructive compromises and solutions we can all live with." This allows for a "Win-Win" outcome. To expect Speaker Boehner to go to The Pres is to say "You won, so let's do it your way." It just ain't happening.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 11:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Military will always have their share of misconduct. More importantly when the head of the Central Intelligence Agency allows civilians access to personal e-mails, (among other things) and that access involves threatening and harassing statements against a State Department official it is more than troublesome on a much higher level. This is the Head of the CIA for Christ's sake!!

To point...

It's not the first time Broadwell has boasted of an unusual level of access to the inner workings of Petraeus' world.

In a speech this summer at the Aspen Institute, Broadwell noted that she regularly had access to classified information in the course of her work in Afghanistan, when she was embedded for about a year in 2010 and 2011.

"I was entrusted with this opportunity to sit in on high level meetings with General Petraeus. Sitting in on SCIF [sensitive compartmented information facility] meetings in the morning, listen to classified chatter of terrorist talk and so forth. And I had that background anyhow, so I knew a lot of that information for my writing, but I knew there was a clear line that I couldn’t cross when I was writing it out," Broadwell said, according to remarks recounted by Politico.

It's not clear how inappropriate Broadwell's access was. As an Army reservist with a background in counterintelligence, Broadwell had a high-level security clearance.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/11/paula-broadwell-emails-david-petraeus-state-department_n_2114319.html

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 11:03 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*Nails, you're changing the discussion to what suits your purpose.*

Just speaking to what I consider a really poor/invalid point you were trying to make. On target with facts.....and stats!

*Your stats prove my point; 51% to 48% is NOT a clear mandate from the populace at large.*

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 11:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal


luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 8:12 a.m.

I almost agreed with your entire comment but then began to consider the thought that if we didn't have some resistance in government with regards to decision making, what type of government would we have if everyone always agreed with the commander in chief???

I do believe making decisions should not be solely because of what party affiliation they belong. That's just as bad as agreeing to everything.

goldenoldie — November 12, 2012 at 11:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — November 12, 2012 at 11:01 a.m.

Roger, it is my opinion that the olive branch should come from BOTH gentlemen, not just one or the other.

goldenoldie — November 12, 2012 at 11:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Gold, my point was that **both sides** need to come together, negotiate, compromise. I just happen to believe that Boehner made it a point NOT to. One can hope that this time around it will be a bit different. And yes, signing a secondary oath is wrong, plain wrong.

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 11:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Then it appears we're in agreement, luvithere...8)...

goldenoldie — November 12, 2012 at 11:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal


and may we be an example to DC!

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 11:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger: Thanks for your response. I am still mulling it all over. I ache about it. Crazy.

This makes me ache, too. States are wanting to secede from the Union again. Oregon among them. Isn't this how the Civil War began?

http://gawker.com/5959719/we-the-people-petitions-filed-in-nineteen-states-seeking-permission-to-secede-from-the-union

manthou — November 12, 2012 at 11:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou, do you really think this is going anywhere? Reaction from the side that lost. On the other hand...I will help Texas pack :)

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 11:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Good to read! Some are getting it!

**220 marijuana cases already dismissed in legalized Washington**

*"There's no point continuing to seek criminal penalties," said prosecutor*

Less than a week ago, voters in Washington State approved the legalization of recreational marijuana use. Prosecutors in the state are already acting on the decision. Around 220 misdemeanor cases involving pot possession of less than one ounce by individuals over 21 (which will be legal under the new law) have already been dismissed in the Seattle area.

“Although the effective date of I-502 [the legalization bill] is not until December 6, there is no point in continuing to seek criminal penalties for conduct that will be legal next month,” King County Prosecutor Dan Satterberg told the Seattle Times, adding “I think when the people voted to change the policy, they weren’t focused on when the effective date of the new policy would be. They spoke loudly and clearly that we should not treat small amounts of marijuana as an offense.”

Read more @ http://www.salon.com/2012/11/12/220_marijuana_cases_already_dismissed_in_legalized_washington/

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 11:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou — November 12, 2012 at 11:39 a.m

If you look at the whole story and petitions, it's not the States that are petitioning, it's a bunch of Ron Paul individuals and many of them signing the petitions don't even live in the states they are signing under, which would make them invalid.

hawkeye — November 12, 2012 at noon ( | suggest removal


Luvithere,

Interesting article; I hadn't heard of "light tight oil" before reading it. It seems they use fracking to recover this oil, so I expect we'll be hearing more about it.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 12:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger, I think we will hear more about fracking itself also. Seems to cause a few bad side effects. I am definitely not sold on it.

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 12:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal


And this will be a deal breaker. If Harry Reid can force this through, don't expect the House to cooperate on anything.

http://www.newser.com/article/da2gbl9o0/brewing-senate-fight-over-curbing-filibusters-could-threaten-postelection-co-operation.html

roger — November 12, 2012 at 12:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Luvithere,

I'm not certain whether the problems associated with fracking are real, widespread, or anything else. They definitely have to take precautions to properly store the water and other chemicals used to avoid contamination. But all this business of it seeping through cracks in the shale, oil wells, etc, and causing people's house water to burn may not be more than a "onesy-twosy" event that may not even be due to the local wells - I've read where those events pre-date the LNG drilling fields.

A lot of the drilling is going on near the east branch of the Susquehanna River; due northeast of my old PA hometown. I've asked a few of my old friends (mostly hard-core Libs who would be opposed if there was anything going on) - they're not seeing any problems.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 12:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawkeye @ high noon (how did ya do that?): You are so correct. Doubt they will get their 25,000 signatures, but hooray for their right to gather them!

Hey, lookey here: Paula Broadwell with Karl Rove in June:

http://crooksandliars.com/karoli/petraeus-rove-and-paula-broadwell-i-smell-r

The plot thickens. Was she passing notes to Karl for David? I read a quote from her dad yesterday in her defense, something along the lines: just wait until the truth comes out and that she is the scapegoat.

I love a conspiracy!

Nailingit: where are you on this? Asleep at the ol' wheel?

manthou — November 12, 2012 at 1:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Is this the question that begs an answer?

Did the head of the CIA , Petraeus, pass on classified info through his girlfriend to Rove to aid the political campaign of Mitt Romney?

Just askin'

Stay tuned.

manthou — November 12, 2012 at 2:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou — November 12, 2012 at 1:42 p.m.

So much drama. Looks to me like Broadwell could be up for traitor of the year. Either she was passing notes for David or she was on the other team spying.

hawkeye — November 12, 2012 at 2:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Wow - Good find, manthou. This is getting interesting. If GEN Petraeus is in on this, then HE is traitor, skunk, and everything else negative of the year. Hopefully it's a set-up; I'd rather see the mud end up on Rove.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 2:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 11:39 a.m.

Sounds good to me!!!

goldenoldie — November 12, 2012 at 2:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 10:36 a.m.

Your stats are somewhat deceptive, yes only four since LBJ have gotten a higher percentage of the popular vote, but only one has won reelection by a slimmer margin.
1968 LBJ 22.5%

1972 Nixon 23.2%

1984 Reagan 18.2$

1996 Clinton 8.5%

2004 Bush 2.4%

2012 Obama 2.8%

frobert — November 12, 2012 at 5 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Interesting stats, Fro. So should Obama be like George Bush and crow about a mandate and being the decider?

Fact still remains that he won. Since to this day I am not sure who actually won in 2000 and 2004 (given the many instances of fraud in Ohio), at least this time around I feel that this election was really won.

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 5:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Luvithere and Goldie,

You're reacting like adults. I'm talking politicians and power. The Dems are approaching their victory all wrong, in my opinion. The Constitution says that all bills for raising revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives - Pres Obama MUST have Speaker Boehner working with him to accomplish anything. It's one thing for The Pres and Sen Murray to state that the budget must include raising taxes on the rich - though the public proclamations of this aren't really necessary as everyone knows that's one of their non-negotiable points. But for Harry Reid to come out and say he's going to use a "little known" Senate rule to curtail the use of the filibuster makes absolutely no sense. This is just like Nancy Pelosi all over - "We're running the show, so you go sit down and be quiet." This is a direct challenge - a slap in the face of the Repub party - that Boehner can't ignore.

Me - I dislike all of them.

roger — November 12, 2012 at 5:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Your stats are somewhat deceptive*

No. You are wrong. The stats speak for themselves.

manthou-*Nailingit: where are you on this? Asleep at the ol' wheel?*

ZZZZzzzzz....huh? :) I'm going to wait until this gets vetted. I'm not seeing mainstream reporting on this Karl Rove connect. A 5 month old pic with Karl Rove doesn't amount to a whole lot. The other info is speculation at best.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Check out some nitty gritty from the Business Insider...

Also we have learned from law enforcement sources — law enforcement officials — that the FBI is now investigating, and this is an ongoing investigation, into Paula Broadwell.
... The FBI investigation is seeing whether she had improper access to General Petraeus' emails and may have had access to his ... may have accidentally or deliberately had access to classified information. And so we know this investigation is taking place, and that it has identified Paula Broadwell.

The investigation began last spring, reports Ronald Kessler at conservative magazine Newsmax.

Kessler's report claims that the FBI intercepted Petraeus' emails with Broadwell, and they had included sexually explicit references, like "sex under a desk." The pair reportedly broke up some point after Petraeus become CIA Director, but he continued sending thousands of emails to her over the past few months.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-david-petraeus-paula-broadwell-2012-11#ixzz2C3vAuSkO

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 5:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal


The art of negotiation.....can be a lost one indeed. Obama/Reid/leadership are starting far left as they should.

Republicans always start negotiations far right, as expected.

Acting adult has zero to do with it. It's a process of negotiating. Starting from one end in order to end up (what should be due to the elections) as middle left.

Obama's problem in the past is that he starts in the middle and ends up right.

This is hardball politics, not buying AA batteries at Costco.

Just sayin'

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 5:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*but he continued sending thousands of emails to her over the past few months.*

One thousand e-mails in one month amount to over 30 a day. How does the director of the **CIA** have this much down time? What a joke!

Another RW golden boy crashes to earth and we have to clean it up. Again.

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 5:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger@5:28

so true-neither side's gonna take all the marbles. Let's just hope these bozos, and they are if they don't put this partisian BS aside, figure it out. Yea, the D's did better-much better-in the election than I thought they would. Maybe it's time they acknowledged a lot of "power" exists in the House as well it should and deal with that.

I've never seen anything that directly relates increased federal revenue with anything other than increased federal spending, a point I hope the R's drive home. On that point, I hope they stick to their guns.

mrd — November 12, 2012 at 6:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal


So just how can one derive a “mandate” out of such narrow margins?

This is what happens folks, when one spends their life indoctrinating themselves with the writings of one Leftist rag after another. Or in other ways; are so inwardly and positively focused on their certainties of the rightness of collectivism through government.

Separately, here is the problem with compromise: “If I can’t get the whole loaf now, then settle for half a loaf now; then get the other half later.” Do you not understand the nature of the Left as activists who wish to use government to further their agenda? It’s about time the R’s finally started saying no.

There is no question of the hard Left turn this country took during the FDR years. The Left assumes that more Socialism through government is the answer, while the Right has had enough.

As stated before, while so many are quick to point to Europe as an example of a proper template, just how do you explain the economic turmoil going on there right now?

kn_dalai — November 12, 2012 at 6:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal


We need to keep in mind no one spends like a kid in a candy store like the right. Trillions for tax breaks and war. Dubya and Reagan are the worst in history.

It's not so much about mulling over the numbers, it's about the will of the people and what this election was about. No more trillions in tax cuts for the rich and for the unending war machine. Stop shorting citizens on public necessities like education and and emergency services.

Medicare and Social security benefits are not to be touched. This is the will of the majority.

It's called core. It's called values. It's called conviction. It's called leadership.

In Romney World none of those things existed.

I hope to high hell Obama & company grow some and fight for true progressive/liberal values.

Or this election meant nothing.

Sounds like some want nothing more than a figurehead for a president instead of a leader.

A good read from factcheck.org. The analysis also includes Obama unfavorables as well.

Let's not forget recent history..................................................................

**Analysis**

Mitt Romney claims President Barack Obama’s spending amounts to an “inferno.” But who is really responsible for the huge jump that took place in fiscal 2009? Here are some undisputed facts:

Fiscal 2009 began Oct. 1, 2008. That was before Obama was elected, and nearly four months before he took office on Jan. 20, 2009.

President Bush signed the massive spending bill under which the government was operating when Obama took office. That was Sept. 30, 2008. As The Associated Press noted, it combined “a record Pentagon budget with aid for automakers and natural disaster victims, and increased health care funding for veterans returning from Iraq and Afghanistan.”

Bush also signed, on Oct. 3, 2008, a bank bailout bill that authorized another $700 billion to avert a looming financial collapse (though not all of that would end up being spent in fiscal 2009, and Obama later signed a measure reducing total authorized bailout spending to $475 billion).

On Jan. 7, 2009 — two weeks before Obama took office — the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office issued its regular budget outlook, stating: “CBO projects that the deficit this year will total $1.2 trillion.”

CBO attributed the rapid rise in spending to the bank bailout and the federal takeover of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac – plus rising costs for unemployment insurance and other factors driven by the collapsing economy (which shed 818,000 jobs in January alone).

Another factor beyond Obama’s control was an automatic 5.8 percent cost of living increase announced in October 2008 and given to Social Security beneficiaries in January 2009. It was the largest since 1982. Social Security spending alone rose $66 billion in fiscal 2009, and Medicare spending, driven by rising medical costs, rose $39 billion.

http://www.factcheck.org/2012/06/obamas-spending-inferno-or-not/

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 6:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*This is what happens folks, when one spends their life indoctrinating themselves with the writings of one Leftist rag after another.*

It's called live and learn k_nd. Something conservative ideologues such as yourself can't cope with.

*It’s about time the R’s finally started saying no.*

Well there we have it. The extremist right point of view says obstruct some more. The more the better. And there's a bunch of then in Congress.

That's why when I hear some of you dream about kumbaya moments I know it's exactly that. A dream.

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 6:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I'm with luvit. I'll help Texas pack *and* provide some transportation to the nearest Texas town for the locals who find our country too "leftist", or "collectivist", or any other ridiculous label radicals lend to a functioning government.

Hell kn_d, I'll drive you as far as Dallas if you'd like.

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 6:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 5:57 p.m

"Another RW golden boy crashes to earth and we have to clean it up. Again."

Wasn't he appointed by Obama?

frobert — November 12, 2012 at 7:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Fro,
he was in government for a long time, in military, under the Bushes, before the Bushes, and then at CIA under Obama. I do not care who appointed him. We got boys with a zipper issue on both sides. He might have just done the four-letter-word, but he also seems to have four-letter-worded the rest of us. Maybe.

I really do not care what these boys do in their private life. None of them. That's up to their spouses to clean up. I only care if something gets compromised at the national/government level. And that's all any of us should care about.

luvithere — November 12, 2012 at 7:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


And some of you actually pay attention to this nail person.

” conservative ideologues such as yourself”. What?

“extremist right point of view says obstruct some more.” What?

” kumbaya moments.” What? Now just who is more associated with the Kumbaya thing.

Perhaps you should finally refer to the concise definitions which I referred to last week. I can well understand why people think differently about the purpose of government. What is disgusting to me is the total lack of understanding as to the different thoughts about the purpose and efficacy of government, which nail so well exemplifies.

kn_dalai — November 12, 2012 at 7:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert- Yes. I suspect this debacle is a result of that wonderful olive branch called bi-partisanship that so many are high on.

---

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Qghot...

I don't ascribe to a conspiracy to destroy the middle class, but this provides some great insight as to the short comings from the strange world of libertarian thought.

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 7:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal


It's being reported the FBI just conducted a search of Paula Broadwell's home.

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 7:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal


That "strange world of libertarian thought" was what the U.S. Federal Constitution was premised upon.

As many times as I have referenced this; you still don't have a clue do you.

kn_dalai — November 12, 2012 at 7:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal


” conservative ideologues such as yourself”. What?

ideologue def: an often blindly partisan advocate or adherent of a particular ideology

*what?*

*“extremist right point of view says obstruct some more.” What?*

Separately, here is the problem with compromise: “If I can’t get the whole loaf now, then settle for half a loaf now; then get the other half later.” Do you not understand the nature of the Left as activists who wish to use government to further their agenda? It’s about time the R’s finally started saying no.

*what?*

*What is disgusting to me is the total lack of understanding as to the different thoughts about the purpose and efficacy of government, which nail so well exemplifies.*

You? Talking about efficacy of government?! LOL!!

Are you a teacher? Or used to be? Just curious.

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 7:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Did you vote kn_d?

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 7:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*That "strange world of libertarian thought" was what the U.S. Federal Constitution was premised upon.*

Then how could you possibly ever be wrong? :))))) My God. You are emblematic of the obstructionism in DC.

Avatarally speaking of course! Oh, and I almost forgot....... :)

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 7:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Did you vote k_nd?

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 7:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Once again; what total gibberish.

Is this what some of you Leftists think passes for political debate?

Perhaps you should finally try to understand the importance of differing political ideas and how that is different than one's personal feelings.

I refer you to my posts on this subject last week.

(MY GOD PEOPLE, COMPLAIN ALL YOU WANT! BUT TRY TO UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE ROLE OF GOVERNMENT, AS SEEN BY OTHERS!!)

kn_dalai — November 12, 2012 at 8:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal


(MY GOD PEOPLE, COMPLAIN ALL YOU WANT! BUT TRY TO UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE ROLE OF GOVERNMENT, AS SEEN BY OTHERS!!)

Feel better?

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 8:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal


> Feel better? -- nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 8:12 p.m.

Perhaps you can actually say something.

kn_dalai — November 12, 2012 at 8:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Perhaps you can actually say something.*

Certainly you wouldn't have me bloviate more than I am! @ 6:42 sums it up.

Okay I give. Did you vote?

---

It's called policy shaping for the 21st century Newter. That and not treating our president like he's a communist foreigner bent on destroying our country. There's that. People saw through it for the contemptible divisive garbage it is Newt. Now go home to Callista!

**Newt Gingrich: ‘Dumfounded’ by election**

Newt Gingrich on Monday pronounced himself “dumbfounded” that GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney earned fewer votes than the party’s 2008 standard-bearer, Ariz. Sen. John McCain.

**“The president won an extraordinary victory, and the fact is we owe him the respect of trying to understand what they did and how they did it,”** Gingrich said on NBC’s “Today.” “But if you had said to me three weeks ago that Mitt Romney would get fewer votes than John McCain — and it looks like he’ll be 2 million fewer — I would have been dumbfounded.”

Gingrich unsuccessfully challenged Romney for the GOP nomination. In the latest count from The Associated Press, Romney has 58.8 million votes. McCain received 59.9 million votes in 2008.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1112/83710.html#ixzz2C4bEhyao

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 8:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlVDGm...

*Perhaps you should finally refer to the concise definitions which I referred to last week.*

Sounds like homework! :)

K_nd, have you ever taught economics/and/or appeared in a Dangerfield movie?

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 8:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I'm asking you if you voted k_nd, because I wonder if someone who seemingly hates our government governing as much as you, would participate in the process.

After all, a group of people casting their ballots to elect a common ground leader in order to govern it's people and shape a majority of ideas into policy sounds a bit collectivist. Don't you think?

I've also found that those who gripe the loudest tend to vote the least.

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 10:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal



**All Aboard!**

Gen. John Allen, Top Afghanistan Commander, Investigated For Email Link To Petraeus Scandal

ABOARD A U.S. MILITARY AIRCRAFT -- The Pentagon says the top American commander in Afghanistan, Gen. John Allen, is under investigation for alleged "inappropriate communications" with Jill Kelley, the woman who is said to have received threatening emails from Paula Broadwell, the woman with whom former CIA Director David Petraeus had an extramarital affair.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/13/john-allen-petraeus_n_2120609.html

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 10:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Seems like the only people who believe that this election wasn't heavily weighted are a few that post here. Think about it.

**Stop talking and spend some time thinking**

After a failed Mitt Romney bid, the GOP must make adjustments, author says.
Close
By NEWT GINGRICH | 11/12/12 4:36 AM EST
We were wrong.

We were wrong about the turnout.

We were wrong about the makeup of the electorate.

We were wrong about the advertising mix and message that would work.

We were wrong about the effectiveness of President Obama’s turnout mechanism.

The simple fact is Republicans spent more and achieved less than Democrats in 2012.

This was not just a personal defeat for Governor Mitt Romney and Congressman Paul Ryan.

We lost Senate seats we should have won in North Dakota and Montana.

We lost Senate seats we might have won in Ohio, Florida, Wisconsin, Virginia, New Mexico, and Massachusetts.

We had two candidates throw away Senate seats in Indiana and Missouri.

In 2010, we had three candidates throw away Senate seats in Colorado, Delaware, and Nevada. Why have the Democrats not suffered similarly from candidate missteps (as in Massachusetts)?

We had a chance to pick up four governorships. We won one (North Carolina) and lost three (Montana, New Hampshire and Washington).

We lost a handful of congressional seats but did especially badly in the West.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1112/83702.html#ixzz2C59JHJaw

nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 10:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal


This comment is to EVERYONE here in the forum and it references something kn_dalai stated. Here's the well-presented comment:

*As stated before, while so many are quick to point to Europe as an example of a proper template, just how do you explain the economic turmoil going on there right now?*

*kn_dalai — November 12, 2012 at 6:38 p.m.*

Folks...our nation has become clearly politically divided since the election of 2008, to the point that friends are no longer speaking to each other and families are divided. Kn-dalai, your statement hit the nail on the head regarding the importance now, more than ever, that we need to have a government that works together.

What truly scares me...and yes, I say *SCARES ME*, is exactly what is happening in Greece, a nation of Democracy with an obvious division in politics and an increasing division of society. Now I'm not trying to point out that one political party is worse off than the other when it comes to partisan prejudice but for HEAVEN'S sake, are we about to witness the same issues here as they are in Greece? I speak of the far-right political agenda of the Golden Dawn. We're now witnessing racial attacks and political protests that in my lifetime, I never hoped to see such violence...and I'm seeing the early stages forming here in the USA. Is that what we really want, people???

It is a good time to urge your congresspeople that we don't want to become another Greece and to urge them to work together to find the solution which best suits our needs...and to end the partisan division which is ever widening.

goldenoldie — November 13, 2012 at 7:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Good morning! goldenoldie, I found k_nd's statement to be nothing more than drivel.

Although folks have pointed out beneficial aspects of other cultures, I believe no one has ever trumped European culture/society as a "proper template" for America.

Just continued emotional rhetoric from k_nd.

This election was a wake up call but many are just hitting the snooze alarm hoping to wake up differently.

*Kn-dalai, your statement hit the nail on the head regarding the importance now, more than ever, that we need to have a government that works together.*

Please cite your quote from k_nd. I missed it. Where does he state anywhere we need to work together?

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie- In fact he advocates for further/renewed obstructionism. Baffled by your 7:39 post. Yes...baffled! :)

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 8:16 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Nail-
11/10/12*Obama's victory was strong and decisive. Democrats across the country won big, not just on economical issues, but social/cultural issues as well. Obama needs to use this capital while it's fresh and personally campaign around the country to pass his agenda. Take it to the people relentlessly.*
Obama didn't win the middle class vote or above. He won the minority vote by enough votes to push him over the top....

*Passing tax cuts immediately for the 98% is a great way to start. He needs to take it to Republican leadership's states and pound it hard.*
So who is the 98% and what kinda tax cuts are you speaking about, I want to know what specifically where you would cut and by how much..

America has moved way too far right in the last 30 years. Obama needs to draw fresh lines in the sand. Not to be divisive, but to do the will of the majority of Americans who voted him in office.
Draw new lines in the sand, just the things you said and hawk said that he shouldn't do so he could get bipartisan agreement... Well that's a good strategy, the same strategy he has employed since Nov 2008....Speaking of FLIP FLOPPING???

Elections have consequences. The Senate races were more than telling. than the house really..The Rep picked up more seats in the house and with the sheer numbers in the house it actually has more power than the senate to stop bills ever becoming law..

*Given all the political variables, this election was more than decisive*.Only decisive from how Obama won the Minority vote....

*It was a directive to government leadership to get the hell out of our personal lives and fix this economy, but not off the backs of the middle class.*

I really like this comment you posted... These were the exact principles of Romney’s campaign. Get out of big government and out of our business... Your just a little mixed up here, maybe one too many blunts has ya thinking off a bit...Put that Pointed cap back on and let us know what you really think...

While the president may have taken in more campaign money than Romney, I will have to vet that post, he still lost the popular vote by 20%.... Coulda been more if the military had a chance to get their ballots...We mailed our sons to him but we haven't heard yet if he received it...

vanwadreamer — November 13, 2012 at 9:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Many are using this opportunity to espouse fear and claims of future partisan dogs and cats living together/political/USA destruction scenarios. Take a breath.

This article lends definition to this issue. Well done!

**Post-election gloating is a patriotic duty**

*Wasn't the election about the outsiders versus the entitled? The geeks won — this is cause for celebration!*

Many people are surprised by the intensity of the Schadenfreude being directed at the Republicans right now. Everywhere you turn, there’s so much gleefully mean gloating, from Rachel Maddow’s barely contained rant about all the things that really are true about Obama and this country, to Jon Stewart’s hilarious mockery of Fox’s election night meltdown, to the whitepeoplemourningromney Tumblr, the left is wallowing in the misery of the right. Some are decrying it as just plain nasty and unpatriotic. But this glee is actually quintessentially American. This unfiltered joy is straight out of every feel-good movie about losers finally having their day, from “Animal House” to “The Bad News Bears” to “Revenge of the Nerds” to “Big Fat Liar.” Since the time of the original Tea Party, America loves it when the geeks and outsiders finally stick it to their rich and entitled tormentors.

http://www.salon.com/2012/11/12/post_election_gloating_is_a_patriotic_duty/

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 9:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Man, you're going down harder than Allen West! Democrats won huge. Get over it already!

vanwa- *Obama didn't win the middle class vote or above.*

Please, explain to me how you arrived at this conclusion. Please.

*So who is the 98% and what kinda tax cuts are you speaking about, I want to know what specifically where you would cut and by how much..*

You know who the 98% are vanwa, why play these games...as for your request, you never give detail on anything. It's just hate Obama crap. How many times did I request you to define how Romney policy was different than Bush's and why you were on board with it. Give a little get a little. Ask specifics if you will, but why the 98% games.

*Draw new lines in the sand, just the things you said and hawk said that he shouldn't do so he could get bipartisan agreement*

Please source your statement.

*The Rep picked up more seats in the house and with the sheer numbers in the house it actually has more power than the senate to stop bills ever becoming law..*

Refer to last weeks post concerning Republican gerrymandering. Better yet just refer to Newt @ 10:35. And please vanwa, explain the Republican net "pick up" in the House.

*Only decisive from how Obama won the Minority vote....*

Let's see...who does that include? Everyone except old white guys?

it was a directive to government leadership to get the hell out of our personal lives and fix this economy, but not off the backs of the middle class.

*I really like this comment you posted... These were the exact principles of Romney’s campaign. Get out of big government and out of our business... Your just a little mixed up here, maybe one too many blunts has ya thinking off a bit...Put that Pointed cap back on and let us know what you really think...*

I'm okay with the insults vanwa. I can understand why you do it. Regardless, your rhetoric is absurd.

Stay out of our bedrooms and bodies and pursue Obama admin finance reform. Romney indeed! You are making less sense than usual. Get over it. Romney/Right ideology lost. Listen to your own party leaders for Christ's sake. Now all of a sudden we're talking immigration reform! :)))

*While the president may have taken in more campaign money than Romney, I will have to vet that post, he still lost the popular vote by 20%.... Coulda been more if the military had a chance to get their ballots...We mailed our sons to him but we haven't heard yet if he received it...*

Obama did garner a majority of younger/active/ military as I posted last week. Not sure why you would pick this argument! :)

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 10:03 a.m. ( | suggest removal


btw vanwa, please source these two assertions. Thanks.

*I will have to vet that post, he still lost the popular vote by 20%.... Coulda been more if the military had a chance to get their ballots..*

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 10:09 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*I guess losing a few hundred million even bothers the Koch Bros.! Look out Christie! These guys will spend anything on everything. After all, it's papa's inheritance $$$$$.*

**Koch-Backed Group Warns Chris Christie**

Conservatives are peeved at New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, a GOP favorite, for praising President Barack Obama response to Hurricane Sandy days before the election. Some right-wingers even blame Christie for boosting the president's prospects at the last minute. (Christie hugged Obama! How could he?!) Now, in the aftermath of the election, a powerhouse conservative outfit partly funded by the billionaire Koch Brothers is coming after Christie on another front, sharply questioning whether the governor will sell out conservatives in the latest battle over Obamacare.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/11/chris-christie-koch-brothers-obamacare

The New Jersey Legislature passed a bill on October 18 creating a state-based online health insurance marketplace; it did so because under Obamacare a state must either create its own insurance marketplace or let the federal government do it. Christie vetoed a similar state-based insurance exchange bill in May, but he said last month he wouldn't decide what to do about the new bill until after Election Day.

Enter the New Jersey chapter of Americans for Prosperity, the Koch-backed conservative grassroots group. AFP-New Jersey is pressuring Christie to reject the state exchange bill and rebuff Obamacare's requirements before November 16, the date by which states must submit its health insurance plans to the federal government. Here's what AFP-New Jersey Steve Lonegan had to say about Christie in a press release zapped out two days after the election:

Barack Obama has been re-elected. Congress will not be able to repeal the law so now the burden is on the states to thwart it. That means these bureaucratic and costly exchanges must be stopped, along with the tax increases that come along with them.

Other conservative governors across the country like Bobby Jindal, Rick Perry, Scott Walker, and others have already taken a principled stand. Where is Governor Christie? Will he stand with them? Will he prevent New Jerseyans from having their health care choices controlled by federal bureaucrats? Will he allow our state’s struggling businesses to be hammered by Obamacare's tax penalties with unemployment hovering around 10 percent? Or will he continue to go along to get along with Barack Obama?

AFP-New Jersey seems suspicious about Christie. And that last line, of course, is a jab at Christie's buddying up with Obama during Sandy's aftermath. AFP-NJ is urging its supporters to lean on Christie by calling his office and signing an online petition demanding Christie say no to Obamacare.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/11/chris-christie-koch-brothers-obamacare

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 10:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


"Draw new lines in the sand, just the things you said and hawk said that he shouldn't do so he could get bipartisan agreement"

I said what?

Seems to me I have ALWAYS been for everybody getting along and working together for the betterment of the Country.

Now I know I've been taking some drugs lately but I don't think I said anything about lines in the sand.

Or, you could prove me wrong.

hawkeye — November 13, 2012 at 10:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Hey nail,

The thing about Christie, I absolutely loved it when he and Obama hugged. I thought it was so funny, I'll bet Romney & Ryan wet their pants.

hawkeye — November 13, 2012 at 10:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVOmRwiQL30

hawk @ 10:54- I enjoyed the Obama/Christie camaraderie as well hawk. I wish we had more of it.

Neither Romney or Ryan could even carry their own states!

*I'll bet Romney & Ryan wet their pants.* Send in the Pampers & Huggies!!

I don't know about vanwa, denial is one thing, making stuff up is another.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 11:04 a.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 10:29 a.m.

"After all, it's papa's inheritance $$$$$."

No, it is not "papa's inheritance" even adjusted for inflation they bring in almost as much per day as they inherited. Adjusted for inflation they have given more for cancer research than they inherited. They both hold masters degrees in Mechanical Engineering, and held real jobs in the company before the death of their father.

frobert — November 13, 2012 at 11:15 a.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert- Thank God for oil/energy derivatives, eh? These corporcats haven't done a days work in their life, have they frobert. It's all from papa. Your hero worship with these two are fascinating.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 11:26 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Too bad neither one struck anything on their own. They sure know how to spend $$$ on important things though. Papa might be rolling over in his grave with this one.

They are conservative. Money is like candy or a plaything to them. Kinda like Bush and Reagan. Except they are spending their father's money instead of the taxpayers.

Yahoo!

**Billionaire Bill Koch owns a PRIVATE Wild West town**

You may have an Old West play set, but billionaire Bill Koch has his own frontier town.

Koch's town boasts its own water-treatment system and approximately 50 buildings including a saloon, jail, church, stable and train station. The town is located on a 420-acre meadow on his 6,400-acre Bear Ranch in Gunnison County, Colo.

A mansion will soon sit atop a hill for the wealthy Wild West enthusiast to admire his fantasy turned reality. Few will get to visit this Centennial State town for themselves. Security will stand guard at locked gates to prevent trespassers from stumbling upon the Old West town, according to the Denver Post.

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-08-23/news/33347770_1_bloomberg-koch-david-and-charles-koch-town

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 11:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Another 4 Star bites the dust. When will it end? Great leadership. :(

At least he has his faith in God and a huge 6 figure salary to retire on.

**William Ward, Four Star General, Demoted For Lavish Spending, Ordered To Repay $82,000**

The spokesman, Chris Garrett, added that, "While General Ward is not perfect he has always been guided by his faith in God and the belief that there is no greater honor as a patriot than to lead those who choose to serve our nation in the armed forces."

Retiring as a three-star will cost Ward about $30,000 a year in retirement pay – giving him close to $208,802 a year rather than the $236,650 he would get as a four-star.

Army Gen. Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, urged Panetta to allow Ward, the former head of U.S. Africa Command, to retire at his full four-star general rank, according to defense officials. Other military leaders had noted that the demotion would cost Ward a lot of money.

The inspector general's report found that Ward used military vehicles to shuttle his wife on shopping trips and to a spa and billed the government for a refueling stop overnight in Bermuda, where the couple stayed in a $750 suite. The report detailed lengthy stays at lavish hotels for Ward, his wife and his staff members, and the use of five-vehicle motorcades when he traveled to Washington.

It also said Ward and his wife, Joyce, accepted dinner and Broadway show tickets from a government contractor during a trip during which he went backstage to meet actor Denzel Washington. The couple and several staff members also spent two nights at the Waldorf Astoria hotel.

..

A common theme running through the report was Ward's insistence that his wife travel with him at government cost, even though it was often not authorized and she performed few official duties. It said he also routinely stayed in high-priced suites in luxury hotels rather than in standard rooms or less expensive locales.

The allegations, coming after a 17-month investigation, have delayed Ward's planned April 2011 retirement. And they were an embarrassing end note to his career, since he had claimed a place in history as the military's first commander of Africa Command.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/13/william-ward_n_2122379.html

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 12:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Although folks have pointed out beneficial aspects of other cultures, I believe no one has ever trumped European culture/society as a "proper template" for America.
nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:56 a.m.*

Must I remind you where Democracy got its start, nailingit??? There's no reason to be baffled by my statement BECAUSE of the fact that our nation's government and debt issues are slowly heading in the same direction as Greece and why it is so imperative that we avoid the Fiscal Cliff without penalizing the already humbled middle class as Greece did.

Also...you ask for me to cite my reference to kn_dalai's comment the importance now, more than ever, that we need to have a government that works together. Well my fellow forum dweller, I'll try to answer this as quickly as possibly for you.

It was kn_dalai's statement (as well as other comments combined) which generated *my opinion* of the importance of the partisan separation and how it's affecting our nation with regards to little compromise. You see, I can read kn-dalai's comments one way and form a conclusion based on my beliefs as you do yours. If you take a look at what led Greece up to their debt issues we're seeing today, you will see basically the same rhetoric between political parties with little to show as a result except for a government going broke or should I say...a government with debts, relying on other nations to bail them out. I don't know about how you believe we've managed to stay afloat thus far, but how many more loans do we need to get from China or India before our ship sinks, nailingit?

Regarding what you say about the Republicans and what is happening here...

What's so different here now from what began with the Golden Dawn? I only hope we never get to the point of what Greeks are experiencing with the Golden Dawn...NEVER.

I hope I've explained it to you in a way which you could accept that it is my opinion. You don't have to agree or disagree. And btw, good morning as well as good afternoon!

goldenoldie — November 13, 2012 at 12:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Might I add to one statement in my previous comment...

"...a government with debts, relying on other nations to bail them out and nailing the working class with the financial woes, leaving most in the dust with no food, no homes, no healthcare, no retirement...nothing."

goldenoldie — November 13, 2012 at 12:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie- *Must I remind you where Democracy got its start, nailingit???*

Why should you? It has nothing to do with my post.

I was baffled as to your take away with k_nd's statement you cited as inspiration to work together when he stated the absolute opposite. The opposite. The opposite.

Just trying to understand your reasoning.

Again- *Kn-dalai, your statement hit the nail on the head regarding the importance now, more than ever, that we need to have a government that works together.*

Please cite your quote from k_nd. I missed it. Where does he state anywhere we need to work together?

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:56 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal | Ignore User )

goldenoldie- In fact he advocates for further/renewed obstructionism. Baffled by your 7:39 post. Yes...baffled! :)

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 8:16 a.m.

Package it any way you like, k_nd is advocating more obstructionism. Not that it means anything.

Anyway...no matter.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 1:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsYC-h...

I've always wondered why people are so concerned about Grease anyway.

And golden dawn sounds like a weird fetish for early birds.

Thanks for your take but,

I'll stick to USA politics.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 1:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Mr. Pat's take on affairs. 50 shades of crazy. Has Christian thinking evolved to this degree? Just plain weird. It does beg the question,

will Pat get caught and will it be with a female.

**Pat Robertson On General Petraeus, Paula Broadwell Affair: 'He's A Man' (VIDEO)**

Television evangelist and ultraconservative Pat Robertson doesn't think General David Petraeus should be condemned for his affair with writer Paula Broadwell. After all, she is "an extremely good looking woman" and "he's a man."

Robertson excused CIA Director Petraeus for the extramarital affair with his biographer, Broadwell, on Monday's episode of "The 700 Club," the flagship program of the Christian Broadcasting Network.

"Who knows?" he said. "The man's off in a foreign land and he's lonely and here's a good looking lady throwing herself at him. I mean, he's a man."

He also alluded to Broadwell's wiles. "She is an extremely good looking woman. She is a marathon runner. She runs Iron Man triathlons. So she's out running with him and writing a biography. I think the term is 'propinquity.'"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/13/pat-robertson-on-general-_n_2123111.html

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 2:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal


OL Pat's got to be right.You can't blame the General, after all, he IS a man and she IS a woman, also--- and nobody has brought this up yet, it does take two to tango.

hawkeye — November 13, 2012 at 2:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit @ 2:03: OMG. Pat Robertson's holy rationalization for Petraeus' sin: What man wouldn't want a piece of that?

The Christian right: the gift that keeps on giving. What material. Can't wait to se SNL and Jon Stewart and Colbert this week!

manthou — November 13, 2012 at 2:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nail-

CNN EXIT Poll for who won the middle class vote..OBTW Romney won the white vote for those folks over the "Ripe ol age of 40" You must be what 23 and have that degree that enables you to being the almighty know it all. Yes I'm a parent and have had a couple of those kids.. Sure does change once ya have to start paying for your own SSSShit.. Doesn’t it.. Then its why is everything so expensive, or why do I have to pay so much in taxes... Ya nail you'll grow up someday....
All I’m trying to say by virtue of CNN polling is that Obama won by virtue of winning the minority vote and those making less than the middle income wage.. That’s all ...Obama painted this whitte picture of Romney being rich and not paying his fair share of taxes when in fact he paid absolutely what he was supposed to and so did Obama.
Romney clearly won the middle class vote and those earning above it.. There are several reasons for it but the two main ones are Obamas Failed economic record and plan, plain and simple.. It's the same reason minorities and those making under the medium income voted mostly for Obama. There is a culture that Obama created that has divided our country greatly... Why you choose not to see it is your issue...
Yes those younger guys in the military voted for Obama to... Wonder why those vets didn't vote for him that are of the ripe ol age of 40....That’s because it takes a little experience before you can see who is the person that has your back the most... Why would the military take away someone’s body armor several months before they are to end their mission???.
I meant to say that MRD said Obama took in more campaign money than Obama; well Romney won the Military vote by 20%,
And as far as ballots being lost or not even sent, I guess we'll have to wait as that gets figured out as well. Our son had his mailed to our address and we forwarded it to him.. We just haven't heard from him since 11/02...
Btw where did you come up with the hair brained idea of moving the min wage up to $14.00?? Did you ever call madore and ask him how that would affect his company??? You didn't answer that question.. My take is you studied Philosophy and Physiology in College...

http://elections.msnbc.msn.com/ns/politics/2012/all/president/

vanwadreamer — November 13, 2012 at 2:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou- He should interview David's wife Holly on the 700 Club and explain his reasoning. I'd tune in for that one!

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 2:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal


OK, I will say in advance that I am mildly ashamed that I enjoyed reading this soap opera drama on Breitbart just now. So many reasons to hang my head.

All of the links need to be accessed for the full affect.

C'mon. Join me in my shame. I dare you:

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/11/13/Twin-Sister-of-FBI-Complainant-in-Petraeus-Investigation-Beset-By-Financial-and-Legal-Problems

manthou — November 13, 2012 at 3 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwadreamer — November 13, 2012 at 2:52 p.m.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htTLWC...

HAHAHAHAHA, you funny. And HEY!!!!!! Bunkie, ***I'm WHITE AND OVER 60 AND I VOTED FOR OBAMA*** You putz

hawkeye — November 13, 2012 at 3:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye: There are a lot of us in that category. :)

_________________________

How easy would it be to take down the military, based on the schoolboy behavior of a couple of its four star generals? Not much, apparently. Should we all be grateful that these women were just military groupies and not worse? I hope.

Talking about generals taking orders from their privates...

manthou — November 13, 2012 at 3:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou- And a twin sis ta boot who has her own laundry list.

John Edwards, Jim Wright, Dan Rostenkowski and Gary Condit and lobbyist Jack Abramoff.

Great names defended by this firm! Classy!

And a "crisis management" team who handles the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and Monica Lewinsky?

There's a bad joke here but I'll leave it alone! :))

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 3:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Talking about generals taking orders from their privates...*

CLASSIC! LMAO!

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 3:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nail-
What about your/Obama tax plan??? for the 98%

Come on man! give it to us readers..It's gotta be good coming from you it should balance the budget in what 30 days.. Come on man.. Seriously, let us know what you speak of in broad terms but have no specifics, you know the hard crunching numbers... Is it 14% tax on those making less than 24K is it raisning taxes by 4% on the filthy richhhh, That will bring the deficit down real fast...tax reform is a valid point, everyone should pay there fair share...

On another favorite Obama program...Obamacare

Has anyone noticed their premiums going up next year.. Mine went up 23%....Were just now starting to feel the price for Obamacare and it's real... When you actually have to shell out more real dollars from your pocket, that's real... And I'm not even on the program but we'll all pay for it out of our bottom line, paycheck...

Businesses with 50-plus workers will essentially be assessed a fee of $2,000 to $3,000 per full-time employee for not offering coverage. Their deadline is Jan. 1, 2014.

Residents who don't have insurance through an employer, with few exceptions, also have until January 2014 to decide whether to buy insurance through the exchanges or face a penalty assessed through the Internal Revenue Service.

The fines essentially begin in 2014 at $95 per adult and $47.50 per child, then increase to $695 per adult and $347.50 per child by 2016.

Do you see forced governmental regulating your family's business, hum kinda stinks doesn't it...Now this is what ya got after the election...

vanwadreamer — November 13, 2012 at 3:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


vanwa- *when in fact he paid absolutely what he was supposed to*

Please source. Good luck with that! :))))) Psychics, soothsayers and mediums don't count.

Get your bus tuned up while you can! Lions tigers & bears! Dems Libs & Obamacare! Oh my!

A side note vanwa. If you're going to throw out numbers & policy, skewed or not, it's a good idea to source them.

And btw, I understand government regulations are quite limited in Somalia. You might consider a change of scenery. Jeepees are cool!! And they hold as many natives as you want! No regs!!

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 3:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBFbcA...

A few detailing ideas vanwa. I've ridden in both four wheeled jeepy's and on jeepy trikes. And I gotta tell ya, there's an old asian expression...

Depend on driver!!!

I'll tell em' you're coming! God bless America!

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 3:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 1:29 p.m.

Actually Nailingit, this is where you and I differ in our thinking. The foundation of Democracy has EVERYTHING to do with the discussion. Any deviation from it is a strike against Democracy. I"m not speaking of Social Democracy...a morphing, left-leaning design of the basic foundation of Democracy...Democracy in it's original design. I don't see anywhere that states our nation should be one of the people's dependence on our government for everything which is exactly where we're headed. Few are willing to accept the fact that cuts will need to be made...cuts in services we've grown to be quite dependent upon. This will put more out on the streets...more dependent of donations and homeless shelters in order to survive. Social Security is not as "secure" as it once was which was meant to help those reaching retirement after witnessing the poverty-stricken elderly during the Great Depression.

It's sad to say but...unless someone can suddenly pull a magic rabbit out of a hat, we're headed in the same direction as Greece. Maybe a little history lesson by you with regards to the government benefits the citizens of Greece used to take for granted and no longer have would be in your best interest.

..

A thought I have for everyone...

Why is it whenever there's a major disaster such as what happened with Hurricane Sandy or Hurricane Katrina...why is it the people expect our government to bail them out with regards to rebuilding their homes? Whatever happened to homeowner disaster insurance coverage? Have we become such a nation so dependent on our government that we've forgotten the basics???

goldenoldie — November 13, 2012 at 4:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Actually Nailingit, this is where you and I differ in our thinking. The foundation of Democracy has EVERYTHING to do with the discussion.*

Miscommunikay, intentional or not. Again, :), I was speaking to your response which had nothing to do with my question. Nothing to do with government, nothing to do with dependency, but rather your interpretation of k_nd's post @ 6:38. Sigh...

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 4:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie @ 4:26. Perhaps this will lend insight.

**Hurricane of Selfishness: Ayn Rand, Glenn Beck, and Disaster Response**

But this piece is not about politics, Paul Ryan's budget plan which advocates slashing funding for federal emergency services, or even about President Obama's deft handling of this crisis. It is about a highly dysfunctional philosophy that millions in America live by - the objectivist philosophy of Ayn Rand - and which we need to reject once and for all. The best way to illustrate just how myopic, and indeed dangerous, this philosophy is, let us imagine how Rand and one of her current torch-bearers, Glenn Beck, would likely have responded to Hurricane Sandy had they been in charge (ironically, Beck has flip-flopped on Rand and considers her selfish, but given his own every-man-for-himself philosophy, that is pretty rich).

..

This obviously comes straight out of the pages of Rand's world, in which humans are "pay for play" and any service provided for free is irrational and immoral since it violates the tenet of self-interest. To help others without being compensated runs against her fundamentalist capitalist philosophy, which favors profit over humanity and cold logic over compassion. Funnily enough, as I listened to Mayor Bloomberg report on the damage from the storm and the Herculean efforts under way to help stranded citizens, I was reminded that it is not self-interest that is at fault (since Bloomberg himself is a vocal advocate of private enterprise) but the lopsided version of this concept that is personified by people like Ayn Rand and Glenn Beck. In other words, it is not America that does not have a heart but these particular individuals and those who follow their beliefs blindly.

There is no reason that self-interest cannot co-exist with a common interest, why the private sector cannot co-exist with effective government, why in times of crisis our citizens cannot become the beneficiaries of services they have not paid for directly, and why we cannot be both a profit-seeking people and a charitable one. No reason, of course, except for fanatical ideology, demagogues who make a lot of money and gain fame by propagating extremist ideas, and pure, single-minded selfishness.

In our democracy, rights come with responsibilities, and these include the responsibility to help those Americans in need, regardless of whether it is logical or not. Rand and Beck only cover one part of this critical equation, namely the right to pursue personal happiness, but slyly ignore the rest. Why? Because extreme ideas sell much better than moderate ones, because a Russian immigrant can generate controversy by challenging the values of her adopted country, and because it is easy to ignore the flames when it is someone else's home on fire.

read more @ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/sanjay-sanghoee/hurricane-of-selfishness-_b_2045377.html

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 4:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


This is what I'm talking about. Start negotiating far left to reach a compromise. It ain't a perfect world.

**Obama should aim high in deficit negotiations**

By raising taxes on wealthy Americans, eliminating breaks for oil and gas companies and other measures, Obama could meet the goal of $4 trillion in deficit reduction over the next decade, Reich writes.

By Robert Reich, Guest blogger / November 13, 2012

I hope the President starts negotiations over a “grand bargain” for deficit reduction by aiming high. After all, he won the election. And if the past four years has proven anything it’s that the White House should not begin with a compromise.

Robert is chancellor’s professor of public policy at the University of California at Berkeley. He has served in three national administrations, most recently as secretary of labor under President Clinton. *Time Magazine named him one of the 10 most effective cabinet secretaries of the last century*. He has written 13 books, including “The Work of Nations,” his latest best-seller “Aftershock: The Next Economy and America’s Future," and a new e-book, “Beyond Outrage.” He is also a founding editor of the American Prospect magazine and chairman of Common Cause.

Assuming the goal is $4 trillion of deficit reduction over the next decade (that’s the consensus of the Simpson-Bowles commission, the Congressional Budget Office, and most independent analysts), here’s what the President should propose:

First, raise taxes on the rich – and by more than the highest marginal rate under Bill Clinton or even a 30 percent (so-called Buffett Rule) minimum rate on millionaires. Remember: America’s top earners are now wealthier than they’ve ever been, and they’re taking home a larger share of total income and wealth than top earners have received in over 80 years.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 6:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Why not go back sixty years when Americans earning over $1 million in today’s dollars paid 55.2 percent of it in income taxes, after taking all deductions and credits? If they were taxed at that rate now, they’d pay at least $80 billion more annually — which would reduce the budget deficit by about $1 trillion over the next decade. That’s a quarter of the $4 trillion in deficit reduction right there.

A 2% surtax on the wealth of the richest one-half of 1 percent would bring in another $750 billion over the decade. A one-half of 1 percent tax on financial transactions would bring in an additional $250 billion.

Add this up and we get $2 trillion over ten years — half of the deficit-reduction goal.

Raise the capital gains rate to match the rate on ordinary income and cap the mortgage interest deduction at $12,000 a year, and that’s another $1 trillion over ten years. So now we’re up to $3 trillion in additional revenue.

RELATED: 3 views on best way to curb US debt

Eliminate special tax preferences for oil and gas, price supports for big agriculture, tax breaks and research subsidies for Big Pharma, unnecessary weapons systems for military contractors, and indirect subsidies to the biggest banks on Wall Street, and we’re nearly there.

End the Bush tax cuts on incomes between $250,000 and $1 million, and — bingo — we made it: $4 trillion over 10 years.

And we haven’t had to raise taxes on America’s beleaguered middle class, cut Social Security or Medicare and Medicaid, reduce spending on education or infrastructure, or cut programs for the poor.

**Mr. President, I’d recommend this as your opening bid. With enough luck and pluck, maybe even your closing bid. And if enough Americans are behind you, it could even be the final deal.**

http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/Robert-Reich/2012/1113/Obama-should-aim-high-in-deficit-negotiations

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 6:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nailingit, maybe you missed my comment @12:54pm when I said "You see, I can read kn-dalai's comments one way and form a conclusion based on my beliefs as you do yours.." I've tried to explain to you how I formed my conclusion but maybe a little bit more explanation is warranted. When you go back and read the comment for which I'd highlighted...it's obvious the blame game is in play...no offense to the originator of the comment of course. All it took was kn_dalai's comment to send you into a tailspin about how wrong they were and vice versa. So what did it accomplish? Did either of you ever come to agreement? Hardly. What I've been saying from the beginning is it takes a coming together of minds to form a solution. Saying one side is to blame or saying the other side is to blame isn't correct. Everyone's to blame and nothing is getting accomplished as the finger pointing continues.

goldenoldie — November 13, 2012 at 6:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nailingit...

Regarding my comment about the disasters (and for that matter just about anything else anybody receives in benefits from our government)...we've become a lazy society. A society based on benefits...an easier ride so to speak (and I'm not saying it's an easy ride, fighting to gain benefits for which people are entitled...just sayin' the consequences otherwise would be much more difficult in many cases). What I've been getting at from my original comment is simple. We've become far too dependent for our own personal needs because we've always looked for an easier solution rather than doing the gosh-darned hard work from the beginning. The first time I've heard in years, a community that took pride in getting back on their feet without any government help was the little town of Aumsville after the tornado struck and all but devastated several businesses and homes. They worked together as a unit...hand in hand...and rebuilt their town. This was a time when it didn't matter who was Republican and who was Democrat. No...it wasn't politically motivated. It was motivation of a connected community...people willing to work together to find a solution.....something the rest of us could truly benefit.

Now...what I'm reading on the web is that some of the homeowners who lost their homes to Sandy...the same people whose homes will need to be rebuilt, are asking for help from the government but there's no helping them till the seawall is rebuilt. So what are these people going to do in the meantime? They still have mortgages and no homes to show for it. Is the land their homes once stood even stable any more? What will they do if they can never rebuild? Do they have any financial compensation through disaster insurance? Probably not...so guess who they'll be asking help for...and getting a big fat "You gotta wait" answer??? In this case...they can't even help each other. So now the question is...whose big idea was it to allow these buildings there in the first place? Was it the Repubs? Was it the Dem's or was it *"easy money?"* Can't put a political party label on it now, can you! So while the local leaders fattened the city/county/state budget pocket book, allowing these homes to be built in a flood zone...a mega disaster hit...

The people are left in the dark and as city/county/state/federal budgets continue to get crunched...this is just a small sampling of what is to come, Nailingit. Another great example is the disastrous after-effect of Katrina. How many families were displaced? How many businesses never re-opened? With the way our national debt is headed...more benefits will be lost, more funding will be lost. It's just the way the ball bounces unless you want to raise your hand to a flag of a foreign nation rather than our flag, Old Glory. We know about the cutting of tax breaks for the wealthy...but will it truly be enough?

goldenoldie — November 13, 2012 at 6:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Also nailingit...it's no offense to you, but honestly...I want to read YOUR words, not the words of those whose works you've copied and pasted in order to get your point across. Honestly, your POV gets lost in the sea of script while reading along the c/p work. It's far easier in my case, to read your responses alone...to know better your POV. It's more beneficial for me to reference the links you share without the entire script or excerpts from the script in your comment and I know you've got it in you to write your two-cents' worth.

I'm not trying to tell you how to present your argument...just lettin' you know it's just more convenient for me to understand where it is you're coming from sometimes...without the pasted works of others; just the links. You don't have to do as I suggest...just a friendly suggestion, my fellow forum dweller.

goldenoldie — November 13, 2012 at 7:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Nail-
A couple of things while we're going after more federal revenue-

Historically, the Republicans are correct, increased revenues have always led to increased spending. I don't think that can be a singular correlation but it's a hard habit to break. The wealth of the wealthy isn't just lying around waiting to be subjected to tax, especially additional taxes. It will move elsewhere, and they have the ability to insure they'll not take a hit. Little to gain if they move it, say, offshore? Sheltered?

Whacking the defense budget will cost a ton of jobs-the military/industrial complex is a vital part of our economy. We are the creators and suppliers of most of the world's killing machines-about 75% of them, I think. We export death at an alarming rate.

Raising capital gains taxes? Be careful, a lot of that money being put back into those investments has been taxed already. Subjecting it to additional taxation, well.....might curb investment. We need to somehow move Wall St-ie, investment banking-away from speculation in an attempt to make money to investment to make money. Credit IS tight, why loan money at less than 1%? Barely covers the cost of FDIC insurance? Realize most Wall St firms don't even research "start-ups" any longer. No money to be made.

Sorry-but if there was a "magic bullet", it would have been fired long ago. The problems are deep and structural. It ain't gonna be easy, not by a longshot.

On a further note, remember our beloved Democrats are going to have to defend 6 Senate seats in 6 red states in 2014-not a rosy scenario. Can you see Obama as a lame duck prez facing a totally Republican Congess? I can.

As the presidential election was pretty much a major win for the Democrats, one must keep in mind Romney-a total bust-garnered 48% of the vote against an incumbent-not too bad. And 88% of his votes came from white folks, higher than Reagan or something like that. And the Republicans strengthed their hold on the House-kinda strange. The Democrats better get their do-do together, and damn soon. They have no mandate, no footing, no nuthin', to force any issue.

mrd — November 13, 2012 at 7:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*All it took was kn_dalai's comment to send you into a tailspin*

You won't address it. Forget about it. I hope it was fun.

@ 6:52- Did you read @ 4:59...

@ 7:03- *Also nailingit...it's no offense to you, but honestly...I want to read YOUR words, not the words of those whose works you've copied and pasted in order to get your point across.*

And seriously, no offense taken. I on the other hand would much prefer you present your view with a published work/link and not so much in your own words. With lengthy posts I rarely read more than half of them. No offense meant.

*And 88% of his votes came from white folks, higher than Reagan or something like that.*

I haven't checked your numbers, (good time to source btw) but so what? Why is this of such importance to you?

*And the Republicans strengthed their hold on the House-kinda strange.*

Please explain. How did they "strengthen their hold".

*The Democrats better get their do-do together, and damn soon. They have no mandate, no footing, no nuthin', to force any issue.*

Just pure nonsense. I guess elections don't mean much anymore to some. What does it require now 400 electoral votes?

Tell me goldenoldie, did you cast your ballot for prez?

.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Sorry goldenoldie about thinking you were mrd. See what happens when long lengthy personal speak runs together? Sometimes things just keep going and attention to detail is lost.

Hey, I gotta blame somebody! :)

--

Sooooo mrd maybe you will speak to my inquiries.

And 88% of his votes came from white folks, higher than Reagan or something like that.

I haven't checked your numbers, (good time to source btw) but so what? Why is this of such importance to you?

And the Republicans strengthed their hold on the House-kinda strange.

Please explain. How did they "strengthen their hold".

The Democrats better get their do-do together, and damn soon. They have no mandate, no footing, no nuthin', to force any issue.

Just pure nonsense. I guess elections don't mean much anymore to some. What does it require now 400 electoral votes?

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal


500? 538? What the hell does it take?

Why is it much of Republican leadership recognizes they got trounced and are ready to give on major issues like tax cuts and immigration reform practically overnight, and several in this forum are not getting it?

Obama won guys. Dems won big in the Senate and strengthened their minority in the House.

What's the critics criteria on winning an election anyway?

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit: The New Republic has a fantastic article that nails it (tee hee) about President Obama's mandate.

Oh, yes. He has one:

http://www.tnr.com/blog/plank/109818/obama-wins-four-more-years-mandate-agenda-validation-obamacare#

manthou — November 13, 2012 at 8:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Great article manthou. Inspirational! Thanks for that.

Today I heard Paul Ryan claim there was no mandate. I wonder what he and others who try and diminish this powerful overwhelming victory would be saying if the same numbers were reversed and favored Romney.

I can imagine what the right would be saying with a 51% + popular vote and 332 electoral vote win.

They'd be in hawg heaven.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 8:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Several months ago or more, I posted, with specifics, on the disconnect of how the Washington electorate has a habit of sending Democrats to Olympia, but then the electorate has also passed one anti-tax initiative after another, over the years. Seems rather strange considering the affinity of Dems and their taxes.

Here we go again. While both houses of the Washington legislature have won comfortable Democrat margins, the electorate has passed initiative 1185, which requires a two thirds majority for passing new tax increases, by a nearly 2 to 1 margin. The word hamstring comes to mind. Talk about a mandate.

kn_dalai — November 13, 2012 at 8:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal


> Hell kn_d, I'll drive you as far as Dallas if you'd like. -- nailingit — November 12, 2012 at 6:59 p.m.

No. I think I'll stay here.

But I will offer to drive YOU, to South Florida. I'll even buy you and inner tube and a paddle.

kn_dalai — November 13, 2012 at 9 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Off subject now, I saw a press conference with the Mayor-elect Charlie Hales and he said that his priorities are first repairing all the streets in Portland and bicycles come second. Also, on the CRC, he believes that the bridge is important, light rail- not so much.

Finally, a person in charge with a steady hand on the tiller.

hawkeye — November 13, 2012 at 9:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal


> manthou — November 13, 2012 at 8:12 p.m. -- manthou — November 13, 2012 at 8:12 p.m.

I was wondering. With your concern over honest news reporting...do you think your New Republic article is a good news source, or an opinion by a Leftist writer expressing his own analysis in a Leftist publication?

kn_dalai — November 13, 2012 at 9:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawkeye,

Charlie won his election, first and foremost, by talking about filling the potholes. Who’s going to disagree with that.

After that, J. Smith self destructed.

Even the Left coast Portlanders have some amount of sense. Charlie was the best of the three.

kn_dalai — November 13, 2012 at 9:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*But I will offer to drive YOU, to South Florida. I'll even buy you and inner tube and a paddle.
kn_dalai — November 13, 2012 at 9 p.m*

Cool! What kind of ride do you have? That long a trip dictates a little comfort. Heated leather seat with lumbar multiple adjustment would be in order.

You're *an* english professor? Or is it you're *a* english professor. Or you are a engl...etc, etc. The trip would also necessitate some auditory restraint on your part.

I'm good with my IPOD n phones. Occasionally I might share a tidbit of wisdom for your enrichment.

I require a background check with your driving and personal/criminal history.

3 references not to include family.

Tube, paddle, and place of purchase will be of my choosing.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 9:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 9:44 p.m

Hey guys, if you are going in December, I'm up for a trip to Disney World!!!

hawkeye — November 13, 2012 at 10 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawk- Cool! Far as I know k_nd is doing all the driving. I assume he's footing the gas bill as he's buying me the latest in water sport/survival recreational equipment asmoney appears not to be a problem.

It'd be great to travel with someone else that wasn't as uptight and stuffy as k_nd. I kinda like the guy, but he's always wrong about right.

We need to lay out rest spots. I don't want to end up in some cheap Libertarian rat trap.

And since he's already purchasing the gas, buying us both the latest in sport/recreational equipment, he might as well pay for food and lodging.

Maybe some others will want to come.

k_nd should see about renting or buying a nice RV if he doesn't have one. Since he's footing the bill why not?

I bet he hasn't even looked at a map yet.

He's going to need our guidance in a different way then he does now. Tedious at best, but at least he's buying.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 10:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal


k_nd- It could be said Mark Twain was liberal on many issues. Should we then discard his opinion as being bias and not substantive?

God forbid his works should be printed in a "liberal" publication.

If I deem you are able to multi-task we can discuss this in detail while you're driving.

nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 10:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal


What’s with you guys anyway.

Of course I’m doing all the driving. I’m also ecologically conscious in terms of saving on the gas bill, as you can see.

Also…my mode of transportation doesn’t involve no taxpayer funded interstate highway system, (and we can hunt our own food along the way).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3fGZK...

kn_dalai — November 13, 2012 at 11:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou-

I liked your clever little remark about Generals and Privates. I am going to share that in the office, if you don't mind. We have had several laughs since the Petreaus story broke.

danabwoodley — November 14, 2012 at 5:27 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Angus King To Caucus With Senate Democrats**

WASHINGTON -- Independent Senator-elect Angus King of Maine says he has decided to caucus with Democrats, which will add to the party's voting edge. His decision ends months of speculation about which party he would align with.

The former Maine governor was elected last week to replace retiring Republican Sen. Olympia Snowe, a prominent centrist. GOP and conservative super PACs spent millions of dollars to attack King during the campaign for Snowe's seat.

With King joining their caucus, Democrats will have a **55 to 45** edge in the Senate.

King said Wednesday that caucusing with Democrats will still allow him to take independent positions on issues.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/angus-king-to-caucus-senate_n_2122002.html

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 7:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal


kn_dalai — November 13, 2012 at 11:59 p.m.

Excellent!!!

I call sidecar! Oh AND the .50cal, looks like fun. Do you have some good recipes for squirrel? Of course we can't hunt squirrel with the .50cal, maybe if you bring some string and walnuts we can trap them. We WILL have to stop at the Cracker Barrel (it's a rule) at least every other day though so you might just as well figure out that into the route.

hawkeye — November 14, 2012 at 7:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*You won't address it. Forget about it. I hope it was fun.*

*nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:31 p.m.*

Guess we'll just leave it at that...maybe call it a minor communication malfunction between the both of us!?! There's too much at stake right now to worry about how someone arrived at their conclusion...even though it was my point I was stressing in the first place, not kn_dalai's.

..

*"With lengthy posts I rarely read more than half of them. No offense meant."*

*nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:31 p.m.*

No offense taken. In fact, that's how I feel about your lengthy copy/pastes from those links...no offense meant...8)...

..

*Sorry goldenoldie about thinking you were mrd.*

*nailingit — November 13, 2012 at 7:38 p.m.*

No problem! All is good.

goldenoldie — November 14, 2012 at 7:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


The sign of the ages and our NEW WORLD Economic disORDER???

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-20320993

Peoples...to deny what is going on in Europe is affecting us, remember this...import/export of American-made products to these nations is dwindling as well.

goldenoldie — November 14, 2012 at 7:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal


k_nd @ 11:59- Although commanding a rocket launcher & machine gun sound appetizing, it seems a bit cramped unless there are two side cars for hawk and myself.

And if any female dwellers want to come, given the fairer sex is usually lighter and smells better, I might be willing to accommodate someone with periodic lap time, but it might be problematic to ride on bumpy roads. I don't know if another stimulus package would go over very well.

No one wants to be inadvertently Patraeused.

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 7:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Interesting...definitely something worth watching, considering the possible risks which come with such an operation in the middle of the cattle industry. Accidents do happen. Will we pay the price???

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20318386

goldenoldie — November 14, 2012 at 7:43 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Jon Stewart Mocks Secessionists: 'Stop. Wait. Don't Go.' (VIDEO)**

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/jon-stewart-mocks-secessionists_n_2128948.html

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 8:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 7:12 a.m.

I don't understand why anyone speculated about who lifelong democrat Angus King would caucus with. When elected "independent" Governor of Maine, he was just another democrat, trying to cash in on Maine's history of electing independents.

frobert — November 14, 2012 at 8:43 a.m. ( | suggest removal


kn_d, one more thing, we have to stop at Dave & Busters. If you've never been, they have great food and a really cool game room.

just saying.

seems odd that we don't have either of those businesses here (D&B; and Cracker Barrel) there's a couple of decent opportunities there.

hawkeye — November 14, 2012 at 9:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal


OH !!! and In-N-Out burger, what's up with that???

hawkeye — November 14, 2012 at 9:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal


NAIL-
So where did you suddenly come up with such high business acumen... I mean you sound or read like an economist now...We can cut 10 trillion over ten years if we do just this and that.. Can you source those numbers independent of each other, so if we tax the super rich how much will that reduce the deficit and if we tax corps more how much will that reduce the deficit.. Those numbers sound awfully good.. You might be on to something....OBTW will this create job growth or cost jobs as a side question???

Last time on the election...There was no mandate; He won the large block states all by narrower w% than 08 and some by just a percent, so yeah he was going to get more electoral votes.. It's people like you who just have to be right all the time and bloviate and propagate their ideas.. Mainstream middle class and above voted for Romney, They knew his plan for job growth and the economy was of utmost importance.. If there was any mandate it was from the democratic far left

No deficit reduction until the economy recovers.
Roll back tax cuts for the rich – and don’t cut their taxes more.
Cuts to Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid benefits.
Continue with the entitlement programs that Obama has increased since he took office.. Which by the way has almost since he took office...?

vanwadreamer — November 14, 2012 at 9:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Interesting info straight from the CBO on deficit reduction tax plan by Obama..chart included

http://washingtonexaminer.com/how-much-deficit-reduction-would-obamas-tax-on-the-rich-accomplish/article/2513252#.UKPcYoZat0R

But just how much deficit reduction would Obama’s tax hikes on the rich necessarily accomplish?

Nothing, according to the Congressional Budget Office.

ELISI — November 14, 2012 at 10:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou and Nails,

A victory of a couple of precentage points, a bit over 3 million votes, is not exactly a mandate. A mandate requires an overwhelming victory. This was more the lesser of two evils to many of us who view both of our major political parties with disdain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_...

Reagan was barely a mandate. Tricky Dick had a clear one - to get us out of Vietnam. He failed. LBJ had an clearUntign concerns one - that crazy guy Barry Goldwater was talking about nuking China.

roger — November 14, 2012 at 12:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — November 14, 2012 at 12:13 p.m.

LBJ's mandate was to STAY in Vietnam so the industrial complex could profit more, also why (IMHO) why Kennedy died. He wanted to get out and quickly.

Other than that, EVERY contest is "the lesser of two evils".

hawkeye — November 14, 2012 at 12:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Guess we'll just leave it at that...*

goldenoldie — November 14, 2012 at 7:29 a.m.

Sounds good!

---

*When elected "independent" Governor of Maine, he was just another democrat, trying to cash in on Maine's history of electing independents.*

frobert — November 14, 2012 at 8:43 a.m.

Sounds like this successful independent possesses above average political acumen. I'll have to learn more about this guy.

---

*kn_d, one more thing, we have to stop at Dave & Busters. If you've never been, they have great food and a really cool game room.*

hawkeye — November 14, 2012 at 9:39 a.m.

I have a few places I'd like to stop at also, a little off the beaten path maybe. We need to commiserate and draw specifics for k_nd. I don't want him thinking too much on his own.

---

*NAIL- So where did you suddenly come up with such high business acumen... I mean you sound or read like an economist now...*

By **Robert Reich**, Guest blogger / November 13, 2012

To repeat:

""I hope the President starts negotiations over a “grand bargain” for deficit reduction by aiming high. After all, he won the election. And if the past four years has proven anything it’s that the White House should not begin with a compromise.""

""Robert is chancellor’s professor of public policy at the University of California at Berkeley. He has served in three national administrations, most recently as secretary of labor under President Clinton. Time Magazine named him one of the 10 most effective cabinet secretaries of the last century. He has written 13 books, including “The Work of Nations,” his latest best-seller “Aftershock: The Next Economy and America’s Future," and a new e-book, “Beyond Outrage.” He is also a founding editor of the American Prospect magazine and chairman of Common Cause.""

*OBTW will this create job growth or cost jobs as a side question???*

Yes. Consumer/Creditor confidence alone would be huge. Many dynamics involved.

In addition I would impose a one time progressive "patriot tax" on the top 1/2 of 1 % to address our 50 states budgetary concerns. Adjust yacht prices to curb inflation.

I would create a department called Homeland Empathy and appoint Bernie Sanders as Czar.

Robert Reich would be in charge of economic policy and Mitt Romney would oversee the newly created Department of Ethics.

I would put a frisbee in every American hand, a Hamilton in every pocket and adult sized go-kart tracks in every town & city with a population over 5000.

After all this is about the role of government.

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 1:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger and Hawkeye,

LBJ got us deeper into Vietnam than JFK ever wanted. JFK saw how Vietnam was a no win and planned to remove what troops and advisers that were there out when he was killed.

Nixon actually did get us out of Vietnam after bombing the daylights out of the Ho Chi Minh trail and the people voiced loud enough to stop and we wanted out. The withdrawal started
July of 1969 thru to November 1972. The last of the remaining troops and advisers were removed by 1975.

ELISI — November 14, 2012 at 1:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I should add it was in 1975 at the fall of Saigon when they airlifted civilians and troops out for the last time.

ELISI — November 14, 2012 at 1:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I thought the Supreme Court decided on this...

These bagger bozo's should get the boot.

**Wisconsin Lawmakers Back Bill To Arrest Federal Officials Who Implement Obamacare**

Nine Republican members of the Wisconsin Legislature say they would back a bill to arrest any federal officials who attempt to implement President Obama's signature health care law in the state.

The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports that the nine state lawmakers told the Tea Party-aligned Campaign For Liberty that they support authorizing "state and local law enforcement to arrest federal officials attempting to implement the **unconstitutional health scheme known as Obamacare."**

One of the nine lawmakers backing Campaign for Liberty's proposal is state representative Chris Kapenga (R-Delafield), who told the Journal Sentinel that **he believes the health care law is unconstitutional.**

**"Just because Obama was reelected does not mean he's above the constitution," he said.**

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/13/wisconsin-obamacare_n_2125468.html

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 2:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hmm...Nailingit, could it be there is much question by state governments as to the legality of the implementation of President Obama's Health Care Bill and Article 1, Section 7 of the US Constitution??? Some may say that it is an abuse of authority by the president.

goldenoldie — November 14, 2012 at 2:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal


*Some may say that it is an abuse of authority by the president.*

Some may say Obama's a native Kenyan. So what. SCOTUS has ruled. Silly silly stuff with the right.

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 2:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger: I guess we all can discuss the "mandate" question ad nauseum. Maybe the question that should be posed is:

Who has the power?

Mandate or not, President Obama wields a whole lotta power and he isn't worried about running again. I saw a little of this in how he was testy today about Susan Rice in the press conference.

My Kentucky granddaddy used to call this a "pecker check." I think Lyndsey Graham and John McCain are going to get into said pecker check with the POTUS very soon and we will see who has the power (bigger pecker), regardless of mandate.

Just sayin'

manthou — November 14, 2012 at 3:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal


LOL!

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 3:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou,

And I'm still saying the power hasn't changed - these arguments that being a lame duck lead to a rise in Pres Obama's power seem to ignore that the same didn't hold true for either Bush 2 or Clinton. Bush 2's 2nd term was a (more or less) nonevent. Clinton had a pretty successful 2nd term - because he worked with Newtie rather than fought with him. Pres Obama will have to do the same with Boehner. Otherwise, four more years of deadlock. He can send Sen Murray, Axelrod, and all his other mouthpieces onto every TV program he wants - at the end of the day, money bills come from the House.

roger — November 14, 2012 at 4:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Is anyone else having trouble posting to the forum? Just wondering. Got an email message from a customer who could not post. It appears that it's working properly, but...

If anyone else is experiencing difficulties, please email me at john.hill@columbian.com. Thank you.

John Hill (Columbian Staff) — November 14, 2012 at 4:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal


No problems on this end John.

---

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSL1gPCWW0E

**Joe Arpaio: I Wish Obama Would Invite Me To White House For Drinks**

Arizona Sheriff Joe Arpaio would like to have his own version of a "man-to-man" beer summit with President Barack Obama so he could give the president advice on dealing with immigration, the outspoken law enforcement official told Breitbart News in a story published Tuesday.

"I wish the president would invite me to the White House," he said, according to the website. "We'll have some wine and beer, and light up cigars."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/joe-arpaio-obama-white-house-drinks_n_2130375.html?ref=topbar

*At what point should a person be lawfully removed from office?*

*Can I call you Joe?*

mental incapacity noun

Definition of MENTAL INCAPACITY

1
: an absence of mental capacity
2
: an inability through mental disorder or mental retardation of any sort to carry on the everyday affairs of life or to care for one's person or property with reasonable discretion

http://www.merriam-webster.com/medical/mental%20incapacity

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 4:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nail-
I put up a poorly written post, so let me err, explain.

Strengthen should have been maintained their majority. The point I failed miserably to make is that I feel, the composition of the House probably better represents the overall view of where the electorate is at.
I kerspose the margin of victory, mandate, etc could be argued about forever. I really don't feel getting 52 out a hundred votes is an overwhelming victory. I pretty much vote for the D's. I feel Obama could be facing a republican congress after 2014, with the D's needing to defend 6 senate seats in the red states-ain't no electoral college to play on there.
The % of Romney's votes coming from whites, to me, indicates a softness in support from these voters for Obama.
BTW-I voted for Obama.

mrd — November 14, 2012 at 5:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal


John Hill, nice of you to check in. I wasn't sure you were still here. No problems posting here, still a lot of heartburn with the "captcha" though.

hawkeye — November 14, 2012 at 6:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 2:52 p.m.

So if the shoe were on the different foot and we had a Republican president who made a decision without honoring the Constitution...a decision you knew was violating your right to choose whether or not you wanted to pay for health insurance...a decision forcing you to pay for something you could not afford, you'd have the same response???

Also...have you always agreed with every decision of the SCOTUS???

Just wonderin'.

goldenoldie — November 14, 2012 at 6:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hey John Hill...just thought I'd let you know that posting has had a bit of a delay for me...nothing big, just a minor delay and it sends my security system into protect mode...just a clickin' away! Thanks for askin'.

goldenoldie — November 14, 2012 at 6:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mrd- As far as numbers go I'll refer to my post @ 11/12 @ 7:36.

As far as the House goes, *I feel, the composition of the House probably better represents the overall view of where the electorate is at.*

With a 12% approval rating? I don't think so. Their own even turned on them. Republican social/economic measures have been denounced country wide. They've gone nutty since 2010 and paid the price for it.

Unfortunately 2010 is the gift that will keep on giving in the House for another 6-8 years. Please refer to some articles from last weeks forum that are spot on about this. Most likely the right will have the house for at least that long due to republican gerrymandering. This is just a fact given the districting changes that occurred in 2010.

This election had dynamics & numbers historians will buzz about for years and years to come. It was a message election.

Just one of many... A president getting elected to a second term with unemployment hovering around 8%? Unheard of. Till now.

Exit polls were telling, especially concerning the tax issue.

We need strong leadership and I believe Obama has found his footing. Obama claimed he has a mandate for the middle class in a press conference today. I believe him.

At least until we get screwed again! :))

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 8:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie @ 6:18- Incredible some on the right are arguing this! It's weirdly bizarre. It doesn't matter what I think. It doesn't matter what Beck or Limbaugh or hannity or any politician or pundit thinks.......get this...

OBAMACARE IS THE LAW OF THE LAND! THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT HAS RULED ON THIS MATTER! :)))))

OBAMACARE IS THE LAW OF THE LAND! THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT HAS RULED ON THIS MATTER! :)))))

OBAMACARE IS THE LAW OF THE LAND! THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT HAS RULED ON THIS MATTER! :)))))

(thought maybe if I capitalized and repeated it, it might help a few that look in on the forum once in awhile) Why stop now?

The world is not 6 thousand years old.

Climate change is real.

Rape does not shut down pregnancy.

Obama is not a Muslim.

Ambassador Rice is not responsible for the Benghazi attack.

Obama is a natural born citizen of America.

Donald Trump is a butt hole.

**Opinion does not change fact.**

It is a great study in human behavior though. When folks don't get their way sometimes just making stuff up seems to help. It's why Fox News gets great ratings.

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 9:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal


These disgruntled old conspiracy nuts need someone to blame.

How about the 4 star who couldn't keep his pants zipped up for his country?

**Obama Lashes Out At Top Republicans Over Benghazi-Linked Criticism Of Susan Rice**

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/obama-susan-rice-benghazi_n_2131135.html

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 9:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Even many on the hard right are getting sick of GOP base absurdities. Interesting read. Notice how the writer feels the need to repeat messaging to these knucklehead conspiracists.

**Is It Time to Roll Up the Welcome Mat Here?**

**Barack Obama won the election.**

**He did not win by stealing the election.** Voter irregularities always happen. It is one reason we support voter ID rules. But even in the worse scenario of reports out there, there were not enough tales of voter irregularities to matter nationwide. This is another benefit and built in safeguard of the electoral college.

**Barack Obama won.** He won by turning out the most people in a well run campaign. In other words, **he won fair and square.**

We here at RedState are American citizens. **We have no plans to secede from the union. If you do, good luck with that, but this is not the place for you.**

We have a place for you here if you wish to continue the fight against Republicans in Washington like John Boehner and Mitch McConnell who’d be happy to sell us down the river to keep their power, no matter how devoid of principle or sound policy. You have a place here if you’d like to keep fighting the Democrats who are intent on further stifling economic growth, pushing forward with Obamacare, bankrupting the nation, and siding with teachers unions against kids who deserve better.

**Too many people have spent the past four years obsessed with birth certificates. Now they are obsessed with voter fraud conspiracies, talk of secession, and supposed election changing news stories if only we had known.**

**So let’s add dabblers in this latest nuttiness to birthers as a category of people we do not welcome at RedState. Our aim is to beat the Democrats, not beat a retreat to a Confederacy that Generals Grant and Sherman rent asunder well over a hundred years ago.**

Even here at RedState, while we may not much care for him, President Obama is still our President and we are still quite happily citizens of the United States. If we must drain this fever swamp that’s taken hold of a few people on the right over this past week before we can drain the swamp in Washington, so be it.

All others need not apply.

Sincerely,

Erick Erickson
Editor-in-Chief, RedState.com

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 9:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 9:14 p.m.

Natural born citizen of America? what is that?

I don't think anybody currently on here has questioned the fact that Obama was born in the United States, but he never claimed to be born on either of the American continents.

frobert — November 14, 2012 at 10:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal


frobert LIVES for technicalities. Big Friggin Deal

hawkeye — November 14, 2012 at 11:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal


LOL!

**Evidence Obama Born In Kenya Goes Beyond 1991 Brochure**

http://www.infowars.com/evidence-obama-born-in-kenya-goes-beyond-1991-brochure/

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 12:48 a.m. ( | suggest removal


after wrestling with lies and attacks from both sides, my nightly prayer was, "God, please have YOUR WILL be done. please have the one you choose be the winner".

obama won.

I was afraid. is HE planning to punish us for our sins? unfettered abortions, demeaning of morals using 'fashion', and the lives of people on television shows as our examples of how to live??

unwed births exceeding married ones?

whatever, i just trusted God. His will ALWAYS results in the increase of good in the world, even if we have to suffer for our sins.

whatever it was, i accepted it as God's will.

now i'm seeing potential security breaches in the CIA, Presidential decisions made for partisan reasons. the entire focus of federal gvt being to re-elect the dem prez regardless of the needs of the country.

facts are facts. obama is president for the next 4 years. syria has crossed the isreali border in a clear act of war. our sect'y of state, hillary clinton, is walking away from the problem.

and obama, our commander-in-chief, has no support among the troops. his preferred handling of international crises is to ignore them, and after benghazi, this no longer passes muster with our troops.

i watched the press conference today obama seemed to FINALLY realize that the stakes he was playing with were the future of our country, isreal, and another world war (this time nuclear).

pray for our president. he needs all the help he can get. our country's future depends on the actions we *all* take **now**.

iconoclast — November 15, 2012 at 2:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal


178 feet !!! That's what the current I-5 bridge CLEARANCE is when it's fully raised.

The new bridge is going to be lower that the current height of the old bridge's superstructure. People can quit worrying about airspace for the airports. There is no reason (other than Loo-Rail) not to raise the height to accommodate the needs of the river traffic.

What in hell is wrong with these fools. They should have checked the height requirement FIRST !!! What, there were no engineers on the CRC board??? Now we have to wait and see IF the USCG will permit theme a height less than needed.

Now we know that IF these CRC people dropped the Loo-Rail in the plans they could go as high as needed and still stay way below the height of the current bridges structure.

JohnCasey — November 15, 2012 at 4:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*"It doesn't matter what I think."*

nailingit — November 14, 2012 at 9:14 p.m.

Actually, it does as far as I'm concerned because that was the origin of my question, wanting to know what you thought but if you don't want to provide an answer to my questions, that's your play in the game of discussion on a public site. No prob! I sense you show a propensity to keep your guard up when it comes to sharing your inner thoughts. I'll respect that...but I still might ask you such questions in the future.

And Nailingit...just to let you know, I don't question the issue of President Obama's place of birth OR what religion affiliation he is. He's our president and he believes in God. I have no problem with that and I respect the fact that he is our president for another four years.

Time to move on...whaddya say???

goldenoldie — November 15, 2012 at 6:22 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Hmmm...hey folks

Anybody ever see when the Open House for the Crossing was posted on the Columbian? I never saw it. AFTER THE FACT, I found it happened to be *yesterday!* Methinks the crowd would have been much larger if they'd gotten the word out better!!!

Guess I'd best check in on the crossing's website weekly since I'm finding it increasingly difficult to rely on our community news sites!

goldenoldie — November 15, 2012 at 6:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


JohnCasey...those "fools" don't give a rat's rear end to plan the project according to a structured methodology. They're more interested in...

...well... I think you'd know what I'm going to say without me saying it.

goldenoldie — November 15, 2012 at 6:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Conservatives. What a wild n' wacky bunch! At least they're benefitting someone.

Late night comedians.

**Impeach Obama Robocall Campaign Launched By Conservative Group**

WASHINGTON -- The movement to impeach President Barack Obama has been launched, just days after he won a second term in the White House.

The Conservative Majority Fund, a conservative group known primarily for its birther conspiracy spreading, has launched a robocall campaign to gin up support for the president's impeachment.

The call, emailed to The Huffington Post by Shaun Dakin of StopPoliticalCalls.org, reads in part as follows:

*Our only recourse now is to move forward with the full impeachment of President Obama. We suspect that Obama is guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors and that there may be grounds for impeachment as is laid out in the constitution. Further, he may not even be a U.S. citizen because nobody, I mean no one, has seen an actual physical copy of his birth certificate. Impeachment is our only option. And Republicans are already considering Obama investigations. As the nation's most effective conservative group we are launching the official impeach Obama campaign.*

Conservative Majority Fund is on the fringe of the conservative fringe. And their outlandish drives are often done with an eye towards exploiting people's dark political fears as a way to raise money. So it's not terribly surprising that they moved this quickly to start the drumbeats for the president's impeachment.

Among the "misdemeanors" they cite are the president's proposals to close the detention center at Guantanamo Bay -- an idea supported by Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) -- and to give "full amnesty" to undocumented immigrants. Indeed, a pathway to citizenship has, in recent days, been endorsed by McCain and other Republicans.

The group is casting a wide net with the calls. According to Dakin, people in Washington, Colorado, New Jersey and Virginia have so far reported receiving the call.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/impeach-obama-robocall-campaign_n_2132682.html

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 7:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Maniacal in Maine!**

*Tain't no negroes in these here parts...call da judge!!!*

**Charlie Webster, Maine GOP Chair, Alleges That Black Voters Came To Rural Towns To Vote [VIDEO]**

"In some parts of rural Maine, there were dozens, dozens of black people who came in and voted on Election Day," he said in an interview with WSCH TV. "Everybody has the right to vote, but nobody in town knows anybody that's black -- how did that happen? I don't know. We're going to find out."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/15/charlie-webster-maine-gop_n_2136055.html

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 7:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Peaches are rotting in Georgia! Putting the Bull in Dog! Taking the mind out of control!

It's becoming a joke to be a Republican. Can we say implosion? We are truly witnessing the dissolution of the Republican Party.

**Top Georgia GOP Lawmakers Host Briefing on Secret Obama Mind-Control Plot**

President Obama is using a Cold War-era mind-control technique known as "Delphi" to coerce Americans into accepting his plan for a United Nations-run communist dictatorship in which suburbanites will be forcibly relocated to cities. That's according to a four-hour briefing delivered to Republican state senators at the Georgia state Capitol last month.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/11/georgia-senate-gets-52-minute-briefing-united-nations-takeover

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 8:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal


A template for Vancouver law enforcement?

**1 of 2**

**Marijwhatnow? A Guide to Legal Marijuana Use In Seattle**

The people have spoken. Voters have passed Initiative 502 and beginning December 6th, it is not a violation of state law for adults over 21 years old to possess up to an ounce of marijuana (or 16 ounces of solid marijuana-infused product, like cookies, or 72 ounces of infused liquid, like oil) for personal use.  The initiative establishes a one-year period for the state to develop rules and a licensing system for the marijuana production and sale.

Marijuana has existed in a grey area in Seattle for some time now. Despite a longstanding national prohibition on marijuana, minor marijuana possession has been the lowest enforcement priority for the Seattle Police Department since Seattle voters passed Initiative 75 in 2003. Officers don’t like grey areas in the law. I-502 now gives them more clarity.

Marijuana legalization creates some challenges for the Seattle Police Department, but SPD is already working to respond to these issues head on, by doing things like reviewing SPD’s hiring practices for police officers to address now-legal marijuana usage by prospective officers, as well as current employees.

While I-502 has decriminalized marijuana possession in Washington, the new state law does not change federal law, which classifies marijuana as a Schedule I narcotic. All Seattle Police officers have taken an oath to uphold not only state law, but federal law as well. However, SPD officers will follow state law, and will no longer make arrests for marijuana possession as defined under I-502.

The Seattle Police Department and Mayor Mike McGinn have already begun working with state officials to navigate this conflict, and follow the direction of Washington voters to legalize marijuana.

In the meantime, the Seattle Police Department will continue to enforce laws against unlicensed sale or production of marijuana, and regulations against driving under the influence of marijuana, which remain illegal.

**Here’s a practical guide** for what the Seattle Police Department believes I-502 means for you, beginning December 6th, based on the department’s current understanding of the initiative  Please keep in mind that this is all subject to ongoing state and local review, and that it describes the view of the Seattle Police Department only. All marijuana possession and sale remains illegal under federal law, and Seattle Police cannot predict or control the enforcement activities of federal authorities.

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 8:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**2 of 2**

*Can I legally carry around an ounce of marijuana?*

According to the recently passed initiative, beginning December 6th, adults over the age of 21 will be able to carry up to an ounce of marijuana for personal use. Please note that the initiative says it “is unlawful to open a package containing marijuana…in view of the general public,” so there’s that. Also, you probably shouldn’t bring pot with you to the federal courthouse (or any other federal property).

*Well, where can I legally buy pot, then?*

The Washington State Liquor Control Board is working to establish guidelines for the sale and distribution of marijuana. The WSLCB has until December 1, 2013 to finalize those rules. In the meantime, production and distribution of non-medical marijuana remains illegal.

*Does I-502 affect current medical marijuana laws?*

No, medical marijuana laws in Washington remain the same as they were before I-502 passed.

*Can I grow marijuana in my home and sell it to my friends, family, and co-workers?*

Not right now. In the future, under state law, you may be able to get a license to grow or sell marijuana.

*Can I smoke pot outside my home? Like at a park, magic show, or the Bite of Seattle?*

Much like having an open container of alcohol in public, doing so could result in a civil infraction—like a ticket—but not arrest. You can certainly use marijuana in the privacy of your own home. Additionally, if smoking a cigarette isn’t allowed where you are (say, inside an apartment building or flammable chemical factory), smoking marijuana isn’t allowed there either.

*Will police officers be able to smoke marijuana?*

As of right now, no. This is still a very complicated issue.

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 8:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**3 of 2** :)

*If I apply for a job at the Seattle Police Department, will past (or current) marijuana use be held against me?*

The current standard for applicants is that they have not used marijuana in the previous three years. In light of I-502, the department will consult with the City Attorney and the State Attorney General to see if and how that standard may be revised.

*What happens if I get pulled over and an officer thinks I’ve been smoking pot?*

If an officer believes you’re driving under the influence of anything, they will conduct a field sobriety test and may consult with a drug recognition expert. If officers establish probable cause, they will bring you to a precinct and ask your permission to draw your blood for testing. If officers have reason to believe you’re under the influence of something, they can get a warrant for a blood draw from a judge. If you’re in a serious accident, then a blood draw will be mandatory.

*What happens if I get pulled over and I’m sober, but an officer or his K9 buddy smells the ounce of Super Skunk I’ve got in my trunk?*

Under state law, officers have to develop probable cause to search a closed or locked container. Each case stands on its own, but the smell of pot alone will not be reason to search a vehicle. If officers have information that you’re trafficking, producing or delivering marijuana in violation of state law, they can get a warrant to search your vehicle.

*SPD seized a bunch of my marijuana before I-502 passed. Can I have it back?*

No.

*Will SPD assist federal law enforcement in investigations of marijuana users or marijuana-related businesses, that are allowed under I-502?*

No. Officers and detectives will not participate in an investigation of anything that’s not prohibited by state law.

*December 6th seems like a really long ways away. What happens if I get caught with marijuana before then?*  

Hold your breath. Your case will be processed under current state law. However, there is already a city ordinance making marijuana enforcement the lowest law enforcement priority.

*I’m under 21. What happens if I get caught smoking pot?*

It’s a violation of state law. It may referred to prosecutors, just like if you were a minor in possession of alcohol.

http://spdblotter.seattle.gov/2012/11/09/marijwhatnow-a-guide-to-legal-marijuana-use-in-seattle/

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 8:49 a.m. ( | suggest removal



Let's hope the next election cycle brings with it a renewed love of fact-checking over punditry. I have a friend who has used Bayesian probabilistic analysis (the same statistical technique Nate Silver, Dr. Sam Wang and Drew Linzer used to accurately predict Obama's victory last week) to predict outcomes and he often gets hell from government folk who don't like the inconvenient truth of it all. It is so much easier to shoot the messenger when you don't like the message, no matter how accurate it is.

God, I'd like to get rid of all the drama and the noise (as Nate Silver's book suggests). Journalists need to learn a little bit about statistical analysis and its power to predict accurately before they disparage those who use it. Of course, when their boss hands them a pay check based on how well they produce a one-sided message:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/11/14/partisan-journalists-are-following-the-money-all-too-literally.html

manthou — November 15, 2012 at 9:27 a.m. ( | suggest removal


It's been a while since I've posted here. Sometimes one needs that break to regenerate the mind and body...I'm wondering how much of the distraction the Bengasi terrorist attack and the Patraeus affair will have on both parties cooperating together to get our fiscal situation in order in the short run...

stikoutking — November 15, 2012 at 10:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJNb8p...

manthou @ 9:27- *God, I'd like to get rid of all the drama and the noise*

Me too! I would place some blame on the left, but I don't recall wild reckless crazy partisan predictions like the right had this year.

Good Beast read. [The intellectual dishonestly usually comes in the form of soft collusion—a reluctance to criticize extreme voices on their own side of the aisle in public, even as they are dismissed in private.] A rushxample...

Unfortunately no one one the right tells Rush to shut it. It must be hard for him to keep a straight face much of the time.

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 10:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Yep - Those clowns are planning on working together back there in Wash DC. So much for any sort of mandate, or anything else that might lead to bringing sanity back to government.

The Repubs are starting to hit back - No to any tax increase from Speaker Boehner.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/john-boehner-fiscal-cliff_n_2134040.html

The new Dem Senators are "pledging" filibuster reform - here from Elizabeth Warren. This sends a message that the Repubs won't just roll over and accept.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/elizabeth-warren/filibuster-reform_b_2136800.html

Buried in this article is a blurb that Spkr Boehner wants a joint House/Senate bill, but Maj Ldr Reid is saying No - the Senate version is the one to go forward. So, don't expect any movement on this in the near future.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14/violence-against-women-act-renewal_n_2132366.html

“Mr. President, don’t think for one minute I don’t hold you ultimately responsible for Benghazi. I think you failed as Commander in Chief before, during, and after the attack." Sen Lindsey Graham's repsonse to Pres Obama after he chastises Graham and Sen McCain over their "going after" Susan Rice.
http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2012/11/15/lindsey-graham-obama-failed-as-commander-in-chief/

roger — November 15, 2012 at noon ( | suggest removal


**Nancy Pelosi to Obama: Stand firm on taxes**

It’s a major sticking point whether Obama and House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) will find a way to raise revenue without hiking marginal tax rates. But Pelosi, emboldened by picking up eight seats in the House, said she’s “agnostic” about the components of a grand deficit compromise, but would like to see the rich pay more.

She described her ideal fiscal cliff deal as “grand in scope, that increases revenues by asking the wealthy to pay their fair share and that makes responsible cuts.”

Pelosi is heading to the White House Friday to meet with Obama, Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio), Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.).

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1112/83930.html#ixzz2CKEYWMhi

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 12:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal


JohnCasey — November 15, 2012 at 4:10 a.m.

Hey John, did you see where the Mayor-elect in Portland isn't following suit with Sweet Sam on the REQUIREMENT that Light Rail be included in the construction of the bridge? So, if this is true, then it doesn't matter what the grade of the bridge is. If we could actually get Mr. Peterson to design a bridge that would include the possibility of LR later and make the bridge tall enough for river traffic, how could anybody complain. As I recall, the one he initially designed looked great and had everything needed.

hawkeye — November 15, 2012 at 12:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMLcbT...

A brief critical election message for America's right, startling revelation for many in the middle, and a rehash of truth for those on the left.

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 12:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal



***Now here's something. Take note where the "Conservatives" are***

LAS VEGAS (AP) — Top Republicans meeting for the first time since Election Day say the party failed to unseat President Barack Obama because nominee Mitt Romney did not respond to criticism strongly enough or outline a specific agenda with a broad appeal.

In conversations at the Republican Governors Association meeting in Las Vegas, a half dozen party leaders predicted the GOP will lose again if it keeps running the same playbook based on platitudes in place of detailed policies. Instead, these leaders asserted, the party needs to learn the lessons from its loss, respect voters' savvy and put forward an agenda that appeals beyond the white, male voters who are its base.

"We need to acknowledge the fact that we got beat," Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal said in an interview. "We clearly got beat and we need to recognize that."

hawkeye — November 15, 2012 at 2:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 2:13 p.m.

That was great, but when they let the doves go I was waiting for the shotgun blast. Disappointing!

hawkeye — November 15, 2012 at 2:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal


stikoutking: Welcome back. Sometimes crises are opportunities in disguises. Or so they say. Maybe a chance for both parties to come together over these issues. I was impressed when I heard Peter King, a Republican, become enraged that the President had not been informed of the FBI probe of Petraeus.

One can hope.

manthou — November 15, 2012 at 2:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawk- Given Pat Robertson's recent revelation that adultery is now acceptable, no doubt adults only baptism's are in the future. Wouldn't be the first time conservatives went skinny dipping in a holy place.

This went away as fast as it came. Imagine if Democrats had done this. Republicans would have demanded a full Congressional inquiry/criminal investigation! :) This RW congress can really stink it up. I think people are catching on to this crowd.

A blast from the recent past.

**House Republicans Scolded For Drinking, Nudity In Israel**

The FBI probed a late-night swim in the Sea of Galilee that involved drinking, numerous GOP freshmen lawmakers, top leadership staff — and one nude member of Congress, according to more than a dozen sources, including eyewitnesses.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0812/79865.html#ixzz2CLCVScPM

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 4:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawkeye,

Where did you find that bit about Charlie Hales saying light rail isn't necessary to the CRC? Everything I've read has him saying we can eliminate interchanges, etc, but light rail, bike paths, and walkways are mandatory. He's an old Portland Transportation guy who has played a big role in their downtown philosophy of reducing the presence of cars, so this would be a major change for him. The only thing I can see causing him to say it's OK to drop light rail is if Oregon is so broke they're ready to drop out of the project entirely. (Which is a real possibility; the Orange line and Sellwood Bridge project have them breaking into all their reserves.)

roger — November 15, 2012 at 5:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal


A CNN segment I just saw says Israel's army is on the move. This is getting pretty volatile. I missed what started this, but it looks as though they plan on putting a major beating on Hamas.

roger — November 15, 2012 at 5:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal



roger

http://eastportland.katu.com/news/politics/499197-hales-plans-shift-focus-city-transportation-budget

I know, hard to believe but you have to hand it to the guy.

hawkeye — November 15, 2012 at 7:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I've been wanting this for a long time! Go for it Harry!!

**Democratic Solution To The Filibuster: Make Them Talk**

With Reid's backing, the reform caucus stands a good chance of enacting rules changes. The plan they're putting forward is still taking shape as the reformers work to gather support, but its central tenets were laid out by Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-Ore.) in an interview with The Huffington Post.

Merkley said that he first pitched filibuster reform to Reid in the summer of 2007, while he was being recruited as a candidate. The plan he put forward in 2011, he said, has been significantly revised.

The critical component, though, is a mechanism that would force senators to physically take the floor and speak in order to maintain opposition to legislation. The effort to end a filibuster is called a cloture motion. Under the proposed rules, if a cloture vote failed to win a simple majority, the bill would be killed and the Senate would move to new business. But if it won a majority -- though less than a supermajority of 60 -- the bill would remain on the floor for any senator who wished to opine on it. If at some point no senator rose to speak, after given several chances to do so, a new vote would be called -- and only a simple majority would be needed to pass it.

"You have to present your case," said Merkley. "If you think there should be more debate, then you've got to debate. You've got to present your case before your colleagues, before the American public. If you haven't got the guts to do that, then you shouldn't stand in the way of the majority vote."

..

The critical component, though, is a mechanism that would force senators to physically take the floor and speak in order to maintain opposition to legislation. The effort to end a filibuster is called a cloture motion. Under the proposed rules, if a cloture vote failed to win a simple majority, the bill would be killed and the Senate would move to new business. But if it won a majority -- though less than a supermajority of 60 -- the bill would remain on the floor for any senator who wished to opine on it. If at some point no senator rose to speak, after given several chances to do so, a new vote would be called -- and only a simple majority would be needed to pass it.

"You have to present your case," said Merkley. "If you think there should be more debate, then you've got to debate. You've got to present your case before your colleagues, before the American public. If you haven't got the guts to do that, then you shouldn't stand in the way of the majority vote."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/15/democrats-filibuster-reform_n_2141382.html

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 8:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWyEc7...

Filibusters here we come! In addition to defending/advocating positions, the public will see what's behind the wheel. The public will see Republicans filibuster equal pay for women, veteran work programs, funding for our embassy's, etc. etc.

If they've got the political nerve.

"You have to present your case," said Merkley. "If you think there should be more debate, then you've got to debate. You've got to present your case before your colleagues, before the American public. If you haven't got the guts to do that, then you shouldn't stand in the way of the majority vote."

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 8:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal


**Tulsi Gabbard, First Hindu In Congress, To Take Oath Over The Bhagavad Gita: Report**

Last week, Democrat Tulsi Gabbard became the first Hindu-American to enter the U.S. House of Representatives after she soundly defeated Kawika Crowley of the Republican Party in Hawaii's second Congressional district.

The 31-year-old will be making history yet again when she takes her oath of office. According to The Hill, **Gabbard, an Iraq war veteran, will be taking her oath over the Hindu holy scripture Bhagavad Gita, instead of the Bible.**

Gabbard, whose first name refers to a tree sacred to Hindus, follows the Vaishnava branch of Hinduism. The Bhagavad Gita, a centuries-old Dharmic holy book that is part of the ancient epic Mahabharata, is her primary scripture.

"The Bhagavad Gita is often considered a guide as to how to make decisions in difficult situations, when the decision is often not clear cut," Mihir Meghani, a co-founder of the Hindu American Foundation, told Religion News Service last week. "Hinduism's innate pluralism recognizes that there are various ways to look at things, and its focus on dharma, or duty, guides those holding positions of power or authority."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/12/tulsi-gabbard-hindu-congress-oath-bhagavad-gita_n_2117474.html

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 9:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I didn't know Merkley had it in him. Good for him, I like it.

hawkeye — November 15, 2012 at 9:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Not surprising and helps to explain the wild wacky delusional views many evangelicals hold about life, liberty & reality. Many embrace drinking from this poisoned well that is drying up quicker than you can say Dream Act.

47%. Isn't that roughly the percentage of Republicans who believe President Obama is a Muslim with a phony birth certificate?

Or is it higher...

**Fox News Is The Most Trusted By Evangelical And Protestant Pastors, 2010 Research Shows**

It has been a rough week for Fox News. As it became clear on election night that their 'gut' polls and predictions were wildly mistaken, the melt down has become one for the history books -- and late night comedy.

But they were not the only ones shocked. Evangelical Christians responded to the results with dismay, disbelief and even disgust.

It turns out the two reactions are related. According to a 2010 survey of 1,000 Protestant Pastors conducted by LifeWay Research, **Fox News was chosen by 47% as the most 'accurate and fair' news outlet,** followed by PBS with 31% and CNN with 28%.

Time will tell if the next LifeWay Survey reveals that Evangelicals have turned the channel away from Fox.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/12/fox-news-evangelicals_n_2117390.html?utm_hp_ref=religion

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 9:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal


So this funny thing happened to me for this year's election.

As I have stated, I am currently serving in Afghanistan. Shortly after arriving here, I updated my mailing address with the county elections office to ensure I recieved my ballot.

First of all, I am still waiting to recieve my ballot for the primary that we had in August.

I did, however, recieve my ballot for the general election. It arrived in the first week of October. So I pulled up the voters guide, sat with my ballot to read and make my choices.

Knowing the mail system I deal with here, I saw that I had an option to scan and email my ballot back to the county. (to use the mail, it would probably still be sitting somewhere in Asia waiting to go back to the States). I sent the email on 12 October, with a reply from the elections office that it was recieved.

Today, 16 Nov, I am told by my wife, that I recieved a letter, at my home address in the States, from Clark County Elections Office, dated 13 Nov, stating that my ballot was "illegible" and therefore, unable to be counted.

Am I the only one who sees something wrong with this? Are there any attorneys in the basement that can advise me if I have any legal recourse for this?

danabwoodley — November 15, 2012 at 10:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6q37n...

DBW- Remember to take off your hat.

nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 11:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 15, 2012 at 11:50 p.m

While I do appreciate your attempt at humor, this situation has me more than annoyed. With my chosen profession, and I am played like this in the attempt to exercise my own Constitutional rights.

And a law requiring a photo ID disenfranchises voters?

danabwoodley — November 16, 2012 at 12:07 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**dana**

very interesting.

been keeping up with the CIA director/adulterer? the woman who had access to lots of good secrets?

or the "it was the video not terrorists" cliffhanger that suddenly appeared like a mushroom after a rain once the election was over?

or how about the county in fla that had a 163% voter turnout rate? or the 3 districts in chicago that had over a hundred thousand voters, but not one vote for romney?

you can't make up stuff like this, and you're (pardon the pun) on the front lines of all of it.

DeeLittle — November 16, 2012 at 12:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Well, Dee, I have sent a message to the County Auditor, WA Sec of State (current and incoming), Rep. HB, and Sens. Murray and Cantwell divulging my displeasure.

Still wondering if I could have legal recourse on this.

Also considering who else I can tell. Honestly, I would like everyone to know.

And regarding the GEN(r)/former DCIA, and numerous others that have worn stars on uniforms:

I am appalled that these same people get to look at me and tell me things I can/cannot do, but for some reason are not able to behave in a like manner themselves. I have actually begun a writing piece that I am considering publishing, and these gentlemen will certainly get an entire chapter on their exploits.

The sad truth is, I am not too certain that I can continue to advocate to anyone that at least a single term of service in uniform would be a good move. Many things have had a negative affect on my view of the service. I would be more than willing to hang up my boots now, but I have too much time invested. If I don't stay to get my pension, I would qualify for the official title of "Stupid".

danabwoodley — November 16, 2012 at 12:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**dana**

you are certainly not alone in that thinking.

to me, the obama admin was/is **so** outrageous, it's like we've been in the dark, but everything was familiar so it was no big deal. suddenly we bump into something strange, and have to turn on the light.

first thing that happens is all the vermin run around trying to find a place to hide. then comes the disgust at the condition of the place that the rats and cockroaches left.

next will come the cleanup. i wouldn't recommend military service to anyone right now either. let's hope our military's damage isn't very extensive, and there's enough to salvage that it'll be a quick, honest and decisive cleanup.

as for politics....well...at least we're at the vermin-recognition stage.

think the gaza rockets & isreali land-troop buildups will cool down your area any...?

btw...**IF** we get an admission of the cia's stand-down order, there's still hope for our country. if not....well, maybe we can move to the country of texas by then. good to hear from ya....was hoping all was ok, given your chosen profession & all :)

DeeLittle — November 16, 2012 at 2:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal


I just got through reading an article about cell phone use and texting while driving in USAToday. Statefarm insurance company says we, the public, have to do a better job in getting the information out about the perils of driving while texting and cell phone use.

Now that's ironic. Maybe if the insurance companies would take a firm stance on who they insure and not concentrate so much on their bottom line ...

You have responsibility to teach your children to drive safely. Insurance companies should let it be known that if you have an accident while driving distracted your future costs for insurance will sky-rocket at the least and maybe you'll have a problem getting anyone to insure you in the future. Maybe if they don't make it easier to get coverage it may dissuade them from doing it.

We already have up to one in three or four people driving without insurance. Make driving without insurance a felony. It's time we got harsh on the penalties.

Don't like the solution??? TAKE A BUS !!! (or Loo-Rail ... LOL) Then you can talk and text on your cell phone to your little ol' hearts content.

JohnCasey — November 16, 2012 at 4:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal


John-

Another idea. Since you are already driving, why not just to see that person to have the conversation?

danabwoodley — November 16, 2012 at 5:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — November 15, 2012 at 7:04 p.m.

Thanks for the link. That is a shift - I see someone is listening to the voters and not just the interest groups. Mayor Adams not budgeting for repaving those roads has been a sore point with a whole lot of people. As for the CRC change of position, I'll definitely be watching for clarification. This emphasis on interstate commerce that he says he'll apply should mean the entire corridor.

Related is in The Columbian's editorial today. Washington State is facing a $900 million budget shortfall for the next 2-year cycle (2014-2015), and it goes to $1.1 billion when extended out to 2017. I gather that because some is due to the Court ruling that says funding education is a State priority, The Columbian engages in their usual diatribe about public employee salaries and pensions. However, what they don't mention is the State's cost share for the CRC - where are they (we) going to find an extra $450 million for the project? Given our already high gas tax and Transportation budget already committed elsewhere for the next several years, I'm suspecting Jim Moeller and associates on the Transportation committee were looking toward a TIFIA loan from the Feds. That source has probably dried up too.

roger — November 16, 2012 at 5:14 a.m. ( | suggest removal


JohnCasey...the problem about parents these days is...some of them are worse drivers than what their children become. You were absolutely right when you said "Maybe if the insurance companies would take a firm stance on who they insure..."

I honestly believe there should be a mandatory retraining process involving people who have had multiple accidents in a given time frame as well as those with multiple traffic infractions...even combining the two (speaking of 5 or more in a year no matter what state these happened in) ...or they lose the privilege to drive indefinitely. The problem here is...how would it be enforced?

goldenoldie — November 16, 2012 at 5:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal


*"However, what they don't mention is the State's cost share for the CRC - where are they (we) going to find an extra $450 million for the project?"*

roger — November 16, 2012 at 5:14 a.m.

Tolls and Carbon Tax...

These two seem to be the hot topic of our leadership nationwide lately. *It's the Democratic way!!!* (yes, I'm being sarcastic)

goldenoldie — November 16, 2012 at 5:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


danabwoodley — November 15, 2012 at 10:25 p.m.

There's a piece in today's Columbian covering the topic of ballots that have "issues" - Clark County Auditor's office has a team that's contacting the people who submitted those ballots to verify them before tallying the results. This is especially crucial to the outcome of a few races that are still pending. I'll presume your letter had some sort of instructions for verifying your ballot - I'll also presume you left your wife a general power of attorney before deploying. Perhaps there's some way she can validate your ballot for you?

roger — November 16, 2012 at 6:04 a.m. ( | suggest removal


DanaB...might I consider this an understatement when I say you sound frustrated???

This is just a suggestion by me and I believe my understanding of your frustrations is far below that of what you are experiencing...but now, more than ever before is the time for you to continue to stand proud for what you are doing and to continue with your duties at 120%.

Because of those who have tarnished what it means to be a distinguished member of our armed forces, the frustrations are understandable...but for anybody with integrity and pride in their service who wants to call it quits now, they're not only letting down the people who stand by the US Military, even through adversity whether it be times of war or in recent case historic accounts of adultery and a possible leak of sensitive information, they're letting themselves down by allowing those tarnishing our military with their personal antics get the best of you.

Hang in there, Dana...not just for US...but for YOU as well.

Just my two cents!

goldenoldie — November 16, 2012 at 6:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal


After hearing Senator Murray say she wants to lead the Senate's Budget committee, and that she doesn't consider it crucial to actually have a budget --- I can see where this is going.

The House will not approve anything that raises taxes on the rich - Boehner keeps making that point. Previous (before the election) statements from that Party indicated they may be willing to put this on the table, but in light of the post-election Dem assault on the Repubs, I gather this is no longer an option. And I suspect knowing this has led to Murray and other Dems opining that a budget isn't really necessary - they can continue to spend (somewhat unchecked) without one.

My thinking, and supported by the numerous postings from the liberal press that Nails is putting out here, is that this is going to become an all out war for political dominance. I've started watching the mouthpiece of the conservative side (FOX) since the elections, and one predominant theme keeps popping up - countless businesses are going to reduce full time workers to part time status to avoid the health care law, and others are talking relocation out of country or bankruptcy/shutting down. (Hostess is the latest - no more Twinkies and Wonder bread!!!)

We The People are looking at some seriously critical times in front of us.

roger — November 16, 2012 at 6:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Oh - Reference the CRC meeting the other night - The Columbian did have a small article the day before. It noted the date/time/location, and that the agenda would be the height issue, with time allocated to the audience. This was in the hard copy - I didn't notice if it made it to the free on-line version. If not - oh well - they've got to pay Editor Lou's salary so he can continue having coffee meetings with any and all.

roger — November 16, 2012 at 6:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal


About the bridge height thing: They say the light rail can't traverse beyond a certain grade, correct? I find it hard to believe none of the engineers have never heard of a rollercoaster.

Sheesh.

Drift — November 16, 2012 at 7:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Legal marijuana, but no Twinkies?

http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/16/news/companies/hostess-closing/

frobert — November 16, 2012 at 7:14 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Speaking of the CRC..

Has anyone here thought about not only Smith Towers or Briz Guitar shop, the Day and night Mart and other business that will be effected by the CRC?

Will the occupants of Smith Towers and businesses be relocated on the city's dime or will they be left to fend for themselves?

From my understanding Smith Towers is home to low income seniors, and most of the businesses like the Mart and the Briz Guitar, the buildings are owned by the occupants.

Does anyone have more info on this to share?

ELISI — November 16, 2012 at 8:02 a.m. ( | suggest removal


How easy we have made it for the government to gather information about us today: no court order needed, thank you.

What Paula Broadwell should have realized:

http://www.salon.com/2012/11/16/paula_broadwells_big_mistake/

manthou — November 16, 2012 at 8:04 a.m. ( | suggest removal


danabwoodley — November 16, 2012 at 12:59 a.m.

Hey DB, why don't you contact Stevie Mathieu here at the Columbian. There might be a story there and that could bring your problem to light.

BTW, is anybody else having problems posting today?

hawkeye — November 16, 2012 at 8:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal


I can't read the comments over on the other side. I get an error message.

The other day I popped in here and there were both no comments nor a place to make one.

I dropped John a line about it just a few moments ago.

Drift — November 16, 2012 at 9:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou- From your article:

*When the last major law on electronic communications and privacy was passed in 1986,*

I was surprised that it's been twenty six years given internet and cell phone usage.

This might be one issue Congress can collectively work to change.

A little disturbing the head of the CIA wouldn't ensure his lover was utilizing better OPSEC. Reckless and dangerous. Maybe spillover from his Iraq venture.

nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 9:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal


John & Golden

Nevada has it going in the right direction where if you drive without insurance you loose your liceense and if you don't pay your insurance the insurance company notifies the state and you have a certain amount of days before they fine you and ultimately suspend your license..
Here in Washington you get pulled over and I've seen where our finest don't even give the uninsured driver a ticket..
Golden is right the parents are often just as bad as the kids while texting and driving...Currently 23% of the drivers in Clark County are uninsured....I have had a hard time posting as well where the system says thank you but it doesn't get posted ..I also sent John a note, he said he was looking into..

stikoutking — November 16, 2012 at 9:49 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Drift — November 16, 2012 at 7:06 a.m.,

Degree of incline that LRT can handle is one of the areas CRC hasn't provided much info on. 7-8% seems to be a standard maximum, though MAX has one stretch with a steeper slope over a couple of hundred feet. Your comment about roller coasters is an actual solution for some systems that have to go up a steep grade over a long distance - the problem is going down safely at an acceptable speed. And I've no idea how they plan on countering icy winter conditions. While not as bad as by the Glenn Jackson, those wintertime Gorge winds still get to Hayden Island area and can make for slick conditions.

There are a couple of other factors. ADA requirements for handicapped/wheelchair accessibility say a max slope of something like 8%. And they also have to build the exit ramps to SR14 and 6th Ave so they can be used safely (ever wonder why trucks are always overturning on the ramps on I205?).

The real problem here is that the old downtown is in the wrong place - too close to the river to allow a bridge that adequately and safely meets all needs and desires.

roger — November 16, 2012 at 10:03 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Does anyone know if the new pot laws address hash?

nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 10:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou- Enjoy!

WATCH: Colbert, Susan Lucci mock Petraeus soap opera

http://www.nypost.com/p/pagesix/watch_colbert_and_lucci_mock_petraeus_I5X4rg5IEdG6zaNVKTsuOI

nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 10:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 10:57 a.m.

Classic!!!! Thanks

hawkeye — November 16, 2012 at 11:16 a.m. ( | suggest removal


A must view video ... Who could have imagined this, But only Paul harvey and thats the rest of the story...

1GBHC34T

stikoutking — November 16, 2012 at 11:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit: Funny, funny video! You almost expect those kind of plot turns any minute now!

Elisi: There are about 200 buildings that are identified as full or partial acquisitions for the total CRC project. I am working on finding you a link and list.

manthou — November 16, 2012 at 11:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Elisi: Here is the list of proposed and potential property acquisitions (full and partial) for the CRC. I have one property that will be losing a tiny portion of a corner to make way for a bend in the light rail line on E 17th, so I try to keep an eagle eye out for changes:

http://www.columbiarivercrossing.org/FileLibrary/FINAL_EIS_PDFs/Appendices/CRC_FEIS_Appendix_E.pdf

manthou — November 16, 2012 at 11:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Forgive three posts in a row. Forum hog here.

Elisi and others who read the CRC property acquisition doc I linked above: to reduce a major potential freak out, please note that all properties listed (yep, there is a boat load) are divided among the following categories: Permanent Partial Acquisition; Permanent Full Acquisition; Temporary Construction Easement; Permanent Easement.

So, not all on the list will be purchased, removed by the CRC. But they will have some impact in the construction period.

manthou — November 16, 2012 at 12:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal


ELISI at 8:02 am: I found your answer on pages E-17 and E-18 on the document I posted at 11:55 am.

Smith Tower (515 Washington Street) will still be standing, but will have a Temporary Easement change during construction.

Briz Guitar and Loan (506 Washington) will be have Temporary Easement change only.
Day and Night Market (514 Washington) will have a Temporary Easement and a Permanent Access change). All three buildings will be standing after CRC construction but I will imagine the view will be concrete and the noise will be deafening.

I keep imagining that mess of pillars and concrete that greet me when I exit to Seneca Street from I 5 into downtown Seattle? Kinda like living under the belly of the USS Nimitz?

manthou — November 16, 2012 at 12:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal


The nail: "Does anyone know if the new pot laws address hash?"

Wanna read the whole thing? http://sos.wa.gov/_assets/elections/initiatives/i502.pdf

No? Mayhap this is the portion of interest?

(3) Delivery, distribution, and sale, on the premises of the retail outlet, of any combination of the following amounts of useable marijuana or marijuana-infused product to any person twenty-one years of age or older:
(a) One ounce of useable marijuana;
(b) Sixteen ounces of marijuana-infused product in solid form; or
(c) Seventy-two ounces of marijuana-infused product in liquid form.

So, one may assume an ounce of hash (or less) would be legal to possess.

But then, what about those brownies made with four ounces of kief and 12 ounces of brownie mix? ;^)

Drift — November 16, 2012 at 12:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Thank you for the link and info manthou, very much appreciated! :)

I vision it more like parking in the parking garage at Sea-Tac myself. First time we ever parked in it I thought the roof was caving in on us. Gave my husband a good laugh, being claustrophobic I hate it, at least PDX parking garage is open enough one can breathe.

ELISI — November 16, 2012 at 12:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Drift- *So, one may assume an ounce of hash (or less) would be legal to possess.*

It sure looks like it. I've looked on the net a bit and found hash laws vary with states though most view it as pot. Check out Montana penalties! Hopefully prices will drop soon. I expect with more affordable pot, hash productivity/availability will be on the rise. At least I hope so!

*But then, what about those brownies made with four ounces of kief and 12 ounces of brownie mix? ;^)*

Get em' while they're hot!

http://www.legaljoint.net/state_by_state/FirstDraftOfHashish.asp

nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 1:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I love it: Market Watch is advising the Masters of the Universe how to invest in legalized pot now. Didn't take long for the big boyz to stick their fingers into the pie, did it?

Funny.

manthou — November 16, 2012 at 1:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Howdy, at computer here running statistical analyses on a very messy data set. Need break!

So off to forum, naturally...Hey Nail, with this newfound interest in hash laws, may we expect a very mellow, relaxed, peace-to-all, including republicans, Nails soon here in basement?

luvithere — November 16, 2012 at 6:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I believe Alabama currently has a case before SCOTUS seeking to repeal parts of the voting rights act saying it's not needed. Yeah...right.

**Map lays out racist election tweets, most originated from southeast** **[MAP]**

A flurry of racist tweets that followed President Barack Obama’s re-election came primarily from southern states, according to a map that geographically pinpointed the point of origin of the hate speech.

Tweets calling the president a “monkey” or using racial epithets prompted a group of geography experts to try and break down whether the hateful language was more prevalent in some areas of the country than others.

As it turns out, it was.

The bigoted tweets serve as a “useful reminder that technology reflects the society in which it is based, both the good and the bad,” said geography research group Floating Sheep.

The group took 365 tweets and laid them over a color-coded map of the United States to analyze the frequency of hate tweets compared to the frequency of election-related tweets in that state.

Mississippi and Alabama had the highest ratio of racist tweets. They were followed by Georgia, Louisiana, Tennessee, forming a “fairly distinctive cluster in the southeast” of online hate speech, the research finds.

North Dakota, Utah, and Missouri also had a high prevalence of racist tweets.

In the west and northwest, there were very few racist tweets, with the exception of Oregon, the map indicates. Rates of racist tweets compared to overall Twitter usage was also low in the Northeast, the research found.

Some states, including Montana, Idaho, Wyoming and South Dakota, had no hate tweets, but the research notes

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/map-pinpoints-election-online-hate-tweets-article-1.1199402#ixzz2CRafZQgK

nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 6:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal


luvit- *Hey Nail, with this newfound interest in hash laws, may we expect a very mellow, relaxed, peace-to-all, including republicans, Nails soon here in basement?*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLXmE_...

luvit- It's a values thing. The new laws won't affect my lifestyle. On those occasions when I wish to absorb this portion of God's green earth, legalization brings accessible delivery methods, variety, and cheaper prices. I always advocate "peace-to-all" to include republicans.

I've never thought pot/hash is relegated to political affiliation. It's just when folks get high it tends to cause one to be introspective. Introspection lends itself to self-circumspection which many times leads to inner change and thoughtful views about life and self.

It's why fewer republicans get high. :))

nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 7:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hm..............you already sound so...relaxed. makes me wonder....

Just having fun. beats factor analyzing data.

luvithere — November 16, 2012 at 7:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Amen! Beats the hell out of it!

nailingit — November 16, 2012 at 7:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal



luvithere: speaking of data sets: Did you follow Dr. Sam Wang's Princeton Election Consortium's Bayesian predictions during the election? Drew Linzer? Nate Silver?

My hubby is a quant nerd was crazy about the brilliance evidenced there. Thanks to his reassurance, I had a very calm election night and ignored the pundits.

I wonder how the quants vs the pundits will play out during the next election...

Can't argue with the numbers, no matter how boring or anti-climactic they are.

manthou — November 16, 2012 at 8:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — November 16, 2012 at 6:05 a.m.

My frustrations go beyond the star wearers indiscretions. I am also frustrated that in some areas, where we can do better, no one wants to try anything new (unless it is suggested by someone who is probably wearing those stars). There are some things that happen for no reason other than "that's how it's always been".

In the past 10 years, there are things that have changed. Some were good, others not so much. Now we are seeing a lot of those changes reversed. Some should have not changed in the first place, but others I think is a better idea, but they want to revert to the "old ways".

The big problem is that there could be people like me, who see how we can make things better. Unfortunately, we are not moving up into positions where we can actually influence the required changes. The ones who are moving up are the ones that will gag themselves insisting that the "old ways" are the best, and just smile and nod profusely at those in higher positions, and not able to express an idea counter to what the highers present, or even produce a thought of their own.

But, only 4 1/2 years.

danabwoodley — November 17, 2012 at 12:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal



Manthou - good morning. Yes, I most certainly followed Silver and Wang. Loved Wang, loved it. I read a number of more scholarly articles on them. Love it that Sam Wang does not need to eat the big bug he bet Glenn Beck. :) Gave me hope through election night also and kept blood pressure at reasonable levels that last week.

Dana - it is well known that incompetence rises to the top. Don't we all know at least one moron at the top in our work lives? That, plus our tendency to do things "the old way," our innate fear of the new and unknown, typically explain to me why we keep doing the dumb things over and over again. Brown-nosing as you described above is unfortunately in many instances the way to rise to the top.

I have now moved from factor analyzing to hierarchical cluster segmentation. Yay! Maybe I treat myself to some simple regressions tomorrow. Take it easy for a bit.

luvithere — November 17, 2012 at 8:09 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Important history lesson.

**Jon Stewart Slams Bill O'Reilly Over 'Traditional America' Hysteria (VIDEO)**

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/16/jon-stewart-slams-bill-oreilly-traditional-america_n_2143614.html

nailingit — November 17, 2012 at 9:11 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Lou: the Press could listen more to its reader base, too. Just look to the North to see what happened to the Seattle Times' subscriptions (McKenna ads), which seems so out-of-touch with the community it serves. There's a good lesson in that somewhere. Just sayin' here since those of us who are smart enough to eschew FB cannot sound off, no matter how respectfully, upstairs.

Government could listen more, too. I think the Republicans lost because they talked AT folks with closed ears and minds.
________________________________________________________________________________

OK. Potential Offense warning: The following link is tongue-in-cheek and meant for only those with a modicum of humor left. Sort of a day dream fantasy: what would the US look like if these whackadoos were really able to secede? Lazy Saturday am reading at its best. Enjoy:

http://www.vice.com/read/why-not-let-all-the-states-secede-from-the-us

manthou — November 17, 2012 at 9:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou-thanks for the link to the seceding article. Good, relaxing, funny read over a cup of good coffee.

luvithere — November 17, 2012 at 10:04 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou,

I've been thinking about the secession issue myself, and come to the conclusion it won't work. Especially when you consider the number of states which will split up and go different directions. For example, Clark County will join much of the rest of Washington and expel King, Pierce and Thurston Counties. A similar fate will befall The Peoples Republic of Portland. Lew Waters' Clark County Conservative will replace The Columbian as our news source. Jim Moeller and supporters will have to sneak out in the middle of night and return to Olympia.

The USA that remains - the one with all the money - will be more liberal than ever. They'll probably dig up Teddy Kennedy, and send Nancy Pelosi to a taxidermist, and declare them rulers for eternity. Why, they'll probably even name Nails their Director of the Department of Educating the People!!!

And the first thing they'll do is look at the new nation (or nations) created by those who have departed the Union. They'll note the conservative Christian domination of the government(s) - which will be - and that there are oppressed minorities (atheists, gays, liberals, etc.). They'll see Sheriff Joey Arpaio being designated General of The Army of Arizona. Rick Santorum would be elected President of something. Why, I expect they'll even rewrite their religion to add a 4th Divinity - Ronald Reagan.

This will be considered completely unacceptable by the old Liberal USA, and they'll begin issuing proclamations that the new Conservative nation MUST observe the human rights that the Liberal Nation believes in.

And then we'll have war. Vancouver will help attack and conquer Seattle, and will also help Clackamas County take over the Portland Metro area. This won't sit well with Northern Calif, and they'll send their armies north. Oregonians will dig through their attics and find the old signs saying "Thanks for Visiting - Now Go Back to California." Why, Ted Nugent will probably even show up to head the various militias that will mobilize to defend the Conservative Oregon.

No - This just won't work.

roger — November 17, 2012 at 10:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal


roger at 10:56 am: You should seriously consider starting your own blog, man, starting with your post directly above. :)

Very clever, insightful, thought-provoking and doles out much-needed satire to all sides of the political spectrum.

Bravo! I want more!

manthou — November 17, 2012 at 11:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Roger, that was really very clever. Nailed it!

luvithere — November 17, 2012 at 12:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Rockin' Roger! Dood, that was great!

Drift — November 17, 2012 at 1:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Aw, shucks. Thanks all.

roger — November 17, 2012 at 1:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal


ROGER- *Nails their Director of the Department of Educating the People!!!*

I'm honored! A move up from the Department of Information Insemination.

Sounds awful ambitious in the light of pot legalization. :)

nailingit — November 17, 2012 at 1:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal


I'm wondering ----

Think about Hoover Dam. Nevada? or Arizona? And Lake Mead, the water feeds to California. This could be a BIG problem. Who would get what and who would control and maintain what. I'm seeing HUGE regional battles here. Then there's the TVA. That would be a cluster cluck there. And Bonneville and the other dams here, who would control all that power and water? I don't see it happening.

hawkeye — November 17, 2012 at 2:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Guess I can no longer ask anybody just what it is they've been smokin' lately. All kidding aside, Roger...you definitely have a talent with words, sir. Glad you're part of the craaazy crowd down in the basement! I'm with manthou on this one. As she said so very well...*"very clever, insightful, thought provoking and much-needed satire to all sides of the spectrum."*

You know, what you said...made me think. Yeah I know...that can be a mental mind blower for me, but seriously...it made me realize even more so, just how divided our nation has become. This "message" sent to DC was a message of division and not just in a political sense. I believe it's a societal message of division as well. I believe people are fed up with the very wealthy controlling what goes on in just about every facet of our lives. Anybody who believes money doesn't talk when it comes to government decisions must be impaired in sight, hearing and speech...to say it mildly.

Oh how I wish there was a quick cure for this illness plaguing the US...but I'm afraid it's gone global.

goldenoldie — November 17, 2012 at 2:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — November 17, 2012 at 2:20 p.m

And the proof is right here in Clark County-- when a candidate spends more than THREE TIMES the annual salary to get elected. Makes you wonder if there is an underlying reason.

hawkeye — November 17, 2012 at 3:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Hawkeye,

Oh come now Hawkeye, if you are going to use that as an example then I can use this..

Look at the amount Obama spent to get re-elected..money DOES buy an election..last I knew he had well over 1 billion to use...much more than THREE TIMES his salary.

ELISI — November 17, 2012 at 5:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Irregardless of political affiliation, the truth sometimes hurts. Money in politics? God-or money-forbid. As I understand the mis-mash of this election, I think GOP PAC's raised a similiar amount, which doesn't change the fact that money plays a more important role than we'd like to believe. Any place on earth comparable to US money/politics/elections? Nope. I guess the rest of the world is screwed up and we've got it right. Yea-right!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYIC0e...

mrd — November 17, 2012 at 6:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal


hawkeye — November 17, 2012 at 2:15 p.m.

Arizona has been fighting court rulings allocating the lion's share of the Colorado River to Calif for decades - it ends up back in the courts every so often.

Per the latest ruling, in 2000, as long as at least 7,500,000 acre feet (9.3 km3) of water is available from the Colorado River, California is allocated 4,400,000 acre·ft (5.4 km3); Nevada, 300,000 acre·ft (370,000,000 m3); and Arizona, the remainder. If more water is available, California is entitled to 50% of the water from the Colorado River, Arizona to 46%, and Nevada to 4%. If less water is available, the Secretary of the Interior must allocate the water according to various formulas (which were the subjects of the court cases) to ensure that each state receives a specified amount, with California receiving an absolute fixed maximum of 4,400,000 acre feet (5.4 km3) per year (547 U.S. 157).

Arizona has its own fights over water, that were going on when I lived there in the '70s. The Tucson ranchers and the various Indian reservations have seen a diminished availability since the Phoenix area started growing. There is (or was) especially a whole lot of heartburn over Phoenix homes all being built with swimming pools. Phoenix dominates what happens in that state, much as Seattle does here, often to the detriment of other areas.

The Colorado actually meanders down from Lake Powell, up on the Arizona/Utah border. I think someone back there told me a while back that the water level has been dropping quite a bit in that lake; coves where we used to pull a houseboat into are now high and dry.

So, I'm not sure what's driving your concern, but that the issue is cropping up again doesn't surprise me in the least.

roger — November 17, 2012 at 6:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal


mrd,

Lets just face facts here, both parties have their little "super PAC's" Both parties have enough that has play the game of politics to have been bought and paid for elections.

Not one side or the other can point the dirty finger at the other.

ELISI — November 17, 2012 at 6:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal


roger — November 17, 2012 at 6:13 p.m.

The reason I brought it up was because of all the secession talk. If it's been bad in the past, can you imagine what would happen if Arizona ANF California wanted out?

hawkeye — November 17, 2012 at 8:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal




ELISI-you're right. Both parties are guilty. That's why politics-ie, our governments- suck as bad as they do.

mrd — November 18, 2012 at 2:17 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldie @ 2:20 pm yesterday: Here's your quick cure for what ails mankind and womankind: We need to realize that we are all connected. What my brain and energy give out, you take in and vice-versa because our brains are one and the same, as are our souls, our hearts. Little machine parts that need to be healthy and cooperative and loving with each other or else the Big Machine that runs-it-all gets clogged up. But you already know that. :)

Here's another gift: A CRC article from former Columbian staffer Andrea Damewood who is now toiling hard at the Willamette Week:

http://www.wweek.com/portland/article-19904-a_bridge_too_low.html

manthou — November 18, 2012 at 7:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal


'SNL' Spoofs Petraeus Scandal With Paula Broadwell Reading 'All In' **(VIDEO)**

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/17/snl-spoofs-petraeus-scandal-paula-broadwell_n_2152884.html

nailingit — November 18, 2012 at 8:04 a.m. ( | suggest removal


goldenoldie — November 17, 2012 at 2:20 p.m.

Perhaps a contact high?

roger — November 18, 2012 at 8:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Manthou,

I saw and read that Willamette Week article when looking to see what John Laird was referencing when talking about Charlie Hales and the CRC. (Nothing new there, so I suspect he was referencing pre-election articles.)

Interesting that The Columbian writes articles that infer the USCG will capitulate and accept the 110 foot height. Andrea references a memo from the USCG that seems to say otherwise. "A midlevel bridge (with 95-to-110-foot clearance) has “a low probability of meeting the reasonable needs of navigation or of obtaining a Coast Guard permit,” wrote D.A. Goward, the Coast Guard’s marine transportation director."

And the CRC wants the Corps of Engineers to build a smaller dredge or barge, or perhaps contract out their operation to private firms. They're also talking about trucking sailboats around the bridge, telling the owners to lower the mast (a 2-day operation, per one boat owner), or just buying the sailboats to remove the problem.

roger — November 18, 2012 at 8:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal


I don't chime in much on the CRC issue as there are so many well educated and concerned citizens who approach this subject with unbridled passion and hindsight.

I do think we can learn from history. Take the Elbe River Crossing for example. No tolls, light rail nor concerns with bridge height. Maybe we're approaching this all wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFH2OZ...

nailingit — November 18, 2012 at 9:08 a.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnoCR8...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaN7Kx...

Buy the time anything gets built it will be outdated. Perhaps we should collectively work with the international community regarding the CRC. We don't seem to be doing well on our own.

We could put Vancouver on the world map by yielding to international prototypical entrepreneurial ideas that pay for themselves through private investment.

Great for publicity/tourism/business/entrepreneurialism/humor etc.

Turn local problematic "solutions" into a foray on international problem solving.

Vancouver. We are the world.

nailingit — November 18, 2012 at 9:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal


**Victory for strangers, heathens, wastrels!**

*Republicans counted on tried-and-true class warfare like never before. This time, "outsiders" were the majority*

Republicans of 2012 kept shouting that America had been stolen from them, stolen from true Americans. They imagine that America is being invaded by strangers crossing our borders, abetted by a secret Muslim Manchurian president, and hordes of beggars running to government for “stuff” that the overtaxed Republicans will have to pay for. For how much longer will they be sticking to this illogic?

In spite of his father’s dreams for him, Mitt Romney was the mouthpiece of the Tea Party coalition. He was the friend of Trump and the servant of Limbaugh. He was a commodity purchased by Sheldon Adelson, who hated him until the superior hate-monger Newt Gingrich imploded. This is the biggest irony of all. Romney himself is not and never was his own man. As a politician, he is not a symbol of self-reliance. He’s the opposite.

Here’s what the election proved: You can’t win by hating a large portion of the electorate. Those accused of being beggars and dependents actually have a voice. And ears and eyes. They could not ignore the insults and slurs delivered by each and every Republican primary contender. A majority now believes that the richest Americans should pay their fair share of taxes, because the super-rich are the real takers. Romney’s refusal to disclose more than a sliver of his tax returns was indicative of his party’s problem. The Republican candidate was a private businessman who exhibited zero interest in putting the public good before private interest, no matter how much money he was making.

Read more @ http://www.salon.com/2012/11/18/victory_for_strangers_heathens_wastrels/

nailingit — November 18, 2012 at 10:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Oh please don't tell me he truly said that!!! If you're wondering what I'm getting at...just read this article:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/election-2012/wp/2012/11/18/joe-biden-to-sandy-victims-youve-got-a-homeboy-who-gets-it/

goldenoldie — November 18, 2012 at 3:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal


manthou — November 18, 2012 at 7:41 a.m.

I'm curious...was this article meant to be satire or is the organization involved in finding solutions to the height restrictions really *that idiotic???* Asking the USCG to modify the dredges??? *In THIS ECONOMY???* And to physically haul sailboats out of the water which are too tall??? Yeah...like *that's* going to happen!

All I could do was laugh at how ridiculous the CRC truly is portrayed in this article...especially if they're truly expecting changes to be made by others in order to fulfill their own selfish needs. All the promotions...all the advertising...and from day one, they still couldn't accept what was laid out on the line as far as those height restrictions (and God knows what else they've tried to skirt around!!!).

Thanks for the entertainment, manthou!!! It truly made me laugh.

goldenoldie — November 18, 2012 at 3:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Soooo....everybody....!!!

You think we'll have that wind event the weather forecasters are predicting??? Only time will tell.

As of right now in my neighborhood (3:40 pm)...just rain...and a bit of a breeze...nothin' much. I don't know about everyone else's yards but when I walked across my lawn, there was a bit of standing water as my rain shoes sloshed in the grass...something rarely seen in my neighborhood. Little puddles of water are here and there in the yard and in the garden...

Guess that's why we're the "Evergreen State." Gotta love Washington.

Yep! A soaker indeed.

..
A little observation while out and about...

Larch Mountain east of Portland on the Oregon side...snow dusting the top. The hills east of Larch Mountain...snowy!!! Looks like a good possibility for entertaining skiers, snowboarders and sledders on Turkey Day!!! Let's hope the snow level doesn't suddenly leap above 7,000 feet.

goldenoldie — November 18, 2012 at 3:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yeyy4...

Just in case the Fed doesn't bail out Hostess (we can only pray) here is a survival vid for Twinkie users. I'm still looking for Ho Ho's & Ding Dong vid's. Might have to cook something up.

Congressman on Hostess bailout: ‘I don’t think that cake has been cooked yet’ [AUDIO]

http://dailycaller.com/2012/11/16/congressman-on-hostess-bailout-i-dont-think-that-cake-has-been-cooked-yet-audio/

nailingit — November 18, 2012 at 5:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal


***Here we go!!!!***

If you were waiting with bated breath for the "Draft Palin" movement, it's your lucky day! Conservative columnist Charlotte Allen has endorsed Sarah for the 2016 GOP nomination in today’s Los Angeles Times. Allen argues, apparently with a straight face, that "large segments of the electorate neither know nor care much about serious economic and political issues," and that Palin is the ideal Republican vehicle for "appealing to voters' emotions." Continuing her penetrating political insights, Allen adds that the former governor’s good looks are key to Republican success, since "men love Sarah Palin, and she loves men." We'll just let that sink in

hawkeye — November 18, 2012 at 8:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Palin n' Perry in 16'! PP

nailingit — November 18, 2012 at 9:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal


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