Open forum, Feb 17-23



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Right now we have dozens of trains coming down the Gorge every day into Vancouver. I see them sitting along side the road, waiting to get to their destination, be it the port, the yard or just to travel thru to another destination. With that said, all these proposals for more coal trains and more oil trains (since we already have some of both) baffle me. Where is the railroad going to find the track capacity? If the current trains are already stalled, where are they going to put more?

Hawkman — February 17, 2014 at 8:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Weren't we discussing Dave Van Ronk not long ago?

I saw the Coen bros movie last night, "Inside Llewyn Davis," which is based on Van Ronk's memoire, "The Mayor of MacDougal Street."

Just as in "O Brother, Where Art Thou?,' the music plays a starring role in this film. There is a Showtime spinoff, Another Day/Another Time concert of the soundtrack which I have not yet seen.

Go see it. Many of you would enjoy it. :)

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 9:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk: I see that there is another crude oil terminal proposed for Portland, on the Willamette.

Until we can figure out how to run our country petro-free, we will be dodging these bombs-on-rails futilely and increasing tracks and trains to feed the hunger.

We want a risk-free life with absolute safety guarantees, but even Disneyland cannot offer that fantasy. We don't want crime in our neighborhoods, we want to civilly commit criminals based on fears of what they MIGHT do in the future after they have served their time, and we want a hip urban lifestyle without the ugly, toxic warts.

I am no fan of these oil or coal trains and terminals and would be thrilled to see them banned from the metro area. But is it realistic to expect to live near two major ports without having to accept what its commerce brings?

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 9:52 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Good points Manthou. We have charged our port with creating jobs. I think they have done a great job. These trains have been going through for as long as I can remember. Hawk makes a good point on trains having to wait to pass through. Are the rail roads going fix that problem? I as you live pretty close to the port and we hear trains all the time. I kind of enjoy listening to them. And I am not to concerned about the ones carrying oil and other fuels as they have been doing this for years. I suppose our fuel consumption will all change in the near future. Until then we will need the fuel. It has helped us from importing as much as we used to.

timerick — February 17, 2014 at 10:59 a.m. ( | suggest removal

There are various reasons to see trains waiting around the Vancouver area. Some are waiting for crews to take them one direction or another. Some are waiting for the customer to make room for the train, such as the grain elevators. Sometimes they are waiting for track workers to do their work before letting trains through. Vancouver is a crew change point and sometimes they are waiting for a rested crew to take the train. The BNSF main lines are busier than they used to be, partly because they can haul more product at a cheaper rate than trucks. Trains operate similar to auto traffic. Train dispatchers, either through signals (similar to traffic signals) or written train orders, control train movements. You will see trains waiting their turn at signals just like automobile traffic does at traffic signals. Depending on how good the dispatcher is, it is amazing how many trains can be moved on a stretch of track. And of course, there are days when it gets clogged up period because of unforeseen situations, such as land slides. When this happens, trains will stack up until the problem is corrected.

BeenThereTwice — February 17, 2014 at 11:26 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick: I enjoy the sounds of the trains, too. Throwback from my youth, I think.

Here's what I believe is a major contributing factor to this conflict: the demographics of downtown residents have changed considerably.

Downtown and waterfront used to be the low-rent districts, previously the most undesirable places to call home. Not so much anymore with the movement away from the suburbs into the cities.

Two homes within walking distance of mine have sold or are on the market for more than $600,000 this month. People are rehabilitating historic homes, large and small, and inner city neighborhoods are attracting young people, professionals, and retired persons who want to park their cars and walk to work and entertainment. And they are paying a sweet price for the honor of doing so.

So there is a clash of cultures that this gentrification brings: industry used to be able to set up shop without much neighborhood complaints or government oversight. Not so much anymore.

I kinda look at it like this: it is not realistic to move into an old neighborhood and expect to change it to fit your tastes. Any change that is most palatable to all needs to be gradual and it needs to respect the cultures and lifestyles already present.

Missionaries have a history of invading ancient cultures and forcing them to adopt new and strange beliefs through radical change. That's why some of them wound up dead.

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 11:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal

BeenThereTwice — February 17, 2014 at 11:26 a.m.

Yea, got all of that. My Dad retired from UPRR and my brother was a crew dispatcher in Omaha. I heard all the good stuff about crews delays. That being said, with all the "standing" trains we have now, without building more track, where will they put them all?

BTW, welcome aboard.

Hawkman — February 17, 2014 at 11:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal

BeenThereTwice: Welcome or welcome back, whichever greeting is most appropriate. Good to hear another voice here. It has become an echo chamber of late.

I have to make sure I arrive for any Amtrak trip well in advance as I have nearly missed a train once due to a long, slow line of freight cars moving on the tracks that bisect and block the station approach. Better planning on my part is needed, not trying to make the train accommodate my crisis. :)

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 11:49 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawk my oldest son is a yard master for UP in Portland. Part of UP's problem is they don't own much track on this side of the nation and they have to give BN the right of way. I would think that BN has the same problem where UP owns the tracks.

timerick — February 17, 2014 at 12:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Imagine if it became public the Obama's were into Astrology, and announced it influenced their decision making. There'd be calls for impeachment, and rednecks slapping each other's backs with a resounding, "I told you so!". There would be a red state push to enact anti-astrology laws across the land, evangelical Christians would lobby to ban Tarot card possession & manufacturing, and certainly the right would introduce a 'stars don't really exist' conspiracy, citing the shiny objects in the night are really God's tears, as He cries for lost liberal souls.

At any rate...Happy Presidents Day

[President Reagan and his wife, Nancy, are both deeply interested in astrology, the White House spokesman, Marlin Fitzwater, said today, and two former White House officials said Mrs. Reagan's concerns had influenced the scheduling of important events.

A California astrologer said she had been consulted by the Reagans regarding key White House decisions, but Mr. Reagan said astrology had not influenced policy.

Followers of astrology believe the alignment of stars and planets influences human affairs. Such people consult charts, based on their birth dates, for clues concerning many decisions.]

Read More @

nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 1:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Vancouver has its own variety/talk show live. Hosted by Temple Lentz at the Kiggiins. This Wednesday, the 19th at 7:00 pm. Sounds like fun.

nailingit: I remember reading about that astrology thing with the Reagans. Not any more far out than consulting a holy book of one's choosing, I guess.

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 1:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Not any more far out than consulting a holy book of one's choosing, I guess.

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 1:43 p.m

Funny, that's just what I was thinking. Just change the word "astrology" for "religion", I mean, really, what's the difference?

Hawkman — February 17, 2014 at 1:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 1:43 p.m.

Hawkman — February 17, 2014 at 1:54 p.m.

I wasn't alluding to the merits of astrology, (although much could be said) but rather the reactionary politics of today. Contrasting public opinion/media extremism during different presidential eras type thing. It's what my entire paragraph was about.........

nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 2:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Maybe some don't remember, or paid much attention to politics at the time.

The Reagan's depending on "soothsayers" for decision making was by and large laughed off at the time. The butt of jokes for a short while. No big deal. Evangelicals weren't outraged, Democrats didn't fund raise off of it, pretty low key. Besides, Ronnie was on his way out and sick anyway.

Today, as I alluded to earlier, Republicans would make it a central talking point, and use RW media to go ballistic with it. Of course I was being facetious with some of my earlier post concerning possible reactions, but no doubt there would be a congressional investigation as to what events were influenced, calls for impeachment, hearings, fund raising events, etc. etc......if it became public Barack Hussein Obama used an astrologer for decision making.

I know you guys know this, but as a reminder, look at what their messaging has done with something completely fabricated. One of many many many many examples...

-Conservatives more likely to think Obama is Muslim now than in 2008-

Some folks are easily influenced. Many times bias is the driver, regardless of fact.

nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 2:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal

-Conservatives more likely to think Obama is Muslim now than in 2008-

nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 2:59 p.m.

Yup, and one in four Americans think the Sun revolves around the Earth. Go figure.

Hawkman — February 17, 2014 at 3:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Do some media companies bear any responsibility in assisting with the mountain-making-out-of-molehills? I can think of a couple…...

Speaking of media, I picked up a brand new DDSS mug today, the one with the new graphic. Very clever. It is not only a good reminder to stay smart, but to persevere against bad government in the face criticism. It also is more specific to our certain local issues and personalities.

What are you going to do with the profits from the mug sales, Lou? I suggest a simple public Open House at The Columbian with light refreshments. You know, give your subscribers and supporters a chance to mingle with the journalists who work so hard every day to keep CC and Vancouver honest.

How could you insure the attendees are not hostile? They need to show a DDSS mug at the door for entry. :)

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 3:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: "Do some media companies bear any responsibility in assisting with the mountain-making-out-of-molehills? I can think of a couple…..."

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 3:20 p.m.

Conflating media outlets with broad based generalizations doesn't cut it to well either. Specific examples, to include trends within the individual outlets themselves, as well as a solid history of fact based reporting and good journalistic practices would be a start if we're to shoot that bear.

Please name them for discussion if you wish, and cite your examples and reasoning with each. Molehill mountains can be quite treacherous to climb, and in some cases highly elevated. Others, downhill, a walk in the park and of little consequence. Varying degrees, specifics and volume of such, mean much within this type of framework.

nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 4 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: You're gonna make me work today?

OK. Well, much of what comes from Fox News opinion has riled up the right wingers in the same way MSNBC motivates the left. It is difficult for me to listen to either anymore because of the emotional response they both pull for. It is just too exhausting and shrill at the end of the day. Rush Limbaugh trades on name-calling and hate-mongering, as does Glenn Beck. That's all news-as-entertainment, not reporting.

Not to change the subject or anything, but…….

I was heartened to read about the new Republican majority leader in the WA State House. He is a compromiser and a gentleman, according to sources in both parties and this story from the ST. Are we seeing a trend toward civility and getting things done together? Hope so.

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 4:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I think you are seeing that more of us that lean to the left are going to support those that are willing to compromise. It needs to return to the days when things were done for the good of all. That takes both sides. I think Nail has alluded to that in previous posts. We can't have a one party system. It leaves it open to too much corruption from the side that holds all the power. As to bias in the news. It depends on where the money is flowing. Our news outlets are to invested in big money making projects. I feel that we see that here in our local paper. Hard to be objective when money is on the line.

timerick — February 17, 2014 at 4:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

The Columbian has a poll going, asking whether the City should take a stand for or against the oil transfer point. Surprisingly, those for the project have an early lead (55-46).

roger — February 17, 2014 at 5:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 17, 2014 at 5:58 p.m.

I'm all for it. But only because I believe that the technology is there to transfer it fast and safe. If only they will use it.

Hawkman — February 17, 2014 at 6:40 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I am to Hawkman. I think if they follow all the rules and regulations the risk will be worth it.

timerick — February 17, 2014 at 7:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm thinking it could work OK - And the income and the jobs are guaranteed.

roger — February 17, 2014 at 8 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 17, 2014 at 4:20 p.m.

I'll take content over presentation and delivery. At least with the sources you mentioned, any journalistic bias is up front, not masked with a pen of underlying subtleties intended to influence policy and shape the unsuspecting mind. Maybe I've read the WSJ and watched CNN too many times and have become jaded.

Your boy, Rep. Dan Kristiansen, is an anomaly. Just enough eye candy to capture your longing for civility. Of little significance and short lived at best. (I wanted to let you down easy, but didn't know how.:)

nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 9:43 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Waters has all but shut down his blog in his self loathing, and the Columbian hasn't mentioned it that I'm aware of. Sitting on it maybe?

Anyone heard anything concerning "Gripe Gate"? The gossipy e-mail featuring not only Benton and Rivers salty salacious critique of one another, but some "soothing advice" administered by tea party blogger and local activist Lew Landers.


nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 9:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

-1% Jokes and Plutocrats In Drag: What I Saw When I Crashed a Wall Street Secret Society-

The neophytes – who had changed from their drag outfits into Mormon missionary costumes — broke into their musical finale: a parody version of “I Believe,” the hit ballad from The Book of Mormon, with customized lyrics like “I believe that God has a plan for all of us. I believe my plan involves a seven-figure bonus.” Amused, I pulled out my phone, and began recording the proceedings on video. Wrong move.

“Who the hell are you?” Novogratz demanded.

I felt my pulse spike. I was tempted to make a run for it, but – due to the ethics code of the New York Times, my then-employer – I had no choice but to out myself.

“I’m a reporter,” I said.

Novogratz stood up from the table.

"You’re not allowed to be here," he said.

I, too, stood, and tried to excuse myself, but he grabbed my arm and wouldn’t let go.

Read More @

nailingit — February 17, 2014 at 10:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: There you go, again, bursting my hope bubble. :) Someone's gotta do it, I guess.

The Benton/Roach letter is in hiding. I don't know if the C has a copy or not, but it will be an APIL blog subject, I suspect, if they do. Its purpose was to "expose" Ann Rivers' "poor" voting record on a few bills, the most prominent being her yes vote on our version of the Dream Act, against demands of the the dreaded MCCaucus. That's my best guess. Benton and Cockroach are only self-destructing and it is soooooo much fun to watch. We'll see the letter sometime.

Ray Spenser's smart Chicago attorney is calling CC out for what it is: a backwoods borough that interprets the law in ways that will continue to harm our bottom line: to the tune of $2700 a day in interest.

Barry Cain's hiring of the former EFSEC leader tells me that Gramor does NOT want to back out of the project and is putting some money and effort into fighting Tesoro/Savage and the Port. This expert advised Vancouver to take a stand now. Interesting development.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 7:25 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Correction: Rivers voted NO on SB 6523, the Dream Act clone. 10 No; 35 Yes. 4 Excused. Benton and Roach were two of the four excused. Sorry, Ann.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 7:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou: "Benton and Cockroach are only self-destructing and it is soooooo much fun to watch. We'll see the letter sometime."

How do you really feel?

Wondering if you got to schmooze with editor Lou when you picked up your latest DDSS mugs and attained any insight about the floating Lew Landers mailing, but it doesn't sound like it. Obviously I've decided to obsess with this for a time.


I'd find it difficult to enjoy drinking my coffee from one of the new cups, given the illustrations and all.

It would always taste weak.

nailingit — February 18, 2014 at 8:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal

There is a cult of self victimization in today's conservative movement, the likes I've never seen before.

nailingit — February 18, 2014 at 8:30 a.m. ( | suggest removal

(Some republicans just don't feel..."special" enough.)

[But the upset conservatives said Wednesday the problems go beyond standard caucus infighting.

“I’m serving under the worst majority leader in 20 years,” said Benton, calling Tom “extremely manipulative.”

Roach said caucus leaders treat some members poorly while others are “elevated to special status.”

Several leaders and allies refuted those criticisms.

About Benton’s remark, Tom said, “We each have our moments.”

“I think even the Bentons of the world understand we’ve done amazing things for the state of Washington,” he said.

Sen. Doug Ericksen, a Ferndale Republican regarded as quite conservative, called Tom “the best majority leader I’ve ever had.”]

nailingit — February 18, 2014 at 8:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Who said I planned to drink coffee or any beverage from my new DDSS mug? The new graphic sold me, for sure, and I think it will hold SOMETHING (flowers, pencils, etc) and enjoy a place of prominence SOMEWHERE (desk, book shelf, etc) so it can remind me to stay vigilant about local government shenanigans. For those who claim the C is biased, the new graphic shows Lou B, distracted by his note writing, getting ready to join David Madore off that cliff, too.

Hey, here's a cure for your obsession: simply email Stephanie Rice or Tyler Graf directly and ask her if the C has a copy of THE email and, if so, what they plan to do with it. One or both will get back to you. And then you will know that there will be an endgame to this.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 9:01 a.m. ( | suggest removal

No, I did not get to schmooze with the editor yesterday, but did so before a BOCC hearing a couple of months ago.

I know Tyler Graf is a male human. Should have used "them" rather than "her" obviously. Would love to be able to edit my posts, as Crosscut allows.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 9:05 a.m. ( | suggest removal

"nailingit: Who said I planned to drink coffee or any beverage from my new DDSS mug?"

manthou- It being a coffee mug and all I just assumed...but you're right, the possibilities are endless.

I could keep one in my garage, and utilize it in a way so I wouldn't have to make trips into the house when spending time there. :))

nailingit — February 18, 2014 at 9:20 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou- Not too long ago you asked the forum about places to settle in our fine State. I thought you might find this interesting.

-12 Great Retirement Locations In The Pacific Northwest-

nailingit — February 18, 2014 at 9:50 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Thanks for the newest list. Interesting that I had already narrowed it to some of the suggestions: Bellingham (for the left-leaning culture, university, and waterfront), Poulsbo (for the waterfront and cute downtown); and Tacoma (for the historic homes, waterfront, arts). Vancouver made the HuffPo list, but, until we know what the Tesoro plans are and the fate of the CRC and waterfront development, it doesn't make my short list. Not that it is mourning my loyalty loss….I think its county government, as it stands now, is among the most worst in the state.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 10:33 a.m. ( | suggest removal

The State of the County address on March 6: hope the Columbian reporters bring their truth-o-meter with them. I predict it will be going off like a siren. The address, given by Mielke (will anyone be able to understand him?) will be given at none other than a square dance center. Hee Haw! How appropriate. Hope they wear their overalls and hip waders…….

What prompted this vitriol? Just watched the Commissioner Comments from the BOCC today. Truly stunning BS. God love 'em. Ya' can't make this stuff up. Stuart was absent.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 12:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Stephanie Rice did a fantastic job of answering questions people have posed to her about the Spencer settlement. Since Krause was the lead detective on many, many other child sex abuse cases, the county could be on the hook for even more.


She also lists a detailed account of the expenses incurred in the defense of these two retired employees.

Worth a read, folks. Really good.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 1:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Speaking of vitriol... stunning comments by readers on this AP article, both about the President, and about gays.

jacjak — February 18, 2014 at 3:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Three Clark County businesses have been added to a list of retailers in six states that received meat products from Rancho Feeding Corp. of Petaluma, Calif., that have been recalled for being from "diseased and unsound animals."

Those retailers are Butcher Boys, 4710 E. Fourth Plain Blvd., in Vancouver; the Shell station at 16320 S.E. Cascade Park Drive in Vancouver; and the Brush Prairie General Store, 15320 N.E. Caples Road, in Brush Prairie. Managers and owners at the three outlets said they received and sold small quantities of meat from Rancho last year.

Because when I'm out looking for beef lips and tongue, I ALWAYS go to the Shell Station, don't you?

Hawkman — February 18, 2014 at 3:33 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak — February 18, 2014 at 3:08 p.m.

No kidding. But- I have seen worse spoken by lots of folks these days. Just take a look at all the laws the rightwingers want to pass in regards to gay marriage. That's what they spend their time on these days. Consumed by this topic. Cramming or trying to cram their own brand of religion down our throats.
And the way they changed Obama's words and interpret them, is disgusting.
And from our beloved and most famous baggy dude from Texas:

I am starting to really think that one needs to explore what's really ailing these folks. Could it be...?

Don't the southern states (and some of the midwest also) have better things to be concerned about?

luvithere — February 18, 2014 at 3:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit: Looks like Lew Landers and Boss Benton have kissed and made up. Smaaaaack. I can't keep up with those cute little lovebirds.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 5:36 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 5:36 p.m.

Now, I frequently support Lew when our hard core Lefties attack him, but this time he's full of crap. His latest column says "...but little has been said about another Portland envy dream of city leaders and developers, a Waterfront Project...." I sort of recall someone has been carrying on about that project and it's tie to light rail for the past 2-3 years. How the only City Council money making schemes that's panned out was Esther Short Park. How the City has grown east. How the best use of the site of the Waterfront project would be to plow it under and turn it over to the Port for expansion.

roger — February 18, 2014 at 7:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Oh - I think the reason Benton is back in Lew's good graces is due to his bill blocking the exercise of eminent domain to turn over property to an agency of another state. If you read the articles in this paper, you'll see a few people commenting that - shocking as it seems to them - they actually agree with Benton this time. It passed out of the Senate today (had to read this in The Oregonian), so our 49th District legislators are going to have to come up with a convincing explanation for shooting this bill down. I'm thinking they'll have some problems selling this.

roger — February 18, 2014 at 8 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: I think I remember reading that Benton's bill passed, but along party lines 25-23 or something like that. This means nearly half of the Senate, the Dems, did not like it.

I would like to hear what the arguments were against it. Have you heard or read any? I know Jeff Hamm testified against it, as did Annette Cleveland.

Could be a partisan thing only. Some people don't want to give anything to Benton, just because, well, he's Benton. I don't think that's good governance, but it's happening all over.

Jim Moeller has sworn to defeat this in the House. Again, if any of us here read the reasons for the opposition, please point me in the direction.

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 8:21 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"nailingit: Looks like Lew Landers and Boss Benton have kissed and made up. Smaaaaack. I can't keep up with those cute little lovebirds."

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 5:36 p.m.

(assuming you're referencing Landers latest posts) Fluff pieces, amongst other silliness, extolling the virtues of Don Benton. You have to love that one. And of course some token props for Rivers. I wonder if this sucking up is a two way street. I think a certain someone fell from grace and is trying to do good deeds and retrieve salvation.

Maybe I'm missing something, but where do you find this love being reciprocated? Lew will suck up to the powers that be, they bring relevancy and meaning to his world. Without them he's lost.

I noticed he's trying to get back on track writing about the evils of C-TRAN and light rail. Like a rehabbing pitcher exercising his arm. I expect a Benghazi story is in the making.

Let's see what the future holds for this struggling conservative blogger. Will his reputation ever be restored? One might ask what the hell that reputation was and if it should be restored, but that's another chapter.

So many questions to be answered in this ongoing conservative saga.

Like sands through the hourglass...

nailingit — February 18, 2014 at 10:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — February 18, 2014 at 3:56 p.m.

Their message hasn't changed since the Swaggart-Fallwell days. We're dealing with the fallout from the Moral Majority movement, to include it's sons and daughters. Absolutists who measure their faith by how contrary they can be to others.

Society is not only changing, but leaning secular. It drives them insane.

nailingit — February 18, 2014 at 10:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 18, 2014 at 8:21 p.m.,

I suppose you'd find the reason for opposition on one of their facebook pages. Sen Cleveland tried to introduce a rider to the bill, saying it doesn't apply to transportation projects. I read somewhere that she said there are quite a few (seven?) that would be affected by this bill.

roger — February 19, 2014 at 5:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: I checked Moeller's and only got the I'm gonna kill it threat. I will look at Cleveland and Wylie, too.
Community discussion on Saturday, March 1, from 9:30 to 11:30 am. about the Tesoro/Savage issue at the Kiggins Theatre. Might be worth attending. I see Pridemore is coming out of the shadows to moderate this:

Proposed Oil Terminal, Port of Vancouver
What will it mean for our area? Learn more . . .

Craig Pridemore, former 49th District State Senator

Royce Pollard (Former Vancouver Mayor), Barry Cain (Waterfront Development), Cager Clabaugh (ILWU Local 4), Loren Goldberg (Columbia Riverkeeper), David Seabrook (Firefighter)

Port of Vancouver, Tesoro/Savage

manthou — February 19, 2014 at 5:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Saturday is also the day of the 17th LD's update (Stonier and Harris, anyhow), to be moderated by Kelly Parker. I think that's in the early afternoon, but I'm curious if the timing is coincidental?

This Tesoro meeting appears - shall we say a bit on the bogus side? It hasn't been noted in The Columbian. Perhaps on some downtown facebook page?

If there was to be a real discussion of the pros and cons, then it would have been coordinated with the Port and Tesoro/Savage before being scheduled. I'm thinking the organizers would rather they weren't there, nor Aldritt and whoever else supports the project.

This is going to turn out quite similar to the CRC. The people leaving that gathering are going to claim they speak for the area.

roger — February 19, 2014 at 6:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

roger: It does appear to be organized by one side. The invitation to Tesoro/Savage and the Port is a gesture of balance. I want to hear Barry Cain and I want the opportunity to ask him some questions, so we, my long suffering spouse and I, are going. And yes, I think the Waterfront project will replace the CRC as a demon.
Hey, I have another gripe about my 49th LD House leader. Tell me if I am off-base or hyper-sensitive or unrealistic or……….

Jim Moeller RTd (that's re-tweeted) a Tweet by Dominic Holden yesterday. Dom is a news editor at The Stranger, Seattle's popular alt-weekly. Dom was being cute, as he often is (I rather enjoy his humor), and tweeted some very foul language, claiming no one re-tweets offensive language.

Well, he got 20 re-tweets and Jim Moeller was one of them.

I am no prude. I read The Stranger. I am never offended by the language there or concepts or photos because that is the package it sells. If people are offended, well, they can go read Couve dot com, where information is presented in a pretty rosy, sanitized package.

Back to Moeller's decision to be cute like Dom and re-tweet the profanity.

I don't think sitting legislators should do that. Why did he? Is he so sure of his position and re-election that he does not care that he might offend SOME of his constituents?

The language does not offend me. His poor judgment does. His silence and/or absence during Freeholder meetings offends me. And I am a voter who has always supported him, enthusiastically.

manthou — February 19, 2014 at 7 a.m. ( | suggest removal

-Kansas Bill Would Allow Spanking Children To Point Of Bruising-

TOPEKA, Kan. (AP) — A Kansas lawmaker is proposing a bill that would allow teachers, caregivers and parents to spank children hard enough to leave marks.

Current Kansas law allows spanking that doesn't leave marks. Rep. Gail Finney, a Democrat from Wichita, says he wants to allow up to 10 strikes of the hand and that could leave redness and bruising. The bill also would allow parents to give permission to others to spank their children.

It would continue to ban hitting a child with fists, in the head or body, or with a belt or switch.

This just in---a republican amendment to the bill-HR BeatDown-allows for the use of horse whips-brass knuckles-and boiling water on the child's birthday---In related news-Kansas lawmakers introduce legislation allowing yet to be born fetus's to run for president and the public stoning of those who espouse gay marriage---

nailingit — February 19, 2014 at 9:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal

When I was in school they hit us with boards. Some hit harder than others.

Drift — February 19, 2014 at 10:19 a.m. ( | suggest removal


Butcher Boys didn't receive any of the tainted beef from the California company. What they did receive was a couple hundred pounds of Veal which wasn't on the recall. They received the Veal through a distributor and does not get any beef from this particular company. They were listed because they received meat from this company but not the specific type recalled. Just another Government swipe at an innocent company which may or may not affect their business. Not sure about the store over in PEE TOWN, Gartners....

Your Railing against the R party just continues.. That and others here who continue to spew the Left wing diatribe makes this basement a tough read at time. It seems you spend more time looking up this stuff than working.. Like I've said so many times but you have never answered..

"do you think Obama has done a good job as our President???
A couple snipets of his current record
50 million now on food stamps
Record number of people on some for of Public assistance
Record number of people not looking for work
Record number of people unemployed
Where is the Job creation he came into office in 09, Shovel ready
Obamacare is hurting the majority of Americans in the Pocket. It is not sustainable
17 Trillion in debt
A president who waves his arms and has made 28 changes to Obamacare that suppoesdly congress needed to vote on, but he is Obama...
Billions in Green power wasted tax payer money. BILLIONS...
He then goes to California to view the drought stricken areas then plays golf at a country club with unlimited water rights...
The guy says one thing and does whatever he wants...
This is your president....
Just sayin LAMO DUCK

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2014 at 10:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2014 at 10:56 a.m.

I only reported what I read, AND I documented it. Where is your proof?

Also, I know nail won't answer you because you are just copy and pasting some crap you heard from an unreliable source (or you would have revealed your source), but I'll say this. This President has NOT started any wars for his Father, he didn't let the country go bankrupt after a certain President put us on that path, he got people ON healthcare that couldn't get it before and IF he had a House that would actually work WITH him rather than against him, think of all the things they could accomplish together.

By the way, that's all I'm going to say on the subject so you can reply or not, I don't care.

Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 2:17 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Like I've said so many times but you have never answered..

"do you think Obama has done a good job as our President???

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2014 at 10:56 a.m.

Yes & No.

nailingit — February 19, 2014 at 2:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift — February 19, 2014 at 10:19 a.m.

Same on this 'end'. The board of education impacted my life many a time.

Most times it was a choice between a number of swats or suspension. Sometimes both. I always tried to keep matters in house as much as possible.

nailingit — February 19, 2014 at 2:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou @ 5:42 a.m. & roger @ 6:36 a.m.

The 17th LD Town Hall is 1pm - 2:30. Enough time to get from Kiggins Theatre to Wy'east Middle School and even grab a bit of lunch.

I'm pleasantly impressed and encouraged with this 'across the isle' Town Hall by our reps. Been awhile since I've seen that...

jacjak — February 19, 2014 at 3:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak: Looks like we're going to have a busy March 1 Saturday. Good to stay involved and come with questions. :)

I am going to Hello, Vancouver! tonight at the Kiggins. 1200 people have said they are coming. Yikes.

manthou — February 19, 2014 at 3:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit @ 9:39 a. m.

Leaving bruises on a kid, no matter who does it, or with given consent or not, is an excellent way of making baggage for dragging around, and can make for some really bumpy relationships throughout life. Kansas should tremble and shudder that this can even be considered in this age, no less be considered as a potentional law. Talk about the ultimate in mixed signals... 'stop hitting or I'll hit you'.... Hopefully, those of sound mind will not allow this bill to leave committee. And, as I am not a complete bleeding-heart, I propose 10 women of Gail Finney's comparative size and weight take her behind the woodshed and give her 10 adult size hits with their hand, one right after the other. Just a bit of help for her research into pain, brusing, and for better adult comprehension toward a small child's body and trusting mind. Did a bit more reading, and she's doing one giant-sized moonwalk back on this... it's just a bill to 'clarify' what is already legal, etc. etc...

Nuff said. It's 5 0'clock somewhere....

jacjak — February 19, 2014 at 3:45 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Stephanie Rice: Awesome factoids about Ms. Zellner today! So glad there are attorneys like her to take these difficult cases. I agree that Clark County is in trouble facing this skilled councilor.

BTW, I think her fees are reasonable, given her track record. There are attorneys in NYC that charge between $750 and $1250 per hour. :)

manthou — February 19, 2014 at 4:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

FYI --- food post.

Had lunch today at fairly new downtown pub. New to me, anyway. South Pacific Restaurant & Bar on 11th and Washington. We will be going back! A Jagermeister mushroom sauce seals our commitment to be repeat diners for sure, and the Chipotle Fondue is excellent. Even having just finished lunch we were reading the menu and planning our next visit. They're original location is in Battle Ground. So great to see local business expanding. We already have a plethora of forgettable chain foods, so really like seeing the local food scene continuing to expand in such a noteworthy way.

jacjak — February 19, 2014 at 4:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal


The owner was interviewed yesterday and spoke about the Recall. As far as cut and pasted man.. If you don't know this BS by now you've lived in a cave....Dude wise up not Wise A$$....Typical Liberal BS, you "ALL" just yell louder to be heard. Kinda like the 1% marchers back in the day.. Where are they now.. They quit after coverage stopped covering their nonsense.. LMAO...
HE " you probably mean Obama got people on healthcare who weren't on before.. That's another myth... 60% were signed up on the Free plan they already qualified and of the 3million who had there healthcare cancelled only 350K -400K have signed back up. Those can afford the new rates while the others are still shopping or will not purchase do to the higher cost.. Like I've said before I have an office partner like many Liberals, they believe something because someone says so but not based on actual facts or actual events. I deal with this daily....We quote 10 family's and sell a couple or provide what there qualified through the exchange at no or little cost to them ....

NAIL- Heck NO!!! Pretty clear he has lied, Misled the American voters and let down the black people in the US... They don't want speeches anymore they are demanding action.. He says he doesn't know anything and he is right.. Sgt Schultz Ver is Hogan.. Keeps his head in the sand and blames others... Sebelius even blaming Bush for some of the healthcare website wows.. Really

And Nail do You.. You seem pretty Smart. Uh hum so what you say...Has he lied to the American people, has he misled led the American people???? You know he is now the 5th best President of all time according to a Quinipac survey...

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2014 at 4:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjac try the garage on 4th plain. It is a block west of Kauffman. Very good ruben. Nice clean and bright place. Service was a little slow but was tolerable.

timerick — February 19, 2014 at 4:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2014 at 4:26 p.m.

Good to know that you can still get a job in insurance with a junior high education.

Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 6:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I see Steakburger is really going away. The developer must be a friend of Madore since he is boasting about how much money he saved with the fee waivers. A million dollars!!!! That's coming out of OUR pockets. Feel the burn, friends and neighbors.

Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 6:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Sorry --- here

Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 7 p.m. ( | suggest removal


OK - I finally got smart and went to Pridemore's facebook page, and there discovered the link to Community Discussion About Oil Terminal. Does your friend Linda McLain intend to advertise this in The Columbian? Or will this be the only advertisement?

She's got it listed as Public (anyone can see and join), but that list of invitees already exceeds the capacity of the Kiggins Theater. And I notice that, though advertised as a community discussion, her list of invitees is almost entirely local Democrats and environmental activists from around the region.

I really don't see a lot of room for learning - the event is clearly geared to drumming up opposition to the project.

roger — February 19, 2014 at 7:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Remember the short lived effort by those rabid Leftists to recall Madore. The one that fizzled before it got started? Funny really. Well, I see that they still have their Facebook page “Recall David Madore”. Here’s an entry from November 5, 2013:

“All Vancouver City Council candidates that Madore endorsed lost today.

You rock, Vancouver.

Further proof we hate you Madore.”

I see that 33 people “liked this”. Well at least they’re not trying to cover up their hate. Not this time anyway. Something a little unusual for Leftists who like to call others mean spirited. Just when are all you psychoanalysts out there going to start psychoanalyzing your own?


Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 6:50 p.m.

You’re making an assumption that the project would have gone ahead even if they had to spend an extra $mil. Here’s what he said “He credited the county's 100 percent waiver of traffic impact and permitting fees for making the project pencil out.” You will note “pencil out”.

kn_dalai — February 19, 2014 at 7:28 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jacjak: Looks like we're going to have a busy March 1 Saturday. Good to stay involved and come with questions. :)
manthou — February 19, 2014 at 3:42 p.m.

The 17th LD Town Hall is 1pm - 2:30. Enough time to get from Kiggins Theatre to Wy'east Middle School and even grab a bit of lunch.
jacjak — February 19, 2014 at 3:05 p.m.

Just to be clear on dates, the 17th LD Town Hall I was referring to is Feb. 22nd, and the Tesoro/Savage community discussion is March 1st, according to manthou's post at 5:42 a. m. Sorry about any confusion.

jacjak — February 19, 2014 at 7:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — February 19, 2014 at 7:28 p.m.

Maybe you could read the entire article. You know the part about Fred Meyer?

"Merrill said Fred Meyer's decision to develop its fueling stations was not influenced by the county's fee waivers, although the measure creates a substantial savings -- about $500,000 for each station in Hazel Dell and Salmon Creek -- for the company as the projects move forward.

That's not surprising, said Marty Snell, director of Clark County's Community Development Department. He sees the resolution as one that helps smaller projects with fees that can range from $25,000 to $300,000.

But it's different for corporations, such as Fred Meyer, Snell said. "They have the budgets for these kinds of fees," he said."

And yes, I believe the project would have happened regardless. This has been in the works for years.

Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 8:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"And Nail do You.. You seem pretty Smart. Uh hum so what you say...Has he lied to the American people, has he misled led the American people???? You know he is now the 5th best President of all time according to a Quinipac survey..."

vanwadreamer — February 19, 2014 at 4:26 p.m.

Name a President who hasn't lied and misled the, "American people". So grading on the curve...

Thanks for the Quinipac survey info. Not bad, especially when compared to what's-his-guts.

Who do like in 16' vanwa? Bobbi J? Cruz? Rubio? Walker? Christie? Huckerbee? Paul? Ryan? Santorum? Gingrich? Palin?

The right has a great selection to choose from. Some real movers & shakers. Folks with messages that resonate so well with the "American people".

It'll be the same GOP gene pool in 2016 as it was in 2012...and 2008.

All espousing policies of 2000-2008.

Who says you can't travel back in time?

Or refuse to learn from your mistakes.

nailingit — February 19, 2014 at 8:51 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"Maybe you could read the entire article. You know the part about Fred Meyer?" -- Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 8:05 p.m.

I suggest you take your own advice.

I’ll disagree with you, but also split the difference: there are three separate projects going on here.

“The work will be part of several projects that make up a two-block makeover to construct four new commercial buildings, rebuild the McDonald's restaurant, add a new Dutch Bros. Coffee kiosk and replace a building with a Fred Meyer fueling station.”

1) Fred Meyer’s plan for closing the Salvation Army building.

2) MAJ’s plan to demolish the old Steakburger and put in $5 million worth of new buildings.

3) McDonald’s buying a small part of the old Steakburger property from MAJ, for their own new future building.

So MAJ will put in $5 million plus the cost of the property. I can guarantee you that developers DO pencil things out, and an extra $1 million for a project of this smaller scale is a LOT. I take Jenkins at his word that the fee waiver is the reason that MAJ can go ahead with this. But I will note your point about Fred Meyer saying that for their part, which is separate and apart from the Steakburger property, that was not a factor.

Now here's what I'm wondering about:

“The county's three-member board of commissioners did away with the fees in 2010 as a post-recession emergency measure and have approved an extension every year since then. On Jan. 7, they voted 3-0 to do so for another year.”

I’d been thinking that it was the Madore faction that did away with these fees last year. Now where did I get this idea from? So is the reporter wrong about this, or is this actually something that happened pre-Madore? 3-0 vote last time would mean that Stuart also voted with Madore and Mielke.

kn_dalai — February 19, 2014 at 9:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Well let's see here, this is the quote

"The county's three-member board of commissioners did away with the fees in 2010 as a post-recession emergency measure and have approved an extension every year since then. On Jan. 7, they voted 3-0 to do so for another year."

Let's pick this apart, shall we? Part one---"The county's three-member board of commissioners did away with the fees in 2010 as a post-recession emergency measure and have approved an extension every year since then. "

That doesn't mean that it was a 3-0 vote. As I recall, it was a 2-1 vote.

Part 2 -- " On Jan. 7, they voted 3-0 to do so for another year." What difference would it make if Stuart voted no?

I'm guessing that either you don't live in Clark County or don't care that our roads are going to turn to crap and we won't have enough Deputies to protect us.

Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 10:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 19, 2014 at 10:02 p.m.

Not really sure what your point is there Hawkman. Among other things, you seem to be saying that Stuart voted in favor of dispensing with the development fees because he decided that his vote wouldn’t matter so he voted “aye”. Say what?

This matter of who did what and when, deserves some looking into, which I haven’t done. Neither have you, but something here isn’t right, and you’re obviously pulling the party line by laughingly trying to distance Stuart from whatever vote he may have taken, without actually knowing yourself. OK. Got it. As I've said before - I really do like to laugh.

Just what do you think of the county’s addition of 4 new HR employees, when other departments were downsizing? One might wonder why the county HR department needs more staff when the rest of the departments staff are dwindling.

kn_dalai — February 19, 2014 at 10:31 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hello, Vancouver! was fun last night. Packed house full of local politicos and community leaders. Good entertainment and information. Well-organized. Beer and wine at your seat. What's not to like?

Carolyn Crain showed up, bless her heart, because these downtown "mafia" folks, as her supporters like to whine, are the ones she needs to sweet-talk votes from. She stayed to the end, smiling, even through Temple's brutal-but-apt Don Benton joke.

High Five Media did a great job of putting this community party together. It showcased not only Vancouver and its talented residents, but the professional skills of Temple Lentz, Noland Hoshino, Jim Mains and Brian Dainty. They are going places.

Next production is scheduled for April 23. Video clips of last night are available at

manthou — February 20, 2014 at 6:42 a.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — February 19, 2014 at 10:31 p.m

I have no idea why they need 4 more employees. Maybe they are expecting to lose three of them from having to deal with Madore and they only needed one to begin with. Maybe they needed more people to handle internal complaints, who knows. I'm sure David will get to the bottom of it (or what he perceives to be the bottom) and straighten it all out. Of course, then we will need more HR people because he will harass the crap out of anyone he has to deal with and they will quit, but hey, I'm sure he can find people that are "qualified", maybe someone in animal control can take the job.

Hawkman — February 20, 2014 at 6:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman, nailingit: I can always tell when the web view counter goes back to zero for some of our frugal posters who don't subscribe.

Troll alert: they thrive on baiting others, but you both excel at handling them. Kudos. My style is to starve them.

manthou — February 20, 2014 at 7:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Will someone please bring kn_d up to speed with a current Face Book post criticizing Madore? Preferably with "leftists" doing the criticizing. The more hateful the better. kn_d shouldn't have to depend on a 3 1/2 month old posting to make non-sensical statements underlining his subjective approach to life.

A subject of this importance is deserving of an up-to-date Face Book post with a fresh set of 'likes' to accompany it.

Wait a minute. What was the subject anyway?

manthou — February 20, 2014 at 7:28 a.m.

I feed stray dogs also. At least they have a leg to stand on. :)

nailingit — February 20, 2014 at 7:41 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Yesterday vanwa was kind enough to point out a Quinnipac Poll revealing President Obama to be among the fifth "best" president in United States history. (thank you vanwa)

I thought this Quinnipac poll was interesting also. I know it's early for this national election stuff, but I wanted to highlight a rare and lucid Rand Paul moment when he recently said, “I think Republicans will not win again in my lifetime...unless they become a new GOP, a new Republican Party,”

-Poll: Hillary Clinton sweeps GOP in Ohio-

Hillary Clinton buries Gov. Chris Christie and other potential Republican presidential candidates in the crucial swing state of Ohio, according to a new poll on Thursday.

The former secretary of state, who led Christie 42 percent to 41 percent in November, now tops the New Jersey governor 49 percent to 36 percent, according to a Quinnipiac University poll.

Of those polled, 55 percent said Clinton would make a good president, while 39 said she would not. Only 31 percent of voters said Christie would make a good president, plummeting from 44 percent in November.

Not only are Clinton’s numbers against Christie skyrocketing, but she bests the rest of the potential GOP field. She takes the biggest lead over Sen. Ted Cruz, 51 percent to 34 percent, and wins out over Rep. Paul Ryan 49 percent to 40 percent.
She leads Sen. Marco Rubio by 50 percent to 36 percent and Sen. Rand Paul 51 percent to 28 percent.

Quinnipiac University surveyed 1,370 registered voters from Feb. 12-17 with a margin of error of plus or minus 2.7 percentage points.

Read more:

nailingit — February 20, 2014 at 8:25 a.m. ( | suggest removal

The bitterness of you people is palpable. Sort of child like:):) Proudly hypocritical:):)

kn_dalai — February 20, 2014 at 9:06 a.m. ( | suggest removal

-Legal Pot To Generate $190 -Million For Washington: Report-

OLYMPIA, Wash. (AP) — Washington's new legal recreational marijuana market is expected to bring nearly $190 million to state coffers over a four-year period starting in mid-2015, according to an economic forecast released Wednesday.

The forecast by the Economic and Revenue Forecast Council showed that $51 million in revenue is expected for the 2015-2017 biennium from marijuana production and sales. An additional $138.5 million is expected for the next two-year budget that ends mid-2019. A little under half of that revenue is expected from excise tax and license fees related to the marijuana market, and the rest is expected to come from retail sales tax and business taxes.

Read More @

nailingit — February 20, 2014 at 9:45 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Here it is around 10:15 and not a single comment. Instead, comments are being posted on the reining back on cultivation by the WSLCB.

I got a return letter from Annette Cleveland this morning. She was responding to this:

Yeah, it was a form letter. This particular sentence tells me the Good Senator is under some sort of misconception: "The federal government, through U.S. Attorney Jenny Durkan, has been unequivocal about the necessity of combining the medical an recreational markets."

I must have missed the memo. My understanding is Jenny simply said Washington's medical marijuana system was not tenable.

Yeah, I'll drop Senator Cleveland an email asking if she can show me where Jenny says -anything- about "combining."

Drift — February 20, 2014 at 10:29 a.m. ( | suggest removal

On that revenue forecast, nail, there's some pie in the sky going on there. I've no idea what the retail market might bring in for the state, but there's some spending that isn't accounted for in all of that money counting.

The legislature appears to be so enamored with your figures they are willing to have the sick and disabled jailed for activities many of us are employing to treat our maladies. To explain: A section of the bills (related to medicinal cannabis) currently working their way through the legislature would make physician requirements so onerous an individual relying on the V.A. for health care would be hosed.

That's item I. There are several.

So, law enforcement will be out rounding up a bunch of invalids, toting them off to jail, paying for their medical care... You know, those who -after years of taking care of their own needs - decided to just roll the dice and hope for the best, under the new law.

Oh, but wait! It's the municipalities that will bear the brunt of that cost, huh?

Silly me. Carry on.

Drift — February 20, 2014 at 1:06 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"Hillary Clinton buries Gov. Chris Christie and other potential Republican presidential candidates...."
nailingit — February 20, 2014 at 8:25 a.m.

Other potential Republican presidential candidates do seem to spend an inordinate amount of press time denying. Must be going around...

jacjak — February 20, 2014 at 1:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm bummed.

The punch line to the joke was such a let down. I mean, with all of the build up I was anticipating a big Finnish.

(see jacjac @1:32)

Drift — February 20, 2014 at 2:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"The legislature appears to be so enamored with your figures they are willing to have the sick and disabled jailed for activities many of us are employing to treat our maladies."

Drift — February 20, 2014 at 1:06 p.m.

But..but..they're not My figures. And golly gee whiz, I thought the projected revenue sounded good for education, health needs, stuff like that.

I hope I'm not responsible for incarcerating disabled was just an (AP) tidbit...nothin' meant by it...

Thanks for bringing this aspect out. Although understand why this (AP) piece in Huffpo's Business Section didn't address your talking points.

We need to let our lawmakers know how we feel about these issues for sure.

Elections certainly do have consequences.

Aye-Aye Captain

nailingit — February 20, 2014 at 3:11 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger, I thought of you when I found this, reason being that you used to call her the Chihuahua or the barking Chihuahua. Something like that. She was on the Columbian Facebook comments for a while and then gone all of a sudden. Her FB page was also deleted. As she appeared to be very attractive and was opinionated, I thought maybe someone started harassing her for one thing or the other. Maybe not.

kn_dalai — February 20, 2014 at 5:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn, I do remember that poster. Was a complete rw fanatic. I remember one pst on the C for some reason very clearly: that everybody associated with Occupy WS had fleas, never worked, and needed to be hosed down. It went downhill from there. Very abrasive, very rude to those who disagreed. Probably got booted for that.
If that is really John Russell, then wow. I believe he left the Washougal City Council and went to DC for some non-profit anti-abortion outfit. Maybe he came back?

luvithere — February 20, 2014 at 6:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

And another one says No.

Sen. Bruce Starr, R-Hillsboro, a key supporter of an effort to revive the Columbia River Crossing, issued a statement Thursday saying he won’t support the bridge without the Washington Legislature’s support. Starr’s statement could mark the death of the project.

roger — February 20, 2014 at 6:14 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Oh - The rabid chihuahua. So she might have been a he, huh? Well. my sailor friends talk about having to be careful in port in Thailand - I guess we can have girly boys here too.

I'm pretty clueless as to what the deal was between Jon Russell and Kelly, Lew and friends. But there definitely appears to have been some animosity.

roger — February 20, 2014 at 6:27 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Yes, I do not know either. Got no scoop on that, Roger. But politically they were very much aligned, so who knows. Just glad Russell left the area. They are welcome to him over there.

luvithere — February 20, 2014 at 6:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Well luvithere, she may have been a rw fanatic in your book, but I was quite enamored with her. It did strike me as strange that she seemed to have a better grasp of political stuff, than I would have expected for someone of her seemingly young age. You may want to take a look at that Clark County Politics blog. The author of that site has a “Jon Russell” watch. He’s really got it in for Russell, who is now apparently living in Virginia and trying to get elected to office back there. Interestingly, Mike Briggs has made a comment on that about Jon Russell. Interesting because that website also has it in for Briggs and has a “Mike Briggs” watch, which also thoroughly trashes Briggs. I take no offense in that, as I also think so little of Briggs, but I can see how Lefties wouldn’t like the characterization of Briggs. So be carefull luvithere, and don’t lose that famous German temper of yours if you decide to take a peek:)

kn_dalai — February 20, 2014 at 6:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift — February 20, 2014 at 10:29 a.m.

I've been saying all along - This legal marijuana plan is all predicated on jacking up the cost as high as possible to maximize the tax income. That cutting back on the number of grow farms is because they'd have created too much supply, and forced the cost to have to drop. The more weed available legally, the greater the cover for the illegal market.

I'm not buying into the banning of the collectives. Isn't that where a person holds a grower's card, and has a group of registered card holders he grows for? That would be for people like me, who tend to kill any plant they try to grow.

roger — February 20, 2014 at 6:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Nails, check it out.

Looks as if the jail stint addled his remaining brain cells.

luvithere — February 20, 2014 at 6:46 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn, I did take a look at the link you provided. That's where I got the "she might be Russell" from.
I got no idea why they are so set against him. Briggs I get but not Russell. Must be a personal thing. Maybe with both of them.
As for "her" political grasp...she had none. All she did was spout angry diatribes. maybe you just liked her face. Whoever she/he is.

The German temper is under control, kn. :). Had a good dinner, feeling mellow.

luvithere — February 20, 2014 at 6:59 p.m. ( | suggest removal


Commissioners Tom Mielke and David Madore on Wednesday requested that Chris Horne, the county's chief civil deputy prosecutor, investigate what revisions could be made to the county's workplace violence policy to allow employees to carry concealed firearms. Commissioner Steve Stuart was absent from the meeting.

The county's current policy prohibits employees from bringing concealed firearms at work, even if they have a permit to do so. Other people, including elected officials and the public, are exempt from the policy and may bring weapons into some county buildings.

Hawkman — February 20, 2014 at 7:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman: I suggest listening to every Wednesday Board Time audio, if you can stand it. I started to write my long list of Madorisms and Mielke malaprops, but decided you all had had enough or maybe don't care. :)

The gun thing was one issue. Then he argued about a land use legal problem with Chris Horne at length (you could hear Horne's voice rising in frustration).

But what really got me was how much Anna Miller, Madore's personal paid "assistant," inserted herself into this governing process so much, with Stuart's absence, yesterday. She was making suggestions and telling the boyz how to solve a constituent complaint to her, Anna's satisfaction. No one reminded her that she wasn't elected by anyone. Just appointed, as Madore prefers. Clarko Bizzaro. Get me outta here.

People on the FB side who don't live in Vancouver are asking for an annexation to distance themselves from Clark County.

God, this M and M team are dangerous together and are running CC into the ground with their idiocy.

And you guys thought you might make it through a day without one of my CC complaints. I am only mildly sorry that I could not restrain myself.

manthou — February 20, 2014 at 8:52 p.m. ( | suggest removal

"People on the FB side who don't live in Vancouver are asking for an annexation to distance themselves from Clark County. " -- manthou — February 20, 2014 at 8:52 p.m.

Just what people are those manthou?


No, I didn't think so.

kn_dalai — February 20, 2014 at 10:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger, collectives operating as the legislature intended are a fine idea. What's happened, though, is some folks have opened store fronts claiming they are within the scope of a "collective." It is this activity that's prompted the Western Washington U.S. Attorney to state medical marijuana is not tenable in this state.

The WSLCB, and apparently the legislature, have decided the way to deal with the issue is by simply gutting the current laws making it near impossible for a person to receive a medicinal cannabis recommendation.

A classic 'baby/bathwater' scenario.

Drift — February 21, 2014 at 7:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Good points in the editorial today. Maybe we shouldn't be throwing any more money into "saving" Vancouver Lake. Let nature take its course.

Lake Oswego has thrown boatloads of money into making that body of water worthy of the expensive homes dotting his mucky, algae-infested rim: it is drained, dredged, and aerated (using special submerged machines) at regular intervals. Still, kids are warned by their parents not to swallow that water and to take a long, soapy shower after swimming in it.
Any bills in the legislature any of you are watchdogging or advocating for or against? Things are happening fast. Do the legislators consider our comments anyway? I go online every so often and use the bill comment feature. Convenient, but I wonder if it is only for show.

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 9:36 a.m. ( | suggest removal

HB 2149 either needs to go away, or go through some serious amending. SB 6178 is merely the lesser of two evils.

Drift — February 21, 2014 at 11:07 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I sent the following via the legislature website, manthou:
Good day, staff.

I mailed a letter (USPS) to your office (1-11-14) voicing my concerns on the WSLCB recommendations to align medicinal and recreational cannabis. This morning (2-20-14) I received a form letter in response. I question a sentence in that letter: "The federal government, through U.S. Attorney Jenny Durkan, has been unequivocal about the necessity of combining the medical and recreational markets."

That must have been sent directly to Legislators, because I'm unable to find such a statement. What I find is the following: "The continued operation and proliferation of unregulated, for-profit entities outside of the state’s regulatory and licensing scheme is not tenable and violates both state and federal law."

There's no mention of "combining."

Could you please clarify this conflicting information? Have you a copy of the U.S. attorney's communiqué speaking of this necessity I might review?

Will I get a response? I'm pretty darned sure a document substantiating the claim about Jenny Durkan can't be produced, but will I get -any- sort of response? I suppose we'll see.

Drift — February 21, 2014 at 11:16 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Looked at the Roll Call vote for HB 2149 and see that it was opposed by most Republicans. Senator Cleveland was a sponsor of SB 6178.

Drift: I know you corresponded with Senator Cleveland and were disappointed in her response, right? Weren't you going to take another attempt from a different angle?

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 11:17 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Looky there, Drift: our posts crossed each other in the ethernet.

Don't give up. I get some good results sometimes by calling. Emphasis on sometimes.

At least you can look at yourself in the mirror and know you tried. Better than unproductive crabbing, which is fun, for sure, but not very effective.

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 11:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

For Several months I have read your comments here on the forum, posted very little seeking insight into how others think on various topics.
Most of you speak of wanting tolerance and how you despise hate, yet when anyone doesn't agree with everything you say you call it intolerance and hate. Explain to me just how that works, that is if you lefties can wrap it around your brain or will you back peddle as usual.

jasonb — February 21, 2014 at 12:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

No, I didn't think so.

kn_dalai — February 20, 2014 at 10:41 p.m.

That would be=====

Betty Sue Morris · Top Commenter · Vancouver, Washington
I'm ready to annex to the City of Vancouver!

Of course, you could look for yourself.

Hawkman — February 21, 2014 at 1:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jasonb — February 21, 2014 at 12:49 p.m.

I think if you've been reading everything written here, you would have noticed that "we" don't usually respond to generalities. If you could be more specific, I'm sure someone will get back to you in due time. Thanks for calling and have a nice day.

Hawkman — February 21, 2014 at 1:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Great to have someone post about the gossipy going ons in our local bagger blogs.

We have our very own Perez Hilton in the house.

nailingit — February 21, 2014 at 1:50 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — February 20, 2014 at 6:46 p.m.

Tom Delay should be sitting in a jail cell somewhere. If his prior felony conviction isn't enough, then his appearance on 'Dancing With The Stars' should be.

nailingit — February 21, 2014 at 2:03 p.m. ( | suggest removal

jasonb I tend to lean to the right most of the time. But I have never had any of my opinions shot down. I also listen to what the rest have to say. Because you believe one way or the other is no reason to ridicule anyone. It is much like religion. Some believe and some don't. Some take it to a extreme. Taking anything to the extreme is never good for anyone.

timerick — February 21, 2014 at 3:20 p.m. ( | suggest removal

You can call me Jonathan……..

Tyler "Swift" Graf has produced his own Modest Proposal: River County! I'm all for it, as long as it gobbles up Madore and Mielke with it.

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 4:07 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 20, 2014 at 8:52 p.m.

kn_dalai is right; there is not any sort of groundswell asking to be annexed - it's Betty Sue Morris and a few people who like whatever she says. And some person Quan, who's just carrying on in general.

And I hope you caught the snotty little comment from Larry Smith, about taking so long. Betty Sue was instrumental in shutting down City Council's last illegal attempt to annex Orchards/Sifton - something old Larry took part in.

roger — February 21, 2014 at 4:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Careful there jasonb. If you keep this up, pretty soon someone is going to call you a troll. Now as you know, jasonb, there’s not much worse that can happen than being labeled as a troll by broad-minded, tolerant extremist Leftists. So take my advice. If you don’t want that to happen to you, you’d better start slamming those Republicans right NOW. And just remember, whatever you do, be sure to let everyone know that you think Madore, Mielke and Benton were expelled from hell to wreak havoc on, and destroy this good Earth.


Hawkman — February 21, 2014 at 1:02 p.m.

Well Hawkman, I can see how you could have misconstrued this, as my statement was ambiguous. But here’s the thing. “No, I didn’t think so” meant I knew manthou wouldn’t respond, ‘cause she says I’m a troll, and doesn’t want to feed the troll. OK then.

A Democrat, who obviously doesn’t like Madore, saying that she wants to be annexed into Vancouver, is hardly noteworthy. Nor does it portend some groundswell of support other than the usual suspects.

kn_dalai — February 21, 2014 at 4:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 4:07 p.m.

From the street boundaries, I'm thinking Mielke would go, but Lord David would stay. I'm still holding out for east of I205 breaking off to form the city of East Vancouver (unless someone has a clever name).

roger — February 21, 2014 at 4:58 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Ok, I am living officially in the county (while paying outrageous property tax courtesy of belonging to Camas for that purpose). I do not like Madore.

But hell if I want to be annexed to the city of Vancouver. I think not. I see no groundswell for that either.

Anybody got their property tax statement lately? Ours went up by nearly 800 bucks. Highest ever. Why? How? what?

Anybody care to explain? I yearn for the cat's rant at this point about the assessor's office.

luvithere — February 21, 2014 at 5:04 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Since some of you seem to appreciate fine dining, I’d like to share this with you.

It’s Big Hoss’s Bar and Grill. The pickled pigs feet are succulent, the world class beer nuts are guaranteed to satisfy even the most demanding of palates, and at 2 for $1, the corn dogs offer an exceptional value. For that after dinner mint, might I suggest a dip of Skoal. As a high class establishment, Big Hoss don’t allow no spittin on the floor, but does provide a empty beer bottle at no charge.

While there’s no roving fiddle player, there are plenty of pull tabs for your entertainment, to maximize your eatin experience. For those more athletically inclined, one might try a game of shuffleboard or perhaps the tried and true, old fashioned darts. Just make sure old drunk Cyrus, doesn’t come wandering through in front of you when you’re tryin to hit that big 50 pointer with a fast throw.

All-in-all, a true culinary and entertainment delight.

kn_dalai — February 21, 2014 at 5:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 21, 2014 at 1:02 p.m.
odd, I do not see Betty's post re annexation.

luvithere — February 21, 2014 at 5:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger @ 4:47 PM: I seem to remember that annexation rift and bad blood between Pollard and Betty Sue. She made a clever inside joke.

East Vancouver as a name works for me. East Chicago. East Gary. That's where all the vice and gambling action was/is/will be. :)

My idea? Just annex downtown/uptown Vancouver to Multnomah County. I'm talking all the area south of 39th to the river, with I-5 being the East border and Fruit Valley Road being the West border. Not a soul outside that area would shed a tear.

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 5:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal

A boundary east of 205 would leave both bridges in old Vancouver. Don’t know how much clout they will have in tolling, but it’s a sure bet they’d like to put a toll on the Glenn Jackson bridge, if they could ever build a new I-5 bridge.

kn_dalai — February 21, 2014 at 5:41 p.m. ( | suggest removal

A wise man once said..

"Let us not seek the Republican answer, or the Democrat answer, but the right answer."

jasonb — February 21, 2014 at 6:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

And about that tolling of the Glenn Jackson Bridge. If you haven't already seen this, then you may want to check out Lew Waters excellent blog site and this video.

kn_dalai — February 21, 2014 at 6:10 p.m. ( | suggest removal

kn_dalai — February 21, 2014 at 4:54 p.m.

Didn't say or see any reference to "groundswell of support". Don't know where you got that.

As for Big Hoss' place, sounds like it fits you to a tee. Enjoy.

Hawkman — February 21, 2014 at 6:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — February 21, 2014 at 5:10 p.m.,

You have to do a chronological sort - that was an early post, and this limited version of facebook only shows so many. It's still there - I just checked.

roger — February 21, 2014 at 7:05 p.m. ( | suggest removal

It just might be dead - finally.

This is the second day in a row The Oregonian mentioned OR Sen Starr (R - Hillsboro) saying he would not support the Oregon alone CRC. He says WA gets on board financially or it's no dice. That means both the leading Dem and Rep are united against it. Also buried in this latest story is that the House committee proposal supporting the resurrection is stuck in the joint Ways and Means committee, with little likelihood of getting a hearing.

I'm not sure there's much Gov Inslee can do, considering the WA Senate won't allow any funding. We'll see - It seems something will have to happen in the next couple of weeks if it's going to hang around longer.

roger — February 21, 2014 at 7:18 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 5:25 p.m. -- "Just annex downtown/uptown Vancouver to Multnomah County."

I thought about that for a few - then decided tim might not like that idea and let it go. And besides - we'd have to pay a lot more to fund the border guards we'd need to keep all the North North Portlanders in their own zone - too many of you'd try to escape once you realized all the taxes being passed over there.

roger — February 21, 2014 at 7:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger @ 7:37 PM: There is a great action/doomsday film in that image you describe: "……border guards we'd need to keep all the North North Portlanders in their own zone--too many of you'd try to escape once you realized all the taxes being passed over there."

So funny…..

Those Oregonian articles don't paint a rosy pic of the CRC. March 7 is rapidly approaching.

Wonder if we will see and hear fireworks in Clark County when Kitz closes the lid on the coffin? Might have the funeral in North North Portland. :)

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 7:42 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Wonder if any of our local governments have a "secret" router to hide emails like Scott Walker?

Hooray for the tenacity of these journalists for uncovering this cache of goodies! Yum!

manthou — February 21, 2014 at 7:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

musings while wondering if i'll ever get to sleep again....

my old home basement just ain't the same no more. thanks, lou >sarcasm off<

imo, the best of the basement's gone now. And no, it's NOT the money. It's the PRINCIPLE. Some of you may wanna google that word. The few who are still left are valiantly fighting on, and for that I salute you; I never know from day to day if I’ll have access again, so each visit is now kinda special to me and I appreciate even more those posters who have stood and fought and paid for the privilege.

looks like the will of the people fought the crc back into its dank hole. Wonder how long it'll be before it's fed enough money to give the payoffs a try again....

madore certainly fell from Target One quickly. Boredom? Lack of material? Or just bad memory....

i'd like to posit questions like, “what do you think the US should do about N Korean mass-murder (think Nazis w/o the good points)?” or, “do you think we owe Ukraine the effort of supporting their struggle to keep from becoming a part of the new Soviet Union?” or how about, “do you think The Great Hillary should be held to her promise to NEVER desert the muslim women who so recently were freed from extremist forces?"

But I kinda doubt i'd get any answers anymore.....


DeeLittle — February 22, 2014 at 5:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Enough with the "stupid stuff" all ready. Heck, I saw those cups and then skipped Lou's column.

Drift — February 22, 2014 at 7:47 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Freeholders meet today again at 9 am.

CVTV Channel 23 live streaming to your computer or TV.

Will Jim Moeller pipe up and participate? I know the legislature is in session, but, don't run for this critical position if you don't have the time or don't want to hurt your re-election campaign because you might say something stupid (apologies to Cap'n Drift).

manthou — February 22, 2014 at 7:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I tried to watch a Freeholder meeting. It was like watching paint dry.

Drift — February 22, 2014 at 8:51 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Drift: I hear ya. Gubment business is like that. Some politicos count on us being bored so they can sneak in all sorts of folly, but I'll volunteer for the watch. For now, anyway.

manthou — February 22, 2014 at 8:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal

There's a "must read" article in The Columbian today - taken from a San Francisco paper. It concerns a Tesoro refinery in that general area, and the aftermath of a recent injury producing accident caused by sulfuric acid.

I really don't care about their pissing contest with the Chemical board - that's an argument over jurisdiction that just possibly Tesoro may be right on. Cal/OSHA is also investigating - this is clearly in their lane - and Tesoro is cooperating with them.

It appears this pipe leaking sulfuric acid is an ongoing problem, and another worker was injured in a similar accident a few weeks ago. A makeshift repair was made, rather than actually correcting the problem. Further, reports from workers say this problem has existed long enough to suggest the company has had enough time to replace the pipe - but they haven't.

An even bigger problem is that workers are in the area without wearing the federally mandated safety equipment for working around acids and caustic substances.

I think the Port Commissioners are correct in believing an oil transfer facility can operate safely. But I'm also thinking Tesoro is the wrong company to trust to do so.

roger — February 22, 2014 at 9:12 a.m. ( | suggest removal

'Press Talk' has become 'Small Talk'.


Good balanced article about a fascinating subject.

--Will the Republicans go the way of the Whigs?--

-It would take a huge defeat or a civil war to kill the GOP -- but its dysfunction may augur a new political era-

Still, there really are significant divisions within the GOP, as the party’s panicked post-2012 retreat on immigration reform, and the humiliating aftermath of the government shutdown, have made clear. (With lightning speed, Ted Cruz went from Our Next President to Our Next Prime-Time Fox News Host.) To the immense frustration of the Republican establishment in Washington, the party faithful have repeatedly snatched defeat from the jaws of victory by nominating some Tea Party zealot or Christian flat-earther who blunders away a potentially winnable statewide election by saying something stupid about women and sex. As things stand, the Republicans have a good chance of retaking the Senate majority in this year’s midterm elections, even though they have no coherent policies on any major issue and their only platform is to run out the clock on the Obama administration and hope against hope they can beat Hillary Clinton in 2016. Amazingly enough, if it weren’t for their propensity to commit ritual suicide in close elections, the Republicans would already hold the Senate majority, in all likelihood.


To a large extent, the predictions of a GOPocalypse that’s coming someday soon but not right now are based on observable political and demographic factors I don’t need to explore at any length here. As John Judis and Ruy Teixeira argued 12 years ago in “The Emerging Democratic Majority,” long-term shifts in the American population, as the country grows steadily more diverse and more metropolitan, would seem to favor the Democrats. And there’s no question that the Republican Party of 2014 is a peculiar coalition of groups with distinct worldviews and ideologies that don’t always overlap: The corporate overlords and 1-percenters, the burn-it-down Tea Partyers, the decaying but still vocal “Christian conservatives” and the Ayn Rand libertarians are united only by a strident rhetoric of American exceptionalism, a professed dislike of big government, and by what we might call the identity politics of whiteness. They can all agree that they hate Obamacare (for varying reasons) and view the presidency of its author as a continuing nightmare. But they disagree about almost everything else.

Read More @

nailingit — February 22, 2014 at 9:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Well, it appears our legal system doesn't hold a monopoly on silliness. This guy will most likely spend the rest of his life behind bars (the Norwegian system has a maximum sentence of 21 years, but they don't have to release you if they determine you pose a threat to society). But to even begin to think to demand that a Playstation2 isn't good enough, and give me a couch....

roger — February 22, 2014 at 9:44 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Manthou please don't send me to Multnomah County. As dysfunctional as our city and county can be, I still like it here better. Oregon and Portland in particular are a little to liberal for me. Our mix is a lot better.

timerick — February 22, 2014 at 10:28 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Well, and so it continues... more shades of 'The Cry for Justice'...⌖=comments&_r=0

jacjak — February 22, 2014 at 10:32 a.m. ( | suggest removal

It's not so much about casting party blame nowadays, it's understanding what the two parties believe in. It's what they stand for, what they fight for, what legislation they introduce, what they want bound in law...

-Arizona Senate Passes Bill Allowing Discrimination On Basis Of Religious Freedom-

The Republican-controlled Arizona state Senate voted along party lines Wednesday to pass Senate Bill 1062, a measure that would allow businesses to reject service to any customer based on the owners’ religious beliefs.

The bill reads:

"Exercise of religion" means the PRACTICE OR OBSERVANCE OF RELIGION, INCLUDING THE ability to act or refusal to act in a manner substantially motivated by a religious belief whether or not the exercise is compulsory or central to a larger system of religious belief.

nailingit — February 22, 2014 at 11:04 a.m. ( | suggest removal

All politics is local, nail. :)

I can't do much about Arizona, but what do you think about this bill being considered in Washington? Roll call in Senate shows overwhelming support from Rs and Ds so far. Amazing bi-partisanship in an age of perpetual conflict.

Substitute SB 5173: Respecting holidays of "faith and conscious"

manthou — February 22, 2014 at 11:55 a.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick: Don't worry. I have written a personal waiver for you alone in my fantasy secession scenario. :)

manthou — February 22, 2014 at 11:56 a.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 22, 2014 at 11:55 a.m.

Your link wouldn't open up for me.

All politics aren't local. Much happens at the national level as well as state rights regarding trends, lawmaking, party direction etcetera.

We do well to pay attention at what's happening around us in our political sphere. Never good to be insular, and never good to be taken off guard.

Even if it's not our own first and foremost passion.

And truth be known, although I like to think my correspondence with my elected mean something, with few exceptions we have very little influence pre or post election.

nailingit — February 22, 2014 at 12:08 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 22, 2014 at 11:04 a.m.

I read that earlier and I don't think it's going to pass the smell test, or the Supreme Court test. It's pure and simple discrimination with a twist. I can't believe the R's in Arizona are arrogant enough (or stupid enough) to think this will pass muster.

Hawkman — February 22, 2014 at 3:47 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 22, 2014 at 3:47 p.m.

These types of bills are being introduced by republican lawmakers across the country, tying up our courts while basic freedoms are being threatened and denied.

Republican leaders get energized introducing bills extinguishing personal freedoms. Voting rights, gay rights, a woman's right to choose and so on. I wish it wasn't so, but the proof is in the pudding.

I understand why there has been such a remarkable exodus from the GOP. The party has left many behind.

-Inside the Conservative Campaign to Launch "Jim Crow-Style" Bills Against Gay Americans-

nailingit — February 22, 2014 at 4:25 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 22, 2014 at 4:25 p.m.

It makes me wonder if ALEC had a hand in writing this one.

Hawkman — February 22, 2014 at 5:34 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I keep trying to tell you guys that there are different Americas. The people from a lot of those Red states truly believe their Christian bible trump every other set of laws, and they're more than willing to pass local laws that conform to said beliefs.

Matthew 22.36-38 will do --
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.

We sinners will pay.

Cheech Wizard: It’s up to you to dig out everyday cosmic truth.

roger — February 22, 2014 at 6:38 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Roger, I am starting to have my doubts about the Civil War. maybe it would have been better to let the southern states go. But it's never too late! They could form the union of the bible thumpers. Of course, they would go under fast as they rely so heavily on DC for aid. You know, the DC they dislike so much.
Might as well take Texas with them.

No dinner yet, shows. Need sustenance.

luvithere — February 22, 2014 at 8:01 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 22, 2014 at 5:34 p.m.

I thought the same thing. Seems like a coordinated effort of some sort.

nailingit — February 22, 2014 at 8:26 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Two Ron Paulies were just elected to run the Clark County Republican party: Kenny Smith and Brenda Pollenti.

Tea Party Repubs like Frank Decker and Micheline Doane are in mourning. These weren't Carolyn Crain's choices, either.

Nailingit, we have our Republican strife at home, too.

They don't like the results of the latest Vancouver city council elections and are going to work harder on outreach. We'll see if they make any headway.

manthou — February 22, 2014 at 9:37 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou- Frank made a lot of headway last election. It just ended up in his rear.

I think Frank's foray into Face Book made him unelectable.

nailingit — February 23, 2014 at 9:02 a.m. ( | suggest removal

luvithere — February 22, 2014 at 8:01 p.m.

I wouldn't be so quick to look on the South from that 20th Century perspective - they are quietly growing their economies by attracting businesses like Boeing and car manufacturers, and industries like NC's furniture one that relocated to China are now returning (seems those pesky Asians want to be paid a livable wage too).

roger — February 23, 2014 at 9:23 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Anyone else been having trouble with their subscription? I have to erase my cookies after 30 articles and log out and back in every time for the past week. Not the first time problems have arisen. I've spoken to circulation about this and was left empty as to how and fix this long term. The blame always goes to the company they hired for their pay site with no correction in view.

It's always 'the other guy'. If this new problem isn't fixed or it gets worse, I might have to cancel and ask for money back. I'm not a big fan of charging premium prices to view a local newspaper in the first place, add to that the ongoing problems of simply utilizing a service I've paid for months in advance, and spending time making numerous calls to the Columbian asking how to fix each new problem as it arises...

This is getting old Columbian. I know from conversations with staff I'm certainly not the only one affected with this.

I'll wrap it up because I was informed I only have five articles left to view. (although I'm paid up till June)

Get it together people. When you charge for a service, make sure your service is worth charging for.

But it's the other guy's fault, right?

nailingit — February 23, 2014 at 10:58 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Sorry you are having so much trouble, nailingit. Mine has worked fine. Just have to log in again when I change computers.
Andrea Damewood will be the new food critic for the Portland Mercury. She still has her civil service day job.

Don't know why she is leaving investigative, hard-hitting reporting behind, but I wish her health and happiness. What's not to like about testing Portland food and reporting about it?

manthou — February 23, 2014 at 11:57 a.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 23, 2014 at 10:58 a.m.

OH, can I echo your frustration????

I FINALLY got signed on using Firefox but I couldn't sign on using Chrome. It asks me the usual, I give it my name and password and all it does is go back to the sign in page.

I called "Virginia" and she assured me if I "clear my cookies" ("I don't know how to do it but I'm sure you can Google it") it will work. Try again, Virginia.

I even tried to reset my password, no dice.

I really want to use Chrome, not Firefox but for the time being, I'm stuck.

Hey Columbian! FIX YOUR SITE!!!!

Oh, and get rid of that stupid captcha!

Hawkman — February 23, 2014 at 12:19 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 23, 2014 at 10:58 a.m.

Ditto with the problems. Ready to toss in the towel after repeated frustration. Told to delete cookies, told to log out & sign in again. Friday I was told to use different brouser. On that, I refused. Don't know much about the inner workings of code and computers, but blaming a brouser was a bit much. They put me into the mailbox of someone named Greg. When he returned the call I handed phone to hubby. He's certainly more tech savey and I was so DONE. Greg reloaded my account, whatever that entailed. Has worked fine since. At least so far. Can't help but feel sorry for the subscription desk people who are completely untrained in anything even resembling tech support.

Still, it's a pitiful way to run a fee based website.

jacjak — February 23, 2014 at 12:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I use Firefox at home - no problem. At work I have Internet Explorer (I can use it to read the papers at lunch), and I usually get the x number of reads left warning. But when I select the Log In option, and remember to select the main page option at top, then it leaves me alone for the rest of the day.

roger — February 23, 2014 at 12:44 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm using Chrome now - had to sign in, but no problem with it.

roger — February 23, 2014 at 1:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

From Andrea's new food blog --

"I spent a lot of time trying my damndest to drive a stake into the heart of the Columbia River Crossing, and now that I've moved away from news reporting, I’m hoping to focus more on steak."

She's smart too. But she needs to learn that ribs should NOT be slathered in BBQ sauce - they should be cooked with a dry rub, and the sauce should be used for dipping. (Sweet Baby Ray's that she mentioned is pretty good, but the Jack Daniels brand is even better.)

roger — February 23, 2014 at 1:23 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 23, 2014 at 1:23 p.m.

I agree, sauce should be used as a condiment, not a cooking aid. We had dinner at Slabtown the other night on NW Vaughn and it was great. A friend of mine had a half rack and I had the Texas Plate, about 6 pieces of brisket and a cut up sausage and mashed potatoes. Very little sauce on the side for dipping. It was very tender and I cut it with a butter knife. I like how they do things there, they only cook so much per day and when they are out, they close. When you go in they tell you what they have left and that's what you get or leave. Well worth the trip from Battle Ground.

Hawkman — February 23, 2014 at 2:15 p.m. ( | suggest removal

roger — February 23, 2014 at 1:23 p.m.
Correct. I do my ribs with a rub, juicy, tender, done right in oven on a rack with container of water under to steam from below. So good. Nothing worse than meat slathered in red ketchupy sauce. Yuk.

luvithere — February 23, 2014 at 6:12 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Anyone use a Traeger? I just discovered what a slow and low smoke in it can do to brisket and ribs.

Does this scenario remind you of anybody in Clark County? Marine commander doesn't like what the newspaper publishes so he bans it from sale at all Marine bases. Maybe his next step will be to publish his own newspaper.

manthou — February 23, 2014 at 8:54 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman — February 23, 2014 at 12:19 p.m.

jacjak — February 23, 2014 at 12:35 p.m.

If our experiences provide a good sampling, then I suspect their problems are wide spread. The C should address this in their daily carousel and provide consumer updates via E-mail.

The very least of services a paid web site should provide is to keep their customer base informed of widespread problems. Who's affected, why, a short term fix if applicable, and what's being done to fix this long term.

The Columbian charging for website access was controversial and a big deal around here. All the more reason this paper should press hard into fixing these ongoing problems, to include keeping a well informed and knowledgeable staff, and bring customers the product they are paying for.

If it's the company they hired screwing things up, fine. What's being done about it?

nailingit — February 23, 2014 at 9:22 p.m. ( | suggest removal

nailingit — February 23, 2014 at 9:22 p.m.

I'm guessing it was the same outfit that did the "Cover Oregon" web site. They are doing the same thing Oregon is doing, throwing money at it they don't have.

Hawkman — February 23, 2014 at 10:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hate it that so many of you paid subscribers are having trouble with the paywall. This just contributes to our little discussion community fading……..

I do enjoy the Portraits of Clark County. I think there are many interesting residents who contribute positive energy here and we need to champion them.

manthou — February 24, 2014 at 7:21 a.m. ( | suggest removal

I'll believe it when I see it. My guess-this is the beginning of the end for sequestration. Obama is playing hard ball to restore cuts and clean up this sequestration mess on his watch.

Maybe this President isn't such a lame duck after all.

-Pentagon Plans to Shrink Army to Pre-World War II Level-


I was hoping this guy would get get into the race.

-Deval Patrick Says 'Maybe' To Potential Presidential Run-

nailingit — February 24, 2014 at 7:37 a.m. ( | suggest removal

12 days and counting to sine die at the Oregon legislature, folks.

The CRC has been so traumatic and divisive. If it survives, can you imagine the fighting and strife that will continue to tear communities apart?

Problem is: there is no alternative option that will be acceptable to all and this fighting will continue no matter what plans are presented to the public.

Someone on the FB side made an interesting comment: The demise of the CRC might be the way to shut down growth along the 1-5 corridor and push it to East County. Could this have been the hidden agenda all along?

roger: There you go. You may have your city center East someday.

My concerns? Living with daily in-fighting is bad for one's health. Better to find a place where citizens do not have to destroy each other over big-issue controversies. Where that is, I don't know, but coal and oil, the CRC: if people believe these issues are destroying our community, then they turn it into a self-fulfilling prophecy.

manthou — February 24, 2014 at 8:39 a.m. ( | suggest removal

(Boneless) pork ribs go in the crock pot. (Bone in) beef ribs are marinated over night and then put on the top grill of the outdoor grill. Hickory chips go on the lower level. The burners are just high enough to produce smoke from the chips. Low and slow!

I won't tell you what I use for rubs/sauce, because then I'd have to...well, you know.

And, I don't want to jinx myself, so I won't mention having no issues with my paid subscription (IE 9).

Drift — February 24, 2014 at 9 a.m. ( | suggest removal

My concerns? Living with daily in-fighting is bad for one's health. Better to find a place where citizens do not have to destroy each other over big-issue controversies. Where that is, I don't know, but coal and oil, the CRC: if people believe these issues are destroying our community, then they turn it into a self-fulfilling prophecy.

manthou — February 24, 2014 at 8:39 a.m.

From all I read, there is no place where controversies do not impact community. We all seem to have an opinion and want to voice it. The 2008 election had both a positive and negative influence on the whole nation, I think. Those who never bothered much with voting or politics got off their duffs and took an interest. For anyone who thinks this had nothing to do with skin color of presidents, just remember the magazine covers, from The New Yorker to Newsweek. Add to that, the stock market and mortgage melt down and TARP. 2008 was the perfect storm of reasons to get involved, and it seems to have awoken in many a sense of involvement hitherto unknown to them, or unseen across the spectrum of America's citizenry. And, like any blatant statement not backed up with fact, I will add that there's a natural tendency to have interests one at a time. Some fade, or we're distracted by some other interest, but political involvement seems fascinating and riviting while being very time comsuming. And, it affects each of us in big or small ways whether we're paying attention or not.

Clark County is no different than the place off in the distance, really. And it has tons to offer, even if some of it is across the river, or up the river, or up the freeway.

jacjak — February 24, 2014 at 10:34 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Interesting article in the American Thinker, from a writer from the New York Post... The Polarization of the American People...It is also witnessed here in the basement. We have the Unusual suspects still blaming the R party for today's wow's and we have just a few defending the conservatism left in the basement....There was a great article in Saturdays paper on the left side of the editorial page. It's funny that none here in the basement has made light of it yet??? Interesting in that so many here and there have Ragged on Benton yet he gets quite a good report from an expert in the field and the County...

There are always two side to every story, but not every story is written that way, AKA LOU'S own writing is like well easy to predict and pretty much Boring...

I just had my own coffee mug Made..... Don't read stupid stuff, it may make you do Stupid things....

vanwadreamer — February 24, 2014 at 10:46 a.m. ( | suggest removal

Apparently Bobby Jindal is the "mouth that roared" today at the White House. That guy just doesn't know when to keep his mouth shut, or maybe he's just grandstanding for attention. Either way, that's no way to get elected. People don't want to elect big mouth big shots, if they did, Trump would be President, or Jessie Ventura.

Hawkman — February 24, 2014 at 2:24 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Vanwa I read the letter last week. It did not change my mind on Benton. I did not care for the guy way before he was hired at the county. He is there now and we should watch and see how he preforms. Whether he does good or bad will not change my mind. I just do not care for the guy. It goes back several years. And Hawk why are you picking Jessie Ventura. He was one of the most entertaining wrestlers that was ever in Portland. Now Trump I can agree with you on.

timerick — February 24, 2014 at 3:35 p.m. ( | suggest removal

timerick — February 24, 2014 at 3:35 p.m.

Yes Tim, you are correct. as a wrestler he was very "entertaining", as a Governor he was very "entertaining," as a Presidential candidate, he'd make a good wrestler.

Hawkman — February 24, 2014 at 4:55 p.m. ( | suggest removal

vanwadreamer — February 24, 2014 at 10:46 a.m

So says a guy who leans just right of Hannity.

There's more irony in your posts than in Centrum Silver.

nailingit — February 24, 2014 at 5:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

vanwa: I gotta pile on here. Sorry in advance. :)

About Ms. Olmsted's letter in support of Benton. She qualified the whole thing when she wrote this:

"Benton is doing a great job as department leader, perhaps because of the caliber of long-standing county managers and staff he has working there."

She resides in West Linn, OR, for goodness sake, and does not have to live in the state or county Benton is ravaging.

She is a UC Berkeley grad, as is someone near and dear to me. She's no dummy by her alma mater and I can assume she is a competent scientist in her field. She might not be such a good judge of politicians, however.

Anyway, give the Columbian some credit, would you, for publishing a letter that is pro-Benton, albeit with qualifiers. She lauds his political acumen and the benefit that brings Clark County (debatable). That's her opinion. Hooray for the first amendment.

I'm sure my thoughts on OR Senator Richard Devlin, who represents West Linn, would hold a lot of water with Clackamas County residents, too. I think I'll pen one right now for the West Linn Tidings.

manthou — February 24, 2014 at 5:32 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I'm sure my thoughts on OR Senator Richard Devlin, who represents West Linn, would hold a lot of water with Clackamas County residents, too. I think I'll pen one right now for the West Linn Tidings.

manthou — February 24, 2014 at 5:32 p.m.

That and $3 will get you a Starbucks!

Hawkman — February 24, 2014 at 5:56 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Hawkman: As a fellow Madore admirer like me, what do you think the REAL reason is for his wanting to do an audit, farm out labor negotiations and perhaps cut HR staff?

Could it be to eliminate the job of "Diversity and Inclusion" officer? HR had to step up that branch of its operations to comply with Federal and State laws and I always knew that Mielke hated it because he made snide quips about diversity as often as he could.

When he and Madore introduced prayer as a prelude to all meetings, he explained to critics (with his lusty laugh), "We're just being diverse, afterall."

With those two wascally wabbits, there is usually a hidden agenda.

manthou — February 24, 2014 at 8:16 p.m. ( | suggest removal

manthou — February 24, 2014 at 8:16 p.m.

ALWAYS a hidden agenda.

I'm really surprised he wants to farm out the negotiations, seems to me he'd like to be the one to "win the day" by screwing over everyone he can. He takes pride in "saving the County money". Even if it means pissing off everyone else.

Explain something to me (anyone), just how does outsourcing work to someone on the outside save you money rather than having someone already on the payroll take care of it. Wouldn't that just cost MORE money?

Hawkman — February 24, 2014 at 8:49 p.m. ( | suggest removal

Anybody else wonder if the "C" has forgotten us?

Hawkman — February 24, 2014 at 10:02 p.m. ( | suggest removal

I sent John Hill an e-mail asking that he have a new page created.

Maybe Editor Lou is mad at us? Not much love for his column or his cup with this crowd.

roger — February 25, 2014 at 5:31 a.m. ( | suggest removal

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