Open forum, Feb 3-9



The forums are moderated by Columbian staff and our community guidelines and terms of service still apply. To participate, login with your ID or register for an account at

Columbian staff members create new forum threads. Don't see a forum topic here that fits your comments? Email Web Editor John Hill --



Hey, all: I just read the weather report. Ugh. What a cruel tease this beautiful weather has been. Please no more frozen pipes or condensate line. Might have snow on Saturday.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 6:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou, I've been watching that as well. I really don't like it when it gets into the teens, especially when I have stuff to do outside at 7:30 am. Oh well, dress warm, I guess.

Hawkman — February 3, 2014 at 6:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk: Are you working on the old City Hall project per chance? I walked by it yesterday. Wow. They tore it down to the studs. Impressive. Ambitious.

Did you all know that Paul Allen sweet talked an astronaut into taking the 12th Man flag on a space walk? Fun story and pics from Crosscut:

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 6:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Research shows that readers trust news media more when they see corrections published and noted prominently. My experience has been that the media avoids admitting error at all cost.

After a rough fight over ethical controversies due to irresponsible reporting (just a couple of journalists) and questionable business decisions (purchasing ads for Rob McKenna's re-election), the Seattle Times Co actually created a new editorial position for Assistant Managing Editor Leon Espinosa: "Standards and Reader Interactivity." I believe this is an attempt to regain subscriber confidence after those bonehead decisions. We'll see if it results in more corrections or a lack of need for corrections. :)

Craig Silverman of "Regret the Error" offers some other good strategies that I hope more newspapers will consider:

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 9:19 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Buy popcorn stock!

///Republicans face 2016 turmoil///

The party is divided and in turmoil, with a civil war raging between its establishment and insurgent factions. For the first time in memory, there is no obvious early favorite — no candidate with wide appeal who has run before, no incumbent president or vice president, no clear establishment pick.


“It’s certainly something I’m looking at very seriously,” said real estate developer and reality-TV star Donald Trump. “I think we’re going to have an interesting field, with a lot of people moving up and down in the race.”

Trump added: “I’m a popular guy because I have popular ideas, talking about how China is ripping us off and about how Obamacare is a disaster. Those are the big issues where people want to see leadership.”


The next presidential election is expected to be a testing ground for a new generation of Republican leaders — senators who might include the charismatic Marco Rubio (Fla.), libertarian Rand Paul (Ky.) and tea party gladiator Ted Cruz (Tex.), and much-mentioned governors such as Chris Christie (N.J.), Bobby Jindal (La.), John Kasich (Ohio), Rick Snyder (Mich.), Scott Walker (Wis.) and Mike Pence (Ind.).

Then there is the potential for a parade of formers and also-rans. Texas Gov. Rick Perry, now in his last year in office, is preparing for another race, a do-over after his 2012 debacle. Former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee, who took the Iowa caucuses in 2008, has said he is thinking about it, too, as is former senator Rick Santorum (Pa.), who won Iowa in 2012.

Asked whether he has ruled out another run, former House speaker Newt Gingrich — busy these days with a CNN show and selling a new book — was hardly Shermanesque. “Probably,” he replied by e-mail.

Even former pizza magnate Herman Cain, who briefly led the GOP primary polls in late 2011, is keeping the door open.

“As for me, I would never say never,” Cain said. “People call up my radio show every day asking me to consider running again. Nobody from the establishment is calling, but there are some people in the grass roots who are reaching out saying, ‘Herman, get back in.’ ”

Rounding out the field may be a battalion of backbench congressmen, tea party darlings and conservative media stars, including Maryland neurosurgeon Ben Carson, whose fiery speech at the National Prayer Breakfast last year made him a conservative celebrity, and John Bolton, the former U.N. ambassador, who has raised more than $700,000 for his political action committee. Rep. Peter T. King (N.Y.), another hawk on foreign policy, is eyeing a run as well.

Read More @

nailingit — February 3, 2014 at 9:26 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Great news! Mike Yancey says he’d love to run for county commissioner! But he lacks the funds. He’d make you Democrats a real good candidate. He’s pretty much a poster child for Democrats! Please be generous with your donations. And for Mike Briggs too!

kn_dalai — February 3, 2014 at 10:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Do you think Hillary will run? If she doesn't, she is passing up a sure thing.

Now that Christie has been tarnished, what reasonable Republican can be nominated? The far right wingers will be doomed, so who do they have realistically?

I cannot think of any.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 10:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 10:34 a.m.

I think Christie will be fortunate to retain his Governorship, let alone future aspirations when it's all said and done. The one potential GOP Prez candidate with out-of-this-world poll numbers-drowning on the Jersey Shore.

I honestly can't think of anyone viable the right can put up. If they think another Bush will fly, then let them.

They might believe Jeb would complete the unholy Bush trinity and usher in a new age of conservative darkness, and they would once again rule the land. Get Cheney back on board, Dubya a frequent guest in the White House, Tony Perkins gets a cabinet position, the Koch Bros. chair the EPA, I can see it now. Needless to say, Jeb has the "smart" evangelical vote, while Huckerbee has the remaining 95%.

I can't imagine Hillary not running, especially against this crop of republicans. Barring health concerns, it appears to be her destiny. (follow the money) Christie's downfall has taken any GOP hope for the next Prez election away imo.

And the chances were already slim.

Republicans want to cut back on the number of debates. I think we need more of them. They sure helped America understand what type of policies drive each party in 2012.

nailingit — February 3, 2014 at 11:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal

It's going to be an interesting Presidential primary, nail.

Hey, Trader Joe's just backed out of its NE PDX plans, due to complaints that it brings gentrification.

Well, come on over to the North bank of the Columbia. The Cascade Park location is appreciated, but never made much sense in terms of TJ's mission: neighborhood stores that don't require cars to get there.

With more apartments being built downtown, it might sustain a store. One can hope.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 11:44 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Madore might make a good presidential candidate. If Yancey gets elected to the board – that’d be enough to scare anyone out of town. But not to worry. If Briggs also gets elected, there’d be a new set of the M & M boys.

kn_dalai — February 3, 2014 at 12:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou @ 11:44

Do you know approx. where the PDX Trader Joe's was intended?

'Gentrification' seems to be a fairly defined word to describe the impact of a TJ in any area, especially if a Walmart, Winco, Freddies, etc. are also in the area. I'd be curious to know if the concern was more a loss of revenue, and not necessarily the displacement of low income residents. I always think of Portland as quite diverse, so find the exclusion of another option unusual.

Agree about the Cascade Park TJ. Go periodically, but can't deal w/ the parking and the one enterance in & out to 112th regularily. But, no matter when I go, they are very busy.

jacjak — February 3, 2014 at 1:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak: It was proposed on a vacant lot at MLK and Alberta, I think.

Here is a link to the Oregonlive story:

I did write TJ corporate (worth a try) and the city council. Let's roll out the welcome mat where PDX closed it. Can't hurt to ask.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 1:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 6:47 a.m.

Yup, that's the place. We are getting ready for glass, should be in by the end of the month then they start on the inside. It's been a lot of work, ADA ramps are going in on the South side. I'll be working to get the fountain up and running again soon, maybe AFTER this next freeze. It's a work in progress but I think it will be really nice when it's done.

Hawkman — February 3, 2014 at 2:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I LOVE TJs! I used to shop at the original South Pasadena store. I go to the one we have as much as I can and woudl never be averse to another one or two... we cannot all subsists on Walmart. How can a TJ be leading to gentrification? How about calling it a decent store with decent food?

nailingit — February 3, 2014 at 9:26 a.m.
I just got heartburn. The list of horrors. Don't they have one halfway normal person left??? Good for us though.

luvithere — February 3, 2014 at 3:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Ray Spencer has been awarded 9 million dollars in damages today for his 20 year wrongful incarceration, thanks to Clark County.

Another multi-million dollar lawsuit to pay out.

Tell me, who was the county prosecutor in all three of these cases? Was it Art Curtis? Maybe we should rename the justice center that bears his name.

The buck stops with the head honcho, as far as I am concerned. It does not matter which deputy prosecutor worked on the cases: Curtis should have been more alert.

Hiding evidence. Leading child witnesses. Conflicts of interest. Makes me sick.

Happy for Ray Spencer and his children to have some compensation for their lost lives together.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 5:13 p.m. ( | suggest removal

More good news: Stephanie Rice has posted Benton's performance evaluation on APIL, thanks to Mielke's foot-in-mouth disease.

The evaluation reads like one of those letters of recommendation you write when you cannot be genuinely effusive.

If the commissioners keep opening their pie holes when they should keep quiet (I'm thinking Madore's FB page, too), the next lawsuit ought to be successful, too.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 5:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

How can a TJ be leading to gentrification? How about calling it a decent store with decent food?

luvithere — February 3, 2014 at 3:10 p.m.

So riddle me this... Would it be reverse gentrification if they put a "Grocery Outlet" store in Lake Oswego?

Hawkman — February 3, 2014 at 5:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 3, 2014 at 5:22 p.m.
Same issue, just reversed.
We always read about the lack of grocery stores in lower income neighborhoods. Shouldn't always be a Walmart that fills the spot.

luvithere — February 3, 2014 at 5:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — February 3, 2014 at 5:27 p.m.

So the message here is, we are poor and don't want to bring our standard of living up. Don't tempt us with good stuff!

Wouldn't that be something that would be determined by business, or lack of?

Hawkman — February 3, 2014 at 5:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 5:20 p.m. --

That eval was written by Bill Barron to cover Benton's first four months on the job. While it doesn't say a lot, it does say Benton has gotten with his subordinates to learn about them and their jobs. The way written, it indicates that Benton ignored the furor over his hiring and rolled his sleeves up, got to work learning his job.

There was no need for Barron to write this - Why did he do it? The more we learn about his role in this affair, the stranger it becomes. Madore and Mielke believed they had the right to hire Benton (probably wrongly, but....), but it was Barron's job to know the rules, and it was his job to tell them only he could approve a noncompetitive hire. He had also agreed with Madore over changing the job description from an environmental focus to a managerial one (the e-mail that circulated). Then, when the hiring incident blows up and we start getting the public outcry, he hurries up and retires and moves to Boise.

At some point we're going to have to ask what the dirt is that those two yahoos were holding over Barron.

roger — February 3, 2014 at 6:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: Your points about Barron's involvement are well-taken. I wondered why he did not dig his heels in when he had the authority to do so.

We have the Anita Largent trial to look forward to and Barron will be deposed and then put on the stand, if it does not settle. I think we are going to learn a lot more than what appears on the surface, too.

I truly will be waiting in line for a seat at this trial. We could erase the deficit if Clark County passed legislation that allowed them to sell tickets. There would be scalpers. :) Maybe CVTV will televise it with the judge's permission.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 6:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk, all I am saying is a biz deserves a location in any neighborhood. TJs obviously thought they could make a profit.
I do not consider them nearly as upscale as Whole Paycheck. Their prices are a lot better.
Hm, now that I think about, I know someone in that neighborhood. Also against it although she can easily afford anything expensive. What exactly are they afraid of?

luvithere — February 3, 2014 at 6:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

That Trader Joe's decision has the neighborhood in an uproar. If the comments on The Oregonian are to be believed, the group who challenged allowing TJs on that vacant lot wanted low income housing and shops devoted to the entrepreneurial minority community. Several people who claim to be residents of the neighborhood (most appear to be Vietnamese or other Southeast Asian names), are calling this B.S. - that group is comprised of a few "Black victimhood" types who don't even live in the area. They're arguing that there are plenty of subsidized housing projects and small shops in the area - that the Trader Joe's store would have been a positive addition that would go a long way toward bringing up the neighborhood and property values. I didn't see any comments supporting that group that caused this (though with over 500 comments spread over two articles, I just may have missed one).

Where would you put one of their stores downtown? I agree I'd like to see more of their stores here, and driving to Chkalov is a pain, but they've got to be able to compete. There's got to be a reason TJ's, Henry's and Whole Foods are all on that stretch of East Mill Plain, and New Seasons further down 164th.

roger — February 3, 2014 at 6:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 6:15 p.m. --

I agree - completely. I wonder where a hearing like this would be held, and how many gallery seats would be available for spectators?

roger — February 3, 2014 at 6:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Thanks Roger - as always more background. Now I need to go to the O to read up on it.

luvithere — February 3, 2014 at 6:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

A pretty entertaining war of words going on in the LTE section. Seems one of our freeholders (Peter Silliman) is well versed in the arguments presented by those who believe in Creationism.

roger — February 3, 2014 at 6:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

About the TJ's...

Only read some of the comments, then quit. Seemed to be the same few folks having an ongoing difference of opinion. Incentives seemed to be a large kink for some of the commenters.

I think any store that meets codes, safety, parking, signals, etc should be able to open it's doors wherever they feel they can thrive. Personally, I like TJ for specific items and New Seasons for others. NS is more upscale and it's fun to snoop the isles. Also, they give military and senior discounts (think it's Wed). But still, fav place is Chucks Produce, who also gives senior discounts on Tue. But, Winco is my go-to for most staples. We have many options in Vancouver, tho not much in our city is within walking distance especially if eligible for a sr. discount.

Manthou, if your communication does get a response, North part of the metro area could be good. Chucks is in Salmon Creek area, but not sure what else on the par of TJ, NS, or WF. Ever since Zupan's left Vancouver there's not a TJ type store for Hazel Dell, Felita, etc. Or, as you suggest, downtown. Zupan's in NW Portland seems to be thriving w/ all their foot traffic.

jacjak — February 3, 2014 at 7:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Home of the free.....

-Antonin Scalia: 'You Are Kidding Yourself If You Think' Internment Ruling Couldn't Happen Again-

Scalia was responding to a question about the court's 1944 decision in Korematsu v. United States, which upheld the convictions of Gordon Hirabayashi and Fred Korematsu for violating an order to report to an internment camp.

"Well of course Korematsu was wrong. And I think we have repudiated in a later case. But you are kidding yourself if you think the same thing will not happen again," Scalia told students and faculty during a lunchtime Q-and-A session.

Scalia cited a Latin expression meaning, "In times of war, the laws fall silent."

"That's what was going on — the panic about the war and the invasion of the Pacific and whatnot. That's what happens. It was wrong, but I would not be surprised to see it happen again, in time of war. It's no justification, but it is the reality," he said.

Read More @

nailingit — February 3, 2014 at 8:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak and roger: I did have a conversation with the New Seasons CEO a few years ago. They chose East Vancouver because of the population and income demographics that can support this specialty store and others.

Downtown or Uptown just don't have the resident numbers, I was told.

We are getting a new organic food store in Hazel Dell soon. Closest to me outside that dirty ol' Safeway on Main. Looking forward to it. I forgot its name.

An interesting side note about actuarials: When we moved to Vancouver from a "nice" Clackamas County suburb 10 years ago, our insurance company, Amica, dropped us like a lead weight. Why? It was not because of our personal financial history, which was and is stellar. It was the demographics of the "depressed" neighborhood we were moving to. They no longer wanted to invest in us for the same reasons, I suspect, grocers do not want to build downtown. The average income of residents is just too low and unstable.

Hey, they can't gentrify da "Couve, cause it's not gentrifiable. We're low class swine and will stay that way, no matter how much lipstick they paint on us :)

We are all just statistics and risks-by-the-numbers, I guess.

manthou — February 3, 2014 at 8:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou, with all the new apartments going in Downtown, I suspect SOME type of grocery will be moving in. There are lots of empty lots for sale.

I find it odd that they didn't want TJ's when they have a New Seasons on Interstate.

Hawkman — February 3, 2014 at 9:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm thinking that with the last multi-million dollar award, Madore might want to start charging to get into the parks again.

Hawkman — February 3, 2014 at 9:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Art Curtis, CC's former prosecutor, started out as a public defender.

When one of his clients was released and committed a rape again, he switched over to prosecuting. And he seems to have embraced that job with a great deal of enthusiasm. Perhaps a little too much enthusiasm in the case of the three Clark County men who have been awarded millions in their wrongful conviction trials.

Which is more acceptable for our country? Being so overly zealous (violating conduct codes) in prosecuting cases that there is always a certain percentage of innocent persons convicted and incarcerated or defending persons successfully, some of whom go free and commit more crimes.

What about Gary Lucas? Was he the Sheriff for these three botched investigations? Who was the Vancouver Police Chief?

There is an investigative book in these stories and it will not reflect well on Clark County's system of "justice." I do hope it has improved over the past 20 years.

I will never see or hear the name "Art Curtis Children's Justice Center" again without a pang, thinking of the Spencer children, deprived of their father for so many years.

Justice my behind.

manthou — February 4, 2014 at 5:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 4, 2014 at 5:01 a.m. --

I think there's a bigger picture with all the County problems than relative newcomers like us are aware of.

On the environmental side we have the Rosemere storm water sewer upgrade controversy and decisions made with that issue which will cost us. Something else I've wondered about is the clean bill of health the old Alcoa site got. About 10 years ago it was still considered a contaminated area. And then, without any real activity, they suddenly get cleared - and then the planning for the Waterfront Development project kicks off. Coincidence?

We've seen several senior County administrators leave, and also a few old time "movers and shakers" (Lucas, Pollard, Barnes) join with groups like Identity Clark County in an all out fight with Madore, Mielke and Benton. This paper, due to the Campbell family's ties to ICC, has a strong bias in covering this.

Maybe we've had similar conflicts in the past - I don't know. And while the CRC has been a major part of the conflict, it seems to me that with Madore's emergence on the scene a whole lot of other things are also coming to light. Is it just possible that he's bumbled his way into upsetting the status quo, and they're pushing back hard before he turns up anything truly harmful to whoever has run this County - be it the developers or someone else?

And now I'm starting to sound like Alleycat....

roger — February 4, 2014 at 5:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Lucas was first elected in 1990; Spencer was convicted in 1985. Lucas was in the department then, but I don't know in what capacity and I haven't seen his name tied to the case. Don't hold me to this, but I think his name was mentioned in the articles covering the other two guys - But I don't recall it being in a negative light. (Or maybe it was something PuppyCat said? I think we discussed that one here, and he's never been overly fond of our Sheriff.)

roger — February 4, 2014 at 6:43 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: I am sure Clark County conducted its business in many departments for years without the benefit of public scrutiny and oversight.

What's the rationalization often used by crooks? It's not a foul if it is not called.

Madore and others are certainly digging, asking questions, and demanding answers from people who are used to doing business unchallenged. Not a bad thing, really. I just don't like some of Madore's double standards. He does not hold himself to similar scrutiny and criticism and does not take it from others well.

If you conduct yourself and your department with integrity, you have nothing to fear, right? Don't do stupid stuff and you won't be embarrassed by violating public trust.

Spencer and his family will be asking the AG for further investigation with the hope that charges can be filed. I never buy it when a department leader claims ignorance of multiple examples of deep corruption within their department. I think they are culpable, too, so I am watching to see where Spencer's complaint leads and who gets collared. Art Curtis. Bill Barron. Gary Lucas. They probably knew more than they are admitting, but the "I can't recall" defense seems to be working as they enjoy retirement or plan for retirement.

manthou — February 4, 2014 at 7:07 a.m. ( | suggest removal

The sheriff's department had a lot of problems back in the 90's. The sheriff back then I believe was Frank Kanekoa. That is one reason why Lucas was elected. People wanted a change for the better. Several officers were dismissed or left on their own. Kind of a big mess.

timerick — February 4, 2014 at 7:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal

"Is it just possible that he's bumbled his way into upsetting the status quo, and they're pushing back hard before he turns up anything truly harmful to whoever has run this County - be it the developers or someone else?"

And now I'm starting to sound like Alleycat....

roger — February 4, 2014 at 5:58 a.m.

Naw. Not the cat. I'd say more like goldenoldie.

The No Tolls crowd want so desperately for ol' David to do some good, if even by accident?


Speaking of which, I still have a stuffed zucchini on the back burner.

nailingit — February 4, 2014 at 9:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal

-City closer to pot-shop rules-

Regulations could be in place by late March in Vancouver

The Vancouver City Council indicated Monday it will follow a voter-approved state law when it adopts regulations for state-licensed marijuana businesses.

A public hearing will be 7 p.m. March 3 at City Hall, 415 W. Sixth St.

If the council adopts the proposed ordinance, rules will be in place by late March. That's when the state anticipates approving licenses for growers and processors, principal planner Bryan Snodgrass told the council during a workshop on Monday.

Snodgrass said the state estimates licenses for retailers won't be ready until June.

In September, the city council adopted a six-month moratorium on marijuana retail facilities to allow more time to enact zoning rules.


The Liquor Control Board has capped the maximum number of pot shops statewide at 334. Clark County can have up to 15 marijuana retailers, including six in the unincorporated areas.

However, the county commissioners, who govern unincorporated areas, have said they won't allow marijuana businesses until the drug becomes legalized by the federal government. That stance was backed in an opinion by Washington Attorney General Bob Ferguson, who had been asked whether local jurisdictions have the authority to ban state-licensed sellers and producers.

The rest of Clark County stores would be in cities: six stores in Vancouver and one store apiece in Camas, Washougal and Battle Ground.

Camas and Washougal have ongoing moratoriums, while Battle Ground has not taken any action.

nailingit — February 4, 2014 at 9:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

More pot revenue for Vancouver and, perhaps, BG, from Camas, Washougal and unincorporated CC, eh, nailingit? These stores will be busy.

Just heard snippets of the Dec 13th legislative breakfast and bristled big time when I heard Don Benton refer to CC DES employees as "MY scientists."

He placed emphasis on the "my."

Yeah, right, Don. YOUR scientists? In your dreams, egghead. When did you ever claim a scientist? You hate them. Their pesky research gets in the way of your propaganda. Remember? Oh, yeah. That was BEFORE you got that job. I remember….

God, I can't stand that guy or the fact that my tax dollars are paying for his salaries. Plural.

manthou — February 4, 2014 at 11:09 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 4, 2014 at 11:09 a.m.

I'll be sure and contribute to our local economy while supporting local business entrepreneurs.

I encourage all of my forum friends to frequent these upcoming businesses. It's the least we can do.

nailingit — February 4, 2014 at 12:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou @ 11:09

As I seem to be collecting 'code words', watch for any mention by Benton of "scientific transparency". That one seems to be popping up a lot, even by global warming and evolution deniers. Watching Benton's past m.o., he'll probably toss in much strut about protecting private land owners or business owners or kids, with lots of 'impact studies' and 'buffers' and 'provisions' or some other speedtalk that means he intends to not say much. "MY Scientists" is such a strange phrase to have used by someone who is not. Sounds like Donald Trump who thinks he owns everything.

jacjak — February 4, 2014 at 12:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I find it interesting that the Columbian that we pay for be it delivery and or online gets scooped by local TV stations. They are already talking about a young man that was assaulted and then expelled from Hudson's Bay today for wearing a Broncos jersey. I would think we could get better for the money we spend.

timerick — February 4, 2014 at 1:09 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Snowing in Lakeshore.

nailingit — February 4, 2014 at 1:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 4, 2014 at 12:49 p.m.

Now remember kids, I know of a building for sale on Fourth Plane and Burton rd. that's PERFECT for the pot business. It's an old bank branch with the vault still in it and working. Tell your friends and dealers.

Hawkman — February 4, 2014 at 1:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Funny. I also watched that CREDC breakfast. I also noticed how he used the word “my”. Although I missed the emphasis on the word “my”, manthou. While that may have been a poor choice; considering he’s their boss, it’s not really out of line.

It is the first time I’ve ever watched Benton for more than just a minute. I was very impressed, and wondered where the fire breathing devil was. He seemed to have a command of the issues, certainly more than the newcomers Stonier and Cleveland, although I was also impressed with Stonier’s able commentary.

Most interesting to me, was the different political ideas of Harris and Benton emphasizing the private sector, while Moeller advocated for a government holistic approach of caring for social, health and education needs of students. And there was the issue of raising gas taxes, which well all know Moeller will always favor, while Harris talked specifically about promises made on two previous occasions in the past to reform the structure and spending if a new increase in gas taxes passed, but then those promises were never kept. I was glad to see Harris speak about a better balance between DEQ rules being bureaucratically made and implemented with no regard to economic considerations. Good discussion he gave about Boeing, storm water runoff, fish consumption, the DEQ and economic considerations. Also an interesting prediction he gave that the counties and municipalities will all be bankrupt in 15 years over these rules, if they’re not changed.

kn_dalai — February 4, 2014 at 1:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Here's a good one;

WOODRUFF, SC (FOX Carolina) -
A new phone scam could get you a hefty cell phone bill and an ear full on the other end of the line.

It's called the "One Ring" scam. Scammers only ring once, disconnect, and then wait for cell phone users to call the number back. The numbers usually come from islands like Grenada, the British Virgin Islands and Antigua.

One Woodruff woman received two strange phone calls, but before she called back, she called her cell phone provider.

"I called Verizon's customer service and they said that it is not real, do not call back," said Shanna Hadden.

The Better Business Bureau of the Upstate said whoever calls back is charged a hefty amount: $19.95 for the international call, then an additional $9 per minute. The lure is that many times callers are connected to an overseas adult entertainment service.

"Do your research - when in doubt, check 'em out," said Vee Daniel, director of the Upstate Better Business Bureau.

Common area codes to look out for are 268, 809, 876, 284 and 473.

Hawkman — February 4, 2014 at 2 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Something else about that breakfast meeting. Annette Cleveland said she’d been looking at a T. Roosevelt quote every day. The quote was about the right choice is the best choice, but it’s better to make the wrong choice than do nothing at all. There had been transportation budget talk including some on the CRC, and I take that quote to be her thinking about that. That may have fit TR’s personality, but seems to me like it’s a very poor guideline to follow.

kn_dalai — February 4, 2014 at 6:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal

So I hear rumors that the southbound lanes of the I 5 bridge are no longer closed due to roller failure. It was expected that it might be closed through Wednesday.

At the RTC meeting yesterday, there was reference to the fact that a state transportation package will not likely be passed in March and that we will have to wait until December for a special session. No one in SW WA will vote for anything that does not give us a piece of that pie.

In the meantime, cuts will occur. Maybe folks will learn to live with these inconveniences and we will save the state money? Who needs transportation and infrastructure safety, after all…..

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 5:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

In The Columbian's article, Curtis King notes that one of the big hold ups with that transportation package is the issue of where that 10-plus cents per gallon gas tax will go. His planning calls for it to go to a fenced transportation fund, while others are wanting it to go to the general fund (as with other sales taxes) - this in response to the State Supreme Court ruling on education funding, and the need to find that money somewhere.

Lynn Peterson is reacting to the transportation budget shortfall by looking to increase the pot of money she has to work with. She needs to focus on her contracting operation; they've wasted millions due to their inability to provide effective oversight.

roger — February 5, 2014 at 6:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Scalia cited a Latin expression meaning, "In times of war, the laws fall silent."

or if a bombing occurs, like in Boston.

mrd — February 5, 2014 at 7:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal

When journalists advocate for their friends………or seemingly so.

I have withheld forming a personal opinion about the allegations publicized by Nicholas Kristof from Dylan Farrow against her adoptive father, Woody Allen, for a variety of reasons.

Now a brother has weighed in, supporting Allen. Another brother supported her version.

Margaret Sullivan, the NYT's Public Editor, has published the most thoughtul and reasoned response I have read thus far and I wanted to share it here.

Kristof is personal friends with the Farrow family. Should journalists recuse themselves, like judges or doctors or other professionals do when faced with emotional conflicts that might bias their performance?

The world of journalism needs more public editors period. They need public editors like Margaret Sullivan.

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 9:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 5, 2014 at 6:42 a.m.

I think it should be a law that if you collect taxes on anything "road" related (gas taxes, license taxes, weight fines, etc.) , it must go to the road fund, not the general fund.

Hawkman — February 5, 2014 at 2:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 9:31 a.m.

"I have withheld forming a personal opinion about the allegations publicized by Nicholas Kristof from Dylan Farrow against her adoptive father, Woody Allen, for a variety of reasons."

I have a reason as well, I don't really care. Seriously, let the authorities take care of it, if there is something to take care of. Other than that, it's just another soap opera on the level of the Kardashians.

Nothing against you manthou, but Woody is far far away from my radar.

Hawkman — February 5, 2014 at 2:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk: I respect that. So much within our control right at home.

My point was less about Woody and his daughter and more about the big picture question I posed about the press. And my admiration for the NYT public editor, a dying and rare breed these days.

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 2:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hey, nailingit! Get that stuffed zucchini in the oven tonight. Hot and comforting will complement the cold. :)

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 2:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Is there anyone here who supports Liz Pike's idea for a sub-minimum wage wage for new employees?

I'm of that old opinion that the minimum wage is that wage one gets paid when starting out, with raises to come when you attain proficiency and become a valued employee worth paying more to keep.

There seems to be a disconnect somewhere - people come across as thinking the minimum wage worker is the teen taking your order at The Greasy Burger. There are plenty of adults working at that pay range, and often in part time jobs so the employer doesn't have to provide a health plan.

Employees have become just another interchangeable cog in the production process for far too many businesses, most particularly in the service sector, where minimum wage is most prevalent.

roger — February 5, 2014 at 5:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

This is interesting, and the links.... I've never heard of 'students for liberty'

jacjak — February 5, 2014 at 6:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: I worry about that Pike's bill does not list an age range, so it will be abused. Too loose. If it were for teens, I'd be more open to it.
Another Clark County manager is going, folks: Kelly Sills, who has been here for 13 years as Economic Development Manager. He is going to Portland. This is the staff member who has been helping all the Freeholders. They will be in mourning. Another good person voluntarily leaves. Are they doing exit interviews? Would they get the truth?

Other BOCC news: apparently, an employee of Clark County was packing heat at work. It is against policy. The commissioners are going to discuss changing that, but with restrictions. Hmmmmm. Wonder if it was the Marine who took the shooter down? He certainly was brave.

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 6:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

mrd — February 5, 2014 at 7:40 a.m.

Was that at the same time he (Scalia) said "You're kidding yourself if you think interment camps won't return"?

What a testament to the idea there is no safety in least his, anyway.

jacjak — February 5, 2014 at 6:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal


jacjak — February 5, 2014 at 6:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

First off, what Pike is proposing is wide open for abuse. Period. This is not for teens, this is written so any employer can call someone in training, pay them little for 680 hours, and then kick them out. She is riding that bandwagon for a while now. That and arming the Camas teachers to the teeth (which she will re-propose soon). it is so time to vote this woman out. Roger, how about a run for the east side?
The marine at the VA had no weapon. I got this on very good authority (spouse had to go in there last night). Did it with his hands and strength. Good thing he was there.

And now for the cold. Out here in the east, up the hills, and the winds hit the house like crazy. Power was flickering a while ago. it would be very bad if we were to lose it as we are all on electric heat. I got the propane fireplace going for hours as the heat pump could not keep up. As for the snow tomorrow: I got to go to Salem and then back in afternoon. Rats, calls for shorter day and a fast drive home to outrun the crazies on the streets. Snowgeddon in Portland! One hopes we will do better than Atlanta.

luvithere — February 5, 2014 at 7:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere: Keep safe tomorrow. I heard that the snow was going to hit worse south of PDX.

Steve Stuart mentioned an employee by name in reference to the concealed weapon at work. Just what we need at Clark County to make life even more unpredictable and crazy: guns.

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 7:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

First off, what Pike is proposing is wide open for abuse.

luvithere — February 5, 2014 at 7:01 p.m.

Does that mean ALEC had a hand in house bill 2614?

Pike, Manweller, Magendanz... the 3 representatives that introduced house bill 2614. Did a bit of reading on each of the two I'm not familiar with. Love Google. It doesn't hide much... the good, the bad, ugly, and gpa's.

Wonder what's up w/ the Columbian (again). That article says there are 50 comments, but only shows a part of Ron Goodman's. No others.

jacjak — February 5, 2014 at 8 p.m. ( | suggest removal

This bites!

A judge on Wednesday ordered a Texas teenager who was sentenced to 10 years' probation in a drunken-driving crash that killed four people to go to a rehabilitation facility paid for by his parents.

Judge Jean Boyd again decided to give no jail time for Ethan Couch, defense attorney Reagan Wynn and prosecutors told reporters after the hearing, which was closed to the public. Prosecutors had asked Boyd to sentence him to 20 years in state custody on charges related to two people who were severely injured.

The sentence stirred fierce debate, as has the testimony of a defense expert who says Couch's wealthy parents coddled him into a sense of irresponsibility. The expert termed the condition "affluenza."

Hawkman — February 5, 2014 at 9:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Per the Oregonian, the latest discussion on the CRC revolves around collecting tolls from the nasty Washingtonians who refuse to pay. A previous article suggested they look around town for cars that haven't paid and "boot" them. Yesterday their Dept of Justice said they'll need to change their own law to make this violation one that can be cited, and to enter into an agreement with Washington's DOL to allow Oregon to suspend Washington driver's licenses for nonpayment. Our own State AG says our DOL would have to change its rules to permit this.

While the article presents this as opinions, the fact that our AG has offered up a decision means Lynn Peterson and Gov Inslee are also in on the discussion. It'll be interesting to see whether The Columbian gets around to reporting on this - I'd expect a bit of a firestorm to follow. First the on demand eminent domain C-Tran/TriMet agreement, and now this.

roger — February 6, 2014 at 5:38 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm sure hoping we get told which of our local legislators attended the party Boeing threw for them last night. I'm sure a good time was had by all.

roger — February 6, 2014 at 6:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: The Boeing party. Boy, if I were a legislator, especially one who voted for the tax incentive that benefited that company, I would not be caught within 10 miles of that shindig. I noticed there were a lot of rationalizations from politicians as to why that "gathering" is perfectly fine. The list of attendees will be published. I cannot wait.

I saw that Oregonian article yesterday, too. How does DOL change its rules? Through the legislature or through its own executive process?

My kitchen cold water pipe froze again last night, but the condensate line for the furnace did not because I wrapped it in heat tape. Cannot access that cold water line, which is getting the full blast of the east winds. Could be worse, so I am counting my blessings.

manthou — February 6, 2014 at 10:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Apparently, Tyler Graf has inherited Erik Hidle's beat at CC.

Congratulations. I think.

manthou — February 6, 2014 at 11:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Well, we have about 4 inches of snow and growing.

Hawkman — February 6, 2014 at 1:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

FYI, if you're going to travel, check this out first.

Hawkman — February 6, 2014 at 2:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal

So, reviewing the BOCC Board Time audio again:

It appears that Steve Stuart and Tom Mielke have been violating CC policy by carrying a concealed weapon to work.

They want to change the policy.

I know Stuart had received thinly-veiled threats for his votes this year and I understand why he feels he might need personal protection. But I don't know about opening that can of worms. I keep thinking of some of the people I have worked with: hot heads and no impulse control. A weapon in their desk at work? Yikes.

manthou — February 6, 2014 at 3:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Ok, I made it back up the I5 with no issues as I left at 11am to drive back up here. Lucky me. Hit bad patches of ice later on. I5 has its share of horrible accidents today.
Came home to my first ever frozen pipe -the hot water one in kitchen sink. Rest all seem ok. Anybody know what to do? Got cold water trickling to keep that running but worried the other line will bust eventually. Currently got a heater under sink to warm the wall. Our neighbor told us to and he knows everything. :)
I blame the east winds, they are brutal. They hit the back of the house and that's where the sink is facing.
Sure hope power stays on or the well stops as does the heat. Way too cold for this.

luvithere — February 6, 2014 at 4:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere: So glad to hear you are back home safe.

You and I have the kitchen sink frozen pipe issue. Mine is the cold one, though. All others work everywhere else.

Like you, I have had a space heater under the sink all day. I would use a hair dryer, too, but cannot access the pipe as it is in the wall. The sink is against the East side of the house and is getting all that wind, too.

The Old House said to open the frozen pipe valve in the sink and, in my case, run the hot water in the others. No luck.

I have cold water in the refrigerator door and in a valve on the gas range backsplash for filling big pots, so that will have to do.

At least we are home, safe and in a heated home. :) Last time this happened, the pipe defrosted when the outside temp became warmer. No breaks.

manthou — February 6, 2014 at 4:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal


The faucet just sputtered alive and is flowing full and steady. 15 hours of patience, luvithere. Keep the heat on under that sink and the frozen faucet line open.

manthou — February 6, 2014 at 5:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

good for you. 15 I know what I have to look forward to.
Not sure where to locate the valve though and what to do

luvithere — February 6, 2014 at 5:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

ah know what you meant. We got one line for both and so the faucet is running......hoping it ends as well as yours. Eventually.

luvithere — February 6, 2014 at 5:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

It's just the faucet handle, luvithere. Turn it on and, though nothing comes out now, it will eventually start a slow drip and then, whoosh. If you go to bed, leave it on just a tad so you don't have a full, hard flow when you are asleep and not able to monitor it.

Good article from Stephanie Rice about Kelly Sills' resignation. Another loss. That makes 11 high-level CC managers or attorneys. The Freeholders are already panicking, especially Nan, who relied on him tremendously. His last day is Feb 18.

manthou — February 6, 2014 at 5:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvit, the blow dryer works pretty good. Just aim it at the pipe and let it go. I had to do it two years ago and the only way to get to the pipe was thru the outside vent. I got a piece of wood and laid it down on the ground and turned it on then opened the faucet and waited. It took about an hour then whoosh!

Stay warm everyone, 20 deg right now, we have about 8 inches of snow. I'm NOT going anywhere tomorrow.

Hawkman — February 6, 2014 at 6:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Thanks Hawk. Sadly, we cannot get to the pipe from outside. We are just letting the two heaters under sink run as long as it takes. But we are already thinking we might need to do some remodel here in Spring. rather not have this again.
Please don't bust, please don't bust....

luvithere — February 6, 2014 at 6:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou, yea figured it out, finally. Duh to me. As we have one faucet for both hot and cold, I turned as far as possible where it shuts down (going from ice water to hot water), so IF we get any hot water again, this will be at least warm.
Maybe I should speak to it in stern German. Works with everybody else.
Los jetzt, du fauler Sack. Mach mal los endlich! Jetzt wird mal was geschafft! hergottsdunderwetternochamol.

Don't even try. Some dialect thrown in. Rolls off well.

luvithere — February 6, 2014 at 6:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

So, I had to learn that my garbage won't be picked up tomorrow in the OREGONIAN?????

Hawkman — February 6, 2014 at 7:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk, thanks for the link. Now I know why garbage was picked up today but not the recycling. Bu tin the Oregonian???

luvithere — February 6, 2014 at 8:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 6, 2014 at 7:39 p.m. -- I figure this info will make it on-line tomorrow afternoon, or maybe even Saturday - Timeliness doesn't appear to be a high priority with The Columbian these days. They're also being extremely silent on the fact that MAX service has been very iffy for much of the afternoon and evening. It seems something froze over on the Steel Bridge, and then a fire had service on the Red and Blue line shut down. TriMet's buses aren't faring all that well either. According to my son, he and a few hundred others walked across Steel Bridge to catch a very behind schedule Yellow line. Needless to say, TriMet is catching hell in the comments section of Joseph Rose's commuter column this evening.

roger — February 6, 2014 at 8:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger you didn't expect the Columbian to come out against Max and Tri Met did you.

timerick — February 6, 2014 at 8:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Well, I'd sort of expect they'd consider telling people they might have a hard time getting around the next day or so. I mean, aren't they part of the crowd that thinks we're part of the Portland metropolitan area?

roger — February 6, 2014 at 9:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

My Daughter's friend said it took her 3 hours to get from the Airport (at 6:00pm) to I-205 this evening. It took a friend of my Wife's 4 1/2 hours to get from Hazel Dell to Longview, she left at 3pm.

Again, I'm not going anywhere tomorrow, i suggest the same for everyone.

Hawkman — February 6, 2014 at 11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hey, nailingit! Get that stuffed zucchini in the oven tonight. Hot and comforting will complement the cold. :)

manthou — February 5, 2014 at 2:47 p.m.

That's what She said!


manthou — February 6, 2014 at 5:55 p.m.

From the article:

[[[Mielke doesn't think Sills' resignation, which follows departures by more than a half-dozen high-level employees in the past 12 months, reflects poorly on the county.

He said Sills will be making "a lot more money." When an employee takes an opportunity to earn more money, it doesn't "mean your employer is a bad person," Mielke said.

However, Sills, a Salmon Creek resident who has no immediate plans to move to Portland, actually will be earning less money.

He earns $85,236 a year at the county, said Human Resources Director Francine Reis. As parking control manager, he'll earn $84,970 a year and have to pay Oregon's income tax.]]]

-Unabashed idiocy. Meilke and Madore were made in Hell for each other. They compliment one other perfectly.-

[[[Rekah Strong, who resigned her position as Clark County chief diversity and inclusion officer, told Madore and Mielke at a public hearing in November that they are bullies.

"Your employees fear you," Strong said. "They're not engaged. They're operating in a place of paralysis. You have a lawsuit that is filed against you (by a current county employee) for going against our (equal employment opportunity) practices and what we've committed ourselves to do for the past six years. … We've had a mass exodus of employees because people are fearful."

Sills said Thursday he's worked for seven different county commissioners. They come with different traits and values, and he's learned lessons from all of them.

He declined to say anything else about the current commissioners, reiterating he's excited for a new job that has potential for advancement, and he's planning to take the high road because "the low road is jammed enough."]]]

-Ron Goodman has a great comment about working a bare bones system. Quite the exodus we're witnessing!-


Man, a little snow sure shuts this place down. Be careful out there. I miss John Casey's posts about driving.

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: C'mon, man. This snow is a rare event. NO mode of transportation is reliable with this challenge. Everyone is inconvenienced, in danger, and going no where whether you ride MAX, C-Tran, Tri-Met, personal vehicle, little yellow school bus, or walk.

Outside my neighbor's little ORVs which have been tearing up the snow at the VSAA parking lot and side streets (dangerously fast) it is not easy getting from Point A to Point B no matter how you choose to go.

Portland and Vancouver have problems with their transportation programs and policies for sure, but piling on MAX for being slow and unreliable in a rare, deep freeze snow dump is well, simply piling on.

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 6:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

///Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers Faces Possible Ethics Probe///

Office of High-Ranking Republican Congresswoman Denies Allegations;

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I had plenty of pimples as a kid. One day I fell asleep in the library. When I woke up, a blind man was reading my face.

~Rodney Dangerfield~

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: If there is a double entendre within 10 miles, you'll find it. :)

I listened to the BOCC Board Time audio and Mielke and Madore are very nonchalant about Sills' resignation.

I'd be worried about the brain drain, but they endorse the "no government is the best government" plan. I'd bring in an outside facilitator/consultant to meet with the staff and design an intervention before this county implodes from more poor decisions, lack of morale, and attrition.

Axel Swanson gives great lip service to making "evidence-based" decisions, but, when you work for two clowns who don't value information from science, research and academics and promote a personal ideology (Let's give a fee holiday, without any good idea of its value or risk), it wears thin on staff fast. Talented people will move out as quickly as they can.

The fact that four of these persons are attorneys who advise the BOCC: 'nuf said.

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 6:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou- Their less government plan is working. It'll make it that much harder to justify creating or filling positions in the next administration. We'll get by with less, but will suffer for it.

Less investment in us, the people who live here.

Great job M&M;!

(Accolades also to the conservatives who will chase M&M; through the gates of Hell as long as their taxes aren't raised. Praise God. The future is proud of you.)

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hussah! The darn pipe unfroze at 11pm last night. The sound of gushing water was wonderful! I decided to let the faucet trickle on warm all night to avoid waking up to the same frozen pipe again.
First thing running this morning is the dishwasher. Joy!
Staying in all day with a small trek out to play in the snow in backyard. About as far as I will go today.

I think the exodus from county is not yet over. Bet you there are plenty of employees furtively looking for other jobs. The boys seem to be getting their wish of a smaller government. Of course, any negative consequences are ignored. I doubt they can see that far ahead anyways. Plus, those evil, overpaid gob workers, who needs them, right?
Led by a bunch of ignoramuses. When's next election?

luvithere — February 7, 2014 at 7:03 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 6:29 a.m.,

OK - In the interest of fairness, I've also heard (from a reliable enough source) that the 4th Plain bus managed to take out one of their bus stop kiosks.

Actually, I wasn't deliberately dumping on TriMet - As you note, we don't do well during these conditions. I'm observing that this newspaper doesn't give the commuter to Oregon a lot of timely and relevant information. Anyone planning on going into Portland (or anywhere else for that matter) needs to do a little checking before they take off. MAX ticketing machines west of the Willamette are still cash only, for example. MAX was behind schedule last night, for the reasons I noted, and there's very little info as to whether they've got service back up. Brown's article today notes that some C-Tran express routes are going to go to MAX stations instead, and riders should transfer to trains. If you have to be somewhere on time, I'm thinking an extra 2 hours might be needed.

Me - I went with Trip Check, saw the highways still have snow (and ice?) on them, and decided to stay home. I figure if the weather report is reasonably accurate, then somewhere in the early afternoon the freeways are going to become a nightmare to travel.

roger — February 7, 2014 at 7:18 a.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere: Hooray for your thawed pipe! I let ours trickle last night, too. Seems like we are in for more snow today. Hawk's suggestion of staying in seems to be wise. :)

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 7:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: I do notice that the Oregonian often publishes timely news of interest to Clark County before the C does. I think the Oregonian has many freelancers, though.

Did you read the editorial on the C today? It provides a good perspective of the weaknesses with Pike's training wage bill, a question you posed a couple of days ago.

I especially enjoyed the culinary analogy.

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 7:25 a.m. ( | suggest removal

We have some Al Jazeera fans here. Did you know that there is an Al Jazeera Seattle bureau? It wants to cover more Pacific NW news.


manthou — February 7, 2014 at 7:35 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 7:25 a.m. ---

Yes, I did read that editorial. I still think the idea is all wrong.

Sadly, there is no such thing as a job market for teens anymore - whether serving up burgers, delivering newspapers, or picking strawberries, these jobs are now done by adults too. A teen doing work alongside adults should be on the same pay scale.

Some people understand the concept of work, and some don't. The fix here is to hire people for a probationary period - learn the job and perform, or go find a new job when you're terminated. Seems to work quite well with government jobs.

roger — February 7, 2014 at 8:13 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 7, 2014 at 7:18 a.m

I'm set up with "Flashalert" in my email and every time the Battle Ground schools close, it alerts me. Also when the Western Star plant (Freightliner) closes, it tells me as well. This morning, I got both emails. When Daimler closes the truck plant, you can be sure that there is a REAL GOOD reason.

Luvit= glad you finally thawed out, they are saying our high today is going to be 30 deg. I don't know, I'm still at 23.

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 8:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 7:35 a.m. ---

From reading the article, it sounds as though al Jazeera is not performing well in the US market. They're trying to get into regional markets and provide news relevant to the area based out of in an effort to gain an audience. But I'm thinking way too many stay away due to their name.

Me - I hope they succeed. Their bias is becoming more noticeable in some areas (immigration reform especially), but all things considered, they still tend to do a lot better a job of "balanced" opinion-oriented newscasting than FOX or MSNBC, and the people they've hired are way better than the crowd on CNN.

roger — February 7, 2014 at 8:24 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I still do not have the channel. Would need to upgrade and pay even more to Dish. Blood suckers asks for a lot already, and at 73 a month I am done paying enough at this point. Although itching badly to get decent, in-depths news.
yea hawk, feels good to be back in biz with the water. Now I can put kitchen back together.

luvithere — February 7, 2014 at 8:40 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger from reading the article on Ms. Pikes bill and then reading the response from David Arnett I think if Davids ideas were put in the bill it would improve it. the reason I think this is because when I was young and started work in the lettus fields way back in the early 60's we were started at 50 cents an hour. Once we could prove that we could handle the job we were increased to 75 cents. Then we were promoted to the actual harvesting of the product and we were paid 1.00 to 1.50 an hour. Not unlike a sponsored apprentiship program in todays unions. It was a good way for youth to learn and make some money.

timerick — February 7, 2014 at 11:15 a.m. ( | suggest removal

"I told my psychiatrist that everyone hates me. He said I was being ridiculous - everyone hasn't met me yet."

~Rodney Dangerfield~

It's interesting how people quantify news agencies. It's become common to say MSNBC is left, Fox News is right, and CNN is in the center. In a sense, or better to say in the abstract, this is true. But there are countless variables within these outlets. For Fox to be considered a viable news conduit is up for grabs for sure. Minus a show or two, Fox News is strictly a propaganda machine for the right. To wit; Rick Santorum, Newt Gingrich, Mike Huckabee, and Sarah Palin are just a few of Fox News past and present employees.

MSNBC offers political discussion with a decidedly left slant, promo's the Dem party, but is fairly self correcting, calls out politicians on both sides of the aisle, and debates policy much more than other outlets. Morning Joe and a few others provide a counterweight somewhat.

CNN needs to get their focus back on world news and stateside disasters. They suck at everything else.

C-SPAN is best for unfiltered truth.

Some tend to see the middle ground in politics as the Holy Grail. A middle ground doesn't exist in the ever changing spectrum of life, nor does it the offshoot of politics. Bias always sits towards the front on certain issues, in the backseat on others. Is it contextually factual should be the question.

roger's right. Al-Jazeera sounds funny. They will never capture a conservative American audience. Maybe they should promo their network as 'All-Jazz-Era'. Intro with Duke Ellington and glassy-eyed wingers won't know the difference.

Not to rain on the Al-Jazeera bandwagon, and yes, this article is penned by a CNN contributor, but some food for thought none the less.

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 11:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Tim --

The Fair Labor Standards Act already provides for a youth minimum wage -- -- It also says that once someone reaches age 20 they must be paid at least the full minimum wage. It can only be applied during the first 90 calendar days of employment.

Pike's proposal would pay the intro level worker quite a bit more than the $.25 per hour this Act allows for, but that time period may not be allowable.

roger — February 7, 2014 at 12:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I mean, aren't they part of the crowd that thinks we're part of the Portland metropolitan area?
roger — February 6, 2014 at 9:08 p.m.

One of these days it'd be nice if someone or other would take the time to explain WHY it's looked on as a negative to be viewed as part of a metro area.

Wikipedia -- "a metropolitan area, sometimes referred to as a metro area or metro, is a region consisting of a densely populated urban core and its less-populated surrounding territories, sharing industry, infrastructure, and housing.[1] A metropolitan area usually comprises multiple jurisdictions and municipalities: neighborhoods, townships, cities, exurbs, counties, and even states."

Well, if we consider workforce as part of industry, and bridges as part of infrastructure, we certainly share a metro area with Portland.

jacjak — February 7, 2014 at 12:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak: Many of us in Vancouver identify more with the urban metro area than we do the rural areas of Clark County.

That's not saying one is better than the other. We're just different. We just can't seem to get that here and demonize "the other."

Crazy snowmobilers and ORVers today, racing, tearing around the streets amid little kids pulling their sleds and families on walks. No helmets. One was pulling someone on a sled. Remember the little girl who died when her dad was pulling her on a sled with his vehicle?

Who knew so many recreational toys existed in the city. I am all for having fun, but……too bad there isn't a stupid vaccine.

manthou — February 7, 2014 at 12:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Some tend to see the middle ground in politics as the Holy Grail. A middle ground doesn't exist in the ever changing spectrum of life, nor does it the offshoot of politics. Bias always sits towards the front on certain issues, in the backseat on others. Is it contextually factual should be the question.
nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 11:59 a.m.

Great post, excellent statement, and the question could be a mantra, or better yet, a duty.

jacjak — February 7, 2014 at 12:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal

It's interesting how people quantify news agencies. It's become common to say MSNBC is left, Fox News is right, and CNN is in the center. nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 11:59 a.m.

Well, this should be interesting, then....

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 2:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I remember the time I was kidnapped and they sent a piece of my finger to my father. He said he wanted more proof.

~Rodney Dangerfield~

jacjak — February 7, 2014 at 12:30 p.m.

Thanks JJ. Accuracy trumps everything. So many things get twisted and contorted in our modern day media. As Sgt. Friday used to say; "Just the facts ma'am, just the facts."

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 2:42 p.m.

I saw that this morning and went to the Fox News website to take the readership's pulse in the comment section.

Pretty negative overall. The main theme seemed to be 'The reason I watch Fox News is so I won't have to listen to these kind of people.'

I hope Ailes lets Carville off his leash a time or two. Carville's alien bloodline appears to run deep, and his wife is twice as weird. (although I like them both)

A great get for Fox. Between Carville & Kucinich, Fox can paint liberals as combative Venetians.

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 3:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Politics is not “contextually factual”.

For example:

Generally: sociologists can point to disparities between different factions of human beings; but to assume that this is a “wrong” and that this wrong provides a basis for political remedy by government, and to further assume that the remedy is for bodies, boards, panels and commissions of biased people to decide who deserves to have what is: presumptuous and totalitarian. One might look at Federalist paper #10 to see what Madison had to say about factions.

Locally: the supporters of bringing lite rail into Clark County can site all of the "experts" that they want, and criticize the opponents as not being “engineers” , as has happened often. But the lite rail issue is one of politics over whether there SHOULD be lite rail here in the first place, and not an issue of the "experts" deciding that “no lite rail: no bridge”.

As I’ve noted before nailingit, It seems to me that you use this - context - word far too often and without understanding it’s meaning.

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 3:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"As Sgt. Friday used to say; 'Just the facts ma'am, just the facts.'"

Actually, he never said that. The phrase comes from a Dragnet spoof. ☺

Drift — February 7, 2014 at 4:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Oh wait...sometimes I can be a bit slow. Your quote was sly humor, eh?

I'll go shovel more snow now.

Drift — February 7, 2014 at 4:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal

As I’ve noted before nailingit, It seems to me that you use this - context - word far too often and without understanding it’s meaning.

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 3:59 p.m.

Or perhaps you instituting a preemptive strike doctrine noting your own inability to lend meaning and accuracy when attempting to engage in substantive argumentation or civil discourse.

Of course in your world liberals are always the evil enemy and big government is their weapon. Context is many times lost on a hardcore ideologue such as yourself. You see the world through a very narrow lens. Your bias is extreme. Your best line of defense becomes a critical finger pointing at someone else or bemoaning how unfair everything is. This latest kick many conservatives have about the Columbian's liberal bias is a hoot.

Politics cover a broad spectrum. Your summation, given context, is quite shallow.

My opinion of course.

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 4:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Actually, he never said that. The phrase comes from a Dragnet spoof. ☺

Drift — February 7, 2014 at 4:10 p.m.

Is that a fact...

Book em' Dan O!

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 4:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Insightful article written by an Al-Jazeera contributor.

No doubt it's biased, but it's bias doesn't detract from it's value one bit.

-Enabling Chris Christie: How Fox News, Joe Scarborough and faux-centrist pundits lie, deny and shade the truth-

Delusional projection is an obvious recurrent element in right-wing narratives about Obama, as it has been in narratives about black men since the colonial era.  Delusional evidence is embraced ferociously, no matter how flimsy or nonsensical it may be, because of the psychological needs it fulfills. This was particularly evident with the flowering of birtherism during the 2008 campaign — it’s a psychologically safe way to disqualify a black man from being president, while pretending it has nothing to do with race. Of course the exact parallel with Ted Cruz, born in Canada to an American mother, clearly shows how hollow this claim actually is: Just like Cruz’s, Obama’s mother was American, ergo he’s a natural-born citizen, no matter where he was born, so all the speculation over Kenya is and always was utterly irrelevant, nonsensical.

But the narrative was never supposed to be about facts in the first place: It was about whether you believed it or not, which is to say, it was about declaring a tribal allegiance to the tribe of conservative birther believers. The more ridiculous the belief, the more meaningful the commitment. Repeated sharing of delusional evidence is the foundation of how that tribal identity is maintained, and the same sort of tribal identity maintenance lies at the core of the repeated embrace of delusional evidence in the IRS and Benghazi pseudo-scandals, among others.

Once you understand the logic of delusional projection, it’s no longer mysterious trying to comprehend the conservative resort to Benghazi and other pseudo-scandals, best exemplified in the compact form required by tweets


On the surface, there’s virtually no difference between Joe Scarborough’s line and that of Fox News, Loesch, Erickson or Doocy. But beneath the surface, there is a difference, since somewhat different group identities are being protected against different sorts of threat. The implicit conservative defense is that all the Obama pseudo-scandals are real — and only scratching the surface of his truly monstrous nature.  In the post-Bush era, conservatives define themselves most cohesively in terms of being anti-Obama, which explains what’s most important about this defense.

Read more @

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 4:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'll go shovel more snow now.

Drift — February 7, 2014 at 4:12 p.m.

I had an enterprising 11 year old girl who lives on the corner knock on my door and ask me if she could shovel my driveway for a fair wage.

Most certainly!

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 4:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

What he actually said was "All we want are the facts, ma'am."

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 4:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Or perhaps you instituting a preemptive strike doctrine noting your own inability to lend meaning and accuracy when attempting to engage in substantive argumentation or civil discourse. -- nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 4:30 p.m.

More gobbledgook. Utter nonsense.

As for the rest of it: I've also note previously how imitative you are. I've noted the thing about your obvious use of a "good defense is a strong offense". Which you're doing once again here with me. I get that. What is really disgusting is that the others here actually think you present sound thinking.:):):):):):)

BTW, I've taken your advice and looked up the supposed Libertarian support of public tranportation. Can't find it. So now, as you said you would do, please show everyone where you got this information from. A Libertarian party platform concerning this would be really helpful. Thanks.

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 4:48 p.m. ( | suggest removal

BTW, I've taken your advice and looked up the supposed Libertarian support of public tranportation. Can't find it. So now, as you said you would do, please show everyone where you got this information from. A Libertarian party platform concerning this would be really helpful. Thanks.

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 4:48 p.m.

kn_d please ignore the next paragraph. These thoughts are purely for myself.


(((((omg...not again! Should I direct him to that mighty search engine one-more-time as I have on other issues? Would that loosen a bootstrap from this old libertarians galoshes? "So now, as you said you would do..." and what about a "party platform"? When did I ever say these things? Remember, he's a conservative. Besides, I believe the issue was trains, both electric and choo choo. It's always I want I want, never giving, and always expectant of more. Republicans! Reminds me of...what was I just thinking about? Oh yeah. Root Beer. He expects this kind of treatment so often of others... Hmmm. I wonder if he was raised as what many call...privileged. I don't know. At some point it becomes enabling. Remember what happened to Lisa in 97'!!)))))


knd- NO

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 5:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Who do you think you're fooling?

If you think other fanatic Leftists; you'd be right.

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 5:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 5:32 p.m.

It's a small world after all.

Maybe I'll put that together for you at some point kn_d. False assertions certainly don't raise the level of discourse.

Search libertarian+trains+fifties+ideology...

Something along those lines. I can't believe you've put much effort into this. Then to point your finger in such a disparaging way...

You might want to review fanaticism. Why get so riled up?

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 5:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm not the one who's riled up, I never have been.

Who do you think you're fooling?

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 5:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Search libertarian+trains+fifties+ideology... -- nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 5:39 p.m.

Yes. I've done so. Since I can't find anything on this, and since you're so good at providing links. maybe you can clear this up by just providing a link for this now.

Some kind of Alinksy radical tactic I think. Confuse. Confound. Ignore. Evade. :):):):):)

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 5:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

What is really disgusting is that the others here actually think you present sound thinking.:):):):):):)

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 4:48 p.m.

I'm not the one who's riled up, I never have been.

Who do you think you're fooling?

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 5:47 p.m.

Perhaps you're just fooling yourself. At any rate, per usual, you are providing a distinctly emotional narrative to what is in the end, meaningless dialogue.

Did you celebrate the Gippers B day yesterday?

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Why don't you just provide a source for your assertion that Libertarians support lite rail/public transportation? Hmmm?

kn_dalai — February 7, 2014 at 6:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6 p.m.

After reading that last hour and 15 minutes of dialog, all I can think of is Jethro.

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 6:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 6:27 p.m.

High density rail!

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 6:43 p.m

I'm thinking maglev elevated. Much cheaper and faster.

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 10:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 7, 2014 at 10:45 p.m.

Maglev sounds cool! Elevated always a plus.

Libertarians love this stuff! ;)

Just finished watching an eighties horror flick called 'Pumpkinhead' with my youngest daughter. A stay inside double feature with 'Aliens vs Predators' as the opener. Both fun movies.

Life is good.

nailingit — February 7, 2014 at 11:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

These types of stories are so common in conservative politics. Have to post one once in a while just to keep things honest.

///Republican Official Says Gays Should Be Purged From GOP, Blames Homosexuality On Satan///

Sears, in her post on the Schoolcraft County GOP website, wrote that Communist college professors were indoctrinating young people and claimed that Charles Darwin's evolutionary theory "gave rise to Hitler’s Third Reich, Mussolini’s Italy and Stalin’s Russia."

Read More @

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 12:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal

An idiot snowmobiler has made two loud and very fast swipes up the street in front of my house at 3 am. Sounds like the Indy 500. Lord. Impossible to get back to sleep, even though I have tried. One more swipe and I am calling 911 (as if the police do not have enough to do on nights like this). I assume the 25 mile per hour speed limit is the rule for all vehicles, as well as driving under the influence restrictions. Impaired is the only reason I can imagine why this bozo decided to perform his own Olympic event at this hour. Clarkansas strikes again. :)

While I am up:

So happy to read about the proposed housing for Veterans at the VA campus. Hope this important project comes to fruition. Does anyone think this is a bad idea? Takes up precious parking space, but there is always C-Tran.

manthou — February 8, 2014 at 4:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Clark County's future and health depends on tenacious watchdog journalism. It is on life support now and the Columbian is sounding the alarm, waking us up. Don't give up, Lou and team. Be relentless.

Love this article by Froomkin:

manthou — February 8, 2014 at 7:02 a.m. ( | suggest removal

The press talk column has some good stuff today. The image drawn by Marsha Matta is excellent. Once again, LouLou is really cool in those sunglasses! And that "Editors are always Write" thing is one for the ages!! But the rest of it can be ignored. Nothing to see here folks. Move along. While LouLou tries to discount the viability of a new Clark County news source, he does not take into account the disgust of many in the area over the Columbian’s bias. Don’t Do Stupid Stuff? OH – Mirror, Mirror on the wall….

kn_dalai — February 8, 2014 at 8:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Something to think about - What happens if the Repubs take over the Senate this next election? Polling data suggests there's a 54% chance of this happening. Click on the Washington Post link in this Morning Joe page (I would have linked directly there, but there's a ton of script in that address.)

roger — February 8, 2014 at 8:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I wouldn't recommend a stucco exterior on the vets' lodging. Not in this part of the country ☺

I'll admit to my ignorance on the subject, but that won't prevent me from musing a tad. I'm curious why so many vets are homeless. I've read much of it has to do with mental instability and self medicating with alcohol and illegal drugs. I've also read many are homeless by choice (sort of) due to their inability to function within society.

With that written, I'll opine, (in this case) building the structure does not neccessarily mean they will come. Though, I suppose, having a stable residence relative to addressing the underlying causes for homelessness isn't a terribly bad idea.

In the article (I just glanced) I saw something about a complex being built in another state. Are there any currently complete with residence? I suppose if it doesn't work the "apartments" could be utilized by other citizens down on their luck (shrug).

I don't know it's a bad idea. I don't know it's a good idea. I can't know until (unless) the program is instituted.

Drift — February 8, 2014 at 8:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 8, 2014 at 8:45 a.m.

Just off the top of my head---

Lots of Presidential Vetoes and executive orders

Nobody to blame but themselves

more people dying in the streets.

Hawkman — February 8, 2014 at 8:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 8, 2014 at 8:45 a.m.

Not much would change. I doubt repubs will take the Senate anyway. Too many "patriots" running for office who scare the hell out of the general public.

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 9 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Obama better get his judges appointed quickly just in case.

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 9:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: I keep waiting for Ruth Bader Ginsberg to retire. Soon. Please. Not that she isn't doing a good job, but she seems frail. I want an Obama appointee before he leaves office and before she HAS to be replaced due to health reasons.

Sorry, folks. Madore is using this winter weather to rile up his base about the "myth" of global warming, complete with a sensational graphic, on his FB page.

He is not content with simply killing Clark County, but is expanding his rhetoric to harm the entire planet.

manthou — February 8, 2014 at 9:13 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hi all getting ready to venture out and get a few things for the weekend. Nice to see many of you here on a regular basis. \
Nail- Loved your RD joke.. gave me a good chuckle. Going to do some Heavy laundry at the Laundromat in HD Take care all

vanwadreamer — February 8, 2014 at 9:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_d @ countless posts pleading for help & assistance. :)

Since you seem to be quite passionate with this subject, (And who can blame you. It's about Electric Trains!) I think you'll learn more and understand it in depth if you do some of the research yourself. A faction of conservatism/libertarianism embracing these concepts are nothing new.

Hint: Follow the breadcrumbs and work your way back.


The American Ideas Institute announced on August 16, 2010 that it has established The American Conservative Center for Public Transportation. The Center’s primary purpose is to build support for public transportation, especially urban and intercity rail, as a non-partisan, non-ideological infrastructure issue.

This action was made possible by a grant from The Rockefeller Foundation. The Center will champion a balanced transportation system in which rail and highway travel complement each other. We recognize that some journeys will always be more convenient by car. However, Americans should have the choice to travel to and from any point in the country without relying on an automobile. By restoring this flexibility, which existed as recently as the 1950′s, we can lay the foundation for an America less dependent on oil and secure from threats from the Middle East and other oil-producing areas.

The new Center’s Director is William S. Lind, who co-authored Moving Minds: Conservatives and Public Transportation with the late Paul M. Weyrich, a well-known conservative supporter of rail transportation. The Executive Director is Glen D. Bottoms, who recently retired from a 25-year career with the Federal Transit Administration and who has written on a variety of rail transit topics.

Mr. Lind and the late Mr. Weyrich co-authored another book, The Next Conservatism, which embraces rail transportation as a central component in the new conservative agenda. The Moving Minds book compiles all of the previous Weyrich/Lind transit studies into one volume.

Mr. Lind notes that, “The American Ideas Institute’s American Conservative Center for Public Transportation will be a strong and effective advocate for a robust public transportation system. The Center will work to establish a conservative voice for enhanced public transit, including both urban and intercity rail. Conservatives have traditionally supported a strong national defense, and nothing is more essential to America’s security than reducing our dependence on automobiles powered largely with imported oil. Improved public transportation can be an effective partner in this process, with technologies, especially electric railways, that have been tested and proven in more than a century of service.”

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 9:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal

"I keep waiting for Ruth Bader Ginsberg to retire."

manthou — February 8, 2014 at 9:13 a.m.

I'm of the same mindset. But to this date she defiantly wants to stay on. Let's hope she considers the big picture. No one lives in a bubble like these SCJ's. I think we need some sort of term limits with these guys.

And they should undergo drug testing on a regular basis.....

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 10:16 a.m. ( | suggest removal

vanwadreamer — February 8, 2014 at 9:41 a.m.

Stop in more often. I took exception with your last post concerning a leftist bias in the basement. (usually kn_d's mantra) I was going to break down the players and show you how "balanced" this place is, but didn't. Some other time I guess. Anyway-good to see you post.

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 10:22 a.m. ( | suggest removal

The idea of electric rail is to move the most people in the most effective way. That I agree with. The way the rail was set up to cross into Vancouver was not going to produce that result. It was going in to one of the least populated areas of the city. If as the original plan had been used , it may have worked. If I remember right it was to go a park and ride on Main St. by Kiggins Bowl. With the plan of someday going north to Salmon Creek and then on to Ridgefield. Glen Jackson bridge was, at the start ,was also going to bring rail to east county. I don't know why that never happened. To take rail to just Clark College in my opinion was not the right place.

timerick — February 8, 2014 at 10:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Got up at 6am and back to bed at 8am. Too blustery, cold.
Snow is coming down hard, and the darn winds are back.
I hope the power stays on. Now that would be cold here. After the pipe froze the other day, we discovered we also had this great propane portable heater (in garage, forgotten). Ran for hours on one little bottle. Made for camping. Might be camping in the house here with it.

luvithere — February 8, 2014 at 10:48 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick: How has this weather changed the way you are doing business. Service calls with trucks and all……Did you shut down on Thursday or Friday?

vanwadreamer: Egad! Going out? Consider letting the laundry fester a couple of days more. It's dropping those big flakes again, wetter and slipperier it seems. Watch out for bonehead drivers, too: cars, trucks and snowmobilers. :)

luvithere: If there is freezing rain, I fear many of us will lose power. No underground utilities were I live and all these huge, untrimmed trees. Let's hope not.
For those Breaking Bad fans, I discovered the Better Call Saul website this morning. Too funny on so many levels. Don't miss his "office cam" link and "philanthropy" page. It is so rich with items, it will take an hour to peruse this gem:

manthou — February 8, 2014 at 10:54 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 9:56 a.m.

That’s nice. Nice how you’ve combined Libertarian/Conservative. Who do you think you’re fooling? Just because someone has what can be called some Libertarian positions, does not make them a Libertarian anymore than one who believes in some sort of government social safety net for the truly needy makes them a Democrat. The question was about Libertarian support of public transportation. You’ve provided proof of this by linking to a conservative website. (Interesting to note the different descriptions of paleoconservative and neoconservative as well as different liberalisms, plural). I’ve seen this website before, BTW.

Neoconservative and paleoconservative aside; one of the founders of the American Conservative is Pat Buchanan, who you may want to look up and see if he fits the bill as a Libertarian. I’ll stick to David Nolan’s succinct description of the political spectrum. Nice try, but not good enough. Try again?

kn_dalai — February 8, 2014 at 10:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Just went and got back from Fred Meyer. My driveway and road to the highway were pretty deep but I have all wheel drive so no problems. The highway, SR 503 has been sprayed and is wet until you get to Battle Ground. BG is snow packed, all of it. Freddies is snow packed, quite a few people there. No eggs, almost out of milk. The trucks are stalled, the drivers can only drive like 10 hours and then have to rest 10, or something like that, so things are delayed. It's just starting to snow steady here, got my stuff and got home. Hope everyone is safe and warm. Hey Tim, how are the streets downtown?

Here's a link to check out the main roads;

Hawkman — February 8, 2014 at 11:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Curious that in the 21st Century, with fresh water, arable land, and every kind of resouce diminishing, and while human population continues to explode, politicians go straight to the BIG stuff, and talk about who is in charge in the nuclear family, though the basis for their position is purely anatomical. Steve Pearce, N. M. says "the husband is to lovingly lead and sacrifice". Must make his wifey feel all aglow about the trouble she puts him to. What a guy...

jacjak — February 8, 2014 at 11:30 a.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — February 8, 2014 at 10:56 a.m.

"Who do you think you’re fooling?"

Your latest attempt at obfuscating points with redundant silliness is, well, silly. If you want to save time...wdytyf will do.

Breadcrumbs grasshopper. The more I give you, the more paint you use. Dig your heels in soldier!

"The question was about Libertarian support of public transportation."

That's what I was wondering. You've got me setting party platform doctrine. Once again you are quite a bit over the top.

What is (and where for review) is my quote? What exactly did I say I would provide to you. That's a starting point for sure.

Once again-so high maintenance!



(as a side note: at least these moments get our comment numbers up a bit:)

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 11:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou I sent the crew home at noon on thursday and had them stay home on friday. I stayed both days to answer phones. Even the phones were quite. Went down this morning to pay bills and check things out. Quite again today. They are plowing some of the streets but most have packed snow. Came home at 11 and we had some lunch. Wife is getting tired of staying in so I think I will take her to our favorite Pub and let her play some punch boards for awhile. This is going to be a mess when the melt starts.

timerick — February 8, 2014 at 11:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hey, Nail!
I smelled your stinky bait at 10:16. I managed to swim over and watch the House Appropriations Committee public hearings on SHB, 2149, SHB 2198 and SHB 2144 before the lure became too much for me though.

So, here I am - swallowing the hook ☺

IMHO no one should be subjected to drug tests. I mean, in a clinical setting looking to see if the vitamin D supplement is working is perfectly acceptable. But that's not what we're talking about, is it?

And then there's that driving thing, right? .08 and a person is drunk (a breathalyzer is a drug test, yes?), or at least under the infuence, right? Yet, I think everyone and their uncle knows darn well aunt Betty is snockered after one glass of wine but grandpa can knock back five whiskeys before he shows any sign of impairment.

But the courts need a line. A line a citizen can't cross without fear of prosecution. That line for booze is .08.

Now, now, don't think I'm advocating operating a motor vehicle while impaired! That's not where I'm going. I'm simply trying to set you up for "impaired."

Because, when people are tested for drugs isn't that the stated goal (though I'm not real sure how that works with pre-employment)? Are they, could they have been, impaired by a drug at the time of testing?

We should test for impairment, not parts per million. Drug testing is a charade acting as an indication of.

And let's back up to that drug test at the doctors office for a moment. I've heard many stories of medicinal cannabis users being given a choice by their PCP, "Stop the pot or stop the opiates. I won't prescribe a pain-killer if you pop hot for pot again."

Yep, that last sentence was about as pertinent to the conversation as your suggestion the judges should be tested.

Or were you simply being facetious?

It doesn't matter. I finally got a CAPTCHA I could read and just didn't want to waste it.

Drift — February 8, 2014 at 12:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Sorry, folks. Madore is using this winter weather to rile up his base about the "myth" of global warming, complete with a sensational graphic, on his FB page.

He is not content with simply killing Clark County, but is expanding his rhetoric to harm the entire planet.

manthou — February 8, 2014 at 9:13 a.m.

He probably thinks the planet is simply no bigger than what he thinks or where he's standing. He has faith he's at it's center of it, after all.

Madore will always play to his base, and for this reason is losing more and more relevence as he has to keep getting further and further from any center ground. There was a letter in the Columbian yesterday from a guy name Mark Driscoll about D. Benton. A commentor asked if the letter writer was a pastor by the same name, and posted a link. So I spent part of my snowy yesterday snooping around Google about the pastor guy. Interesting what you can find if you get to about page 10 or 15 of the google links. Good grief, who'd have known there were so many schisms and factions in religion, or they have their own nasty little version of NSA and swat teams for anyone who causes ripples to the sanctity of the whole body of christian fundamentalism. In this guys case, the young and misunderstood angsty christian believers are prime for a rebel leader, it seems.

And while I could find nothing to connect this guy to the Driscoll who wrote the Columbian letter as being the same guy, reading about the pastor person was a window into the HUGE impact and power to be gained from feeding a base of followers if it's played right.

jacjak — February 8, 2014 at 12:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

What is (and where for review) is my quote? What exactly did I say I would provide to you. That's a starting point for sure. -- nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 11:33 a.m.


Jayne should have mentioned this decades old libertarian movement used to be strong supporters of light rail (by and large) to fill transportation needs. -- nailingit — January 12, 2014 at 10:35 a.m.

In order to clear this Libertarian matter up, please link to some reputable source about the Libertarians past promotion of lite rail, rather than allude to previous posts. -- kn_dalai — January 13, 2014 at 11 a.m.

Google can be your friend if you give it the opportunity. Until then you'll most likely stew as you insist on a response, get frustrated and angry for a time, then I'll supply you a proper response, you'll say nonsense, then you'll slide out the door for a few weeks. -- nailingit — January 13, 2014 at 12:56 p.m.

“Strong supporters of light rail”? Where’s the “proper response”? PROPER RESPONSE? Maybe if you’d turn off your pop culture current event politics TV every once in a while and spend a little time understanding underlying political philosophies, you’d know that Libertarian is about free associations and free enterprise solutions. I’ll give you this much – you know how to play every game in the book. You provide a good example of what it means to be a Leftist, as do your fellow basement Leftists. Thanks for that.

kn_dalai — February 8, 2014 at 12:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Or were you simply being facetious?

It doesn't matter. I finally got a CAPTCHA I could read and just didn't want to waste it.

Drift — February 8, 2014 at 12:03 p.m.

Totally! And not one to waste a readable captcha myself.

"We should test for impairment, not parts per million. Drug testing is a charade acting as an indication of."
Well stated.

Kaiser now insists on drug testing when on opiates. All they'll do is force folks into the black market to meet their needs. Foolishness at this level needs to stop.

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 12:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak: I saw the brouhaha over the Mark Driscoll identity confusion and actually feel sorry for the Vancouver version, given the feedback he has received because people think he is the dreaded leader of the Mars Hill Church. I'd be inclined to legally change my name.

I have followed the criticism of that church for a couple of years now. It bought a big downtown Seattle church. I think there is one in Portland, too. Hateful rhetoric that most Christians I know eschew. But Mars Hill certainly does not lack for followers.

manthou — February 8, 2014 at 12:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Thanks for that.

kn_dalai — February 8, 2014 at 12:34 p.m.

It's nice to know you're appreciative of something. Would you please go through my posts from about a year and a half ago? I addressed this with, I believe, 3 separate articles, and posted one or two of them 4 or 5 months ago.

"Maybe if you’d turn off your pop culture..."

I hope that doesn't include watching reruns of the 'Untouchables"!

"you'll most likely stew as you insist on a response, get frustrated and angry for a time, then I'll supply you a proper response, you'll say nonsense,..."

(Gee, that sure hasn't happened lately. :))

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 12:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou & JJ- With so many of these right wing religious factions on the market, I hadn't noticed this guy. Interesting stuff. I'm amazed at how many people buy into this type of thing.

-Mark Driscoll on Glenn Beck-

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 1:30 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Another republican turned democrat makes sense.

-Charlie Crist wants Cuba embargo ‘taken away’-

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 2:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Republicans act as children. Lamar should pay closer attention to his backyard rather than obstruct. Let's throw these bums out in future elections.

-Republicans Still Find Ways To Stall Judicial Nominees Despite Filibuster Reform-

So what's the problem? Republicans are refusing to give consent to let nominees get their votes. In a less partisan environment, both parties typically would give "unanimous consent" to let a batch of nominees receive votes, with little fanfare.


In the meantime, the federal judiciary is at a breaking point. There are now 96 judicial vacancies around the country, many of which are designated "judicial emergencies" as caseloads surge at the short-handed courts.

To give some perspective: One nominee currently waiting for a vote, John Owens, would fill a 9th Circuit appeals court seat that's been vacant for more than 3,325 days, according to data compiled by the Alliance for Justice. Another nominee, Beth Freeman, would fill a district court seat in the Northern District of California that's been empty for more than 860 days.

"Over the last year, the number of vacancies has hovered around 90 because obstruction in Congress has led to filibuster after filibuster of qualified nominees," Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), chairman of the Judiciary Committee, said last month. "We must not take for granted that we have the greatest justice system in the world, and ensuring this continues requires the Senate to fulfill its constitutional duty of advice and consent."

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 2:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Got ANOTHER scam email today, it started:

Special Order Delivery Problem
Costco Shipping Agent.

Pretrial notice

Hereby we confirm that your complaint has been received together with enclosures dated January 30, 2014.
The complaint will be reviewed in court in the nearest possible time based on the documents and information
you have previously provided. You do not have to be present at trial in person if the Court does not suggest

Please use this link to check your complaint once again and confirm it. If we do not get your confirmation
the claim will be cancelled.

You will be further notified without delay of any judgement delivered in regard to your complaint.

Court secretary

It's a scam out of Santiago,Chile.
Just an FYI

Hawkman — February 8, 2014 at 4:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

///Britain Puts Mormonism on Trial///

A London court called the church’s leader to account for “false” doctrines—the latest in a string of sensational charges leveled against Mormons since they first landed in Liverpool.

The president of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has been ordered to appear before a British court to defend the Mormon faith against charges that it used false teachings to defraud church members.

The court order is the result of complaints filed by Tom Phillips, a disaffected Mormon living in Portugal, on behalf of two men he says were induced to pay an annual tithing to the Church based on “untrue or misleading” claims. These claims include seven central LDS tenets, such as the belief that the Book of Mormon was translated from ancient gold plates by Joseph Smith and “is the most correct book on earth and is an ancient historical record.”

That an alienated Mormon went public with his grievances about church doctrine is nothing unusual. But what makes this case surprising is that a magistrate judge has backed Phillips’ claims by ordering LDS President Thomas S. Monson to appear before the Westminster magistrates’ court, in London on March 14 to answer to the accusations.

Legal experts are baffled by the magistrate’s decision to pursue the case, which claims that Monson violated the 2006 Fraud Act, a British law that forbids false representations to secure financial gain.

“I’m sitting here with an open mouth,” Neil Addison, a former crown prosecutor and writer on religious freedom told The Arizona Republic, which broke the story. “I think the British courts will recoil in horror. This is just using the law to make a show, an anti-Mormon point. And I’m frankly shocked that a magistrate has issued it.”

Read More @

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 9:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 8, 2014 at 9:52 p.m.

Oh, that's going to be a real show.

Hawkman — February 8, 2014 at 10:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Observed last night at about 10:00 PM:

An adult male with four teens (three sitting in the back of his open pick up truck), skidding around an icy parking lot for fun, making big circles and braking. Their own carnival ride.

He then hitched one of the kids on a big snow tube to his hitch on his back bumper and started pulling it around in circles.

No helmets on any of the kids. No brains on the "dad."

As luck would have it for his teen charges, the tow rope broke during the first human tow and the teens were forced to simply use the small hill in the park for sledding.

Didn't a little girl die that way a couple of years ago? Her dad was tried in court for involuntary manslaughter.

I see similar stupidity on display at the beach during storms.

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 5:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Anyone read today's editorial in the C? Thoughts?

Is Vancouver at a crossroads? Do we continue to nurture our industrial dumping ground image (coal trains and oil transfer stations) or do we try to break away and support a new image of destination resort? Can the two co-exist?

Reminds me of northern Indiana (Hammond and Gary). Never could shake the steel mill, refinery, industrial wasteland image no matter how much money was tossed at the toxicity. Maybe Vancouver is similarly doomed.

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 8:27 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 8:27 a.m.

Ed Ruttledge most likely nailed it. Big Oil and those who support it will get their way.

It's interesting this community after all these years seems to suffer from identity crisis.

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 9:11 a.m. ( | suggest removal

After reading the article and the comments, I agree with Roger. These developers knew of the train traffic well before the purchase of the property. These trains have been hauling all kinds of oil,gas and who knows what else for decades and we all knew it. Now because some big money has bought a parcel of land and want to put high end units on it it has become a big deal. We are not going to stop the trains from rolling. Lets see what kind of safe guards they are going to install for the safety of all residents in this area. I live close to the rail line and to be honest I am not that worried. I am glad to see the Port moving to make this area attractive to industry. We need these kind of blue collar high wage jobs.

timerick — February 9, 2014 at 9:25 a.m. ( | suggest removal

This oil thing reminds me of back when I was in the reinforced plastics (fiberglass) business.

The company had plans to move the "shop" to an industrial area out in Woodland. We had contacted zoning and planning, the fire marshal, all the regulatory agencies to ensure the site was adequate. The preliminary work indicated a few modifications were in order, but nothing insurmountable.

And then the citizenry caught wind of our plans. All heck broke loose. The people of Woodland wouldn't stand for such a stinky and dangerous operation in their back yard.

I was sitting beside the fire marshal at a public meeting. Citizens carried on about the smell from the dog food plant; how they were told there wouldn't be any odors; some waved MSDs on the chemicals used in the FRP manufacturing process, proclaiming great hazard.

I whispered to the fire dude, "Do you think I should testify, rebutting some of their statements?"

He responded, "Why? As long as your operation is within the codes they can't stop you. I'd suggest you say nothing."

Sort of like oil terminals, eh?

Drift — February 9, 2014 at 9:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I'll post the same link here that I used when commenting on both the editorial and the article about the Gramor guy. There's very little that can be done by State or local government to stop the oil and coal trains - regulation falls solely at the federal level. The Alaska pipelines are old and inefficient - transport by rail from Bakken is much cheaper and is going to replace that source of crude oil for the refineries here in the Pacific Northwest. BNSF is the primary railway in Washington, and the tracks through Vancouver are a major part of their network. Those oil trains are going through the town now, and the numbers will increase in the future, whether we build that terminal at the Port or not.

I've been saying for a few years that the plan to build the Waterfront Development project at the old Alcoa location is dumb. This whole issue just accentuates that point of view.

Also, consider that BNSF has a right of way along their tracks. I believe they're exercising this now a few blocks to the west - Isn't Lincoln between 11th and 12th going to be shut so they can build a passenger rail line? Google a map of Vancouver and look at the tracks going into the Port from the north, and compare that to what comes in from the east. I can see an argument that they may want to add track there too, as traffic continues to rise.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 9:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I appreciate reading everyone's opinions on that Gramor/Tesoro conflict. Even though Cain said earlier that the death of the CRC would not effect them, this gives Gramor an alternative villain (Tesoro) to blame. My guess is that the investors are getting cold feet for a variety of other reasons and the oil transfer station provides the perfect excuse to bail.

While I would like to have a fully developed waterfront, what I don't like in development is a "standardized and sanitized" illusion of perfection. You know, the bulldozer technique: get rid of all things deemed unseemly and start from scratch.

I like inner city development to co-exist with the raw and real, similar to what I saw on a visit to Pittsburgh's Germantown (near Max's Allegheny Tavern) a couple of years ago. I see it in certain Chicago neighborhoods, too. Montreal and NYC, as well.

If a neighborhood looks like a movie set, it can attract residents who are too perfectionistic and precious. Not a lot of fun to live there.

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 10:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal

"If a neighborhood looks like a movie set, it can attract residents who are too perfectionistic and precious. Not a lot of fun to live there."

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 10:06 a.m.

Yes. We would hate to discourage current residents who are anti-growth, anti-progress and who envision the future solely based on their limited personal experiences. :)

Metaphorically speaking, communities are a movie set.

Unfortunately, we have opted for a movie version of Petticoat Junction without the perks of a community shared water tower.

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 10:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Har, Har. :)

Many "imperfect" people are pro-growth, pro-multimodal transportation, and pro-diversity. They like downtown living, too.

That's why Mark Driscoll and others like him are so intent on "planting" their message beyond the suburbs and into the messy mix of urban decay. There are a lot of sinners who need saving here.

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 10:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou I think you are right on the button about Gramor. This is a easy way out for them. I would like to know what the contract with city says if they do bail. Tax payers left holding the bag again? Reminds me of the City backed Hilton. If they do bail I hope our city fathers will have learned a lesson. As far as money producing I would say the Port has already done a far better job than the city. Kind of makes me wonder why we let the city have control over C-Tran.

timerick — February 9, 2014 at 11:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Out of boredom, I flipped over to Waters blog. Is this Ortiz character another pen name for Lew? Maybe his wife? Absolutely the most bizarre comment I've seen over there. Zero quality control.

Lew's column reads like a gossip infused confessional, while lamenting conservatives inability to keep their collective mouths shut about constant infighting.

As difficult as it is to try and read through one of his writes, (I had to pause a few times) this one is worth it.

Great stuff!

(gotta find this letter & read it!:)

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 12:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

While I mostly agree with comments about citizen protest attempts towards fracked crude coming through the community or stopping the powerful oil industry, the protestor in me always gets a little piked (what a word) at the choice of verbs and adjectives used to describe 'density' living by some of the regular posts over the past 15 or so months on the FB debate of oil jobs vs urban living. If there is a point to add or take exception to, just say it, no need for snide, smirky and disparaging words or phrases. I'm not sure why there is such division among citizens in CC on so many subjects, and it's especially disconcerting on some subjects when it won't or doesn't impact personally, such as where other people chose to live. Why is there no longer room for opposing viewpoints without the subtle put downs?

I guess what I'm trying to say is the disrespect for the city dweller was becoming fashionable in Clark County well before the Gramor/Tesoro conflict. It's just more open these day, to the point that the loss of any beneficial impact on employment, tax revenues, or property value that's brought through the development of a 'destination site' of future urban housing and services are looked at as some sort of gleeful victory.

jacjak — February 9, 2014 at 12:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'd like to know what the conservative facebook page is that the e-mail was posted to (I think he says by Tom Mielke). I've checked both Madore ones,, Clark Repub party, Tom Mielke, and a page that I think Kelly Hinton writes.

It sort of sounds as though Benton has gone off the deep end.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 12:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 9, 2014 at 12:41 p.m.

I'm sure Lou and his raffish partners in journalistic crime are all over it! While the other Lew is in DEFCON 4 status.

Not that Don would say anything embarrassing.

Good times :)

-Clean up your language, 2 senators told-

In a later meeting with Senate leadership, Benton reportedly called Rivers a “trashy trampy-mouthed little girl”. Rivers said the word trampy was particularly troublesome because it “has a connotation that borders on sexual harassment.”

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 1:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 9, 2014 at 12:41 p.m.

The only email I found was Benton's review on Meilke's page. Not much there, sounded more like a lame pass to me. As for Lew's write, just more of the same crap. I did notice that GO left a lengthy response, though. She really is a "Lew" fan, blowing plenty of smoke up his rear.

As for the rail VS condo situation, 2 miles away is a decent distance, I think they can both survive. Of course, they might have to build a tunnel to hide the trains.

Hawkman — February 9, 2014 at 2:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak — February 9, 2014 at 12:39 p.m.

Is that something you want me to answer, or just a rhetorical question?

Things have gotten quite ugly on the facebook side since Matt left the job as moderator. Those conversations today are pretty tame.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 2:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 1:50 p.m.

They supposedly kissed and made up after that incident. Maybe Don is upset because Ann seems to have replaced him as the voice of Clark County (less those in the 49th, of course - Jim still holds that spot there.)

I suppose I'll have to check the legislative website and see what's being complained about.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 2:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Thanks for posting Lew's latest blog. Fascinating. Sounds like Benton is mounting another poison-pen campaign against Senator Rivers because she won't genuflect at his stinky feet.

Tom Mielke's posting the letter tells me Mielke is in Benton's court. My guess is that the letter has been removed from whatever FB page posted it. Gone, gone, gone.

Although APIL posted this topic, too, here is Crosscut's interpretation of Don Benton's skills at self-promotion. Lest we forget, you know:

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 2:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Thanks for that link Nails. To avoid work, I also read it. According to the last post, leaortiz is Lew's wife. At least I understood it so. The whole write, as I read it, was that the republicans need to keep their mouths shut and fight behind closed doors so the rest of us don't hear about it. Nice try, dirt gets out. Always does.

To say that Lew got canned from the C because he tried to point out his side, is smoke. Probably got the ax because of his insults.
I can never understand why somebody complaints about the C, constantly, and then gets ticked off when they can't access it or comment on it. More than one of these people floating around here.

luvithere — February 9, 2014 at 2:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 12:05 p.m.

Lea Ortiz is Lew's wife.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 2:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal

While researching the "missing letter" I was looking at Tom Meilke's page and in his "likes" he lists the "Tea Party". It seems the party of Tea is upset with Mr. Boehner. I laughed and laughed and laughed... anyway, here's the link. Have fun

Hawkman — February 9, 2014 at 3:39 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 9, 2014 at 3:39 p.m.
Wow, I could only stomach 2 minutes.

luvithere — February 9, 2014 at 3:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm not sure what Don is upset with Ann over - she seems to be a cosponsor or to have supported just about anything of significance that he's gotten into committee. The only thing I can think of is that this is coming from the Rules Committee - Something he wanted didn't make it onto the agenda, and And that Ann didn't try to help get it there.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 3:57 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I have to chime in again on Lew's blog. (Curse you, nailingit, for distracting us with it. I almost didn't get my taxes done).

This is not the first time Waters has threatened to call it quits. He has done so before and the theme is usually this: no one appreciates me or the work I do blah blah blah. Then there is a small chorus of admirers, like the ones we see on this new blog, singing his praises and begging him to hang in there for God, country, and apple pie.

It is a way to fish for attention and play the martyr. It must work for him, because he does it often enough.

Although I must say, this time: I agree with Lew's frustration with the local Repubs. :)

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 5:29 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 5:29 p.m.

Might one say the same about our other Lou, and that damned cup of his?

roger — February 9, 2014 at 5:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Interesting - someone says you can beat the Columbian's paywall.

Hey, if you go over your limit, wipe out your browser cookies, use a different browser, or best yet, use the TOR browser ( Your tax $$ went into developing it, might as well get your monies worth from it.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 5:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Is that something you want me to answer, or just a rhetorical question?

roger — February 9, 2014 at 2:32 p.m.

No, purely rhetorical, and about FB, tho if you do have some sort of hypothesis as to why we're all willing to die on every hill, and so can lose the war, go for it. As one guy whose not afraid of the hard look-sees, I've learned much from the well researched and straight forward opinions you share, though they usually make me have to read a bit, or worse, think.

Cynicism seems a fairly new pattern within the commenting communities in general more so than about any specific subject, imo, be it low income housing, river front development, law enforcement & crime, enviornmental protections, global warming, or heaven-help-us... guns. Maybe it does have to do with moderation, as I don't see much of it at the NYT or WP sites. Or maybe humans have just hit their developmental apex and are now devolving, and all the talk of Abraham Lincoln's 'better angels of our nature' is just another political catchphrase.

jacjak — February 9, 2014 at 6:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: We disagree about the quality of journalism that is published at the Columbian, I know. I think it is responsible.

Now, there are ways of trying to get out of paying for a service and product we like to use every day, but why would you want to? Just vote with your money and simply unsubscribe. I don't get people complaining about the C and then participating on its website as much as you and I do. I hope you hang around, though.

Would you provide your job services gratis if your employer decided to skip out on paying you?

OK. For what it's worth, I sent the good senator Mr. B a short note today, asking him to take responsibility for his complaints about Senator Rivers, rather than asking Waters and Mielke to do his dirty work for him. She should have an opportunity to answer those concerns so we can evaluate them and make up our own minds. This seems like an ambush. I Cc'd Ms Rivers and told her (not Benton) that I appreciated her public service.

I really wanted to say, "Man up, Mr. Benton", but thought better of it.
Seems like a cowardly, bully thing for him to do.

Eventually, he is going to lose it at Clark County.

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 6:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Kelly Hinton has added his own perspective to the Don Benton/Ann Rivers saga.

In his new blog post, he describes Benton as "a petchulant jerk; a bully who is so selfish it makes me want to scream. The man has become so shortsighted and self-centered that he can’t even see straight."

Hinton predicts that information will soon be released that will be the downfall of Benton:

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 7:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou -- You should have clicked on the Mike Briggs Watch (upper left) of that Kelly Hinton page - Seems we've acquired a following of sorts among the conservative folk of Clark County. Lew Waters mentioned us a while back, and now this. (Scroll all the way - he starts with my comments, then moves to yours, and then picks up several of the rest of the crowd.)

roger — February 9, 2014 at 8:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: Hooray the First Amendment! We're also mentioned today on Lew Waters' comments, with goldie and kndalai holding up their ends.

So happy to be able to provide local blogs with material, although it is going to be hard to beat both Waters and Hinton's brutal blogs today. More power to them.

What did I say? Hooray for the First Amendment.

Makes me wonder which one is kndalai. My bet is isn't Waters. :)

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 8:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 6:14 p.m. --

That was a cut/paste from the facebook side. I subscribe, both hard copy and the website. There's many a day when I wonder why, though. As others have also noted, if you want current news about much of anything around here beyond the latest escapades of the M&M; Boys and Don Benton, you probably need to look for it in The Oregonian. And sadly, over the past several months I've gone to reading that paper first, and I get to this one if I have time. I work the sudoku puzzle in the hard copy over morning coffee, and then dump it unread at work for others to look through.

I think we just had this conversation a few weeks ago (if that long), but once again - This paper has tanked in the past year. Laird retired and Andrea left. They've got some good writers (Oliver, Corvin, Florip, Mathieu), but all Lou seems to care about is that crap on All Politics Is Local.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 8:53 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 8:49 p.m. --

Wow - So Lew thinks everyone here is a whiny Liberal, and Goldie supports that observation. Now, that may apply to "some people" here (where is Nails, anyhow?) (That's a joke!!!! Don't get all wound up over it!), but it also suggests the rest of us are just so much bupkis.

At least Kelly Hinton gave us credit for being good judges of character.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 9:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: I have noticed that the Oregonian publishes some breaking Clark County news before the Columbian. I read both, as well as Crosscut.

I think newspapers are struggling so much and are experimenting with ways to better engage their readers. Some ideas work better than others.

I am evangelical about the importance of a free and independent press (even bloggers like Waters and Hinton can make politicians cringe) in keeping government accountable and honest. We have a very, very serious credibility and ethics problem in Clark County and, if we did not have the Columbian to keep the pressure on, we'd be worse off.

I look forward to seeing what newspaper David Madore starts to publish. Better yet: which journalists will he be able to hire? The more choices we have, the better informed we are.

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 9:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: Yeah. We live in a world that needs to create and maintain polarization for entertainment.

manthou — February 9, 2014 at 9:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

This is more than a bit short sighted, to put it politely.

Our country's pattern of federal level elections over the past 50 years has been pretty schizo - we seem to hop back and forth between liberal Democrats and conservative Republicans (with a couple closer to the center like Ford and Clinton thrown in), and there are indications that pendulum is swinging back to the right again. (We'll see in November - and if the Repubs do take the Senate like that Post column said was possible, then watch out.)

A mere ten years ago, John Ashcroft was AG of the US, with control of the Justice Dept and such agencies as ATf and the FBI. John Boy went out of his way to make an example of Tommy Chong.

Weed is still illegal. (Yes - a schedule whatever that is, Mayor.) And I suspect there are more than a few in that crowd chomping at the bit, just praying for a chance to fly in by the planeloads, outfitted in the latest assault gear and armed to the teeth, to teach the heathens of Colorado and Washington about the error of our ways. A slight shift further back to the right, and the god fearing righteous types will turn them loose.

Don't you think Mielke understands how his ilk think?

roger — February 9, 2014 at 9:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 9, 2014 at 8:24 p.m.

HEY!!! We're famous! Well sort of. Almost as famous as that Rufus guy. I wish I could see the email they were talking about. Also, I can't wait to see Benton self destruct. Sure, he might lose his Senate job but will he lose his County job? Will Madore protect him? Is that why he got the County job in the first place, to insure him from not having any money after his State job is over? Only time will tell, if Hinton is right.

Hawkman — February 9, 2014 at 9:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Jayne has effectively neutered Laird's old position.


roger — February 9, 2014 at 2:46 p.m.

Thanks roger. Figured that or a pseudonyme. I don't think anyone else on the planet would be able to come up with an opinion like that. Bizarre!


manthou — February 9, 2014 at 5:29 p.m.

I thought the same thing. The Drama! :))

This self-victimization stuff is just way over the top.

I just took a look over there.

So much drama!

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 9:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Uh - All 3 at 9:40? I think there are laws against that kind of deviant behavior.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 9:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm not understanding this myself, but an unprecedented 3 way just happened at 9:40 tonight.

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 9:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal


nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 9:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 9, 2014 at 9:40 p.m.,

Rufus Parsnagel is one of my favorite pseudonyms on all the newspaper websites, and I've no idea where the name comes from. Google it, and absolutely nothing comes up.

roger — February 9, 2014 at 9:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 9, 2014 at 9:51 p.m.

Both words are rooted in a jackasstainian dialect most commonly used in Washington St roadside rest areas and conservative websites.

nailingit — February 9, 2014 at 10:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Anyone staying home from work again today?

Here's a good civics project. Check out the bills sponsored by our local legislators. It is easy to comment on them.

For starters, here is Benton's list:

manthou — February 10, 2014 at 5:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Will the Columbian sue for copyright infringement? The source of the basement comments isn't even mentioned in the blog (or did I miss it? "Democratians forum" doesn't cut it).

To make my point: I routinely post my LttE on my blog ( and that's fine and dandy. It's sort of a joint ownership; I'm the author, but the Columbian is copyright holder (so to speak). I make sure the Columbo is credited.

Though I'm the author of "Carrier" the publisher owns the book. I can legally reproduce portions, but not the whole darn thing.

Back to the LttE thing. Like I wrote, that's okay, but if I were to paste 1/2 of the Columbian web version on my blog I'd be getting a certified letter (or served). The best I can count, there's about 35 comments spanning 24 (or so) hours on that blog.

Wait and see if those comment don't disappear.

Drift — February 10, 2014 at 6:10 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Forum Login